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Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)

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Yzarc said:
Also this may be a contraversial thing but we should NOT take flight in Shintai form.

My reason is that at E2 we can purchase Rage Recast again. So we get flight from that charm so we no longer are dependent on the Shintai for Flight.
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I am fine with this.

Extra free Hardened Devil Body for more HLs. 15 HLs, 2 extra dice of Soak (I think an extra Devil Body may be better than Demon Armor tbh) and Hardened (Fire) so we are immune to building fires and forest fires.

Jack vile Ripper said:
Honestly, I picked Demon Emperor Shintai because I liked the aesthetics of a giant 15ft tall behemoth rampaging across everything it could see. The even spread of Attributes is also good choice for me. Additional Demon Aspects we can obtain from Unbound Eschaton Shintai.
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The big downside is that if its so huge we can't use it in a lot of places. In tunnels, buildings we don't want to destroy, magically reinforced buildings we may not be able to destroy instantly to expand.

We would be super visible if doing so in the city.

I don't really like it. It's not a dealbreaker but not my favourite.
 
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I'm in favor of being personed-sized in our transformed state rather than gigantic. Being that large is just completely impractical in most circumstances.
 
Valkhir said:
The big downside is that if its so huge we can't use it in a lot of places. In tunnels, buildings we don't want to destroy, magically reinforced buildings we may not be able to destroy instantly to expand.

We would be super visible if doing so in the city.

I don't really like it. It's not a dealbreaker but not my favourite.
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Hmm, I suppose that the giant Godzilla-esque feature is not going to always be useful. There could be many occasion where not a every scenario allows us to expand our body to fit in.

It's just that, there are not many Demonic Aspects that are useful enough, I guess? With E5 as our maximum, we can take up to 5 Demonic Aspects that are integral to our daily usages without resorting to Shintais. Our Demonic Guide already has Demon Weapon, so we won't need to pick that.

Some Demonic Aspects are made obsolete with the usage of some Charms (Gills and Aquatic can be replaced with Boiling Sea Mastery (•), Flexible is already replaced with Cracked Shell Circumvention, Tentacles can be substituted with Mind Hand Manipulation, and Gravity Rebuking Grace made Swift Stride and Wall Crawler useless).

Aside from Hardened Devil Body (which is essential since Shintai Health tracks are different from the Infernal's usual Health Track), there's not much that are useful besides the ones that are useful we can just grab with By Rage Recast.

But I can make a new Option and fluff if you want?
 
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CorruptedKing said:
I still prefer demon Emperor because I'm biased and really like the biblical angel design @Jack vile Ripper came up with
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Technically there were human shaped angels in the Bible. Rather, they were the norm when interacting with humans.

The Thrones, Cherubim, Seraphim are all in Heaven near stuff like the Throne of God or guarding Eden. They are just memorably different than usual modern conceptions of angels so they stick in the mind more.

Not really important, but just saying.

Also, we could look like a cherub with Devil-Tyrant. They look like a human but also with 3 other animal heads and wings.

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Jack vile Ripper said:
Aside from Hardened Devil Body (which is essential since Shintai Health tracks are different from the Infernal's usual Health Track), there's not much that aren't useful besides the ones we can just grab with By Rage Recast.
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Yeah but Devil Bodies are the lifeblood of a tanky build, which I think you and I at least, and maybe more are interested in.

I don't think people will buy repurchases of By Rage Recast for those, and they would be right not doing so. But getting 5 or 6 free ones is excellent.

They may not be present in all instances we are in per se, but with The City Still Stands and Devil-Tyrant, they are always doing the work they are supposed to do as HLs. Which is making us survive in every situation.
 
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CorruptedKing said:
I still prefer demon Emperor because I'm biased and really like the biblical angel design @Jack vile Ripper came up with
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Honestly? We can do both with our base Shintai being human sized Unbbound Escchaton Shintai which CAN be a huge transformation.
Jack vile Ripper said:
Hmm, I suppose that the giant Godzilla-esque feature is not going to always be useful. There could be many occasion where not a every scenario allows us to expand our body to fit in.
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+4 to our Dex is essentially half an excellency per roll for the duration that the Shintai is up. Even better, we can use an Excellency to further boost our rolls.

So, the fact that the aspects are not as useful is made up for by the fact that we hit much harder. It also helps that we can stack hlvls like crazy, making it a true super mode.
 
Yzarc said:
+4 to our Dex is essentially half an excellency per roll for the duration that the Shintai is up. Even better, we can use an Excellency to further boost our rolls.
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Wait, the Bonus Dice that came from Shintais are not considered Dice added by Charms? We can extend our dice pool beyond our Base Attribute + Base Ability score?

@DragonParadox is this true? Are Dice added from Shintai Transformation considered the Infernal's true base Attribute score?
 
Also, I just realized we kind of need to go Devil-Tyrant and stack Devil Bodies if we want to not fuck up a tank build.

Ox-Body specifies that it doesn't grant HLs to Shintai track, only normal tracks.

So Demon Emperor Shintai...would be vastly less tanky than our normal form. What a supermode...

This Charm can be purchased a number of times
equal to the character's Essence rating. It only enhances
the Infernal's regular health track, not her Shintai form.
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Jack vile Ripper said:
Are Dice added from Shintai Transformation considered the Infernal's true base Attribute score?
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While wearing her Shintai form, the Infernal en-
joys the Attribute modifications of the form, along
with any Shintai Aspects and Signature Charms. She
retains full access to her Charms
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I guess it could be normal for Charm purposes. Its attribute modification not a Charm, but a Shintai.

So it could be... [(Dex + Shintai + Unbound Eschaton Dex) + Melee] x 2 (Excellency) + 2 (Without Honour)

Or it could be [(Dex + Melee) x 2] + 4 (Shintai) + 3 (Unbound Eschaton) + 2 (Without Honour
 
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Valkhir said:
Also, I just realized we kind of need to go Devil-Tyrant and stack Devil Bodies if we want to not fuck up a tank build.

Ox-Body specifies that it doesn't grant HLs to Shintai track, only normal tracks.

So Demon Emperor Shintai...would be vastly less tanky than our normal form. What a supermode...
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Yeah, if this were regular Exalted, I would scoff at the thought of having to raise Soak or Health level at all. But this new system isn't so unforgiving as 2.5.

Right, making build now.
 
Jack vile Ripper said:
@DragonParadox is this true? Are Dice added from Shintai Transformation considered the Infernal's true base Attribute score?
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No unfortunately. I asked this and the answer was a no.

From the FAQ in the book (p.446):
Does [thing that raises a trait] increase the amount of dice my Excellence Charm gives me?
Unless it explicitly says it does, no. Those Charms only care about the permanent dots on your character sheet. A Lunar's shapeshifting never empowers her Excellence Charms, for example (although she can have both bonuses active at once).
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Okay, so a max dex and melee and Charms would be...

[(Dex + Melee) x 2] + 4 (Shintai) + 3 (Unbound Eschaton) + 2 (Without Honour)

[(5 + 5) x 2] + 9

29 Dice is not bad with Unbound Eschaton Devil Tyrant, I think its worth it.
 
Valkhir said:
Okay, so a max dex and melee and Charms would be...

[(Dex + Melee) x 2] + 4 (Shintai) + 3 (Unbound Eschaton) + 2 (Without Honour)

[(5 + 5) x 2] + 9

29 Dice is not bad with Unbound Eschaton Devil Tyrant, I think its worth it.
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>29 Dice

You fucking sold me. Add this alongside our Green Sun Nimbus Flare and EVERYTHING we hits DIE horribbly.

It's a fucking shame we don't have a Hungry Tiger Technique equivalent. Doubling the amount of success gained will be MASSIVE with 29 Dice.
 
Jack vile Ripper said:
>29 Dice

You fucking sold me. Add this alongside our Green Sun Nimbus Flare and EVERYTHING we hits DIE horribbly.

It's a fucking shame we don't have a Hungry Tiger Technique equivalent. Doubling the amount of success gained will be MASSIVE with 29 Dice.
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How to get more blender is Charms.

The Signature Boiling Oil counterattack so every successful attack on you results in an automatic counter at full dicepool + our tank build and of course, Thousandfold Typhoon Hand.

Spend at least 1 Essence (maximum is Athletics rating). After all other actions of the turn are done make (Spent Essence x 2) attacks at full dicepool against someone.
 
So we can only make Atheletics rating attacks with that charm. So a Max of 5, if we spend 3 essence that turn.

It is useful but we would need to raise atheletics to get the most out of it.
 
Yzarc said:
So we can only make Atheletics rating attacks with that charm. So a Max of 5, if we spend 3 essence that turn.

It is useful but we would need to raise atheletics to get the most out of it.
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You're right.

We're better off with the counterattack Charm and other stuff to spend EXP on I guess. Maybe as a luxury purchase way later.
 
Jack vile Ripper said:
>29 Dice

You fucking sold me. Add this alongside our Green Sun Nimbus Flare and EVERYTHING we hits DIE horribbly.

It's a fucking shame we don't have a Hungry Tiger Technique equivalent. Doubling the amount of success gained will be MASSIVE with 29 Dice.
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I think if we pick this up I'm going to drop the quest and it should be said that I know that this sounds like an attempt to guilt people into not choosing this option and having thought about it, it absolutely is however I want to be frank and honest about how I feel about it and couldn't come up with a better way. Nobody should feel bad just because I do.
 
Would be worth it to get one more dot in Atheletics as we get to spend only 1 essence for +2 attacks at full dice value.

Any more does not seem worth it though. Still that charm is unfavored and a 4 dot charm so 16xp.
 
Counterattack Charms that doesn't count as Multiple Actions are the bread and butter for any Exalted Character that doesn't want to get mogged by mooks.

Fivefold Bulwark Stance is a good example of this.
 
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