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Nations of Steel and Sabre

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And this is the USE's Coalition of the Willing to invade Mexico.

Wow.

Such values.

Much freedom.

Very Uptime.

Wow.

You had one job, Wallenstein. One. Job.
 
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Wade Garrett said:
And this is the USE's Coalition of the Willing to invade Mexico.

Wow.

Such values.

Much freedom.

Very Uptime.

Wow.

You had one job, Wallenstein. One. Job.
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What do you mean? This isn't slavery, this is perfectly moral recreational program to give the POWs exercise to stay healthy, some soldiers might be depressed from being captured, so I've made it mandatory, it isn't SLAVERY.
This is complexly unrelated!
 
The Big E said:
What do you mean? This isn't slavery, this is perfectly moral recreational program to give the POWs exercise to stay healthy, some soldiers might be depressed from being captured, so I've made it mandatory, it isn't SLAVERY.
This is complexly unrelated!
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"What do you mean clearly a plot to manufacture casus belli? I always wear body armor while riding in the car!"
:p
 
Oh yeah, I should probably figure out my economy bonuses.
Also, fun times. The Mexican war is ... going ... interesting. We've got the Mexicans losing but the Gran Columbians are making their PoWs do forced labor, the Indies beat the shit out of the USE, and started a new war with Oceania...

Also I don't think having former relative allies that are now married to other people who happen to be allies of other people, makes you inherently connected in any way.

Edit: Dammit.
shiverczar threw 1 6-faced dice. Reason: Economic Status Total: 1
1 1
 
Crilltic said:
Dude you realize all three of those characters fall into the examples I gave (well, except for Vader in RotJ, but before that he's literally an archetype and the fact he was redeemed by his love for his son doesn't retroactively not make him a villain in the first place).

Sauron was obsessed with Order and Control and was corrupted by Morgoth to align himself with Morgoth's might to overthrow God. Voldemort was an isolated and abused child, with sociopathic and violent tendencies brought on by his upbringing and also literal magic who used a bigoted and genocidal ideology to get revenge on a father he saw as abandoning him.
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Uhm, Sauron had his chance to reform. He ..opted out. Whether he did it out of powerlust or sheer cowardice, in the end itz irrelevant.

oldemort had REASOnS to be bitter and all... but , well, he did things that put him sqarely beyond the moral evdnt horizon. As in 'creating Horctuxes' , trying to eradicate other halfbloods etc.
ETC.

Vader.. yup, ader was noth a villain and a victim and he redeemed himself in the end.
 
The Big E said:
On another note, I just decided to implement this mandatory recreational labour program to keep all the Mexican POWs occupied during their stay in the prison camps.
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Where are these camps you're taking them to?

Sailor Midgard said:
Vader.. yup, ader was noth a villain and a victim and he redeemed himself in the end.
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He...turned his back on darkness in the end. To call him 'redeemed' for the Jedi Purge, the Galactic Civil War, the torture, mass murder, war crimes, atrocities and all simply because he saved one tow haired youth he just so happened to be related to from death-by-Emperor after all the rest goes a bit far in my mind.
 
Mina said:
He...turned his back on darkness in the end. To call him 'redeemed' for the Jedi Purge, the Galactic Civil War, the torture, mass murder, war crimes, atrocities and all simply because he saved one tow haired youth he just so happened to be related to from death-by-Emperor after all the rest goes a bit far in my mind.
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Hey, there's a theological argument about the nature of redemption to be had there. :mad:
 
Havocfett said:
Hey, there's a theological argument about the nature of redemption to be had there. :mad:
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First we have to nail down what we mean by 'redeemed', no?

That is, there's something to be said for deathbed repentance, thief on the cross, etc, but if you're talking about any kind of quantifiable or utilitarian factor, Mina has a point that throwing one evil space wizard down a reactor shaft doesn't really balance the scales for the younglings, Alderaan, Padme, and all the various and sundry bad stuff that being Palpatine's hatchetman entailed.

(Gets worse if you bring in the EU, because then all Anakin did was briefly inconvenience and annoy Sidious)
 
Havocfett said:
Hey, there's a theological argument about the nature of redemption to be had there. :mad:
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Sure, but I tend to view redemption of his soul or whatever as a separate matter from his redemption as a man. He may have redeemed the former, maybe, but if the Force lives in the slightest bit I'd much prefer it remember the agony that one man wrought on it to give him an all clear for a deathbed reconversion.
 
Theravis said:
It's the second coming of commanderblade!
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*sigh*
Wade Garrett said:
And this is the USE's Coalition of the Willing to invade Mexico.

Wow.

Such values.

Much freedom.

Very Uptime.

Wow.

You had one job, Wallenstein. One. Job.
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Hey, he's going to get backstabbed anyway.
Wade Garrett said:
Unrelated:


Ha ha! Recognition by a European power as a sovereign nation, Jefferson Davis couldn't get that with 4 years of carnage, suck it Marse Jeff!
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Well, Jeff had slaves. Makes him clearly inferior.
Mina said:
Sure, but I tend to view redemption of his soul or whatever as a separate matter from his redemption as a man. He may have redeemed the former, maybe, but if the Force lives in the slightest bit I'd much prefer it remember the agony that one man wrought on it to give him an all clear for a deathbed reconversion.
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and thus, to achieve redemption, Anakin's force ghost must drift among the stars, righting wrongs until the long list of sins is reduced to nothing.....
 
Mina said:
Sure, but I tend to view redemption of his soul or whatever as a separate matter from his redemption as a man. He may have redeemed the former, maybe, but if the Force lives in the slightest bit I'd much prefer it remember the agony that one man wrought on it to give him an all clear for a deathbed reconversion.
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If I recall correctly, there's a force ghost of Anakin all peaceful and resolved shown towards the end of 6... >_<
 
shiverczar said:
If I recall correctly, there's a force ghost of Anakin all peaceful and resolved shown towards the end of 6... >_<
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Mina said:
Yeah that could just be him on a temporary break from feeling all the pain of the universe for all eternity.
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THatWhichWillBe said:
and thus, to achieve redemption, Anakin's force ghost must drift among the stars, righting wrongs until the long list of sins is reduced to nothing.....
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I doubt the Force would waste a perfectly good 'Chosen One' by putting him in eternal torment.
 
THatWhichWillBe said:
I doubt the Force would waste a perfectly good 'Chosen One' by putting him in eternal torment.
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But Anakin wasn't really the chosen one, remember? He never restored balanced to the force. He was just a particularly powerful force user who, depending on which canon you're using, briefly inconvenienced Palpatine, let Palpatine get replaced by magical dark space Gollum, or ushered in the glorious Pallopides Dynasty that reigned for a thousand years.
 
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