Traveller, The Rise of Empire: A Naval Design, Procurement and Command Quest

I am fairly certain Hermosa is their main world from what we know from Nova Refugio and Sinone. Is it possible for us to get any more information on Hermosa from the refugees at Nova Refugio? When we informed them of Hermosa's expansionism they did ask about the possibility of being relocated to Hexos.

As for the scouting missions, I believe we can only really extend our eyes to the west of Hermosa via buying fuel from Plenty. I would recommend finally sending a diplomatic mission towards them and finding out more about the larger polity they are a part of.
 
[X] OPLAN: Sentinel

Seconding C_Z and Rat King. We do not want to surprise attack an enemy that we have very little intel on, especially not one that appears to be better prepared for war than we are.
 
I napkin mathed a 5500 ton escort carrier and it's a very rough sketch, but I think we could get a decent 36-craft ship. Can include a small medical bay for injured pilots, a squad of jarheads for internal ship security, carries enough missiles for ten sorties from each strikecraft (for a strikecraft carrier variant), plus fuel in internal tanks for ten sorties for each craft.

And that's with an M6 drive, armored bulkheads and 10 points of crystaliron armor.

Also thirty six triple turrets for protection. No major anti-ship armament, but I figure we mostly want this to be throwing fighters or strikecraft around. If we wanted to give it some missile tubes that is also a possibility but we'd have to sacrifice some stuff somewhere.

There's some wiggle room in there for additional fuel and missiles for longer legs, but it's a good start.
 
10-3: At the Edge of Hope
Adhoc vote count started by 4WheelSword on Sep 24, 2024 at 6:16 AM, finished with 27 posts and 9 votes.

  • [X] OPLAN: Sentinel
    [X] OPLAN: Sentinel
    -[X] There is no need to start a shooting war... yet. Begin conducting reconnaissance in force in kind. Continue to probe Sinone and Equus, with an eye toward picking up on orbital defenses and "typical" force compositions in both systems, as well as Hermosan reaction times and any broadcasts for filtration and review by the intelligence arm. Continue internal wargaming of WARPLAN YELLOW and WARPLAN RED.
    --[X] Sinone Group: HSWS Perkunas, IC-III Sekhmet, Sakumo (1x Cruiser, 2x Light Cruiser)
    --[X] Equus Group: HSWS Kyzaghan, IC-III Tohil, Tlaloc (1x Cruiser, 2x Light Cruiser)
    --[X] Heimdall Garrison: MDS Heimdall, 3 frigate type craft, Anchorage squadron
    --[X] Regroup the DSS for a long-range mission to the "north" of Equus to survey beyond the edge of Hermosan space in that sector. Attempt to discover what is beyond the "west" of Hermosan space; utilize FSS to extend range if necessary.
    --[X] If no developments (e.g. attack on Heimdall) within next month, stand down Staging Point Force to Cassalon for regular refits and rest and begin rotating escorts, cruisers, and light cruisers through Heimdall. Reestablish Staging Point as a reactive reserve with two cruiser type craft, two light cruiser type craft, two frigate type craft, and a single FSS to ease strain on active forces. Rotation is - Cassalon for regular refit and maintenance/rest - active reserve in Staging Point - active reconnaissance and garrison in Heimdall. Couriers to be deployed as needed. We cannot remain on high alert and maintain our fleet's readiness. With the MDS deployed to Heimdall, some of the threat is at least ameliorated.
    -[X] One launch tube for every two squadrons, one recovery deck for every squadron.
    -[X] Two additional IC refits (2k tons)
    -[X] Two enhanced frigates using modern technology (1k tons)
    -[X] Set aside 5500 tons for escort carrier build (or, if deemed not worth time, for saving for fleet carrier in 15y09m or other build in new fiscal year).
    -[X] If living quarters and other facilities allow, replace the FB squadron on Heimdall Anchorage with a squadron of new strike fighters and a squadron of EWAR craft. FB squadron should be retained on Cassalon or Home as a ground-based squadron for the foreseeable future.


What say the decision makers? There is no need to start a shooting war... yet.
What is the ratio of launch and recovery decks to squadrons aboard our planned carriers? One launch tube for every two squadrons, one recovery deck for every squadron.
What does the HSWS plan to build? Two additional IC refits (2k tons), Two enhanced frigates using modern technology (1k tons),

Advanced Drive Layouts - TL 9
Improved Plant Efficiencies - TL 9
Quality Hull Construction - TL 10
High-Density Metals - TL 10
Electronics and Sensors - TL 9
Command and Control systems - TL 9
Enhanced Starship-grade Weapons - TL 9

Available Budget: 4107.03MCr
Current Dockyard Usage: 6,000Dtons



Refits and Construction
With such a large chunk of the yard available, and so little money to spend on it, the HSWS gets to work. Two further Interstellar Cruisers are placed in the yards for refits, this time the pair that were kept in reserve for so long that they are the last examples of the block II. Alongside them, steel (or in this case, Crystaliron) is cut for the first of the second flight of Fast Escort Frigates. These enhanced ships will have the thickest armour seen on an HSWS ship, along with enhanced power-plants, triple rather than double turrets and a doubling of the small ships missile tubes. This little vessel will be a remarkable boon as a point-defence platform and as a missile bomber.

Meanwhile, space is also reserved for an escort carrier of 5,500 tons, capable of deploying three squadrons of the light strike craft we have previously designed, however some questions on the specifics have not currently been answered. The design as planned is as follows:

Note the relatively small amount of the ships total tonnage given over to launch and recovery and to storage aboard. Architects are concerned about empty space aboard the ship though the HSWS may find other uses for it:

The current design for the Carrier, Escort, is only 5,200 tons with full armour and a large enough powerplant to maintain the ship. This additional tonnage should be used for:
[ ] To design it as a military hull with even thicker amour.
[ ] To reduce the overall size of the ship to save space and money.
[ ] To mount more weaponry.
[ ] To carry additional craft.
[ ] Other, write in.



Lights in the Dark - 15y09m02w
A deep penetration mission is planned and conducted in the North of Hermosa. Launching from Cassalon, a pair of DSS' loaded with drop tanks rendezvous with an FSS at sector '-02 00' for refuelling before continuing their mission. They are headed for the patch of empty space referred to in charts as Sector '-04 01', which borders Equus but is considered uninhabited. They will spend a month there, charting the nearby systems as they have done tens of times before prior to returning. Getting there will, however, require the use of the newest form of drop tank which should be safer than any previously fitted.

Elsewhere, our forces begin deploying much more strongly. While we still have a variance of up to 30 hours in arrival times in a system, it's easy enough to plot jumps that will bring our ships out far enough from the Hermosan core worlds that our forces can assemble and spend a half day observing at extremely long range. It is hard, doing this, to get any real sense of what is happening in system - we are almost reduced to staring at distant points of light with telescopes after all - but our forces are safe enough and able to make some lingering observations of Sinone and Equus.

We continue to be certain of at least fifteen individual Hermosan Combat Platforms, as well as noting the presence of activity in the (small) yards around both main worlds. The local yards may be preparing defences for a potential attack, one which we have planned in some detail. After all, the WARPLAN YELLOW wargamers are relatively assured of the ability of a concerted strike from Heimdall to destabilise and blockade either Sinone or Equus, assuming the Hermosans are not considerably stronger than we have seen thus far. The purpose of this could be threefold: first, to check Hermosan expansionism, second, to strangle some of their economic strength and third, to demonstrate that Home and the HSWS is not without a capability of its own.

Certainly the Hermosans will be looking at the CFA's (which they have yet to be able to close with in any serious way) and wondering exactly how they are armed, how they are armoured, just how resistant they will be to the massed strikes of their own, smaller principal combat platform. WARPLAN RED planners are concerned about the ability of local forces to resist the sheer number of incoming missiles in the event of an active engagement, although sufficient escorts and defenders would allow us to engage on a more even footing.

Rendezvous in force continues for several months, lasting well into the dawn of the 16th year of HSWS operations. Ships are rotated in and out of service as this new normal develops to the point that both sides are, functionally, trading fleets every few weeks. It is surely only a matter of time until someone fires a missile at just the right time to get an intercept, isn't it?

What is the goal of these operations for the HSWS?
[ ] To attempt to defuse war through a show of strength.
[ ] To demonstrate equivalent capabilities through a show of strength.
[ ] To create a casus belli for war through repeatedly tripping a defence line.
[ ] Other - write in.

Report from the DSS HSWS Hanwi on scouting operations:
- Arrived in Sector -03 00 after drop tank jump. Drive required recalibration. Multiple reports of nausea and irritability among the crew. HSWS Uenuku arrives after 6 hours, reporting significant damage to their J-drive. Rendezvous made and parts were pooled to allow the Uenuku to repair their drive.
- It was decided that Hanwi would continue with the mission while Uenuku would return to Home for full repairs. Uenuku's second drop tank was abandoned prior to jump.
- Jump to unexplored system had no major issues. Mission continued as planned.

Scouting reports demonstrate the presence of nothing beyond Hermosa detected thus far. The Scouting Flotilla requests permission to risk an FSS in sector '-03 00' in order to conduct an even deeper scouting mission at four parsecs distant from controlled space. This would be perhaps the longest range mission conducted by the small force, and would probably require a third DSS to ensure that any maintenance issues are not prohibitive to the completion of the mission.

How does the HSWS feel about this mission?
[ ] Approve it. There's only so little we can risk.
[ ] Do not approve. We have enough intelligence.

Please present votes as plans. Voting opens at
 
At the moment the carrier has no native SAR capability to recover downed pilots. I'm not sure how survivable a 10-ton small craft is, but it can't be good for morale to have nil capability on-board to recover downed aviators.

As to what else to use the spare tonnage for, it's already our most heavily armoured capital ship, I don't think it really needs any further armour (though I'm not 100% clear on what advantage upgrading to a 'military hull' would provide).

It's a carrier, so my suggestion would be to increase smallcraft. An extra squadron and adding 1x each of a launch tube and recovery hangar would be 440 tons, so should be doable. Though at 5,500 tons with x4 squadrons it's probably encroaching slightly on our planned Fleet Carrier.

Could also maybe trim it down to 5000 tons to make it easier to fit into our yards and build multiples of.
 
Scouting reports demonstrate the presence of nothing beyond Hermosa detected thus far. The Scouting Flotilla requests permission to risk an FSS in sector '-03 00' in order to conduct an even deeper scouting mission at four parsecs distant from controlled space. This would be perhaps the longest range mission conducted by the small force, and would probably require a third DSS to ensure that any maintenance issues are not prohibitive to the completion of the mission.


Hm. Is it at all possible to find and intercept anyone in the empty sector? As I understand, there are no systems, and if ships are not delibirately trying to jump to the same place, the probabbility that some else's ship would jump to the same spot is miniscule?
And even when our ships are trying to travel to/trough the empty sectors, they risk jumping to some wildly different spots in empty space, separated?
 
At the moment the carrier has no native SAR capability to recover downed pilots. I'm not sure how survivable a 10-ton small craft is, but it can't be good for morale to have nil capability on-board to recover downed aviators.

well, we can spend tonnage to add SAR shuttles to it. It's not that necessary to launch those trough the tubes, or even land via recovery deck, so we can have them any size. Can make them multi-role.
 
(though I'm not 100% clear on what advantage upgrading to a 'military hull' would provide).
For a increase in hull cost, it allows us to have up to double the armor we could normally have. It can only be added to a ship thats at least 5000t. Something a lot more suitable for a new type of monitor rather than a carrier I'd think.
 
IMO:
[ ] To design it as a military hull with even thicker amour.
This lets us double the armour. Armour lets us better resist fire, especially missile fire.
What is the goal of these operations for the HSWS?
I'd suggest a write-in - our objective is to reconoiter the Hermosans in advance of a possible war so that we can best identify and plan around their strengths and weaknesses.

We need to know what the strategic endgame of a war is. How do we achieve a final victory beyond just defeating the spacecraft stationed at Sinone?
[ ] Approve it. There's only so little we can risk.

I am firmly pro-intel.
While we're at it, we should also throw in a write-in of saying hello to the people of Plenty.
 
[ ] To create a casus belli for war through repeatedly tripping a defence line.

Time to triple the defense budget. Memes aside we should wait until we have more intelligence before we go all in.

[ ] Other, write in.

I think we should add as many secondary capabilities/mission enhancement modules as the ship can handle.

[ ] Approve it. There's only so little we can risk.

Getting more intel is always good
 
I'm not entirely sure how long it has been since we first encountered Plenty but I believe it to have been between 2 or 3 years. I think we're well past the time when we should have sent a follow up diplomatic mission to them to figure out more about the larger polity they are a part of. If we can get permission to refuel with them it would also be great for our current scouting operations.

We also decided to delay sending a diplomatic mission to the three single system polities to the north until the end of the current crisis, but I do not see it ending any time soon. After visiting Plenty I think we ought to finally send one up north to learn more about these initially rather friendly seeming systems.
 
At the moment the carrier has no native SAR capability to recover downed pilots. I'm not sure how survivable a 10-ton small craft is, but it can't be good for morale to have nil capability on-board to recover downed aviators.

As to what else to use the spare tonnage for, it's already our most heavily armoured capital ship, I don't think it really needs any further armour (though I'm not 100% clear on what advantage upgrading to a 'military hull' would provide).

It's a carrier, so my suggestion would be to increase smallcraft. An extra squadron and adding 1x each of a launch tube and recovery hangar would be 440 tons, so should be doable. Though at 5,500 tons with x4 squadrons it's probably encroaching slightly on our planned Fleet Carrier.

Could also maybe trim it down to 5000 tons to make it easier to fit into our yards and build multiples of.

We could use the spare tonnage for a few SAR boats. Although we do want them to be able to come in quick (or have native medical facilities or emergency low berths to keep critically injured pilots alive until they can land).
 
I'd suggest a write-in - our objective is to reconoiter the Hermosans in advance of a possible war so that we can best identify and plan around their strengths and weaknesses.

This suggests war is still the goal, frankly. It also misunderstands the question; it's not about the recon operation, it's about massing forces and sending operations into Hermosan space.

[ ] To demonstrate equivalent capabilities through a show of strength.

Is...more of a balance than I'd like, but I also don't want to tie the hands of a commander on the scene too much.
 
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I think we should go for a war, even if it's poorly motivated in-universe. This is a fleet design and command quest and it'll be more fun if we fight some wars.

I think we should plan to hit Hermosa and its industry directly, rather than bothering with anything but testing or feinting strikes on Equus or Sinone. Hermosa is where the imperial leaders are and it's where the bulk of their industry and shipyards probably is.

We might be able to pin a fleet in Equus or Sinone down by encouraging them to move to well within the 100D radius of some large body that we pretend to target, then we jump our fleets out to the next world in the chain and they won't be able to follow us until they move out of the radius again, which could take a long time, given their reportedly slow drives.
 
If we fight a war, what is the political and strategic objective? To crush Hermosa as a military power? To take colonies/territory? To conquer them entirely? What resources do we have to accomplish those goals? Do we expect those resources to be sufficient? Where would our main effort be and how would we fight the war?

If we're going to fight, we have to consider these questions and plan accordingly.
 
[ ] OPLAN Bulwark
-[ ] Use some of the excess space to include additional hangar space for two to four SAR craft for pilot retrieval (doubling as ship's boats); if a suitable design can be made at ten tons, good. If not, the larger design should include either medical facilities or emergency low berths in order to ensure wounded pilots can be stabilized during docking / landing procedures. Include a third launch tube. Consider this the maximum tonnage once this is accomplished.
-[ ] To attempt to defuse war through a show of strength.
-[ ] Dispatch the diplomatic cruiser on a mission to Plenty to attempt to make second (and more enduring) contact.
-[ ] Approve it. There's only so little we can risk.
 
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Since they're much cheaper than I expected tonnage-wise, I'd like to suggest adding another launch tube. It would let us launch all 3 squadrons at once, doubling our alpha strike capabilities (2x fighter squadrons instead of 1), and we'd still have 200 tons left over for search and rescue.
 
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