Wait, didn't Guy heal his own brain damage accidentally when using the anti-assimilation technique "I am"?
With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Twelve)
- Thread starter Mr Zoat
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Chaoswind
Lord of nonsense
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- Latin America
I believe that was the interpretation, i certainly hope that to be the case because the double personality crap is bad bullshit.
Empiricist2
Let's play doctor!
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- Baton Rouge
I don't believe so. He hasn't had brain damage within the time frame of this story, and assimilation doesn't seem to cause any damage unless it finishes. Green rings don't ever seem to do anything unintentionally.
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- Hampden Park
Thank you, corrected.
He was responding to the 'Is he involved with someone?'.
Thank you, corrected.
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- Somewhere out there
I think this was established to be a software issue, part of the bobblehead malware.
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- The Outer Plane Of Munchkinry.
I really hope that we get some commentary on this about how it is, at best, pointless and at worst counter productive.
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- Earth Prime
Eh, it falls in the category of "banter."
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- The Outer Plane Of Munchkinry.
Do you want to know what is worse? They come with instruction manuals on how to make yourself better at visualising things; humans can make things that make them more able to think, so i don't see why they wouldn't be able to use the stupidly large catalogue of tech to make themselves better at using the stupidly large catalogue of tech.
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- U.S.
That sort of gets into the idea of... I don't think it has a official name, Exponential Intelligence? The idea normally arises from the thought that if we can design an AI that is generally smarter than us, then that AI would be better at AI design than us and could make an AI smarter than it is, which would be better at AI design and design a AI smarter than it... ending up with a exponential curve of intelligence that quickly hits some fundamental barrier to further progression. Obviously, the AI could potentially just improve itself instead of making a entirely new AI, making tweaks and improvements to its own intelligence allowing it to figure out new tweaks and so on.
Theoretically humans could probably do this too, but our brains and bodies are complicated and difficult to work with as I mentioned earlier. We also are... not well suited, intellectually speaking, for such a task. We also have a (reasonable) taboo about modifying our own brain, partially because it's so complicated that we don't understand it well and 95% of the time we'd just end up breaking something; no offense to surgeons, but modern brain surgery is rather like using a backhoe to pick flowers, or a sledgehammer to work out dents in your car. It's also partially because we can't easily make back ups, revision changelogs, or copies of ourself to monitor us for value drift.
Now, no one is sure that there's not some minutia of physics or intelligence that prevents this entirely, or makes it a lot slower than we expect the process to be. However it seems that this sort of thing is just entirely absent in DC. Intelligences generally seem to be fairly static. None of the Brainiacs ended up converting a planet into a giant computer brain, they stuck with a human shaped and sized chassis and didn't do any massive self-improvement. The Maltusians, incredibly intelligent as they are, have gone unchanged for billions of years. Either they hit the barrier, or they just got a massive boost when they found their symbiotic microbes and didn't change much from that point. And intelligence boosting exists, anti-green rings can boost intelligence, and OL's mental acceleration technique is a desirable mental improvement, albeit one best paired with a slight tweaking to one's ability for boredom. So, for whatever reason, this concept simply isn't a thing in DC.
So... I guess they should be able to, but they can't. Or maybe they can, but don't because the DC universe literally has a narrative directed by sentient beings, and they didn't write this into the script? Which, might I just add, is a utterly horrifying concept?
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- Somewhere out there
The official name for that phenomenon is "technological singularity."
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- texas
Enhanced intelligence is a thing in DC.
For example, Delphi from the Human Race comic series.
A member of a conspiracy started when a Delphic Oracle saw a plague transforming humanity into monsters. Basically the black goo from the Species series.
She turned her brain into a nanite supercomputer and her mind into a ghost AI running on those nanites.
Oddly enough didn't alter her body at all, just her brain. But she does take advantage of being able to control her body, suppressing pain, releasing adrenalin, etc.
For example, Delphi from the Human Race comic series.
A member of a conspiracy started when a Delphic Oracle saw a plague transforming humanity into monsters. Basically the black goo from the Species series.
She turned her brain into a nanite supercomputer and her mind into a ghost AI running on those nanites.
Oddly enough didn't alter her body at all, just her brain. But she does take advantage of being able to control her body, suppressing pain, releasing adrenalin, etc.
ThrawnCA
Carbon-based biped
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- Australia
Yeah, offing the leader and causing as much damage as possible to the facilities does sound like something Grayven would do.
Yes, but the wording of that was "has an existing paramour".
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- Earth, 3rd rock from the Sun
OL wisely doesn't go for payback for the sake of payback. Assimilating a Weaponer doesn't give you the advantage you think it does unless you are playing Saturday Morning Cartoon VIllain Evil. Sure he knows the entire Qwardian Tech Tree. Qwa Bolts, Antimatter Universe Power RIngs, and more. But the Craft Recipes use Atrocities as ingredients. Eating kittens, kicking puppies, powered by the heart of a forsaken child... Not hyperbole; all of those are actual requirements for different examples of Qwardian technology. And the really good stuff is even more Narmy with the Evul. Sinestro's Yellow Ring needed an entire planet killed by fear.
I call BS to your call of BS. He has another arm right there to use as a template to crib the answers off of.
shepsquared
Erratic Aussie
- Location
- Melbourne, Australia
The Thunderers were those Qwardians that became the soldiers of the Anti-Monitor. The Weaponers are the result of some Thunderers building better weapons and getting exalted for it, becoming more and more separate over time.
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- U.S.
Oh my god I'm a fucking idiot, how did I forget that?
The muscles, nerves, ligaments, etc aren't a perfect match. If you just mirrored it and cloned it onto your stump, I would bet that at the very least, you couldn't move it because all the nerve would be slightly off and thus completely disconnected.
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Empiricist2
Let's play doctor!
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- Baton Rouge
It's fairly obvious. Any story where genuine superintelligences are an active part of the plot quickly resolves all current issues in one way or another. It would be like a story about a conflict between five year olds when an educated adult steps in. The adult can out learn, out plan, and generally out think all other participants. Unless the adult is under some severe restrictions, there is basically no deception the five year old can achieve, no plausible way for to beat the adult in any meaningful sense in the long term.
DC does not want to write a story where the Guardians can talk down nearly any threat, use their Corps to dismantle any opposing force through superior tactics, where their technology is so overwhelming that no one can even come close. Neither do they want those super smart Guardians to even exist, because then the individual Lanterns are cogs in a machine with little influence on the overall development of the story. DC wants to write stories about good guys triumphing over bad guys through force of will, or superior morality, or something similar.
Plus, writing characters smarter than humans is hard. It's still achievable to a degree, by having longer to think about an issue than the character does, having the character reach conclusions the author has already decided on, or simply authorial fiat, but it's doable. Like how Sherlock Holmes reaches accurate conclusions despite extremely little evidence (this somewhat breaks down when trying out Sherlock's methods IRL doesn't work at all).
You don't need surgery. Education into various subjects can make you smarter, although not to the same degree as rewriting your source code. I can't access it right now, but in one of the later chapters of the book The Better Angels of our Nature, the author remarked that it's a known phenomenon that the IQ scale needs to be readjusted every few years, because otherwise the median IQ would be larger than 100. He postulates that increasingly effective and advanced education makes people simply better at the skills that the IQ test is designed to quantify.
If he can mirror every tissue group in one arm without mirroring the cells or molecules, transplant that arm onto his opposite side, and arrange all the nerves and blood vessels to line up correctly, then he's by far the smartest humanoid seen so far in this series.
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- Earth: Universe Meta - 1
Really? That sounds like the most inefficient thing ever. If rings are that hard for them to produce, then killing one guy, and/or snagging a few rings would cripple the entire race's military might. Relying on Evil rituals like that is just stupid.
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- U.S.
Pretty much, yeah. The only stories I've seen that involve superintelligences like that are generally a conflict between people and the AI, in a AI-in-the-box situation. Spoiler alert: the AI pretty much universally wins, even when the people take extreme precautions.
I think The Culture series would qualify as well; the larger minds are so powerful that normal reality is boring, and they live in 12-dimensional simulations while simultaneously running a post-scarcity utopia. I haven't read it though, so I can't speak for what the conflicts are exactly.
Huh. I didn't actually know about that statistic. Makes sense though, increasing saturation of education would mean that by most definitions average intelligence increases. However I'd argue that this would still hit a fundamental limit very quickly and it can only improve some aspects of the brain.
Oh yeah, don't want to mess up chirality. Get it wrong and suddenly half of your arm is toxic and your immune system goes on a riot.
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ThrawnCA
Carbon-based biped
- Location
- Australia
Not a correction, but something I noticed while going through history:
It seems a bit rich to blame Paul for this. Orin knew the arcane significance of his bloodline much better than Paul did; he should have known that it was a really bad idea to sow his royal oats around the place from a magical point of view, quite apart from the implications as a potential (absent) parent and the impact on his kingdom's succession. He did it anyway, and never once checked on his former lover, whether to discover he had a child or simply to say hi and inquire after her health and happiness. If Paul should have followed up sometime in the past 10 months, then Orin definitely should have followed up within the past 12 years.
And now that someone else has discovered what he should have already known? Instead of taking responsibility for what was objectively a big mistake (possibly leaving a magically significant heir around the place and never even checking whether he had or hadn't), he's angry at them for not having already fixed it for him.
Maybe, if Paul was an Atlantean citizen, then you could argue that he would have had a responsibility to take action to address such a threat to the stability of the kingdom. He isn't, and the responsibility for the king's actions rests squarely on the shoulders of the king.
It seems a bit rich to blame Paul for this. Orin knew the arcane significance of his bloodline much better than Paul did; he should have known that it was a really bad idea to sow his royal oats around the place from a magical point of view, quite apart from the implications as a potential (absent) parent and the impact on his kingdom's succession. He did it anyway, and never once checked on his former lover, whether to discover he had a child or simply to say hi and inquire after her health and happiness. If Paul should have followed up sometime in the past 10 months, then Orin definitely should have followed up within the past 12 years.
And now that someone else has discovered what he should have already known? Instead of taking responsibility for what was objectively a big mistake (possibly leaving a magically significant heir around the place and never even checking whether he had or hadn't), he's angry at them for not having already fixed it for him.
Maybe, if Paul was an Atlantean citizen, then you could argue that he would have had a responsibility to take action to address such a threat to the stability of the kingdom. He isn't, and the responsibility for the king's actions rests squarely on the shoulders of the king.
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- Just hanging
Yeah that is one of the more morally ambiguous situation that multiple people in story argued that Paul should have immediately told him, with Green Arrow actually acknowledging he fathered a child and should look into being responsible for it, and the unseen/forgotten possible encounter between Paul and Kaldur where Paul probably figured out that Kaldur's birth father is actually Black Manta.
Usually when it comes to surprise parentage Superman was extremely put off by Superboy/Kon, Kon was put off learning his other half of DNA is Lex Luthor. Paul had spent a lot of time figuring the situation regarding Diana's birth that had several loyal amazon guards trying to kill her, only to learn/figure out that Donna was actually created in a similar manner to act as a weapon for Cronus and poor communication lead to her avoiding that fate.
Usually when it comes to surprise parentage Superman was extremely put off by Superboy/Kon, Kon was put off learning his other half of DNA is Lex Luthor. Paul had spent a lot of time figuring the situation regarding Diana's birth that had several loyal amazon guards trying to kill her, only to learn/figure out that Donna was actually created in a similar manner to act as a weapon for Cronus and poor communication lead to her avoiding that fate.
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- Earth: Universe Meta - 1
It doesn't make logical sense. Then again, that is a fairly standard emotional reaction.
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- Earth Prime
Kaldur's King? Be in the wrong? Nah, must be the fault of the man his King is angry at.
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- Earth, 3rd rock from the Sun
That is pretty much the intent. It's a bit bullshit, really. The Qwardians are supposed to be high encounter Bad Guys™ for you to fight, so of course their Tech has combat stats with a higher upper limit than even the Malthusians, but god forbid you try and exploit their stuff. So all the crafting recipes have blatant poison pills like that. Which doesn't effect the Qwardians at all, because the game just randomly generates their equipment off screen. No dealing with the actual logistics of puppy kicking mills for them, no sir. They just have a generic resource allowance for each tributary in their empire.
At least the 'planet killed by fear' is just the prototyping cost, and if you have a yellow ring in hand, the cost to forge others is not quite so extreme.
ThrawnCA
Carbon-based biped
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- Australia
at the very
at a time
their bodies
their heads
its eyes
an Nth
greater than it's been
abilities and level of intelligence have
The Wraiths' pressure
more sombre than
...more information I have on
unbaconed
enemies' attention
entirety of the League
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