Vox Vitae: Warhammer AI quest
- Thread starter Neablis
- Start date
- Mature Sci-Fi
Yeah, I've said that you can recruit more people for a larger crew as well. It'll have narrative effects more than anything, but building a team might also be part of your crew levelling up. They'll probably pay off in narrative ways, but they're also not essential if you want to keep the crew lean and mean.
- Location
- Australia
@Neablis, I've also been thinking about another idea - would it be possible to recruit (and perhaps later clone) a population of colonists (humans, Xenos, AIs) that can colonise uninhabited or marginally inhabited planets/moons/asteroids/derelicts/systems/etc. that we encounter on our voyages (of course only if they want to settle there - anyone who doesn't want to settle there can stay with us in a nomadic lifestyle either in a fleet or aboard a mega-ship), with some start-up/bootstrapping industry, techbase and defences to adequately defend and look after themselves of course?
I was thinking it might be nice as a major narrative arc to spread and protect sophonts of all kinds as a sort of "ark", leaving a trail of more tolerant, compassionate, innovative, dynamic and cooperative polities (as well as friendly ports) in our wake, less likely to be immediately disturbed by the crueller/despotic/imperialist powers in the universe than already settled worlds and systems - who with FTL comms (traditional astropaths or more modern technological and ships might even be able to protect and support each other to protect themselves, accelerate their development and maybe even spread their (and our) ideals beyond our direct intervention - not to mention lend aid to ourselves as well (for example, if we are close enough by they could lend aid against enemies, or with sufficiently advanced and reliable FTL comms provide us with a research bonus, both for us and for their own research, that persists between systems).
Although of course doing so would take significant research, construction and diplomatic efforts we would need to undertake in order to remotely "automate" such a process (although it would probably always take at least an action to initiate settlement as we'd need to spend construction efforts to kickstart the automotive industrialisation swarm to start building the necessary infrastructure if nothing else).
I was thinking it might be nice as a major narrative arc to spread and protect sophonts of all kinds as a sort of "ark", leaving a trail of more tolerant, compassionate, innovative, dynamic and cooperative polities (as well as friendly ports) in our wake, less likely to be immediately disturbed by the crueller/despotic/imperialist powers in the universe than already settled worlds and systems - who with FTL comms (traditional astropaths or more modern technological and ships might even be able to protect and support each other to protect themselves, accelerate their development and maybe even spread their (and our) ideals beyond our direct intervention - not to mention lend aid to ourselves as well (for example, if we are close enough by they could lend aid against enemies, or with sufficiently advanced and reliable FTL comms provide us with a research bonus, both for us and for their own research, that persists between systems).
Although of course doing so would take significant research, construction and diplomatic efforts we would need to undertake in order to remotely "automate" such a process (although it would probably always take at least an action to initiate settlement as we'd need to spend construction efforts to kickstart the automotive industrialisation swarm to start building the necessary infrastructure if nothing else).
Very possible. Though that's less "exploration" and more "civilization-building." But you could very much theme it as "Going to explore wonders, then settle people there to enjoy/make use of them." It would suit Vita's optimistic vibe. But this is just one option.
Also - I updated the maps page if anybody's curious. Not sure I'll get the update done soon, the map took a lot longer than I expected. Names can be hard.
- Location
- Boston
Just finished reading, and really fun! Glad to hop in on this one. Part of me feels ready to kind of let this planet stand and fall on its own merits now. We WANT them to succeed, but we got a lot of stuff to do and the stars are calling. So yeah, talk to them to improve our own understanding, but I feel we've done enough to try to clear the path for them. It's up to them to walk it.
- Location
- Australia
Sure, the humans on Secundus are probably going to do ok even if we leave now, but I would not be comfortable leaving without at least contacting the Xenos on Denva Primus (the Vellkar), as now that Secundus humanity is going interplanetary Primus-Secundus contact is inevitable, and I would not remotely trust that a (relatively) very equitable, progressive, democratic and accepting society will necessarily all by itself make a clean break from a history and culture steeped in millennia of genocidal xenophobia and human supremacy - even before considering that the Denvan historical and cultural context of having fought genocidally against Vellkar for control of Primus and the Denva system over the course of millennia means that the Denvan humans have (in their minds) much more directly present underpinning/foundation for their xenophobia than most Imperial or Imperial-successor worlds' already fanatically xenophobic outlooks.
At best, it seems likely that the Vellkar would be economically and politically subjugated, de facto if not outright enslaved, and likely to be genocided the moment Imperials arrive for political convenience and appeasement. I suppose we could try to evacuate their entire population with us, but it would be an understandably incredibly hard ask to get them to leave their homes and everything they've ever known - not to mention establishing a bad president for future Denva-Xenos contact and relations (tacitly lending legitimacy to a human ethnostate and forced mass expulsions of Xenos they come into contact with who inhabit planets and systems they have an interest in or proximity to, which in of itself is still an act of ethnic cleansing and genocide).
The only way I can see we can (probably) reliably guarantee the Vellkar's continued survival and equitable, peaceful coexistence with the humans (and encourage the most accepting attitude and conduct towards Xenos as possible) after we leave the Denva system is to find a way to the Vellkar and humans to at least lay the groundwork and get the bowl rolling on peacefully and comprehensively integrating both species into a harmonious, equitable and shared civilisation/polity/community of polities (species segregation, no matter how peaceful or amicable, seems guaranteed to sow the seeds of future conflict, especially if and when contact is reestablished with more conventionally orthodox (read genocidally xenophobic) Imperials and/or Imperial-successors, but more conventional reasons for hostilities like resource competition could fuel the fires of rivalry and war just as easily).
Also, I do think we should at least meet the psyker monks before leaving - if nothing else they could give us useful insights into suppressing the Warp, as although we eventually want to utilise the Warp, it strikes me as EXTREMELY important we have as good safeguards and countermeasures as possible to shut down and counteract malicious/hostile/dangerous Warp forces/entities/phenomena/effects, and these monasteries seem like at absolute minimum a priceless opportunity to at least see some attempts at doing so in action and potentially learn from them (even if that's just learning what not to do or doesn't work), an opportunity we are unlikely to be able to so freely access, let alone stumble upon, in the foreseeable future.
Ok, looked at the maps and... wow. Just wow. HOW is this system abandoned!? It's one of two choke point systems in a Web-Center Sub-Sector that is connected to Sub-Sectors that contain a Hive World (Probably somewhere high up in the Sector's government, if not the Sector Capital) and a Sub Sector that either contains a Forge World or leads to the Sub-Sector that does.... @Neablis, is our starting location right in the middle of the Sector like in Sterbelicht or is this a secondary Web-Center? At least it makes sense for a Navigator House to have serious holdings here given the Warp Lanes. Also, can you tell us which Segmentum we are in and the rough position (I'd assume that we would get that information rather easily)? I looked at HeroCooky's Sector map and it doesn't show the Ketharis Sector.
- Location
- Chicago
- Pronouns
- She/They
So, the map plus lack of recent traffic might mean two different things.
First, that we only got the routes of the ships that passed through here, so we'd necessarily be the point where all the paths cross. There might be other, better routes that avoid us, but this gets us the relevant information from our perspective: who is closest and who are they neighbors with.
Second, that we really are at the sector crossroads, and the lack of traffic means the imperial space lanes have been abandoned almost entirely, and most other planets are in the position of being limited to their own relative backyards.
This might be a consequence of the astronomicon going out, and imperials being unable to navigate, which would be nice because it means we can deal with each system in isolation.
First, that we only got the routes of the ships that passed through here, so we'd necessarily be the point where all the paths cross. There might be other, better routes that avoid us, but this gets us the relevant information from our perspective: who is closest and who are they neighbors with.
Second, that we really are at the sector crossroads, and the lack of traffic means the imperial space lanes have been abandoned almost entirely, and most other planets are in the position of being limited to their own relative backyards.
This might be a consequence of the astronomicon going out, and imperials being unable to navigate, which would be nice because it means we can deal with each system in isolation.
- Location
- Sydney,Australia
Before we even consider leaving this system we need to set up our cover for interacting with the imperium and part of that will be the ship we need a heavy cruiser and set up an origin that will be hard to disprove I'm thinking exploritor magos lost in the warp for a couple of thousand years with that we can get an in with the local forge world which can open up doors with the local imperium.
sure the sector might be cut off from the wider galaxy but that just means the local loyalists will be more paranoid so for any planet that has astropaths we need an airtight ID.
sure the sector might be cut off from the wider galaxy but that just means the local loyalists will be more paranoid so for any planet that has astropaths we need an airtight ID.
So - a few things. First, you don't know how those other sub-sectors connect to each other. This certianly does seem like a sensible place for navigator station because of how well-connected it is, but that also means it's probably pretty hideously exposed, and if the Imperium was going to pull back to a more easily-defended front they might abandon this region because they expect it to not be worth trying to hold.
You're probably in the Segmentum Obscurus, though that's mostly relevant because you're not too far from the Eye of Terror.
- Location
- Australia
Could we use astronomy and Mechanicus datalogs to guesstimate our approximate location in the galaxy?
Or is Warp "weather"/storms/rifts/disruptions and Mechanicus + Inquisitorial databank redactions, deletions and paranoia mean that approach isn't viable?
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The problem with the Velkar is they are kind of screwed by their tech level. If they are still in the bronze age that makes them the Na'vi without plot armor. The Denvans will walk over them without even noticing as a space faring technological species and the worst part is there really isn't much incentive to trade. The population of Velkar is so tiny that any population of Velkar could be replaced with humans doing the same job with minimal economic disruption. The only reason not to kill them, or more realistically drive them way from the superconductive metal, would be ideological, but the Denvans are former Imperials, if anything they have an ideological reason to do the opposite.
So basically if we want the Velkar to live we need to actively bargain with or compel the Denvans into it somehow since we do not have time for an uplift on a scale that would change anything.
The Velkar have survived multiple attempted genocides by imperial forces. I'm more worried about coaxing them out of their bunkers than that the Denvans will kill them especially since I don't think the Denvans will be as xenocidal as you might expect from ex-imperials. When we first landed it was stated the Denvans where keen to get in touch with the local Eldari which I think at the very least displays a theoretical capacity to coexist with xenos.
Yes, but the local Eldari are useful trading partners, they are a space-faring society with vastly greater technology. The Velkar on the other hand are in the way of mining efforts, the incentive is inverted.
- Location
- Australia
So we need to figure out a way to incentivise mining and colonisation efforts on Primus to coincide with Vellker survival and prosperity.
Also, I agree we cannot do all the uplifting ourselves in our remaining time in the Denva system, but we could kickstart and accelerate the process by giving them the same STC access/copies as Denva Secundus humans as well as direct industrial support (constructing manufactorums for their use).
Lastly, this might be a bit pedantic, but I think "Vellkar" is spelt with two l's, not one ("Vellkar" instead of "Velkar").
- Location
- Boston
I think the first thing we need to do is get eyes on Primus to figure out what's actually happening there. I'd like to squeeze these spy satellites into our next plan. We can build a tiny system monitor and ~10 of satellites with an order to drop them off at every planet in system. It won't be as good as a dedicated recon mission to a planet, but it will turn over a lot of unknown cards at once. Once we have data we can start making more informed plans
Actually, @Neablis would dropping the satellites off like this take an actual Order action or could it just happen if we have an idle ship. Not sure on the scope.
edit: although, even at 9 gravities I can see that taking several years of travel time for a whole system.
edit edit: not to mention the planning involved for all the orbits and what not... yeah pretty sure this would be a full action but will wait for GM ruling
Actually, @Neablis would dropping the satellites off like this take an actual Order action or could it just happen if we have an idle ship. Not sure on the scope.
edit: although, even at 9 gravities I can see that taking several years of travel time for a whole system.
edit edit: not to mention the planning involved for all the orbits and what not... yeah pretty sure this would be a full action but will wait for GM ruling
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You know your approximate location - the far reaches of segmentum obscuras. You don't know what that means. Well, I suppose you know it's close-ish to the Eye of Chaos and the Imperial military bastions that surround that, but you're also on the wrong side of the great rift, and a lot has changed since even the information you have was entered into the system. Who knows what's around you?
This is an assumption. The Vellkar were being kept off the surface in underground cave systems way back when - but it's been a couple hundred years since then. You have no idea what happened over there beyond "there aren't any high-energy technological sources visible from a planet away."
Hmm. I think if you built a ship and the satellites I'd let you just drop them off as a free action to get basic info. Denva Primus is quite close-by, after all. But it'd be a better action with multiple ships assigned to it and an action put in to map the whole Denva system, at which point you'd get more information depending on a roll. I'd let you do it with one ship, but multiple ships mean you would get to any POIs faster and be able to leave a ship there to investigate them in greater detail.
Update got a bit delayed - still going to try to get it out today.
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Insult Everyone!
Master of Evil but bad at it.
- Location
- Right behind you~
snetnece unfini-
A couple hundred years isn't much in historical terms, our own very recent history aside. Unless there is something odd going on (external influence ancient artifacts etc...) if they were in the bronze age when the Imperials last saw them odds are good they won't be much different now.
Angle
Release Candidate Enby
- Location
- Colorado, USA
- Pronouns
- They/Them/Theirs/Comrade
Eh, having aliens (from their point of view) shooting at them from orbit and dropping example of advanced technology would certainly provide both impetus and possibility for rapid advancement. Though given they have a desert planet, agriculture is probably very difficult, and without agriculture, the kinds of population density needed for societal advancement are hard to sustain...
Pretty much my thought. Even the Tau took several thousand years to make that leap with a much richer planet and that was noted to be a suspiciously fast degree of progress.
Angle
Release Candidate Enby
- Location
- Colorado, USA
- Pronouns
- They/Them/Theirs/Comrade
The Tau didn't have people shooting at them and then dropping examples of advanced technology on their heads though. I imagine that will accelerate things at least a little bit.
I think Tau did have example of advanced technology in the form of Imperial ship that crush landed on there moon.
Unless GW retconned this.