Star Wars Episode VIII: The Last Jedi

Make an argument. That scene you show there is used to reflect on the tragedy of death later regarding the ewoks.

You know, the Ewoks, giant teddy bears who come bouncing out of the woodwork throwing rocks and making silly noises while the Stormtroppers aimlessly run around like the Keystone Cops.

I mean, look at this shit. It's practically the ride of the Rohirrim!

 
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I mean, look at this shit. It's practically the ride of the Rohirrim!
No, Reveen, you don't understand. Shots like six overgrown teddy bears trying to trip a 28ft tall war machine with a piece of rope are actually subtle yet brilliant metaphors for the self-perpetuating cycle of colonialist violence. Notice how the teddy bears - after all being simultaneously yanked off their feet as they cling to their tragically inadequate rope - all stand up, only to all fall down again mere seconds later, pulled off their feet once again as the walker continues undisturbed. The harder the teddy bears try and resist the colonialist power, the greater their suffering; a vicious cycle facilitated as much by their courageous refusal to let go of the rope as the gap in their technological advancement.

This metaphor is consistent throughout the film - the little man in a fur suit who hits himself in the face with his own bola and knocks himself unconscious, for example, seems to suggest a much more direct link between colonized resistance and self-defeat. His haunting yelp serves to heighten our fear for our heroes as we're reminded that the Empire is so powerful it need not even attack their victims for them to defeat themselves. Such powerful story beats are integral to the film's profound exploration of the all-encompassing horrors of war; the nail-biting tension of the battle scene would be woefully incomplete without them.
 
SFDebris has actually pointed something out in his review of Return of the Jedi. To paraphrase: George wanted his Vietnam War moment so badly that he sacrificed seeing the Imperial throne-world (then called Had Abaddan) and doing something other than another Death Star like in Ep IV to get it. So he got his Vietnam War allegory, where the United States is a fascist drab empire that kills billions with planet destroying war-machines and the Viet Cong are sub-human and superstitious cannibals that have no advanced technology at all. Oops.

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There is a scene where the climax of snoke and rey is about to happen and a small droid that is supposed to clean things breaks it when they cut away like it's family guy. That's the definition of a tone problem for the series as a whole. And it does it over and over and over in the film.
I don't recall. What precisely happens during those scenes?
 
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Make an argument. That scene you show there is used to reflect on the tragedy of death later regarding the ewoks.


I'd say you got owned pretty spectacularly by Reveen and Quantumsheep. See, any remotely even-handed look at the original trilogy would recognise that it's regularly punctuated by things that would upset insufferable Dark-Knight-Tone-Is-the-Only-Good-Tone Police - if they didn't have comically huge rose-colored glasses on, that is.
 
I'd say you got owned pretty spectacularly by Reveen and Quantumsheep. See, any remotely even-handed look at the original trilogy would recognise that it's regularly punctuated by things that would upset insufferable Dark-Knight-Tone-Is-the-Only-Good-Tone Police - if they didn't have comically huge rose-colored glasses on, that is.

I would like to point out that George Lucas only made Star Wars after struggles and battles with rights made it so that he couldn't make an official Flash Gordan movie. Like, there was never any delusion that even if it was going to be pretty serious at points, it wasn't going to also have plenty of camp and goofy fun.
 
I would like to point out that George Lucas only made Star Wars after struggles and battles with rights made it so that he couldn't make an official Flash Gordan movie. Like, there was never any delusion that even if it was going to be pretty serious at points, it wasn't going to also have plenty of camp and goofy fun.
Calling it a "struggle " is hyperbole.
There was a Flash Gordan movie in production, George wanted to direct it, Dino DeLaurentiis said no, George accepted it and moved on. In the end, he always felt he wanted to make something of his own creation in the vein of Flash Gordan, in the sense that they would be episodic Sci-Fi tales of daring and adventure. While I can agree the BLEAK tone crowd is wrong to want that to be the norm, it is equally fallacious to assume that the logical alternative is for it to be campy and goofy. It can still be fun, but the universe it's in can and should be taken seriously.
 
Calling it a "struggle " is hyperbole.
There was a Flash Gordan movie in production, George wanted to direct it, Dino DeLaurentiis said no, George accepted it and moved on. In the end, he always felt he wanted to make something of his own creation in the vein of Flash Gordan, in the sense that they would be episodic Sci-Fi tales of daring and adventure.

This is, to be blunt, ridiculous and pointless semantics over my usage of a single phrase. I could have said "there were failed discussions" or whatever and my point in bringing up that context would remain exactly the same.

While I can agree the BLEAK tone crowd is wrong to want that to be the norm, it is equally fallacious to assume that the logical alternative is for it to be campy and goofy. It can still be fun, but the universe it's in can and should be taken seriously.

Like, there was never any delusion that even if it was going to be pretty serious at points, it wasn't going to also have plenty of camp and goofy fun.
 
This is, to be blunt, ridiculous and pointless semantics over my usage of a single phrase. I could have said "there were failed discussions" or whatever and my point in bringing up that context would remain exactly the same.
Not entirely semantics. From what I read, you were framing it as a fierce copyright issue being hammered out when it was simply George Lucas not being given control of the project Laurentiis was putting together.

Like, there was never any delusion that even if it was going to be pretty serious at points, it wasn't going to also have plenty of camp and goofy fun.
I retract the statement as it is, but I will maintain the universe should be respected (what that means, I'm sure I'll think of later).
 
Re tone it is perfectly possible to have a world that is serious in tone and taken seriously by the characters in said universe, while still having comedic elements. The latest avengers movie being a good example.

The rub is where it always seems to, be in execution, and the fact that it needs to be balanced like all things should be.
 
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