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Threads Of Destiny(Eastern Fantasy, Sequel to Forge of Destiny)

Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
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[X] Invited Renxiang to come out with her. Meizhen would be there later as well, so what was one more for the gathering?
 
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Adhoc vote count started by EternalObserver on Nov 28, 2019 at 9:30 PM, finished with 124 posts and 66 votes.
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[X] Invited Renxiang to come out with her. Meizhen would be there later as well, so what was one more for the gathering?
 
[X] Turned away. She had to see to her family first and foremost. Besides, she was sure that Cai Renxiang was too busy to spend the day on something frivolous

I don't think this is quite the rebuke of closeness with Renxiang as some make it out to be. It's just saying not now. It even ends with taking Renxiang's perspective into account, which conforms with a lesson of Ling Qi's domain that applies to family. But that's not my main concern with this vote.

My overwhelming concern is with the Zhengui narrative. We have to remember he suffered an incredibly traumatic event directly on the heels of his moment of triumph. It's very important to have a private word with him to get ahead of things before it turns into another lingering node of alienation between them that goes unaddressed.

It's true that Meizhen will be there regardless, but later. There's room for a private talk. With us dragging along Renxiang, there basically isn't. Talk yes, private no.

The issue for me is not whether we bond with Renxiang, it's where we fit things in the narrative. This entire war arc is full of ties to Renxiang, especially with our assigned missions. The narrative is inherently cooperative with her in particular and almost can't fail to have future opportunities, and easily ones of more significance than this which has no particular connection to the girl whatsoever. Moments of true relevance to Zhengui and Ling Qi's relationship are fleeting, and we need to size the atmosphere where we find it.

Zhengui is my priority and I don't want distractions with it. I'm tired of it being a problem, and it's even a barrier to other relationships, like Xuan Shi. We made a choice to prioritize our mission above fighting by his side before; now that there's no pressing duty, we owe him our undivided attention. It is inappropriate to appropriate this moment for the benefit of a tentative and speculative connection with our liege.

Thor's Twin said:
We might be able to start the process of making Wang Chao a friend by working on this angle. He wants something from Meizhen, either personally or a Clan thing, but doesn't seem to have the courage to actually pursue it.
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I don't see any reason to assume his motivation was all that much more complicated than ours was when we first met her. She's comparatively isolated at social events, and that can be perceived as an "in". Makes sense for him given how little traction he had with peer provincial scions.
 
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AbeoLogos said:
The issue for me is not whether we bond with Renxiang, it's where we fit things in the narrative. This entire war arc is full of ties to Renxiang, especially with our assigned missions. The narrative is inherently cooperative with her in particular and almost can't fail to have future opportunities, and easily ones of more significance than this which has no particular connection to the girl whatsoever. Moments of true relevance to Zhengui and Ling Qi's relationship are fleeting, and we need to size the atmosphere where we find it.

Zhengui is my priority and I don't want distractions with it. I'm tired of it being a problem, and it's even a barrier to other relationships, like Xuan Shi. We made a choice to prioritize our mission above fighting by his side before; now that there's no pressing duty, we owe him our undivided attention. It is inappropriate to appropriate this moment for the benefit of a tentative and speculative connection with our liege.
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This is actually convincing to me.

[X] Turned away. She had to see to her family first and foremost. Besides, she was sure that Cai Renxiang was too busy to spend the day on something frivolous
 
[X] Invited Renxiang to come out with her. Meizhen would be there later as well, so what was one more for the gathering?
 
AbeoLogos said:
[X] Turned away. She had to see to her family first and foremost. Besides, she was sure that Cai Renxiang was too busy to spend the day on something frivolous


I don't think this is quite the rebuke of closeness with Renxiang as some make it out to be. It's just saying not now. It even ends with taking Renxiang's perspective into account, which conforms with a lesson of Ling Qi's domain that applies to family. But that's not my main concern with this vote.


My overwhelming concern is with the Zhengui narrative. We have to remember he suffered an incredibly traumatic event directly on the heels of his moment of triumph. It's very important to have a private word with him to get ahead of things before it turns into another lingering node of alienation between them that goes unaddressed.


It's true that Meizhen will be there regardless, but later. There's room for a private talk. With us dragging along Renxiang, there basically isn't. Talk yes, private no.


The issue for me is not whether we bond with Renxiang, it's where we fit things in the narrative. This entire war arc is full of ties to Renxiang, especially with our assigned missions. The narrative is inherently cooperative with her in particular and almost can't fail to have future opportunities, and easily ones of more significance than this which has no particular connection to the girl whatsoever. Moments of true relevance to Zhengui and Ling Qi's relationship are fleeting, and we need to size the atmosphere where we find it.


Zhengui is my priority and I don't want distractions with it. I'm tired of it being a problem, and it's even a barrier to other relationships, like Xuan Shi. We made a choice to prioritize our mission above fighting by his side before; now that there's no pressing duty, we owe him our undivided attention. It is inappropriate to appropriate this moment for the benefit of a tentative and speculative connection with our liege.
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The fact of the matter is, native space is limited, and setups like this are exceedingly rare; (CRX after post-trauma from Liming puppeting, shortly following a talk with Shenhua before the court[1] and finding out about her sister's birth). With the context Lin Hei gave us and CRX this vulnerable, this is clearly a turning point.

The framing of the vote is putting into question the nature of our relationship with CRX; do we reach out and attempt to integrate her as a friend and potential family or are we gonna keep things professional (in this situation, which will inform similar choices should they arise). Trying to reframe it to be about Zhengui is ignoring the context.

And sure, Zhengui could use more narrative development but trying to force that out of this situation would be a disservice both to him and CRX.

And frankly you should know better. I'd accept argument in favor of keeping a close but professional relationship but this isn't the first time you're making a contrarian vote with flimsy justification (valid but unrelated in this case). If you're doing this for sake of trolling, please stop, or at least make it more obvious.


[1] And that sure looks like Shenhua making a display for her court and a continued lesson for Renxiang, neither of which help her mental state.
 
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[X] Invited Renxiang to come out with her. Meizhen would be there later as well, so what was one more for the gathering?

Zhengui was critically necessary to the successful defense of Ling Qi's assigned village. Renxiang is required to tell him that he's the Goodest Boy!
 
[X] Invited Renxiang to come out with her. Meizhen would be there later as well, so what was one more for the gathering?

CRX needs something to take her mind off tyrannosaurus regina
 
You know, Renxiang seeing us interact with Zhengui might just influence her reactions to Liming.

Not sure if it will be a good or bad influence though, but our closeness to our spirits are certainly unique enough to be noted by Xuilan since we arent treating them as just tools, but closer to the Bai and the like. And Meizhen doesnt really show overt affection to Cui to catch the eye of other people.
 
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[X] Turned away. She had to see to her family first and foremost. Besides, she was sure that Cai Renxiang was too busy to spend the day on something frivolous
 
[X] Invited Renxiang to come out with her. Meizhen would be there later as well, so what was one more for the gathering?
 
yrsillar said:
Although there were no obvious physical signs of it, there was a certain haggard air to Cai Renxiang as she sat there, quietly polishing her saber. She had no wounds, nor any dark circles around her eyes, not even a single split end or strand of hair out of place. Yet on some level, to Ling Qi she felt… frayed for lack of a better word. It reminded her of the tournament, that day after she had spent the night with the Duchess. "And you Lady Renxiang, were you injured in battle?" It was a little bit of a gamble, to use such familiar terms, she had never been given invitation but… Lin Hai's words returned to her thoughts.

Cai Renxiang gave her a sharp look, and in her lap, Cifeng shook imperceptibly, but the girl did not chide her. "Do not allow the demeanor of Sir Lin to corrupt you, Ling Qi. Neither you nor I are so highly placed that we might afford undue indiscretion."

"I will keep that in mind," Ling Qi replied demurely, folding her hands in her lap. Renxiang had not told her off, really.
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Reading behind the lines(as Ling Qi is getting better at), Renxiang basically said "Not so familiarly in public."
She wasn't directly reprimanded, only warned. And Renxiang is incredibly direct in private, she'd simply tell Ling Qi not to if she meant that.

Also some subtext Ling Qi might not have picked up is that such familiar terms might make people assume...similar relations to Shenhua going on.


yrsillar said:
Ling Qi hesitated a moment. "...Are they really new though? I have known about various things beneath the earth for some time, and the Elders know. Surely no one was really unaware of the caverns and the things that live in them."

"I have no doubt that they were aware enough. I have no doubt that Mother was aware as well," Cai Renxiang replied. She did not look up, instead gazing into the gemstone set Cifeng's side. Ling Qi sensed a faint pulse of sharp metallic qi, echoing through Cai Renxiang's aura. "However, that is not the issue."

It took Ling Qi a moment to mull over what she meant. "...Ah, they can't just treat it as a deadly wilderness anymore."

Cai Renxiang let out a long breath and flicked her wrist, storing the oilcloth away. She studied the blade in the light of her own radiance, before raising her eyes to meet Ling Qi's. "It is not only that. Mother has unsealed a number of archives that indicate certain interests into exploiting those realms in the most recent century."
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...just how many clans have been boosting their profits by looting the underground like a wilderness?

yrsillar said:
"I find it unlikely that the timing is unrelated, and whatever else one might say, the coordination necessary to stage this attack and make alliance with several Cloud Tribes… It indicates a certain sophistication among these subterrene barbarians," Cai Renxiang continued. Pale blue thread spun into existence, reforming the sheath of her saber.
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So, presuming theres an UnderEmpire, then that suggests these probes had changed to full scale harvesting operations.

And the UnderEmpire is picking it up as "barbarian raids increasing, launch retaliatory expedition."
If its full on the scale of the Empire, then we got a Problem. The Empire never really had to deal with anyone being able to reliably field high level cultivators.
yrsillar said:
"The Bao are the most effected, their interests mostly lie in and beneath the earth, though mostly in healthier caverns. They seem to be the most discontent, though I have not been able to ascertain why, beyond the obvious costs to their business."

"I'll look into it," Ling Qi replied. Bao Qingling's comment struck her, was there something more there? Bao Qian seemed the sort that might be in the know too, but she was much less certain of her ability to get him to tell her anything.
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I can't imagine the Bao didn't know what lies under the earth, not with their ancestor.

I wonder if they had secret trade arrangements that got fucked up by sudden outbreak of hostilities?

yrsillar said:
"My thanks," Cai Renxiang said. "Of the Meng, they turn inward as always, and my sources at court indicate that they blame other clans delvings for this, the Bao in particular. There has been a grudge between those clans since the days of the Hui, when the Bao used the chaos to expand their borders through the Meng's northern lands. It concerns me to see such fractures flaring up again."

It still struck her as strange, Ling Qi admitted, to imagine days when nobles of the same province were openly fighting each other and expanding at one another's expense. They were all people of the empire, it gave her a disquieting feeling. "...And the Diao?"

"The Prime Minister will not allow any complaints," Cai Renxiang replied dryly, and Ling Qi eyed her curiously, was that a hint of genuine antipathy, or had she just imagined things.
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From what I recall on the politics, this isn't anything new, just one more burr irritating them.
yrsillar said:
"However some elements grumble regardless, they would rather mount proper retaliation than abandon their delvings, and the Jia clan remains in their camp. The Luo are happy enough to build their defenses I believe. If you could speak with Sir Luo on that matter, I would be appreciative."
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And thats pressing the escalation button.
We don't know how big the Gnawing Ones are, but we could be facing anything from a provincial to an Imperial scale fight if things escalate fast enough.
yrsillar said:
Cai Renxiang gave her a curt nod of acknowledgement. "I require you to make friends with Wang Chao. His clan is making aggressive rumblings as well, and I worry that they are beginning to drift from the Cai families orbit. While their connections to the Diao are well and fine, the Prime Minister will not be matriarch forever."

Ling Qi grimaced, recalling the boy from Cai's parties, he had not left a good impression on her, but… she would try. It felt a little odd to set out to 'make friends' with someone based on a command, but she would just have to do her best. Perhaps she could speak with him at the next gathering? "As you command, Lady Cai."
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This would be the..."launch punitive raids on the Cloud Tribes, they'd never learn otherwise" guy?
yrsillar said:
"Very good," the heiress breathed out, and the light that played around her shoulders brightened a little. "Allow me to commend the efforts you have made already," she added. "Without your show of martial prowess, the task might be impossible. Many indiscretions may be ignored in victory. You performed above my expectations."

Argent Sect: Rank 3
-Inner Sect Disciples: 0
"Thank you, Lady Renxiang," Ling Qi replied with some surprise. "I will make sure to build on my victories."
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I reckon you don't really want to speak ill of someone who stopped an attack on three fronts when the Sect is at war.

Or in general.
 
veekie said:
The Empire never really had to deal with anyone being able to reliably field high level cultivators.
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This is plain wrong, for one most imperial conflict is internal and they have anything up to White (and in one notable example: a sublime ancestor).

Other than that, the fish people in the north have their own sublime, the recently "subjugated" western territories likely punched pretty hard with their sublime flower goddess, what with the current 5th realm+ wildlife, and down south Zhou faced off with Violet Khans more than once. Ogodei at prism was remarkable sure, but only in hindsight of recent history, and we know those barbarians have their own sublime-type they either fear or worship.
 
veekie said:
Also some subtext Ling Qi might not have picked up is that such familiar terms might make people assume...similar relations to Shenhua going on.
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Oh right, Shenhua already kinda sorta joked about us being a Linqin Junior when she first saw us didn't she?

yrsillar said:
"This one, on the other hand… I approve, Renxiang. It seems you have inherited my aesthetic tastes," Some distant part of Ling Qi's mind that wasn't screaming danger warning at her was confused, until the Duchess' gaze flicked away, drawing hers with it, to the other woman present.

Minister Linqin, with her dark skin, neatly combed but clearly wavy dark brown hair, looked back, unamused. "My Lady, perhaps now is not the time for jests," she reminded gently, somehow unphased at the Duchess' attention.
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Yeah, I can believe those sort of rumors are just waiting for an excuse to start flying.
 
[X] Invited Renxiang to come out with her. Meizhen would be there later as well, so what was one more for the gathering?
 
Black Noise said:
The fact of the matter is, native space is limited, and setups like this are exceedingly rare; (CRX after post-trauma from Liming puppeting, shortly following a talk with Shenhua before the court[1] and finding out about her sister's birth). With the context Lin Hei gave us and CRX this vulnerable, this is clearly a turning point.

The framing of the vote is putting into question the nature of our relationship with CRX; do we reach out and attempt to integrate her as a friend and potential family or are we gonna keep things professional (in this situation, which will inform similar choices should they arise). Trying to reframe it to be about Zhengui is ignoring the context.

And sure, Zhengui could use more narrative development but trying to force that out of this situation would be a disservice both to him and CRX.

And frankly you should know better. I'd accept argument in favor of keeping a close but professional relationship but this isn't the first time you're making a contrarian vote with flimsy justification (valid but unrelated in this case). If you're doing this for sake of trolling, please stop, or at least make it more obvious.


[1] And that sure looks like Shenhua making a display for her court and a continued lesson for Renxiang, neither of which help her mental state.
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And yet, that's not what the vote options actually say. That's what we are hoping they might lead to, but @AbeoLogos makes a great point that the vote options don't actually say that, and if we are talking about precedent he has made the same great point multiple times when we voted to make one option for something the option didn't quite say, and he ended up right about his take on the voting option. That he has a track record of reading a vote correctly should not be taken as "Oh, he is trolling because he often has a differing opinion".

[] Invited Renxiang to come out with her. Meizhen would be there later as well, so what was one more for the gathering?
[X] Turned away. She had to see to her family first and foremost. Besides, she was sure that Cai Renxiang was too busy to spend the day on something frivolous

If we look at the actual voting option, it can be construed as 'step toward adding CRX in the family', but it's actual direct effect is 'Does Ling Qi want to help her right now when it will likely be at the cost of Meizhen, Zhengui and the rest of her family?'

I think 'step one of adding CRX to the family' might be important... but it's actually the very first 'family time' we have had with Meizhen since we got to the inner sect, and it's also one of the very, very rare time where Zhengui is relevant as an actual person in the thread. For someone who thinks both Zhengui and Meizhen are being sidelined out of the Family, this can also be taken as the third step to said sidelining.
 
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