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Spirit Quest

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[X] [Cycle] Wyrn
[X] [Edryd] Yes.
[X] [Seryn] Yes. You will need the advantage that it will provide you.
[X] [Conquest] Belamour. Unlike the other two villages, you do not plan to take Belamour by force, but persuade Trevritine and the Belamourish to peacefully submit just as Prylake did.

Picked Wyrn because she gives an interesting perspective that we haven't seen in awhile.
Going to give Edryd the child because she wants it and no one is against Cadyl doing so.
Going to do this without Seryn's blessing, since this is supposed to be Cadyl proving himself and leaving Gwarlon's shadow. It wouldn't do for him to trade Gwarlon's shadow for Seryn's.
Belamour can possibly be convinced to come peacefully, and if they can then maybe the others will see the writing on the wall. Even if they don't, Belamour might begin to resist if Cadyl goes on a conquering spree first.
 
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Raichu1972 said:
Even if they don't, Belamour might begin to resist if Cadyl goes on a conquering spree first.
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That was my thought but I am now debating it.
If we successfully conquer Blawain, Belamour's neighbor, we will have evidence of our success and potentially evidence of our fair treatment over those who have joined us. We can thus use this weight to more easily coerce convince Belamour.
 
Umi-san said:
That was my thought but I am now debating it.
If we successfully conquer Blawain, Belamour's neighbor, we will have evidence of our success and potentially evidence of our fair treatment over those who have joined us. We can thus use this weight to more easily coerce convince Belamour.
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I would rather attempt to coerce Belamour to join us without the implied threat of "we'll just conquer you if you don't".
I believe we can pull this off if we don't conquer anyone else first, but it will be much less likely if we conquer one of the other two nearby villages first.
 
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Raichu1972 said:
I would rather attempt to coerce Belamour to join us without the implied threat of "we'll just conquer you if you don't".
I believe we can pull this off if we don't conquer anyone else first, but it will be much less likely if we conquer one of the other two nearby villages first.
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I don't agree. The implied threat of "we'll just conquer you if you don't" is preceded by the implied kindness in "we could have just conquered you but we didn't."

And besides, no one likes to die. If you do not believe you can resist being conquered without great loss, surrender is far more preferable. Thus, conquering one of the other two nearby villages first is far more likely to be easier to pull off.

A better argument would be something like "what kind of a society would we be building if we bullied everyone into joining us?" My response to this is to again point to the implied kindness in NOT conquering someone but instead permitting them to negotiate the terms by which they join us. There is apt to be initial trouble and reluctance but shifting social dynamics are always rife with such, completely voluntary or otherwise.

Edit: With that said, having now seen the map, we should just negotiate with Belamour. They're too far for fear to be truly effective.
 
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Raichu1972 said:
Going to do this without Seryn's blessing, since this is supposed to be Cadyl proving himself and leaving Gwarlon's shadow. It wouldn't do for him to trade Gwarlon's shadow for Seryn's.
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Given how all warriors have Seryn's blessing, it would be considered normal like going into battle with a weapon so going to war without is basically like going to war without a weapon by the standards of the Six Villages.

Raichu1972 said:
[]Belamour can possibly be convinced to come peacefully, and if they can then maybe the others will see the writing on the wall. Even if they don't, Belamour might begin to resist if Cadyl goes on a conquering spree first.
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Umi-san said:
That was my thought but I am now debating it.
If we successfully conquer Blawain, Belamour's neighbor, we will have evidence of our success and potentially evidence of our fair treatment over those who have joined us. We can thus use this weight to more easily coerce convince Belamour.
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Raichu1972 said:
I would rather attempt to coerce Belamour to join us without the implied threat of "we'll just conquer you if you don't".
I believe we can pull this off if we don't conquer anyone else first, but it will be much less likely if we conquer one of the other two nearby villages first.
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Belamour is isolated enough that they don't know anything outside of their village beyond what you have told them. They even only know of the Eastern Hills (someone remind why the north-west hills are called the Eastern Hills while the south-east hills are called the Northern Hills) and North Lake because you told them.
 
Oshha said:
Belamour is isolated enough that they don't know anything outside of their village beyond what you have told them. They even only know of the Eastern Hills (someone remind why the north-west hills are called the Eastern Hills while the south-east hills are called the Northern Hills) and North Lake because you told them.
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Umi-san said:
Edit: With that said, having now seen the map, we should just negotiate with Belamour. They're too far for fear to be truly effective.
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Good to know.

Negotiating is better then.

I think we should conquer Blawain after, I'm tired of that hobbit farming land and not talking to us. *pouty face* And if he dies we can eat him...
 
Umi-san said:
Good to know.

Negotiating is better then.

I think we should conquer Blawain after, I'm tired of that hobbit farming land. And if he dies we can eat him...
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Cadyl is planning to diplo-annex Belamour whilst outright conquering Blawain and Belamour, you are just picking where village he goes after first.
 
Umi-san said:
is there no like "we forcibly march into blawain and then just stand there" option that doesn't involve outright killing people
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No as the Blawainish will actively resist any outsiders with violence. To the Blawainish, any outsiders to be killed if they come to close. They are not kind and friendly people.

Edit: Same applies to the Belarish. If you want to make non-hostile relations with Blawain or Belarsa, you will have to win the right with bloodshed and violence first. Which he would prefer to just conquer them, Cadyl will settle for just opening diplomatic relations at swordpoint.
 
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Oshha said:
No as the Blawainish will actively resist any outsiders with violence. To the Blawainish, any outsiders to be killed if they come to close. They are not kind and friendly people.
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oh then yeah we should kill their warriors and then introduce their sons to the delights of catgirls
*guy touching his head while smiling knowingly meme*

Or more realistically inflict severe but not mortal injuries, as possible, until we reach the shrine/avatar of their god, and threaten to destroy him if his followers don't stand down.

The rehabilitation period should likely include shifting portions of the conquered province into other villages so as to reduce xenophobia and fray cultural coherence. (Our wife will probably be all "no" and we'll have to be like "but honey, think about all the xenophobic children" and she'll be like "no" and we'll sigh and pull the man-of-the-house card and then we'll sleep outside) But that really can only be undertaken after we've killed the people in that one other village. Which doesn't actually seem that far? Like, there's a forest in the way but we can just row upriver, no?
 
Raichu1972 said:
That seems to be the case for a lot of the Spirits and people we meet, unfortunately. :(
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You are in the stone age and most of the spirits are used to being top dogs.

That said, only half of them are like that. Sangere, Blawain and Bedwyn were hostile while Bedynn and Belsara are hostile due to the actions of Cynfanor and Caradawg poisoning their views of outsiders. Prylake, Evalon and Belamour are peaceful to you while Bedygan was peaceful until it imploded to internal conflict.
 
Oshha said:
You are in the stone age and most of the spirits are used to being top dogs.

That said, only half of them are like that. Sangere, Blawain and Bedwyn were hostile while Bedynn and Belsara are hostile due to the actions of Cynfanor and Caradawg poisoning their views of outsiders. Prylake, Evalon and Belamour are peaceful to you while Bedygan was peaceful until it imploded to internal conflict.
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Ugh, Cynfanor and Caradawg, still causing us problems.

The jerk probably ascended himself through blood sacrifice and went off conquering villages far away or something, since we never managed to kill him and he left with a ton of veteran warriors.
 
Umi-san said:
oh then yeah we should kill their warriors and then introduce their sons to the delights of catgirls
*guy touching his head while smiling knowingly meme*
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Never heard of that meme.


Umi-san said:
Or more realistically inflict severe but not mortal injuries, as possible, until we reach the shrine/avatar of their god, and threaten to destroy him if his followers don't stand down.

The rehabilitation period should likely include shifting portions of the conquered province into other villages so as to reduce xenophobia and fray cultural coherence. (Our wife will probably be all "no" and we'll have to be like "but honey, think about all the xenophobic children" and she'll be like "no" and we'll sigh and pull the man-of-the-house card and then we'll sleep outside) But that really can only be undertaken after we've killed the people in that one other village. Which doesn't actually seem that far? Like, there's a forest in the way but we can just row upriver, no?
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You could attempt to spread out captured Blawainish villages between your villages and nobody apart from the Blawainish and Orcante would object.

As for the distance of Belarsa, it isn't that far from Bedwyn, Sangere and Bedynn, but it isn't a simple matter of just getting there. You have to go through the forest on land or go via river when they have a Forest Spirit and a River Spirit.

Raichu1972 said:
Ugh, Cynfanor and Caradawg, still causing us problems.

The jerk probably ascended himself through blood sacrifice and went off conquering villages far away or something, since we never managed to kill him and he left with a ton of veteran warriors.
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Umi-san said:
He'll likely be back, so there's hope for his demise. :)
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Is it wrong that I find it amusing how you defeated Cynfanor almost two decades ago and he is still causing you trouble?

As for what happened with Caradawg, no comment. For he might have ascended to Godhood in another region or he might have died with his followers in the unknown wilderness or perhaps he ran into another powerful spirit and got enslaved by them. You don't know until look west for him and you need to take Belarsa before you can do that.
 
[X] [Cycle] Cadyl
No way am I picking the girl that got loyalty-slammed into compromising free will when the thread clearly wants to micromanage how this goes down.
[X] [Edryd] Yes.
No strong views on this, but others have convinced me to take this.
[X] [Seryn] Yes. You will need the advantage that it will provide you.
The Cath Wyr are our Warrior Caste/Warform. Let's not pull a Wyrn and play ourselves with our own pride. It's not even a sense of male pride that's lost, it's how we fight now.
[X] [Conquest] Belamour. Unlike the other two villages, you do not plan to take Belamour by force, but persuade Trevritine and the Belamourish to peacefully submit just as Prylake did.
A win for diplomacy will allow us to possible provide a counter-example to Caradawg's bad example, and not lose a pair of very useful spirits. Particularly the Sky-one, as he could very well finally allow the creation of a new War-form Blessing alongside the Cath Wyr!
​
 
Raichu1972 said:
I'm sure Seryn would be perfectly happy to eat him :V
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Actually, Seryn would like to take him as her wife old-Sangere style because she is spiteful like that.

Zaealix said:
The Cath Wyr are our Warrior Caste/Warform. Let's not pull a Wyrn and play ourselves with our own pride. It's not even a sense of male pride that's lost, it's how we fight now.
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Actually, that is known in-universe as a Wyrn's Folly.

Zaealix said:
A win for diplomacy will allow us to possible provide a counter-example to Caradawg's bad example, and not lose a pair of very useful spirits. Particularly the Sky-one, as he could very well finally allow the creation of a new War-form Blessing alongside the Cath Wyr!
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There won't be any warrior-blessing that can match Seryn's blessing. That ship has sailed long ago.
 
Oshha said:
Never heard of that meme.




You could attempt to spread out captured Blawainish villages between your villages and nobody apart from the Blawainish and Orcante would object.

As for the distance of Belarsa, it isn't that far from Bedwyn, Sangere and Bedynn, but it isn't a simple matter of just getting there. You have to go through the forest on land or go via river when they have a Forest Spirit and a River Spirit.




Is it wrong that I find it amusing how you defeated Cynfanor almost two decades ago and he is still causing you trouble?

As for what happened with Caradawg, no comment. For he might have ascended to Godhood in another region or he might have died with his followers in the unknown wilderness or perhaps he ran into another powerful spirit and got enslaved by them. You don't know until look west for him and you need to take Belarsa before you can do that.
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Would Gwarlon be able to build some sort of Dam or in some other way part the river with his Aspect of Earth?
Also, it seems like it would be relatively easy for Gwarlon to dominate these Spirits once their followers are beaten, since Greater Spirit of Spirits should give some crazy bonuses towards that kind of thing.

Unless Cadyl wants to do this without the direct intervention of any of the Pantheon?
 
[X] [Cycle] Wyrn
[X] [Edryd] Yes.
[X] [Seryn] No. You will do this without your sister's blessing.
[X] [Conquest] Belamour. Unlike the other two villages, you do not plan to take Belamour by force, but persuade Trevritine and the Belamourish to peacefully submit just as Prylake did.
 
Zaealix said:
[X] [Cycle] Cadyl
No way am I picking the girl that got loyalty-slammed into compromising free will when the thread clearly wants to micromanage how this goes down.
[X] [Edryd] Yes.
No strong views on this, but others have convinced me to take this.
[X] [Seryn] Yes. You will need the advantage that it will provide you.
The Cath Wyr are our Warrior Caste/Warform. Let's not pull a Wyrn and play ourselves with our own pride. It's not even a sense of male pride that's lost, it's how we fight now.
[X] [Conquest] Belamour. Unlike the other two villages, you do not plan to take Belamour by force, but persuade Trevritine and the Belamourish to peacefully submit just as Prylake did.
A win for diplomacy will allow us to possible provide a counter-example to Caradawg's bad example, and not lose a pair of very useful spirits. Particularly the Sky-one, as he could very well finally allow the creation of a new War-form Blessing alongside the Cath Wyr!
​
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I'm not currently voting for War Form because I want to do this first conquest through diplomacy.
Going there all ready for war might spook them if they know anything about Seryn or the reputation of the Cath Wyrs.

After what Oshha said about it though I definitely want Cadyl in Cath Wyr form for the actual fighting.
 
Raichu1972 said:
Would Gwarlon be able to build some sort of Dam or in some other way part the river with his Aspect of Earth?
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No, too weak.

Raichu1972 said:
Also, it seems like it would be relatively easy for Gwarlon to dominate these Spirits once their followers are beaten, since Greater Spirit of Spirits should give some crazy bonuses towards that kind of thing.
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That is correct. Spirits and Chief work quite well together for dominating other spirits through Seryn is also quite adapt at dominating other spirits.

Raichu1972 said:
Unless Cadyl wants to do this without the direct intervention of any of the Pantheon?
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He wants the aid of Seryn against any enemy spirits and he wouldn't mind if anyone else wants to join in, but no one else wants to do they as they all got their own things to handle and/or aren't interested in war.

Raichu1972 said:
I'm not currently voting for War Form because I want to do this first conquest through diplomacy.
Going there all ready for war might spook them if they know anything about Seryn or the reputation of the Cath Wyrs.

After what Oshha said about it though I definitely want Cadyl in Cath Wyr form for the actual fighting.
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You are picking for the whole war, not just the first conquest. Also, they don't know anything about the Cath Wyrs or Seryn outside of them being the 'outsider cat-people' or the 'outsider mega-spirit' respectively.
 
Oshha said:
No, too weak.



That is correct. Spirits and Chief work quite well together for dominating other spirits through Seryn is also quite adapt at dominating other spirits.



He wants the aid of Seryn against any enemy spirits and he wouldn't mind if anyone else wants to join in, but no one else wants to do they as they all got their own things to handle and/or aren't interested in war.



You are picking for the whole war, not just the first conquest. Also, they don't know anything about the Cath Wyrs or Seryn outside of them being the 'outsider cat-people' or the 'outsider mega-spirit' respectively.
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Alright, changing vote then.
I don't wan't Cadyl to die out of some sense of hubris.
 
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