Let's not. I can't think of what good that could do us.
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The Long Night Part One: Embers in the Dusk: A Planetary Governor Quest (43k) Complete Sequel Up
- Thread starter Durin
- Start date
Let's not. I can't think of what good that could do us.
Doomed Wombat
Let's go Darling!
- Location
- Dancing on wires!
Less chance of us being caught flat footed if either of us does something dumb.
Less likelihood of an idiot from either faction doing something dumb.
Possibly the start of integration of our militaries on Avernus for exploration ect.
No reason not to.
Eh, sorry. Messed up deleting a quote in a multi-quote and got the wrong person. Now fixed.
We have pretty low relations with other planets in the trust. I'd like to prioritize them over our xeno zoo.
Other than Vanaheim, our lowest relationship is with Svartalfheim (4) and then next-lowest is with Niflheim (5) and Alfheim (5).
Our Quartok relationship is 2.
Now I'm certainly willing to accept that the other Trust worlds are more important than the Quartok, but let's put some numbers to it. What level of Relationship do you want to get those Trust worlds to before you're willing to spend actions on the zoo? All 6 or higher? More?
I'd be willing to accept 6 as a minimum across the board, sure.
HanEmpire
Delicious
The other worlds have acceptable relations with Avernus for now. I'd like to get started on stabilizing Quartok-Human relations so that the Quartok will be ready to serve their role: as an example of benevolent aliens we can use as precedent for dealing with other xenos. We can't really do that if our relations with Quartok remains as crappy as it is now, and the process of changing public view of Quartok will take a long time, so it'd be best to start early as possible.
It'll be half a century or more before we dare bring up changing anyone's view on xenos after the last debacle IMO.
That seems like a pretty good goal. I've noticed that a lot of turns, we seem to spend action after action trying to push an already high relationship even higher... which of course is more likely to fail. Maybe we would be better off specifying actions to repeat until we get one of those low relationship worlds one higher, then move on to the next one. It could be much more diplomatically efficient than spending five years plugging at the same world,
Doomed Wombat
Let's go Darling!
- Location
- Dancing on wires!
He's not referring to that, he's referring to our propaganda.
The thing is, nobody blamed them for that, it was all aimed at us.
@durin said 10 years and we gave him a fighting chance, don't give up hope.
Our apology will probably also give him a boost.
Doomed Wombat
Let's go Darling!
- Location
- Dancing on wires!
Yes we can do the apology action and maybe by getting a few more points, but at the moment we're more likely to crit fail and piss off more people.
HanEmpire
Delicious
Oh, well that's no problem. Avernites using propaganda on themselves won't be nearly as big of a scandal as us doing the same to other worlds. And since it's on Avernus we can much better control the flow of information.
I have to admit that I had been wondering how to improve relations with the Quartok, and it didn't even occur to me would could simply do a Diplomatic Relations (Quartok) action.
ArchAIngel
Sorcerer Supreme.
- Location
- Right behind you.
Holy shit, Space Marines.
Okay, let's start making some of the best goddamn shit we possibly CAN. We need hero units that aren't unique and irreplaceable ASAP, and they're perfect for it.
Plus, Ultramarines are the easiest to rebuild given their gene-seed.
And IIRC, Strike Cruisers have pretty bitching Machine Spirits, so we should repair and upgrade it for a nice ship for free. Actually, that'd be a good peace offering to Vanaheim, given it's a fucking Space Marine ship, so that's tons of prestige.
Okay, let's start making some of the best goddamn shit we possibly CAN. We need hero units that aren't unique and irreplaceable ASAP, and they're perfect for it.
Plus, Ultramarines are the easiest to rebuild given their gene-seed.
And IIRC, Strike Cruisers have pretty bitching Machine Spirits, so we should repair and upgrade it for a nice ship for free. Actually, that'd be a good peace offering to Vanaheim, given it's a fucking Space Marine ship, so that's tons of prestige.
About the marines: I think the most we can expect from them is some sort of alliance, like the one existed between Space Wolves and the Navigator house of Belisarus in Space Wolves books. We will provide them with equipment upgrades and maybe recruits, and in return they will send help when we are threatened, maybe station a company on one of our worlds.
The best part of this alliance is that the Ultras are well respected in the old Imperium, which means the worlds that have not gone full chaotic or xeno-humping will be more likely to listen to them than to us, who are borderline heretical if judged by old Imperial standards. If the word of this alliance spreads, it will be far easier for the Imperial Trust to talk to other free worlds.
About the gene-seed: I do not think they will allow us (more precisely, our admech) do anything to their gene-seed just yet-gene seed is one of the most important things owned by a Chapter, and in the chaotic age of 43k even more so. They will need to determine if we are free of taint first, which will take decade, if not several decades. And even if they decide we are free of taint the chapter leadership will have to decide if they can trust a bunch of radical outsiders with it-for example, will the trust build marines with Ultra geneseed behind their backs?
That is why I think we should not even mention it to them until the relationship between us and them are really bro-tier, like 10 or above.
The best part of this alliance is that the Ultras are well respected in the old Imperium, which means the worlds that have not gone full chaotic or xeno-humping will be more likely to listen to them than to us, who are borderline heretical if judged by old Imperial standards. If the word of this alliance spreads, it will be far easier for the Imperial Trust to talk to other free worlds.
About the gene-seed: I do not think they will allow us (more precisely, our admech) do anything to their gene-seed just yet-gene seed is one of the most important things owned by a Chapter, and in the chaotic age of 43k even more so. They will need to determine if we are free of taint first, which will take decade, if not several decades. And even if they decide we are free of taint the chapter leadership will have to decide if they can trust a bunch of radical outsiders with it-for example, will the trust build marines with Ultra geneseed behind their backs?
That is why I think we should not even mention it to them until the relationship between us and them are really bro-tier, like 10 or above.
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- Location
- Berkeley
So, few ideas here.
First, really glad we had some space marines drop by. We should definitely do the diplo option to get some information about them prior to the meeting, and might even want to double down on it. Having good information about the marines, their goals, and any specific issues they have would greatly increase our chances of figuring out what to suggest for working with them.
Second, also on the space marines front. Odds are excellent that in whatever gets worked out with them, Avernus will be involved up to our eyeballs. When we work things out, we should try to make sure we don't look like we're trying to turn them into 'our' space marines, but instead into the Trust's.
Third, there's the issue surrounding the elite operatives. While space marines would help fill that niche, I still think it would be a good idea to continue working on that front for a variety of reasons, including both how difficult it is to put together a meaningful number of space marines and the fact that the operatives would be under our direct command. To make sure we do it well, I'd like to at least request help from a few places—certainly Midgard and the Inquisition, and maybe also Muspelheim and Svartalfheim. As far as favors go, we're generally more than happy to try to help out our fellow trust worlds, so paying them off shouldn't be too onerous.
Fourth, our local expansion efforts. We've been told to build two cities at once or face potential catastrophe, so I think we should do that. Sure, it necessitates both of our personal attention slots, but such is life. Also, the actions are cheap enough to expedite. If Thaddeus can do them, I'd love passing the buck for one of them to him though. Either that or start with building three.
First, really glad we had some space marines drop by. We should definitely do the diplo option to get some information about them prior to the meeting, and might even want to double down on it. Having good information about the marines, their goals, and any specific issues they have would greatly increase our chances of figuring out what to suggest for working with them.
Second, also on the space marines front. Odds are excellent that in whatever gets worked out with them, Avernus will be involved up to our eyeballs. When we work things out, we should try to make sure we don't look like we're trying to turn them into 'our' space marines, but instead into the Trust's.
Third, there's the issue surrounding the elite operatives. While space marines would help fill that niche, I still think it would be a good idea to continue working on that front for a variety of reasons, including both how difficult it is to put together a meaningful number of space marines and the fact that the operatives would be under our direct command. To make sure we do it well, I'd like to at least request help from a few places—certainly Midgard and the Inquisition, and maybe also Muspelheim and Svartalfheim. As far as favors go, we're generally more than happy to try to help out our fellow trust worlds, so paying them off shouldn't be too onerous.
Fourth, our local expansion efforts. We've been told to build two cities at once or face potential catastrophe, so I think we should do that. Sure, it necessitates both of our personal attention slots, but such is life. Also, the actions are cheap enough to expedite. If Thaddeus can do them, I'd love passing the buck for one of them to him though. Either that or start with building three.
- Location
- America
Nah, we don't really need space marines. The Governor's Own is basically a battalion of space marine equivalent people in and of itself. They might like to use Avernus for training, but there are only like 30 left. I really don't want to chance any of them taking a Death's Head Blink Spider to the face.
Doomed Wombat
Let's go Darling!
- Location
- Dancing on wires!
900 years without support + Lin+ GK+ On their last legs it seems.
I think we're going to be getting something a bit better than a simple alliance.
Actually SM's are pretty easy to mass produce quickly, its a combination of constant attrition and the codex limitations that keep them so small.
As for our elites, we need replacement assassins and anti beta hunters.
30 will turn into 90 in 20 years, which would then turn into 270 assuming no casualties and perfect implantation rate, so lets knock it down to 150.
In any case the two named characters are good enough, 15 900 year old marines.
They're nearly as old as Dante.
ArchAIngel
Sorcerer Supreme.
- Location
- Right behind you.
So sit them in orbit until they get to a reasonable number. These are bloody Space Marines, the rallying effect them on the battlefield will have alone makes them worth it.
I wonder what happened to Cato Sicarius. For all that he was commonly considered an arrogant ass and a Mary Sue in the fandom, he was kind of a badass. Would be interesting to know where he met his end, it was probably epic.
Venom that instantly kills a normal human is perfectly survivable to a space marine. I'm not sure any blink spider could kill one, at least assuming they could get medical treatment in a reasonable timeframe.
Doomed Wombat
Let's go Darling!
- Location
- Dancing on wires!
Ok list of why Marines are useful as a base.
1. Prestige factor with other factions, every one knows them and respects them especially since they're a first founding chapter and bare the name of the original legion. Especially the Smerfs who are a household name along side the SW and the BA.
2. Hero units.
3. Mass producible.
4. Cheap.
5. Not going to die, Marines don't need Juvnat as a rule.
6. Possible tech, depends on if they have things like Drednaughts and the like.
With the Trust added in
7. Incredible tech: Nutron rifless, armor, hell I think we could probably give each one a refractor field. To give some scale our personal body guards are as good as Marine Veterans thanks to their stuff. AND THEY'RE NORMAL HUMANS.
8. Quality: Why do you think we keep Svartfulhiem around
.
9. The Avernite factor: We're almost certainly going to be their main recruiting world, we know well what we're like and the rest of the Trust are no slouches.
10. Peace and quite: The fact is that space marines could grow exponentially if given more than 40 years peace and quite.
11. Marines are also respected in the Trust if we can convince them to help us out.
Possible issues.
1. The Xenos: Normally I'd be worried, but the 900 year old guy's calm me as does Lin.
2. The Truth: Lin and GK save here as do the Smerf's themselves actually.
3. Take over: Not going to happen the Smerfs are well versed in this kinda thing, at worst they might apply to become administrators.
4. Political tensions: unlikely to show up according to WOG
5. Tech compatibility: while I have few fears about the old guys adapting to our stuff I do have some fears about the conservatives refusing to adapt the stuff we have to them. For example we have the armor and we have the Jotun sets which are around the right size with a bit of remodeling. The issue is the Black Carapace its much better than anything we could have, but the armor doesn't support it and so will have to be redesigned for it. This could pose an issue.
1. Prestige factor with other factions, every one knows them and respects them especially since they're a first founding chapter and bare the name of the original legion. Especially the Smerfs who are a household name along side the SW and the BA.
2. Hero units.
3. Mass producible.
4. Cheap.
5. Not going to die, Marines don't need Juvnat as a rule.
6. Possible tech, depends on if they have things like Drednaughts and the like.
With the Trust added in
7. Incredible tech: Nutron rifless, armor, hell I think we could probably give each one a refractor field. To give some scale our personal body guards are as good as Marine Veterans thanks to their stuff. AND THEY'RE NORMAL HUMANS.
8. Quality: Why do you think we keep Svartfulhiem around
.9. The Avernite factor: We're almost certainly going to be their main recruiting world, we know well what we're like and the rest of the Trust are no slouches.
10. Peace and quite: The fact is that space marines could grow exponentially if given more than 40 years peace and quite.
11. Marines are also respected in the Trust if we can convince them to help us out.
Possible issues.
1. The Xenos: Normally I'd be worried, but the 900 year old guy's calm me as does Lin.
2. The Truth: Lin and GK save here as do the Smerf's themselves actually.
3. Take over: Not going to happen the Smerfs are well versed in this kinda thing, at worst they might apply to become administrators.
4. Political tensions: unlikely to show up according to WOG
5. Tech compatibility: while I have few fears about the old guys adapting to our stuff I do have some fears about the conservatives refusing to adapt the stuff we have to them. For example we have the armor and we have the Jotun sets which are around the right size with a bit of remodeling. The issue is the Black Carapace its much better than anything we could have, but the armor doesn't support it and so will have to be redesigned for it. This could pose an issue.
Well papa smerf was a dreadnaught according to @durin and I think he said Dante was still alive, but Sicarius... dunno.
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