Remove ads

Ship of Fools: A Taylor Varga Omake (Complete)

Linked contents
Ship of Fools: A Taylor Varga Omake (Complete) Demons and Angels Seven Days to Skitter
Reader mode
Derek M said:
We all can fly, Peter dear. Don't forget your new costume
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Nice story...

But (it might be just me), as while I was clear they had highly protective suits I was unclear by what means they fly. The Family can do the protection, no problem, of course... Adding flight to a superhero is generally considered quite a Big Thing...

Does the flight use visible jets, surround them with eldritch glows, or have any visible effect? A few hints for those with poor memories might be worth considering...

EDIT:

A brief search lead me to this chapter, towards the end. Talk of 'gravity plates' (from Star Trek?) is the only flight-related thing there, and those only provide artificial gravity, for example on starships. The only Star Trek flight bits which are obvious are the levitation boots.
 
Last edited:
Ace Dreamer said:
Nice story...

But (it might be just me), as while I was clear they had highly protective suits I was unclear by what means they fly. The Family can do the protection, no problem, of course... Adding flight to a superhero is generally considered quite a Big Thing...

Does the flight use visible jets, surround them with eldritch glows, or have any visible effect? A few hints for those with poor memories might be worth considering...
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

As I recall, Peter experimented in small gliding wings with his original costume but that never worked out very well. They were too small to provide much lift, and too fragile. I'd imagine The Family has something better.
 
Ace Dreamer said:
Nice story...

But (it might be just me), as while I was clear they had highly protective suits I was unclear by what means they fly. The Family can do the protection, no problem, of course... Adding flight to a superhero is generally considered quite a Big Thing...

Does the flight use visible jets, surround them with eldritch glows, or have any visible effect? A few hints for those with poor memories might be worth considering...
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I can think of a few ways, such as creating an absolutely hugely massively huge cubical extradimensional pocket full of water, with a thick square of EDM or something sitting on top, with a small cushion of heavily compressed air above it. If the fit is tight enough (but not too tight) the pressure of the water vs air should keep the EDM floating on top of the water. When a valve at the bottom is opened, the water is forced out, doing something similar to what Saurial did with her hoverboard, although the water wouldn't evaporate. Though it could be some other gas instead of water, or maybe something that's liquid at high pressures but inert gas at low pressures, like warm (albeit highly pressurized liquid) nitrogen, maybe?
 
Ace Dreamer said:
Nice story...

But (it might be just me), as while I was clear they had highly protective suits I was unclear by what means they fly. The Family can do the protection, no problem, of course... Adding flight to a superhero is generally considered quite a Big Thing...

Does the flight use visible jets, surround them with eldritch glows, or have any visible effect? A few hints for those with poor memories might be worth considering...

EDIT:

A brief search lead me to this chapter, towards the end. Talk of 'gravity plates' (from Star Trek?) is the only flight-related thing there, and those only provide artificial gravity, for example on starships. The only Star Trek flight bits which are obvious are the levitation boots.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Um...the family has access to no fewer than SIX universes with gravity manipulation technology. They include 3 superhero universes, Star Trek (remember Spock's mountain climbing boots?), Stargate (including a literal alliance with the Asgard), and artificial gravity from Ripley's universe. I didn't think flying costumes was much of a stretch given what they pull off in Taylor Varga canon.

EDIT: Let me also point out that in the main TV story, Vectura's mechs fly. They certainly don't do so using any kind of aerodynamic method, given their profile. Between Saurial, Vectura and Dragon, flying suits are like, grade-school science projects.
 
Last edited:
the DragonBard said:
Outsiders are something completely different.

By Dresdenverse canon, alternate realities are still 'within' the Outer Gates, so beings from other worlds are 'not' Outsiders.

Outsiders are closer to Lovecraftian beings.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

He said Varga was closer to being what he knows as Outsiders than what he knows as demons. He never claimed that Varga was precisely either.

It isn't much of a stretch when you consider the Family plays up the Lovecraft references every chance they get in canon Taylor Varga.

EDIT: Now that I'm not on mobile, I can elaborate a little bit. Demons in the Dresden-verse have been depicted as almost stereotypical Dungeons & Dragons demons and devils. Chauncey fits a D&D devil to a tee, and some of the other demons are crushing forces of destruction like D&D demons. Outsiders are, as you stated, supposed to be Lovecraftian horrors. Varga doesn't do the chaotic or lawful evil scene chewing, but he's not above screwing with reality to make alien constructs or speak in eldritch tongues. He also doesn't give a faerie vibe of having to walk a fine line or end up changed into somebody's coursing hound, and he isn't as actively predatory as any of the vampire courts. From Dresden's perspective, calling him most similar to an outsider based on behavior is probably the best approximation, and gets across the idea that he is a) very dangerous and b) possessed of otherworldly powers.
 
Last edited:
Derek M said:
Um...the family has access to no fewer than SIX universes with gravity manipulation technology. They include 3 superhero universes, Star Trek (remember Spock's mountain climbing boots?), Stargate (including a literal alliance with the Asgard), and artificial gravity from Ripley's universe. I didn't think flying costumes was much of a stretch given what they pull off in Taylor Varga canon.

EDIT: Let me also point out that in the main TV story, Vectura's mechs fly. They certainly don't do so using any kind of aerodynamic method, given their profile. Between Saurial, Vectura and Dragon, flying suits are like, grade-school science projects.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Maybe it's a stylistic thing? I don't know.

I did provide a link to Spock's boots, and you could make a case that having individuals flying eats too much into the special effects budget. :)

Or, maybe, a personal flying suit is pushing the limits for what Vectura's shard thinks is Transportation? Possibly the flying Spiderbike would go down better. :)

While some may claim that flying just makes you a better target, it is very useful to have it to fall-back on. Yes, particularly given space-warping to allow a few tonnes of hardware I can't see why Spider Flight isn't entirely credible. After all, they don't need to fit it into a Flight Ring. :)
 
Ace Dreamer said:
I did provide a link to Spock's boots, and you could make a case that having individuals flying eats too much into the special effects budget. :)
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Star Trek does a bloody awful job of maximizing personal gear for personnel. How often have we seen Starfleet personnel suffering from hostile environments that a modern-day special ops team would be well-equipped to handle? Why adopt dustbuster-style phasers that look like a huge pain to aim properly, even with computer-assisted targeting? Why send away teams out with only basic uniforms and the few devices that will fit on a belt? Why heat rocks with phasers? Does Starfleet not have the technology to make portable space heaters? If flight boots exist, then why not have redshirts that can use them to scout? That by itself would have solved a number of, "we have to track them," scenarios.

Part of it, I think, is due to the cell phone problem, i.e., having a handy bit of technology can remove a lot of the drama from a story if it circumvents a significant part of the problem. Another part of the problem is lazy writing -- just treat every excursion as if you were visiting a nearby starbase.
 
Derek M said:
Why send away teams out with only basic uniforms and the few devices that will fit on a belt? Why heat rocks with phasers? Does Starfleet not have the technology to make portable space heaters? If flight boots exist, then why not have redshirts that can use them to scout? That by itself would have solved a number of, "we have to track them," scenarios.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Well, we've seen them be comfortable in said uniforms from blizzard cold to way too close to lava hot. Those uniforms must be great at thermal regulation. As for phasers, they're a swiss army knife. Why heat a rock with them rather than carry a portable space heater? Because then you'd need to carry the heater, rather than grabbing and shooting a handy rock.

As for the flying boots, they seem to be lostech. Remember as well, they fully expect to be able to track any teams from their ship in orbit. Something that prevents that, and just using a shuttle for a closer look probably also precludes the boots. Not to mention lack of SFX budget for it.
 
Last edited:
I suspect, in the case of Spock's anti-gravity boots, that they were indeed Spock's boots, as in his private property, not Starfleet issue. As to why Starfleet wouldn't issue such things, I suspect it's due to budgetary reasons; some bean counter decided said devices aren't worth the cost of making them standard issue.

Similarly, why issue personal space heaters when a rock and a standard issue phaser can do the job? Why issue a number of specialized environment suits when a standard uniform is suited to an acceptable range of climates? Yes, I know, from Next Generation onward the Replicators should be able to provide the specialized equipment on demand, but then FX budgets and Dramatic Tension issues pop up.

I like to think we mostly see the interesting parts of what Starfleet does, and get to skip the parts where intelligent equipment choices would simplify things.

Plus, unlike Star Wars, Star Trek does a lot less merchandising of the sort that would benefit from a large variety of specialized props. Ergo, there is less incentive to make said props. Yes, this is a cynical view, but where Star Wars had a huge amount of money come in from their tie-ins with Kenner, Star Trek made most of it's money selling ad time...
 
Derek M said:
From Dresden's perspective, calling him most similar to an outsider based on behavior is probably the best approximation, and gets across the idea that he is a) very dangerous and b) possessed of otherworldly powers.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Well, the informed reaction to an Outsider in Dresdenverse is 'kill it, burn the remains, throw the remains behind the outer gate if feasible, otherwise contain'. Insofar a comparison with an Outsider is tantamount to saying 'if you haven't killed him before you've seen him, sucks being what you will become'.
 
Derek M said:
Star Trek does a bloody awful job of maximizing personal gear for personnel. How often have we seen Starfleet personnel suffering from hostile environments that a modern-day special ops team would be well-equipped to handle? Why adopt dustbuster-style phasers that look like a huge pain to aim properly, even with computer-assisted targeting? Why send away teams out with only basic uniforms and the few devices that will fit on a belt? Why heat rocks with phasers? Does Starfleet not have the technology to make portable space heaters? If flight boots exist, then why not have redshirts that can use them to scout? That by itself would have solved a number of, "we have to track them," scenarios.

Part of it, I think, is due to the cell phone problem, i.e., having a handy bit of technology can remove a lot of the drama from a story if it circumvents a significant part of the problem. Another part of the problem is lazy writing -- just treat every excursion as if you were visiting a nearby starbase.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...


I think the big part of it is low budget productions. Fast and cheap for the TV shows. That would explain a lot about production values of TV shows vs the production values of the films. :rolleyes:

Edit 1.0: On the other hand doing more with less is always a good thing. :)
 
Last edited:
Derek M said:
Why adopt dustbuster-style phasers that look like a huge pain to aim properly, even with computer-assisted targeting?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

One explanation I've heard for the unusual design for the phasers is that, while they're not great designs for a weapon meant to be wielded specifically by a human hand, they're decent enough designs for the purpose of being wielded by the majority of species serving in Starfleet. For the most part, Starfleet personnel don't carry phasers when going about their day-to-day duties on board a ship, but if an emergency happens they can just grab whichever phaser is closest at hand in the nearest armory, and not have to worry that the one they grabbed was specifically designed for Caitian paws.
 
Derek M said:
Star Trek does a bloody awful job of maximizing personal gear for personnel. How often have we seen Starfleet personnel suffering from hostile environments that a modern-day special ops team would be well-equipped to handle? Why adopt dustbuster-style phasers that look like a huge pain to aim properly, even with computer-assisted targeting? Why send away teams out with only basic uniforms and the few devices that will fit on a belt? Why heat rocks with phasers? Does Starfleet not have the technology to make portable space heaters? If flight boots exist, then why not have redshirts that can use them to scout? That by itself would have solved a number of, "we have to track them," scenarios.

Part of it, I think, is due to the cell phone problem, i.e., having a handy bit of technology can remove a lot of the drama from a story if it circumvents a significant part of the problem. Another part of the problem is lazy writing -- just treat every excursion as if you were visiting a nearby starbase.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

I know I've read a cross-over with ST where either the standard uniforms have many hidden features, or you can requisition all the better stuff, but ONLY IF YOU'VE READ THE MANUAL. (I wish I could find it again. The xover char was living in the holodeck for some reason with guards)
 
DW75 said:
That's the kind of shot even a sniper at close range against a nonmoving target would be wary about trying.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
There's your problem; you're trying to use a sniper instead of a shotgun.

Although if we're talking about best ways to stop vampires, just have clergy bless the water. All the water.
...
And then nick a fire truck.
 
Killing Vamps is easy. A normal can do it.

If they know.

If.

Breaking the Masquerade isn't gonna happen. Only person who ever pulled it off was Jasmine, and she was with the Powers.

Inference: The Powers that Be are upholding the notice-me-nots. They're slightly worse than the Ascended Ancients. The Ancients let the big kids have weapons to beat us up and yoink them out of our hands when we get them.

The Powers don't even let most of us fight back. Maybe a few more bits of Mordite are in order? "But then the good guys won't get-" What? Debilitating visions? The only good guys in the Buffyverse are humans and demons that have gone native.

What WILL happen is a war where the human race kicks the interdimensional gribblies off their planet.

Only thing might be that crosses and holy water won't work anymore if the Family kills the pseudo-christian angel things that sponsor the 'holy' effect.

Still, squads of soldiers with a thermal camera and shotguns or SMG's with hollowpoints looking through hiding spots during the daytime (and staking any sleeping vamps) should be absolutely fine.

Warning the peoples of the western world to stay home after sundown for a quarantine that'll last a few months and just deploying the military like that should minimize most risk within... what? Half a year? Three months?

Vamps do get hungry, after all. Assuming of course medical blood and cattle mutilation are also tracked, they'll have nowhere to hide.

And afterward, when a Vampire infestation does show up, just send in the kill teams.

Two years in, Vamps should be only a sigma more common than serial killers, an acceptable consequence of not being fucking farmed anymore.


Lack of knowledge about Vamps makes them a threat. And that is, without a shadow of a doubt, enemy action.
 
Last edited:
Foxy Boxes said:
There's your problem; you're trying to use a sniper instead of a shotgun.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Considering that i'm a good enough shot with a handgun that i was asked if i wanted to try competing? No, i would never be stupid enough to try to shoot at someones knees if i ever had to use a gun in a fight. And a shotgun is only marginally better.


Foxy Boxes said:
Although if we're talking about best ways to stop vampires, just have clergy bless the water. All the water.
...
And then nick a fire truck.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

MUCH better idea. Notice how a firetruck isn't a firearm? :)

Or at least, it's a better idea as long as it is actually possible to get that much holy water right off(canon leans towards "only small amounts at a time"), and you're capable of "delivering" the water effectively on target.
Still, even squirtguns with holy water has a pretty good chance to be more effective than firearms(except flamers and flamethrowers) in general.
 
DW75 said:
Or at least, it's a better idea as long as it is actually possible to get that much holy water right off(canon leans towards "only small amounts at a time"), and you're capable of "delivering" the water effectively on target.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Ehhhhh...
Worst come to worst, vampires are still susceptible to blunt force trauma.
 
Foxy Boxes said:
Ehhhhh...
Worst come to worst, vampires are still susceptible to blunt force trauma.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

If you believe some sources hitting vampires with your fists (assuming you're strong enough) or wooden clubs works better than metal weapons or bullets...

So, the arrows with the fire-hardened wood points...

Or, maybe you could ask Skitter what her insects can do to them...
 
Ace Dreamer said:
If you believe some sources hitting vampires with your fists (assuming you're strong enough) or wooden clubs works better than metal weapons or bullets...

So, the arrows with the fire-hardened wood points...

Or, maybe you could ask Skitter what her insects can do to them...
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
That feeling when vampires are actually a secret weapon of the Fae, trying to overcome the "cold iron" weakness.
 
Derek M said:
How often have we seen Starfleet personnel suffering from hostile environments that a modern-day special ops team would be well-equipped to handle?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Over civilized. See average large city dweller on a farm or off road camp... They just expect most places to be civilized and they came dressed for dinner with the planet president. If conditions are bad they will just teleport out, except when they can't, and get caught unprepared. Why do you think they send the captain or first officer down as the advance scout? Not to fight the elements, but not insult the natives by sending someone of low rank.
 
Reader mode
You must login or register to reply here.
Remove ads
Back
Top