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With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Twelve)

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Shadow Archon said:
How many time travelers are after this one time machine now?

If you add in the Legion of Superheroes and put some wheels on the sphere, you're just a few steps away from a Scooby Doo chase scene.
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well lets see, currently present we have Gren Arrow, Squire, Miss Martian, Kid Flash, OL, Robot lady and her 4 minions, Mr Goldstien, and Rip Hunter nearby. Plus any other Leaguers in the building.

Truggs isn't present. OL picked up Truggs' rebuilt temporal beacon from a drop point, Rip Hunter modified it to somehow prevent Goldstein from escaping into the timestream. Judging by Kid Flash's comment when the gynoid made for the Timesphere, they had already prepared the Beacon, it went off and the gynoid dropped.

Crimson Doom said:
I mean, I'm pretty sure OL accidentally intercepted a telepathic broadcast from Saturn Girl, so I'm pretty sure the Legion is already involved. We're just not sure how yet.

But yes, time-traveling Scooby-Doo chase is a must now. Ambush Bug, make it so!
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And here's the soundtrack :lol
 
Time Travel would be a really interesting six-month arc to explore, to fill out part of the timeskip, the same way that this six month arc seems to be about establishing a corps and the previous arc was about beating Nabu. Seems a little rough to throw a lot of the major known time travelers into one episode.
 
On a tangent, I have given some thought to the proper name for the SI's avarice-plane-based teleportation.

I considered "emport", to contrast with "teleport" as his empathy contrasts with telepathy. However, it could easily be confused with "import". And truthfully, since "telepathy" literally means, iiuc, "remote/distance feeling", it's actually a better descriptor for his empathy than it is for Martian mind reading.

Instead, after due reflection (but mostly just because I liked it), I present for your consideration: gimmeport!
 
stsword said:
According to the comics, Krona saw the creation of the universe by viewing the future- his time viewer going to the past the long way around, ala the Infinite Man.

By so doing, he linked the destruction of the universe with its creation, shorting the universe of a billion years of life (the comic uses the phrase "the universe was born old"), making it so that another universe will not arise after the destruction of their universe naturally.

It also says he introduced entropy to the universe, but as Empiricist2 rightly points out, that's stupid, so I prefer to think of that as them employing poetic exaggeration. Besides the fact that the universe had an ending suggests the presence of entropy anyway, otherwise, what destroyed the universe in the first place?

Besides, entropy is literally what the conflict between the Lords of Order and Chaos is about. Order tries to maintain order as long as they can, as Chaos eventually makes inroads until Chaos reigns in the Kali Yuga, then the universe is destroyed and the Lords start over in the next universe, and the Lords were made by the Presence right after the birth of the universe.

Thinking that the Presence decided to create the cycle of entropy and the Lords because a blue guy spied on him gives the blue guy a bit more importance than I think is warranted.

Have to remember that the Guardians moved to Oa so that literally the universe can revolve around them. Humility is not one of their strong suits.
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Could it be that the "introducing entropy to the universe" bit can be interpreted as introducing it into the cycle of universes you mention?
IE: Originally, each new universe was a fresh start. But now, each new one is starting out more and more decayed (the next universe will be "born even older")
 
suicidejunkie said:
Could it be that the "introducing entropy to the universe" bit can be interpreted as introducing it into the cycle of universes you mention?
IE: Originally, each new universe was a fresh start. But now, each new one is starting out more and more decayed (the next universe will be "born even older")
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I like the line of reasoning but perhaps it gives the comic book writers too much credit. :)
 
BrambleThorn said:
The first is that from what I remember from the science shows covering the beginning of the universe, the universe operated differently in the early moments of it's creation, because the various laws and limits didn't come online all at once. The universe expanded faster than the current limits of the speed of light for some femtoseconds in the beginning was an example given. But something like that happening doesn't automatically make our current observations on the state of the universe wrong, it means conditions were different then compared to now.
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I'm fairly certain this isn't true. The universe expanded faster than the speed of light, yes. But the speed of light refers to the maximum speed at which information (e.g. massless particles) can propogate through the universe. It doesn't actually refer to how fast space itself can expand.

Space expansion analogy/explanation said:
An analogy that I saw recently: Imagine a long piece of elastic, say 100 meters or so. Now, you shake one end, which causes a ripple in the elastic that moves at 1 meter per second. To make the analogy work, you've done a lot of tests and the speed of this ripple is the fastest any ripple can travel along the elastic, although you could go slower. This time however you make the fast ripple, and then start stretching the elastic very quickly. You stretch it 30% longer every second, so that the total length is 130 meters after the first second, 163 the second, and so on. The ripple is still moving as fast as it can, but the space between where it is and its destination is growing faster than it can cross the distance. The total distance is increasing much faster than the maximum speed your ripple can move at, but none of your experiments tested how fast the elastic can stretch, only how fast something can move across it.
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The early universe expanded faster than light, and it does so today as well. Reading the Wikipedia page on the observable universe, it says that the observable universe will only get about 3 times larger than what we can see right now, because far enough away no light can reach us, even theoretically.

This is the reason why scientists say that eventually there won't be as many stars in the sky, because at some point the distance between distant galaxies will increase faster than light's ability to traverse the distance.

The early universe was very different from today's universe in a number of ways, but I'm rather positive that the speed of light isn't one of them, and similarly positive that the rules didn't pop into existence over a span of time, no matter how short.

BrambleThorn said:
Third, Rip didn't actually say what you are accusing him of. He never said time could not be changed, he said blowback from attempting to change time prevented time from being changed in a productive manner, and implied he came to this conclusion from experience with observed phenomena. Saying he is wrong is sort of like saying Newtonian Physics is wrong. Technically correct, but we still use it today because the results if gives are relevant until you get into situations far beyond the expected norm.
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That's a good point. Yeah, I was misinterpreting what Rip was saying. Thanks.

(I'm also glad you took my comment in good humor. I was slightly worried it was too sarcastic)
 
Re-reading some recent chapters, and I noticed:

Mr Zoat said:
The barwoman puts a new whiskey down in front of Mr Bierce, and I pass her a twenty dollar bill.
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When exactly did the SI stop disintegrating fiat currency on touch? After achieving orange-enlightenment? That might have been specifically pointed out but I don't recall it.
 
aesir_blade said:
When exactly did the SI stop disintegrating fiat currency on touch? After achieving orange-enlightenment? That might have been specifically pointed out but I don't recall it.
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Yes, it was after he achieved enlightenment. I believe it was mentioned when he was having pancakes with Zatara, Zatanna, and Father Mathias? Could be wrong, though.
 
Coda said:
I don't think his problem was never with the idea of fiat currency in and of itself. It was with the blatant misuse of fiat currency in the 2000s that undermined his confidence in it.
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Right, like, I'm sure most people will never be in an accident but if you've been T-boned 20 consecutive times you might call it a death trap and just forget about it.
 
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Pursuant (part 21)
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    • 22nd October
    01:27 GMT -5

    Mr Queen waves his bandaged right hand at the damage to the library. "You not planning on waving your ring and making all of this disappear?"

    I slump slightly in my chair. "No."

    He considers the damage for a moment, holds out his right arm to look at his injuries… Then pointedly folds it behind his back. "Everyone else gone home?"

    "Yes. Kaldur.. stuck around until King Orin got back, and.. Squire wanted to take a look at the gynoid, but she was dead on her feet, so…"

    He scans the floor for a moment, then pulls over a partially intact piece of chair and cautiously sits down on it. "Crazy couple a' days, huh?"

    I raise my eyebrows slightly. "Which part are you referring to?"

    "Time machines. Not exactly an original concept, and we've had time travellers before, but this is the first time someone's actually set down a machine that can transport someone through time right in our laps."

    "If they'd erased it from history, how would you know?"

    He looks away for a moment, staring through the hole in the side of the building at the early morning sky. "Yeah, that's what's been giving me a headache. I don't think the law's really built for people playing with causality."

    "It's not. I checked. The nearest I could find was 'reckless endangerment', and I think you'd have to intentionally mess things up a lot before a judge or a jury would accept it."

    "The League's going to try and work.. something out between the Hunters. At least until Bats can check out their stories. Personally I'd rather impound the time sphere until we have some.. huge disaster that can't be fixed any other way, but otherwise ban all time travel. I mean… If we even can."

    I nod. "That's the most sensible thing I've been able to come up with. We should probably come up with some-."

    "Come up with some sort of protocol so that we know any time travelling we do do is above board. Because two way time travel is a lot more problematic than one way stuff." He scratches the left side of his cheek with the fingers of his left hand. "Look… I've been.. meaning to talk to you since you got back…"

    "Thinking about upgrading your arsenal? Or are you running out of-."

    "No, not… Well, maybe, but… I.. wanted to talk to you about Nabu."

    I exhale. "You really don't want this place fixed, do you?"

    "This place is meant to be a punching bag. Or a crumple zone. Somewhere villains can attack, where they'll feel like they're achieving something without it actually disrupting our operations. Somewhere we can evacuate fast. Sure, we could armour the walls and put in.. automated defense systems, but that's not really what it's for."

    "Everyone on the Light's payroll knows about the.. other place. And anyone else they feel like leaking it to."

    "Still a little harder getting into space than getting to DC. But that's not what I wanted to talk about."

    "I really think I've said all that I can productively say on the subject."

    He nods, then pauses for a few moments. "You know why I originally joined the Justice League?"

    "Star City was fairly stable and since you'd just lost your job you had a lot of free time?"

    "No-. Well… Yeah. But the other thing was that… The League was a group of superheroes with no oversight. Not from government or congress or anyone like that. I thought that I needed to be there to keep an eye on things. Y'know, just in case. And then I actually got to know everyone, realised that they might not be perfect but they weren't anything to worry about…" He shrugs. "I stopped worrying."

    "So you voted for Nabu because you assumed-."

    "I voted for Nabu because I don't know a thing about magic. With the benefit of hindsight, sure, it was a mistake. But I had no way of knowing that at the time." He sighs. "My mistake was not following up on the Helmet after you kids picked it up from the Tower of Fate. That was something I could understand; what happens if you lock a thinking being away from everything while its greatest enemies run riot."

    Huh. Hadn't really thought about it like that.

    "There are an awful lot of files on the League's computers I've never read through. I'm not beating myself up over not knowing Nabu was there. But once Arte told me about what happened with Kid Flash… I shoulda thought about that a bit more. I don't know, talked to Zatara about what he was planning on doing… Something."

    I shrug. "I decided to leave Nabu in the cupboard after he hesitated to release Kid Flash."

    "What, just like that? I thought it took you at least a little longer."

    "Kid Flash is mine, Nabu is-. Was not. Just a polished Star Conqueror." I shrug. "It just wasn't a problem because he was contained."

    He looks away. "Guess I can see where you're coming from. My point is… I don't think I did what I joined the Justice League to do that time. So when Bats and Atom start getting into temporal mechanics, I'm going to make sure I'm there. Not.. sure if I'm going to have anything useful to say, but…"

    "I appreciate that." I stand. "And.. I appreciate you coming to.. say that to me." Hm. "Actually…"

    "What?"

    "You are.. trained as a business executive, right?"

    "I've got a BA in Business Administration and six years' experience running a multinational company. I hated it, but I know how it goes."

    "Would you be interested in part time work?"

    "Aheh." He smiles faintly. "I think Ted Kord can manage-."

    "No, not Ted Kord. There's another company… I've been thinking of buying them for a while to protect them from asset stripping fake cheese merchants, but I don't actually know anything about running a company. I'd need someone to keep an eye on.. my interests. Wouldn't be anything like full time -the management's sound- but I imagine that you'd find it easy enough."

    "Ah… I don't know. Write up a job spec and I'll take a look at it, but I'm a professional archer for a reason."

    "You get paid to do that? I thought you were an amateur."

    "Yeah, funny." He gets up. "You might as well go home. I'm pulling an all-nighter but all that's going to happen in here is a couple of days of rebuilding."

    I nod, and drift upwards towards the hole in the ceiling. Yeah, there's no point in hanging around. For once I'm reasonably in agreement with the League 'don't interfere' policy. I don't have anything special to add and every time I try and get my head around time travel I just end up thinking in circles. I pass out through the outer wall of the Hall of Justice and come to a stop. 'Home' is Alan's house, but it's half one in the morning. He wouldn't have waited up, would he? I'd have said 'not', but I thought that about my parents once and they started phoning the hospital and police to find out if my body had been handed in-.

    "Orange Lantern!"

    Huh? I look down.. at a cluster of four people.

    "Orange Lantern!" Dana Dearden waves both arms to try and get my attention. She's.. wearing Orange Lantern themed clothing. That's a little weird when it's someone I know. Haven't spoken to her since I got back to Earth, but she didn't strike me as the type to take that personally. "How long you been back on Earth?!"

    The three others… The durlan from Metropolis, and two other people I recognise from the crowd. The youth who asked Kal-El if he was alright and his friend. Superhero groupies? Eh, harmless enough. Not sure what the durlan's angle is, but if he's not hostile… Not really a problem. And if he is, it's better that he's hostile here. I mean, what's he going to do, wreck a wrecked building?

    I float downwards towards them. "And what can I do for the four of you?"

    The male human holds up.. some sort of crystal with a computer attached. Ring, what exactly-?

    "Hold still for about two seconds."

    "Are you doing a selfie-?"

    Space distends around us, New York vanishing in a heartbeat as we're all inexorably drawn upwards! I try flying sideways but I just seem to be.. moving in a circle! Gravity-? No, this is.. a shrunken universe where there literally isn't room for significant lateral flight.

    Who the heck are these people?

    A moment later I'm thrown out into some sort of… Small room made of a pale green material with a glowing red energy barrier covering the front. Through it I see the other four appear into the corridor outside, and a.. coluan nods in greeting before turning to look at me.

    "This does not appear to be the Persuader."
     
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    • Mr Zoat said:
    "This does not appear to be the Persuader."
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    No shit, Sherlock. Did the power ring give it away? Or perhaps the fact that he wasn't (currently) murdering superheroes? I bet it was the way he wasn't running at people with a giant sword and screaming his head off!

    Aren't you supposed to be a Coluan? Did you get your electronics from the discount store or something?
     
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    Mr Zoat said:
    "Orange Lantern!" Dana Deardon waves both arms to try and get my attention. She's.. wearing Orange Lantern themed clothing. That's a little weird when it's someone I know. Haven't spoken to her since I got back to Earth, but she didn't strike me as the type to take that personally. "How long you been back on Earth?!"
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    Dearden

    Also how did she end up with time travelers?

    Also she is wearing OL styled clothing, wonder if that means what I think it does. Well hopefully OL can turn her towards hero work with her magical coins or maybe be a new member of corps if her desires are stable.
     
    Mr Zoat said:
    Space distends around us, New York vanishing in a heartbeat as we're all inexorably drawn upwards! I try flying sideways but I just seem to be.. moving in a circle! Gravity-? No, this is.. a shrunken universe where there literally isn't room for significant lateral flight.

    Who the heck are these people?
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    Paul: "...and that's why whenever random civilians want to talk to me I stun them first and ask questions later."
     
    parnary said:
    No shit, Sherlock. Did the power ring give it away? Or perhaps the fact that he wasn't (currently) murdering superheroes? I bet it was the way he wasn't running at people with a giant sword and screaming his head off!

    Aren't you supposed to be a Coluan? Did you get your electronics from the discount store or something?
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    It could be an issue of software, rather than hardware. Era equivalent of Windows Vista, y'know?

    More realistically, this is probably due to OL not appearing in future histories coupled with his being with Superman when the Persuader got spanked.
     
    Massgamer said:
    Dearden

    Also how did she end up with time travelers?

    Also she is wearing OL styled clothing, wonder if that means what I think it does. Well hopefully OL can turn her towards hero work with her magical coins or maybe be a new member of corps if her desires are stable.
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    If she's with time travelers, is she the present version? If her clothing is more than just orange lantern themed, she could be a lantern from the future.
     
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