The Long Night Part One: Embers in the Dusk: A Planetary Governor Quest (43k) Complete Sequel Up

Investigate the Sea?

  • Yes

    Votes: 593 80.4%
  • No

    Votes: 145 19.6%

  • Total voters
    738
Also has anyone considered the advantage of a hyper-reactor battlecruiser armed with Graviton weaponry. They are mentioned to be effective against biological targets like say tyranids and they take little enough time to design we might be able to build some by the time the tyranids reach the trust.
 
Also has anyone considered the advantage of a hyper-reactor battlecruiser armed with Graviton weaponry. They are mentioned to be effective against biological targets like say tyranoids and they take little enough time to design we might be able to build some by the time the tyranoids reach the trust.

we're not sure how it would work against nids. it could be either amazing or worthless.
 
that is another point, he is learning 32, which is good but not legendary. If it's even vaguly possible for him to figure it out, callmus likely will crack it on its own. They probly have a fair number of biologis who are just flat better at it than he is.
I think Archmagos Biologis may count as a master trait, but yeah no +X masters save for psycic expert.

That being said Callamus likely doesn't deal with as complex stuff as he does on a regular basis even if it is in a different field normally. If nothing else Maximal is absolutely used to headache inducing complexity.


At the end of the day we can both work towards it and hopefully at the end compare notes and fix both the issues. Tis the dream anyway.

I'm serious. I don't see the Utter Bastard on my list.
Why isn't it?

It's one of the most destructive pieces of wildlife we've encountered.

Bloody Bastards.

Also has anyone considered the advantage of a hyper-reactor battlecruiser armed with Graviton weaponry. They are mentioned to be effective against biological targets like say tyranids and they take little enough time to design we might be able to build some by the time the tyranids reach the trust.
we're not sure how it would work against nids. it could be either amazing or worthless.
Pretty much.

Best case scenario the guns can bypass armour and hit the soft bits of the Nids like the brain.

Worst case its bloody useless and regardless of the best case using them still requires that you get close to Nid ships where they excel like nobody else.
 
that is another point, he is learning 32, which is good but not legendary. If it's even vaguly possible for him to figure it out, callmus likely will crack it on its own. They probly have a fair number of biologis who are just flat better at it than he is.
Well it is a multi step project and note it's been a while since his learning stat gets raised so imagine that it would be rare for him to get the chance to improve outside major projects. Also the longer he is alive the more he will improve. Also as people keep pointing out it seems like a bad idea to not do something because we assume that some other polity would research something. We don't know if Callamus actually intends to do so and may just decide to focus their resources on typical Mechanicus forces over TWs.
 
Because my list specifically concerns the stuff that's unlikely to result in a Telepathica project for another psyker-power.
Well it is a multi step project and note it's been a while since his learning stat gets raised so imagine that it would be rare for him to get the chance to improve outside major projects. Also the longer he is alive the more he will improve. Also as people keep pointing out it seems like a bad idea to not do something because we assume that some other polity would research something. We don't know if Callamus actually intends to do so and may just decide to focus their resources on typical Mechanicus forces over TWs.
It seems like a bad idea to me to schedule his time for the next twenty years when we want to be able to study Tyranid biology as soon as possible so we can develop counter-measures before time's up.
 
Well it is a multi step project and note it's been a while since his learning stat gets raised so imagine that it would be rare for him to get the chance to improve outside major projects. Also the longer he is alive the more he will improve. Also as people keep pointing out it seems like a bad idea to not do something because we assume that some other polity would research something. We don't know if Callamus actually intends to do so and may just decide to focus their resources on typical Mechanicus forces over TWs.

i'm not saying it would not help him get better, but he is nowhere near being a pargon, so assuming one big legendary feat would do it is being overly optimistic.

we also have explicit word of durin that other powers are orders of magnitude better than us at research. Callamus probably has dozens of learning 40+ biologis, them not researching thunder warriors would be strange.
 
What do you expect to get from this, besides killing Max?
We don't need another project for the Psykana to research a new power from, we're already getting them yet another one of those with the Threnody Dragons.
What we do need are stimpacks for our troops.
Amrita Amanita and Alchemical Slugs.
First of all, saying it'll kill Max is plain fearmongering. Dude's nearly as boss in Combat as a Space Marine sword saint and he's been doing this shit ages. He will be fine. Don't do the crappy thing that is baseless fearmongering.

As for why we're doing the Invisible Dragons, it's not to research a new power. We're looking into them because they are proven hero killers. Researching them does two things. First, it means our heroes are more likely to survive Avernus. Second, it gets us our own Invisible Dragons, just like it got us thundabeasts and tyrant lizards, which'll improve our hero-killing ability.

@Enjou
Diplomacy
SLOT A - Year 1
-Y1: Ask Vlad (Anti-Tyranid tactics)
-Y2: Trade Talks (Vanaheim, Build a Black Ship)
-Y3: Ask Vlad (Anything he knows about the Alpha Legion)
-Y4: Re-Examine (Governor Bertil of Vanaheim)
-Y5:

Need a last action. I'm flexible here too.
Please follow up on the Euryale diplomacy from last turn. The action would be Request Information to get us contacts with other peoples, who may be able to help Lin with Primordial Sea.

SLOT B - Year 3 (Biologis)
-Y3: Fixing the The Flaws of Thunder: Part One
As I noted above, I think Invisible Dragons would be best. They're hero killers, so studying them will improve our heroes' survival rates and give us our own stock of hero-killing wildlife.

If that doesn't appeal to you, I'd like to suggest doing the Draining Rabbit, the Durin-created creature that drains nearby creatures' energy to sustain its own. It'd be great in the hands of our choirs, since they can drain our non-psychic assets to continue doing psychic stuff.

Still need a last action for Ridcully and an action for Aria.
Please please please do the 1-year Research action on the shrine fairies. Durin said it's the first step to understanding their language. After we get their language, we can learn how to do Rituals, which would greatly increase our ability to do massive psychic workings.
 
This isn't for telepathica, its just to stop these bleeding drakes blowing people up.
Yeah, I heard something about a +10% survival chance from it. And it does sound very good indeed.
But I want the stuff on the list done before we risk Max on something this risky.
First of all, saying it'll kill Max is plain fearmongering. Dude's nearly as boss in Combat as a Space Marine sword saint and he's been doing this shit ages. He will be fine. Don't do the crappy thing that is baseless fearmongering.
To clear things up, I'm saying it's a substantial risk. Or I tried to say that, and failed.
 
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The dude has 47 Combat. He does not need to be a Paragon Combatant to do this research. Making ourselves wait until then is unjustifiably overcautious.
phwssssh :confused: ..... alright, if you guys are sure, I'll add it to the original list.

Pure Alum - purifies water.
Fountainclod - produces saltwater from nothing.
Alchemical Slug - "incredibly, phenomenally poisonous", "take in and refine any toxin to which they are exposed", "may be applicable to other chemicals as well", sounds good against Tyranid and Orks, possible industrial uses.
Samsonite Algae - "photosynthetic pathways are remarkably efficient", just what the farmer ordered.
Amrita Amanitas - another addition to the Avernite kitchen, and stims for troops. And you know you like to improve our troops. Possible combo with Alchemical Slug.
True Deathcap - "will eventually consume plant matter, organic substrates (such as most plastics) and even synthetic and metallic compounds." Should be good for getting rid of Chaos-tainted materials, and other kinds of trash. And against Tyranids.
Camo Crocs - another potential layer of camo for our guys.
Soul Oyster - "A battle cannon will only scratch its shell, it fuses with the seafloor and turns it as hard as adamantium, and its "mother o pearl" is outright immune to psychic powers, with even soul-eaters being unable to consume it." suggested a while back by Andres110. Should be good for reinforcing armor and psyker-proofing. Could make our Black Ships even better.
Avalanche Shrub - could help in siege warfare and mining.
Utter Bastard Dragon - to reduce risk of hero-deaths. Probably worth a double-down to minimize the risk to Max. And to help actually researching the elusive bastards.
Untwisted Tungsten - counters spatial disruptions. Might be handy for exploring caverns, the Space-Warped Vale, perhaps even settling that region, should be good against enemy teleportation. "Pretty sure this is native to the space vale." - Doomed Wombat.
Quickbloom - grows fast, breaks down things. Researching poison lichen saved us a hundred million Thrones, thirty million Material and eighty million Metal a year. That was way back when our numbers were even lower. Location unknown.
Xifrum - particularly tough weed, so it can probably grow anywhere, Durin says it's an anti-coagulant. Location unknown.
Warproot - pollen affects psykers. Might be useful for helping our psykers, might be useful against rogue or enemy psykers. Either sure could be important. Location unknown.
Jumplings - "seems to be able to move to different points on the timeline". In time-twisted plains, unsettleable region.

We've surveyed Avernus' Spine (turn 24), Everglades (48), Azure Islands(65) , Aridia(65) and Elysium(65)
 
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Please please please do the 1-year Research action on the shrine fairies. Durin said it's the first step to understanding their language. After we get their language, we can learn how to do Rituals, which would greatly increase our ability to do massive psychic workings.
I'll second this, any chance at being able to do our own rituals should be taken.
 
SLOT C - Year 5
-Y5: Expand Shipyards: Large
-- EXPEDITE YEAR 5
I think this should be swapped out for a PD ship, either Escort or Cruiser. It'd be 1-2 years and help fight strikecraft-heavy enemies, such as the orks and potentially still the tyranids.

SLOT A - Year 2
-Y2: Personal Attention: Thunder Warriors: Laying the Path
The Implement action for Ordinatus would be a mere 2 years. After that, it'd be Fabricator-General actions to actually set it up. There isn't much else for F-G to do to help the tyranid war, and Ordinatus would help more than Cybernetica, I think. You'll still have the Thunder Warriors, just 2 years later.
 
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The Implement action for Ordinatus would be a mere 2 years. After that, it'd be Fabricator-General actions to actually set it up. There isn't much else for F-G to do to help the tyranid war, and Ordinatus would help more than Cybernetica. You'll still have the Thunder Warriors, just 2 years later.
Not commenting on wether or not to build Ordinatii. Just remember that the Cybernetica, whom I give good odds against a pre War Tyranid Warrior, is the smallest of the robots. The description when we got them states that they range in size from sentinels to Knights.
 
We do have an IC reason now.

Samples wanted to find out about nid capabilities since we know none.

But, given the need for samples from this specific fleet I'd still rather ask HWWO if he's got time ATM.
Didn't the Eldar plan to do it for free? Would make sense that they would since the Nids are a galactic threat and would definitely say yes because of that.
 
Didn't the Eldar plan to do it for free? Would make sense that they would since the Nids are a galactic threat and would definitely say yes because of that.
We do have to contact them, but yes they can give us bits from old fleets for free.

Its a minor favour to get nid bits from the fleet that is en-route since they have to dispatch forces to...you know. Kill em etc.
 
We do have to contact them, but yes they can give us bits from old fleets for free.

Its a minor favour to get nid bits from the fleet that is en-route since they have to dispatch forces to...you know. Kill em etc.
I been wondering but could the mystical lion actual kidnap a queen? Since the Tryanids in large numbers tends to weaken warp entities.
 
I been wondering but could the mystical lion actual kidnap a queen? Since the Tryanids in large numbers tends to weaken warp entities.
I dunno hence why I asked if he could. He's not exactly a normal warp entity if indeed Phase Lions are warp entities full time.

Regardless transcendent so maybe him in cooperation with Ridcully?
 
Survey
Written by @Reynal

@Durin, something to help the Primordial Sea action when we do it.
-----------

To Survey the Sea
The Primordial Sea. Perhaps the sole underpinning of reality, immense in importance, yet even its existence could only be deduced from the tangential effects it had upon all that was through beings that despite their might by all rights should not have been able to so much as touch its immeasurable power.

For all his faith, his knowledge, and even the neigh-impossible resistance to corruptive forces gifted to him by the Emperor and developed through those few trials that could strain even it, contemplation of such a thing held dangers of death and far worse uncountable. It was a humbling reminder that for all that he could seek those secrets that others could not even learn of else the mere knowledge warp them that he, too, had his limits in such an arena.

There was much to be done before he could take the time to truly contemplate those thoughts unthinkable and truths impossible. Always so much to be done, always too little time—it was a fact of life in general made obvious on Avernus in specific, but there had been blessedly few circumstances where it was writ as large as it was now. It was not hubris to state that none could take up the mantle for discovering such things when he passed, a day that came ever closer.

No, before he took that risk it would be best to ensure that as much of the work that only he could do was done and that the secrets he had learned so far did not die with him. It was not from cowardice that he delayed his contemplations. Death held no fear for him, he had resigned himself to its inevitability long ago, and the thought of shunning work that could benefit humanity simple to put it off was repugnant. Practicality was what kept him from digging into the perilous depths of the truths and concepts found in the sea.

Practicality, however, also dictated that he take the time to properly consider what shapes the Truths he would seek to find might form. To do a survey before an excavation, to think not contemplate. He was no fool—he would never seek to plunge into the depths without a clue as to what he might find there even if it posed no threat to him, simply for efficiency's sake—but the prospect of danger warranted further care in his approaches. Consideration had to be made for not just where Truths might be found, but where dangers could lurk. What order to investigate things in, while both minimizing the risks and maximizing the odds of finding what he sought. There was a difference, after all, between to think and to contemplate, as he could take as much time as he wished to think on such things without danger. It would not allow him to directly probe at and discover the truth, no, but it was still potentially productive.

Intellectually speaking, the topic in question was fascinating. Little was known, and all so far from his own efforts. A layer of existence from which reality was born and that will outlast its eventual death. Powerful beyond comprehension, or perhaps something beyond power, merely exhibiting the traits of power at the observable level of reality. A force of change, twisting those it touches.

While he had learned such things about it already, there was still so much more unknown, both in its specifics and in its fundamental nature. Was it a force of destructive change in the universe due to the Primordial Sea's inherent nature tilted towards destruction, or was it because the existence of reality made the overall nature of change within it favor destruction? Or is it due to Ridcully's recently discovered Law of Attraction causing the power drawn from it to seek to return there through the unmaking of reality? Did reality spring from it alone, like foam on the surface of the sea (or, as that technically requires air, as a cavitation bubble forms in water), or was there another layer of existence that acted with the Primordial Sea to form reality? How did it form a connection with the Chaos Gods, or anything in reality in the first place? How does it spread? Can the connection be severed, the spread curtailed? All valid questions, all vital knowledge, all unknown, and all unknowable without truly contemplating the true nature of the Sea.

However, just because they were unknown and could not be discovered without difficult, time consuming, and dangerous plunges into the borderline incomprehensible nature of that facet of reality, it did not mean that likely theories could not be developed ahead of time and tests designed to show one from the other. The fundamental process of science, one of the Emperor's great loves in life, and one that mankind as a whole had been rediscovering since the stagnation and fanaticism of the past had been slowly shed. He would no more test these theories without proper preparation than a Magos would play with uncontained antimatter next to a plasma reactor, but they could still be examined for their agreement with what is currently known, refined to better explain observations, and tests of their truth designed and examined for imperfections. Progress was slow, and payoff was far from immediate, but it had long since been demonstrated to be the safest and surest way to learn the secrets of the universe.

He had high hopes it would allow him to learn the secrets beyond the universe as well.
 
@Enjou
For the spend time with instead of just grandchild can you switch it to something like family or blood family so it is all three Syr, Sigmund, and new child? We know that it is possible to do certain groups instead of only individuals.
 
@Durin by samples do you mean corpses or samples of tissues? Or do you mean a living and breathing Queen?
tissue samples mostly
This brings up a point actually.

@Durin
1 Are any of the other Trust worlds planning to make use of Thunder Warriors?
1. Midgard is looking into it, otherwise no
@Durin
1) If we spend the Honorbound on getting the Krork to set up shop next door what kind of combat power are we looking at for such a newly formed base?
2) How much would they expand this combat ability in 20 years?
3) How big of an inconvenience would doing this be for the Krork?
4) Can we get them to set up a smaller initial base through using the Major favor?

Thank you for your time.
1. a lot is all you know
2. pretty fast
3. unknown
4. no
 
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