Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)

Negotiating with LoC is part of negotiating with larger US government and the first step in the process.
Thats like negotiating with the CIA during the Cold War. Its really not binding on the rest of the US.
Its a first step, dont get me wrong, but the Library is not a diplomatic agency.
Its not meant to be. Relations with the Library often end there.

When did I say anything about "some other factions bankrolling [us]"?
You want several billion dollars from the US government for something.
Other factions, mundane and supernatural, have eyes and intelligence agents, and can draw their own conclusions.

Like I said, the US govt does not just give anyone several billion dollars.
The international trade deals it negotiates are generally ground rules between US corporations and foreign govts.


1) Going with this wiki article, we have at least CDW, Sierra Nevada Corporation, Cerberus Capital Management, Atlantic Diving Supply, and probably others (if I was less strict with criteria) businesses that started and mostly remain privately owned by small amount of people
2) We are not a private citizen. We are a head of a sovereign state
3) Why would large scale deals be off the books? I am fully aiming at establishing legal presence. I'll point out that in-story at least Tiffany thinks that this is a reasonable and expected course of action for Molly to take, and she's not stupid.
1)For one thing, most of those corporations only derive part of their income from the US govt.
For another,those are not small organizations; Sierra Nevada Corporation, for example, has four thousand permanent staff.

They are all based in the US, largely employ US citizens, and are subject to oversight by US federal and state inspectors, and to being sued in US courts. Their officers are and can be summoned by the US judiciary and the US Congress.
The IRS can and does audit them.

I mean, you are literally quoting from a Wiki article compiled from information that these corporations were legally compelled to provide to the US government and made public.
The amount of oversight that you are under when doing business with the Feds is huge.

The US wont even let foreign-owned ships carry US cargo between US ports.
Looking in from the outside, you gravely underestimate the level of monitoring and control the US government legally exerts wherever it possibly can.

===
2) Prove it.

And prove it in a way that doesnt shatter the Masquerade into itty-bitty bits. Do it without with all our minions in jail for, at the very least, immigration fraud, if not espionage or whatever options that the US national security apparatus can try if they choose to play hardball or a pressure campaign.

If nothing else, the US as a corporate entity is going to have Opinions about a foreign nation state operating military forces on its territory and shanking people unilaterally.

I genuinely cant see how anyone can see the state of the US legislature, from 1950s McCarthy through the dumbass decisionmaking of the War on Terror to 2000s Tea Party, and assume that the US as a corporate entity will automatically behave in good faith, as opposed to large sections throwing a fit.

There's a reason the Library hides shit when they can.

===
3) Because you will shatter the Masquerade in doing so, and cause all the fuckery that multiple factions in the setting have been trying to avoid, and which the Outsiders have been trying to bring about.

Tiffany expects Molly to go into technological uplift.
Good guess, but we arent obliged to do so.



Why do you think we would be assumed to be a private individual?
Why wouldnt we be?
We are a citizen of the United States. We were born in the US.
We live in the US. We pay taxes there. Our siblings are resident there. We (pretend) to be subject to its laws.

Even among supernaturals, spontaneously manifesting an entire domain of sapient individuals is unprecedented.
The usual evaluation of such claims is psychosis, not royalty.

===
If other nationstates dont recognize you as a nationstate or the official of one, they are under no obligation to extend the courtesies of one to you.

===
Furthermore, I will refer you to how the US treats other nationstates, even those it claims as allies.
It has a lot more resemblance to how the supernatural nations act among each other than we are probably strictly comfortable with contemplating.

And frankly, it crosses boundaries that many supernatural nations wont.
Mab wont tap your phone or spy on you at a diplomatic summit she is hosting or guaranteeing; the US(and the other human powers) have no such compunctions.


====
PS
I dont even want to consider the legal complications of how the Emoluments Clause of the US Constitution would interact with Molly being Demon Empress of Sanctuary.
Or whether all 5 billion citizens of Sanctuary can make an argument for being US citizens :V
 
Last edited:
The doylist of that would be the people of our hell aren't all that talented then. Which with the culture of excellence and there being billions of them would just be depressing. Also fairly sure our hell has had wars its just only semi recently united on a historical level as far as I know.
Culture of excellence does not necessarily mean magic.
Or it might lean towards people having a little of many Paths rather than a lot of one.
Or it might just be skill decay, assuming that its a mechanic in this quest.

No idea.
Since we prepped the FCfF to assemble kill teams we have, I believe.
We put them on standby yesterday. We only figured out where they were going to go maybe an hour or two ago.
I think its reasonable they havent had the time to have any such rituals cast on them, and that noone was going to risk being mid-ritual when Molly calls for them.
 
Culture of excellence does not necessarily mean magic.
Or it might lean towards people having a little of many Paths rather than a lot of one.
Or it might just be skill decay, assuming that its a mechanic in this quest.

No idea.

We put them on standby yesterday. We only figured out where they were going to go maybe an hour or two ago.
I think its reasonable they havent had the time to have any such rituals cast on them, and that noone was going to risk being mid-ritual when Molly calls for them.
Look plenty of mortals can if old get past 5 dots in this stuff on earth if they can't in our hell that just straight up means their not all that excellent if with their what 1,000,000% increase in population size and much higher lifespans means that they kinda suck on some level compared to earth people. Most sidhe have some level of supernatural skill in some stuff, most wizards over a couple centuries old, comparatively some of ours should be well over a thousand. There's a limit to how good but beyond 5 dots seems like something even a normal person could theoretically get if given an absurd amount of time.
 
Arc 11 Post 86: Brass Falling, Blood Flowing
Brass Falling, Blood Flowing

13th of January 2007 A.D.

The problem with taking twenty six people underground to hunt vampires is that the corridors are at most wide enough for four to walk abreast, or four if they are very good friends as Tiffany jokingly puts it... er snuggling up Hand of Gently Falling Ash to the vague confusion of the agent, at least until he figures out she's the designated healer checking him over to see where all the important bits are rather than checking him out. You keep silent on the fact that she's probably teasing Harry as well.

"Vanguard, Rearguard, VIP protect, no scouting, assume prepared and entrenched foe Red One and Red Two Template," the commands ring out in whisper-tongue sending the other agents moving as the gears of a well oiled machine. Cybernetic eyes glare burnt orange and nacreous green, drawing a sigh of fear wonder or both from Harrowmont.

For his part Mr. Adkin does not speak at once, instead seeming to consider his new comrades before drawing the empowered talisman, a little closer... and demonstrating how to trigger it. "Should I die show them the Eye of Ra."

"Understood," something of the confusion regarding what this old man was doing on the mission faded from the face of the agent nearest to him, a tall dusky skinned woman, her elongated features and lack of any hair hinting at spirit blood, perhaps even of an ophidian sort. Such an odd company we make, you think as you pass by the first intersaction, a quick peek around the corner confirming there is no one waiting to ambush you there. So it goes, the second intersection, the third you find colapsed, a mess of broken concrete and rusted rebar.

No one has anything else to say, the only sound passing down the tunnels the sloshing of your own footsteps on bare concrete and broken glass, twisted plastic and other refuse that on closer inspection reveal the remains of lives twice-broken. There is no mistaking the dark streaks on the walls even after all this time and so are the spent casings glinting in the light of gun-mounted lanterns.

On the floor among the tatters that might have once been a shopping bag something moved, ripples in the water drawing every eye. What...?

Every eye bar one.

"Up! Vampires!" Harry's shout comes with a gout of fire aimed at the ceiling where a hidden penned had been silently removed only for four bat-like faces to look on in horror as the fifth of their number is engulfed in flames.

"Contact! Hostile Reds" Electro-Lasers flash poisoned green behind you and the bark of semiautomatic weapons shatters the silence into a million pieces.

You see armored agents moving with inhuman speed, not fast enough to doege bullets true, but enough to turn what would have been a hail of bullets into center mass into grazes and glancing shots, the alchemically tempered armour proving its worth... except for the woman who had been speaking to Mr Adkin, who takes a bullet to the jaw shettering it.

It only seems to piss her off more as she raises her weapon again, eldertich flame in the depths.

One Agent of the Amethyst Hand Takes 3 Damage -> Reflexactivated Adrenal Gland Enhancement Active: 1 Rage Spent: Wound Penalty Negated for the Round

They are trying to pin us in place, the thought flashes through your mind a second before you notice another teltale ripple in the water ahead. Grenades.

Of course they are going to blow up their own people, it's not like they would survive to see sunrise if Sandra has her way.

What do you do?

[] Use Mind Hand Manipulation to grab all the grenades and throw them back at the enemy before they can explode

[] Let Harry handle the Grenades and deal with the four vampires dropping on top of you

[] Call out to the people with guns coming up behind you that they are being lied to and used, maybe your presence will be enough to shock them into listening.

[] Write in


  • Four Vampires in their true form above
  • Five humanoid (Vampires or Infected) figures behind you straffing the rearguard with automatic fire
  • Several Grenades rolled through the water from up ahead

OOC: Everyone but Harry failed their Perception+Alertness rolls, even with the advantages the Amethyst hand agents have they botched so things are pretty touch and go.
 
Last edited:
So we can expect suicide bomb tactics all the way down then. Now I wish we had the other rampires for meat shields. Full essence also would've allowed us to brute force grenade spam with mindhand just saying.
 
Last edited:
[X] Let Harry handle the Grenades and deal with the four vampires dropping on top of you

@DragonParadox
Maybe this was already answered, but can our Calibration Gate reach our Hell?

No, it would be trying to break into your own soul with sorcery, the exaltation would be confused, you generally do not want those autonomous functions confused. It's a bit like a human hearing 'your spine is confused by the intrusion' only the spinal column does not come with built in defenses

@DragonParadox Does the entire tunnel assault before we meet the Dragon or Sandra count as one scene?

If you find her fast enough it would.
 
No, it would be trying to break into your own soul with sorcery, the exaltation would be confused, you generally do not want those autonomous functions confused. It's a bit like a human hearing 'your spine is confused by the intrusion' only the spinal column does not come with built in defenses
That makes it kinda hard to reach our Hell though.

Is it metaphysically reachable enough that someone else could Calibration Gate their way in?
Or a regular Way through the Nevernever could be made?

Molly being the eternal chokepoint to her Hell would limit interactions in the very long term.
 
That makes it kinda hard to reach our Hell though.

Is it metaphysically reachable enough that someone else could Calibration Gate their way in?
Or a regular Way through the Nevernever could be made?

Molly being the eternal chokepoint to her Hell would limit interactions in the very long term.

A Way could do it, but it would be through some vastly inhospitable places conceptually very far from Earth
 
Well it's a very narrow tunnel Harry should be able to force push the grenades back at them but I'm wary of him successfully doing so everytime. If even one gets through in this closed space and noone counters it could be bad for the soft targets. Also Harry can only force push in one direction at a time meanwhile mindhand could better cover both sides.
 
Harry should be able to handle this. He's dealt with larger with less warning, and we shouldn't be blowing through our Essence so soon.

[X] Let Harry handle the Grenades and deal with the four vampires dropping on top of you
 
No, it would be trying to break into your own soul with sorcery, the exaltation would be confused, you generally do not want those autonomous functions confused. It's a bit like a human hearing 'your spine is confused by the intrusion' only the spinal column does not come with built in defenses
How about if we get The Pentacle and the Scepter (••••) charm and learn the deeper secrets of sorcery? I assume that the primordials were able to open gates from their inner world?
 
How about if we get The Pentacle and the Scepter (••••) charm and learn the deeper secrets of sorcery? I assume that the primordials were able to open gates from their inner world?

The problem with opening a gate into your soul is not that you do not know how to do it, it is that you do not know how to shut down the autonomous reaction of your own exaltation. If you want to look into those mysteries your best bet would be to seek out the Labyrinth and learn whatever may be found within.
 
I look forward to doing that adventure. What do you guys figure we need before we are ready for it?
Molly had said back during the White Council diplomatic first contact bit that she could probably have done it back then. Plus we have lord of the land and recharge while there so I doubt force will be a concern.
 
[X] Let Harry handle the Grenades and deal with the four vampires dropping on top of you

Harry has a number of options, starting with techbane, I think.
 
With the tunnels flooded why are we even bothering to fight our way through them rather than using RDV to skip directly to Sandra?
 
With the tunnels flooded why are we even bothering to fight our way through them rather than using RDV to skip directly to Sandra?

Because you would have to fight alone, it seems odd to choose to bring in Sanctuary troops and then not use them at all so I assumes you were going with the group. Going alone might have the advantage of surprise but it would have the issue that you are alone. If she has some means to immobilize or otherwise deal with Molly there would be no back up
 
The troops attacking the tunnels would definitely force Sandra to pull off defenders from her own location, right?

Using the rest of our attack as a distraction while we strike at Sandra herself might be viable.
 
Because you would have to fight alone, it seems odd to choose to bring in Sanctuary troops and then not use them at all so I assumes you were going with the group. Going alone might have the advantage of surprise but it would have the issue that you are alone. If she has some means to immobilize or otherwise deal with Molly there would be no back up

Couldn't we have RDV-Ed past the guards close to Sandra and then jumped in and out of the FFC and deployed our forces there, rather than deploying them at the entrance to the tunnels?

Or used them to pin all the defenders that we bypassed, or a mixture.
 
Last edited:
Couldn't we have RDV-Ed past the guards close to Sandra and then jumped in and out of the FFC and deployed our forces there, rather than deploying them at the entrance to the tunnels?

Or used them to pin all the defenders that we bypassed, or a mixture.

Past these guards certainly, but you do not know what guards she has on her, some of them may well be in arm's reach.
 
Back
Top