Evaunit02mark1
S-s-smell the Prey, S-s-start the Hunt.
Added bonus, she damn well won't get stuck in an itty bitty living space, we'd give her the world, or at least the parts of it we don't personally set on fire.
A Sword Without a Hilt: A Song of Ice and Fire/D&D 3.5 Crossover
- Thread starter DragonParadox
- Start date
-
- Tags
- a song of ice and fire a sword without a hilt d&d 3.5 dungeons & dragons 100% high octane dragon fuel ave corvidae battle action dragon diplomacy best sister bureaucromancy delicious soul-stuff dragon dreams come true dragon ta'veren greatest uncle hubris is a coward's word in defiance of gods and men mammon's folly mutually assured mage's disjunction qm murderhobo top tier coatl
Added bonus, she damn well won't get stuck in an itty bitty living space, we'd give her the world, or at least the parts of it we don't personally set on fire.
- Location
- washington
Quite frankly on this position I don't care what our mother thinks Lya is the best waifu ever and no one could even be thought to come close.
Snowfire
Polyglot of Chimera
- Location
- Wordcats
Just saw this. Please be aware that I'm likely to borrow heavily from any work you produce in this vein, sinilarly to how I did things for when we were explaining the existence of gods. But jumping straight to full bore polit-talk (not saying that's what you're intending, but I do know your style) is probably not the greatest of plans.
Anyway, vote in a bit, right now I'm still sleepy z_z
Also, remember Lya's capstone. She can Adventure with us and still run the kingdom at the same time.
It's kind of a mix. He was raised at the Court in King's Landing for the first eight years of his life, so the notion that some people are born and raised to rule is natural. It's the same way say a tailor might learn his craft from his father, the natural way of the world. That said he then spent time in Braavos being little more than an easily overlooked curiosity for the next five years. It's hard to justify to yourself how much better than everyone else you are when you are in such a position of inferiority for so long.
Then came magic and the answer to his cognitive dissonance which came to him just as he was knitting together his group of freinds: there are people of unremarkable birth who through some quirk of fate or chance have the potential to rise above their station and indeed considering that potential it is the moral thing to help them. The simplest example of this is magic, though something like Alinor's skill at numbers also applies. The way he looks at it distinguished noble lines had to start somewhere.
To put it more concisely: If you find Bran the Builder on the street you should not sniff at him for being a peasant's son.
Eleas
Avian-at-arms
- Location
- Malmö, Sweden
I dunno. There's really no need to drop-kick the remaining pillars of her faith at the moment. Let that happen when she has literally any other lifeline to cling to (which, once some time has passed and she's gained her bearings and/or attained personal arcane power will be a thing).
There are logical reasons that apply and that still don't play into the "lovestruck boy with his head in the clouds" trope. I think any argument to convince Rhaella that her son's judgment can be trusted has to start there.
Off-hand, I see the following arguments emerging from the thread:
One final point, though: unlike other prospects, Lya accumulates. By which I mean that as current political development goes, magical might is a cachet that is growing. Also, the more powerful she gets, the greater the prestige will become. Much like "peerless in the joust and on the field" was a hell of a feather in your cap, "most powerful and influential magic user on two continents" will increasingly mean something.
Time favors Viserys here.
There are logical reasons that apply and that still don't play into the "lovestruck boy with his head in the clouds" trope. I think any argument to convince Rhaella that her son's judgment can be trusted has to start there.
Off-hand, I see the following arguments emerging from the thread:
- We have no prospective allegiance that is awesome enough: we're holding out for something better (truth: it's just that that someone is Lya)
- We cannot bind ourselves to another political actor in this situation, because any actor we consider worth it would by virtue of land and armies and allegiances be seen as the senior party (arguably true; at the very least a possible argument)
- Binding ourselves to a paramount would be unwise because of their leverage (very true, given our unorthodox maneuvering; we do not want to get hamstrung here)
- We cannot protect a mundane wife from assassination (true, but an unpalatable subject to bring up, because that would imply fundamental weakness and would not reassure Rhaella)
- Such a queen would be essentially a puppet left at home (IMHO an arguable argument, but one that might affect Rhaella due to resonating with her former status under Aerys)
- She's the engine behind our success (true, but Rhaella may well see that as Lya essentially holding Viserys hostage; Lya would be an intruder in that scenario, someone interposing herself above her station)
- We love her and we just don't care what people think (very much true, but would not impress Rhaella)
One final point, though: unlike other prospects, Lya accumulates. By which I mean that as current political development goes, magical might is a cachet that is growing. Also, the more powerful she gets, the greater the prestige will become. Much like "peerless in the joust and on the field" was a hell of a feather in your cap, "most powerful and influential magic user on two continents" will increasingly mean something.
Time favors Viserys here.
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Now that is a mindset I can get behind.
- Location
- The underworld
well we are going wipe out a few blood lines and restructure the kingdoms anyways we be powerful enough to control the kingdom on our own
Crake
I AM THE STORM THAT IS APPROACHING
- Location
- USA
And nobody would notice the difference.
Hell I'd sign the whole thing over to whichever Lya of the Week got the shaft and vacation on a Plane of Beach Parties for a couple centuries before swinging back around to get more money to fund our Engine of Extinction we'll inevitably find the need for when a Deep One assault force interrupts our prolonged honeymoon.
Hell I'd sign the whole thing over to whichever Lya of the Week got the shaft and vacation on a Plane of Beach Parties for a couple centuries before swinging back around to get more money to fund our Engine of Extinction we'll inevitably find the need for when a Deep One assault force interrupts our prolonged honeymoon.
Plane of beach parties sounds like a chaotic good afterlife.
Snowfire
Polyglot of Chimera
- Location
- Wordcats
Snrk. That's an...interesting way to talk about sex allocation.
- Location
- United States
@DragonParadox, have Viserys and Lya found any particularly interesting tomes in the library yet?
Evaunit02mark1
S-s-smell the Prey, S-s-start the Hunt.
To be honest I can't think of anything to add besides the fact that we're going to become a dragon soon and all arguments over what we can and cannot do will be rendered rather moot at that point.
Though considering we're trying to preserve what fragments of her worldview that remain such knowledge would probably only hurt rather than help...
I'll address that when you are done with the social parts.
Crake
I AM THE STORM THAT IS APPROACHING
- Location
- USA
I'm honestly tempted to just sideline this entire line of conversation until we're more reasonably established and have contained the Dornish situation through bringing Elia back.
If we can secure the alliance without having to marry anyone, have an army, have hatched dragons, and are even more ludicrously personally powerful (I.E can turn into a fire breathing motherfucking True Dragon) then most of the concerns that Rhaella could raise about what we would be giving up would come across as... rather toothless, even to her own ears.
If we can secure the alliance without having to marry anyone, have an army, have hatched dragons, and are even more ludicrously personally powerful (I.E can turn into a fire breathing motherfucking True Dragon) then most of the concerns that Rhaella could raise about what we would be giving up would come across as... rather toothless, even to her own ears.
Well she is kind of justified in a way. Lineage and blood are a super huge deal to the nobility. Without the return of magic, marrying a lowborn orphan would have been spectacularly unwise.
Even now it's going to be pretty difficult. Viserys is probably going to have to smack down or burn a bunch of people. But he's going to be doing a lot of that sort thing anyway, regardless of who he marries. And Lya is very much worth it.
- Location
- washington
Quite frankly I do not want to set this down she may be our mother but Lya is a future waifu and that is just as important if not more in my opinion. And I will not take the kinds of things our mom is suggesting idly she will be our waifu and she cannot decide otherwise. I would think this would be even more important to Viscerys then telling her about gods it certainly is more personal. It sets a bad precedent and is one of the things I am willing to break her world view over compared to other things.
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- Location
- Germany
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Have you read Azel's government rebuild? End of page, political domain, end of spoiler.
- Location
- Germany
Then have my cliff notes:
- The political landscape has vastly changed. Westeros alone is not everything we have to consider and the vast personal powers of mages make them a force in their own right.
- A marriage alliance cuts both ways and tying us to a LP in that fashion would be a considerable investment.
- Westeros is disunited since the Rebellion. Strong royal favor to a single house would significantly worsen that issue.
- The changes to the world mean that reforms are necessary to the way countries are governed. The Rebellion has shown how brittle a system without strong central authority can become and it needs institutions, not Lord, to address this.
- Due to our awakening blood and personal might, we will probably live for centuries. Dynastic considerations have changed vastly and a wife who we will easily outlive is untenable.
Evaunit02mark1
S-s-smell the Prey, S-s-start the Hunt.
Personal, hell yes, important, eh.
Now don't get me wrong, we're slapping a ring on that finger and a crown on her brow the minute we get a chance, but that's a certainty.
No matter what happens Lya is going to be our queen, but we're not worried about that.
What we're concerned about is our Mother, and the fact that her worldview is all but destroyed at this point.
She's trying, Gods above she's trying, and she's grasping at any straw she can.
We have to make sure that she has something to cling to or she's going to break and that won't be good for anyone.
- Location
- washington
I care more about this than when we told her about the gods.
- Location
- Germany
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Eleas
Avian-at-arms
- Location
- Malmö, Sweden
Oh. Oh. Putting it in such abstract terms would allow her to see mages as a form of recently landed nobility. I like how you phrased that, it's a very strong opener.
I think this is the strongest argument because it does not rely on forcing Rhaella to change her view on the social strata. This is a long-term view; I think it would appeal to her.
I think this could backfire, or at the very least, it needs to be delivered as an aside, and only when Rhaella has a great deal of more trust in Viserys. Remember the last close family member of hers who claimed to be able to live forever due to his magical dragon ancestry? I don't think that's a parallel Viserys wants her to draw.