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The Long Founding (Warhammer 40k)

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Red Bovine said:
So can anyone give a counter argument for artillery not being pretty redundant for this chapter? I am genuinely curious about why people are insisting on artillery despite the argument but no one having given a counter argument against it.
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The point was that it's redundant, no different from the idea to add extra Blademastery to make the Chapter even better at melee. The mundane artillery is extra support fire, plus The Chapter can use scrying to find targets. Psychic fire and Mundane heavy fire is supposed to suppot each other to result in maximum destruction, and the Artillery would be useful against opponents who are resistant or otherwise counter Psykery, like Necrons.

Then, after Ranged attack is done, The Chapter can massacre the enemy in melee and assault from their Dragon mounts. That was the idea for the Artillery, maximum destruction, and then clean up by Dragons and the melee monsters Chapter already has by default thanks to Blademastery.

Gabriel_TFA said:
...I will say one thing...it is still more useful than picking Blade Master BUT it is very less useful and synergies with the traits and trainings, while entratchment does.
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EDIT: Also, thanks to Techmarines, the Artillery will be of high quality, so it synergies just as well with that, as Techmarines with Entrenchment.
 
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Dlan the Wizard said:
The point was that it's redundant, no different from the idea to add extra Blademastery to make the Chapter even better at melee. The mundane artillery is extra support fire, plus The Chapter can use scrying to find targets. Psychic fire and Mundane heavy fire is supposed to suppot each other to result in maximum destruction, and the Artillery would be useful against opponents who are resistant or otherwise counter Psykery, like Necrons.

Then, after Ranged attack is done, The Chapter can massacre the enemy in melee and assault from their Dragon mounts. That was the idea for the Artillery, maximum destruction, and then clean up by Dragons and the melee monsters Chapter already has by default thanks to Blademastery.
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I keep saying this but no, legendary skills are not redundant. That level of skill is insane, it's like comparing a normal swordsman to a legendary master swordsman. Just look at Sigismund who was one of the dangerous space marines due to his insane sword skills that let him survive shit that would have killed most other normal space marines. And again, the Primarchs were among the deadliest beings in the galaxy depict being close range fighters a lot of the time.

Like let's be real, a master melee focused space marine can take out an army of normal people with just close range skills. While it's also pretty acknowledged that if say Custodes had nothing but a close range weapon they would still be able to slaughter whole armies by themselves.

Even discounting sword skills you yourself are admitting that artillery is redundant. Meanwhile as other have pointed thing like entrenchment synergies much more with not just tech machines but psyker powers. Meaning that they pretty much have much better synergies with this chapter than artillery and thus give more of a boost.

The Necrons example is also kind of a lousy argument due to us not really looking into picking fights with them. Heck, we have not run into a single one this whole quest. Besides that despite the misconception Space Marines are actually good in a lot of areas, including multiple forms of combat like close range and long range. We just pick what acc chapter specializes in specifically. Also with the quick learner trait it seems like it would be even less of an issue since they would be picking up other stuff outside psyker stuff anyway.
 
Looks like there is only an eight vote difference between the golden sons options right now

Seven now
 
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[] Plan: The Golden Sons

… i really want to vote this because i do artillery for the guard, however i think the other makes more sense.

[X] Plan: The Golden Sons - Entrenchment Edition
 
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