Voting is open
I am much more open to considering the Southern Strategy with this explanation.

@PoptartProdigy Would it be possible to design an onboarding process to help state actors unduly influenced by foreign interests to divest themselves of those interests thereby joining?

Basically allowing us to absorb states that get vetoed, by providing a path for them to identify and divest themselves of, said interest.

Is that a thing they would be open to considering?
 
I am much more open to considering the Southern Strategy with this explanation.

@PoptartProdigy Would it be possible to design an onboarding process to help state actors unduly influenced by foreign interests to divest themselves of those interests thereby joining?

Basically allowing us to absorb states that get vetoed, by providing a path for them to identify and divest themselves of, said interest.

Is that a thing they would be open to considering?
Much later down the line.
 
@PoptartProdigy Out of curiousity, how concerned is New York about Victoria using military force against them in the future? Would a mutual defense clause against victorian attacks for all members closer than X kilometers to Victoria be viable as a concession for members?
 
^This. Cloture is terrible.
Cloture is not the Filibuster.
It is primarily a temporary brake against precipitate devisionmaking, it does not allow a dedicated minority to paralyse decisionmaking like the US Senate.

As a mechanism for minorities to avoid getting steamrollered or blindsided, its very useful.
But it does not allow them to stonewall decisions
There is a reason why the French-Canadians want reassurances specifically from us. If you take a look at the map on the status screen, currently most of Quebec is under Victorian occupation, with no contending statelets around them. If this occupation ends, it's probably because the Revivalist Council, or the Commonwealth specifically waged war on Victoria and won, resulting in forcing Victoria to give up those areas via peace treaty. Since a revivalist faction would be the one winning the conflict, the revivalist will be the ones with boots on the ground and the legal authority to make decision about how this territory is divided and administered in the future. So we have a say in the existence of Quebec by virtue of controlling this area both legally and militarily. That's why French-Canadians want reassurances from us, since the Revivalists will likely be the ones making decision about the independence of Quebec.
Its precisely because the Quebecois have been occupied by Victoria for over three decades that I dont approve of the option.
We could well end up with a region with a significant reservoir of Vic sympathizers on our northern coast and no legsl way to do anything about it.

*cracks knuckles*

tl;dr, new options thanks to write-ins:

[ ] United Post Office: While the body itself will need to thresh out the details, you could establish as a part of its charter that it will create a postal service operating in all member states (associated groups as practical). This is a significant project to commit the body to undertaking, and with your own commitments, you can't be sure that you'll be able to help in a significant capacity if it needs support, but it is valuable and broadly popular, and could realistically be done in the early stages of things. +1 with all factions.

[ ] Mexican Autonomy: Agree to recognize the Mexican Revivalists' formal organization's current or future membership as beyond the body's scope, and grant them a non-voting representative with the right to address the voting council at any time, along with the right to petition for entrance to the body at a later date by simple majority. +3 with Mexican Revivalists and guarantees that they at least attend, but locks them out from joining the body proper right now and enforces a hands-off policy for their territory.
Sweet.
I support both options.
With the clarification that NY would only be the financier for this body, rather than the eventual federal state, I'm a lot less leery about giving them that level of power. Not only is getting their buy in nice, but we desperately need the resources and institutional strength. That said, if we are going to make them the treasurer, I want to start pursuing direct integration so that it is a strictly temporary state of affairs.

Overall, I think I like this mix of options:
[ ] Direct Integration: +0 with all minor American factions and FCNY; -1 with NCR, Northern Mexicans, and Canadians; -2 with Mexican Revivalists.

[ ] Web of Association: +1 with Canadian factions, western and southern American factions, and northern Mexicans; +0 with NCR, FCNY, and Mexican Revivalists.

[ ] Post Office: +1 to All
[ ] Mexican Autonomy: +3 with Mexican Revivalists
[ ] Cloture: +1 with Canadian factions and the Mexican Revivalists.
[ ] Multilingualism: +1 with all Mexicans and French-Canadians.
[ ] Financier: +5 with FCNY.
[ ] Lifeline of the West: +3 with NCR.
[ ] Truth and Reconciliation Commission:+1 with all Canadian, minor American, and northern Mexican factions. -1 with NCR.
[ ] Military Exchange: +2 with all minor American factions, all Canadian factions, and the northern Mexicans.

Which, if I totaled them up correctly, will leave us with the following support levels:
FCNY (7)
NCR (1)
Anglo-Canadian Factions (5)
French-Canadian Factions (4)
Northern Mexican Factions (6)
Mexican Revivalists (1)
Western Minor American Factions (5)
Southern Minor American Factions (5)

So the big three concessions I've left off this list are
1. Mexican Revivalist Special Status
Frankly, I see this as mutually exclusive with Mexican Autonomy

2. Independence Referendum
I'd be fine with offering this to the French Canadians to get them to join up, but at their +4 status it doesn't really feel necessary. If we want to offer it for ideological or narrative reasons, I could go for it.

3. Southern Strategy
I am definitely down for competing with Brazil for influence over the Mississippi delta. That said, I am very concerned that the Southern Strategy is de facto ceding large amounts of influence of the American South to Brazil without Brazil having to do anything at all. If we are denying polities the ability to join our organization based on the whims of their rivals who joined up before they could, they aren't going to have much choice but to beg Brazil for protection from both us, and a Victorian/Russian resurgence.
Drop Independence Referendum.
Acquire Southern Strategy.

How is Brazil wielding diplomatic influence in the mouth of the Mississippi unacceptable? Attempting to wield diplomatic influence, especially around important trade routes is completely normal behavior for a state. They might not have set out to specifically accommodate Revivalists, but that is not something I would call unacceptable.
It would to late to attempt diplomacy with Brazil if talks had failed, but until yet we had no diplomatic contact whatsoever. I'm unwilling to make an enemy out of nation based solely on second-hand accounts by local revivalists members. For all we know, Brazil could be made into a potential ally if we make clear that the revivalists want to enable the Mississippi trade to flow more freely. And while I think it's good to wait for confirmation before accepting a certain framing, it's strange how you don't apply the same caution to antagonizing Brazil, a nation we have yet to have a single sentence of information on.
It is important to set red lines that potential rivals are aware of. Clear messaging prevents any misunderstandings down the line.
You dont want people thinking somewhere is free real estate when it isnt, and investing resources based on faulty assumptions.
Business investment is always welcome, attempting to establish a puppet state is not.

A South American consortium could have invested in the mouth of the Mississippi at any point in the last two decades and Victoria would not have been militarily capable of doing shit.
Noone did. So its entirely reasonable to be suspicious about intentions now.

I mean, the foundational documents of the Commonwealth go out of their way to be explicit about actively resisting Russian influence anywhere on the continent. Its a core pillar of our foreign policy.
Making it clear that extends to attempts by other powers to exploit is entirely consistent.

Updated my plan to incorporate the reviewed write-in concessions. Now, everyone is majority-approving of the Revivalist body, and all but two are super hyped up about it, which I feel is important (and a pleasant thought).

[ ] Plan: Party Up & Down the Coast to Coast v.1.1
-[ ][GOAL] Direct Integration: The body will attempt to, over time, directly integrate members into a single, federal state. The resulting state will be functional faster and more capably. +0 with all minor American factions and FCNY; -1 with NCR, Northern Mexicans, and Canadians; -2 with Mexican Revivalists.
-[ ][BODY STRUCTURE] Web of Association: While the decisions will be made by the above central council, non-state actors can seek association status and gain guaranteed audiences with said council and permanent representatives to deliver petitions for them. Adds a layer of complication, but this status is still up to the Council, so no states are going to be angry about it. +1 with Canadian factions, western and southern American factions, and northern Mexicans; +0 with NCR, FCNY, and Mexican Revivalists.
-[ ][CONCESSION] Cloture: Nobody wants to enact the liberum veto, but you have several attending factions who are concerned with being swallowed up in the tide of voices. Filibustering and the legislative measures that enabled it are a dirty memory for Americans, but there are ways to guarantee that minority voices are heard and respected that avoid some of the pitfalls. Institutes a supermajority requirement to close debate and move to a vote, with that requirement declining with each attempt at doing so in a session until a simple majority is required. +1 with Canadian factions and the Mexican Revivalists.
-[ ][CONCESSION] Southern Strategy: The Caribbean Sea and the Gulf of Mexico are becoming areas of increasing international interest in recent years, and the various people down there have virtually zero interest in any of that. Making a policy of not accepting the membership of any states found by the people in those regions to be inappropriately under foreign influence would be quite the draw to southern factions, but it would set a confrontational tone with Brazil and their bloc, given their newly-announced interest in the mouth of the Mississippi. +1 with southern American factions, the Mexican Revivalists, and the Northern Mexicans.
-[ ][CONCESSION] Lifeline of the West: The NCR, despite presently being in the flush of victory, is also feeling uncomfortably exposed, at the moment. It wants the body to commit to a project of reopening an infrastructure link across the Rockies, so that aid can reach them overland. Fortunately, Burns has just cleared out the largest concentration of bandits along the I-70, so this simplifies the question tremendously. Still, this is a big project. Without the FCNY's assistance, finding the funding for this is probably going to be the body's first big hurdle to clear. +3 with NCR.
-[ ][CONCESSION] Financier: This body is going to need a long of funding and the skills to manage it, and nobody on the continent is as wealthy as the Free City of New York. They are no longer the financial center of the world, but they know money, and have connections to get some. It'll mean handing quite a bit of power to them that cannot subsequently be taken back or controlled, but granting them the authority to handle the body's finances will invest them in it, freeing you up from having to manage them as closely as you're going to have to manage the other big players. +5 with FCNY.
-[ ][CONCESSION] Truth and Reconciliation Commission: An idea lifted from pre-Collapse Canada intended to examine the impacts of their residential schools for First Nations children, you plan to adopt it on a far grander scale. Make, as part of this body's charter, a commission with the aim of documenting the history and lasting impacts of the Collapse in humanitarian terms, and then making recommendations to the body as to how it should inform their formal decisions -- such as whom to favor in terms of who is the legitimate controller of a given patch of land. Broadly popular, but the NCR is going to see this as a slight against them. +1 with all Canadian, minor American, and northern Mexican factions. -1 with NCR.
-[ ][CONCESSION] Independence Referendum: The Quebecois have always had an independent streak, and half of them living under Victorian occupation has not changed that. They want a guarantee that, once all of Quebec is free from Victorian control, the body shall grant and respect a referendum regarding the independence of Quebec, so they may choose for themselves what their future entails. Sets a fairly dangerous precedent for the integrity of any state formed from this body, but to speak frankly, the Quebecois are not presently organized enough to make large-scale concessions other than this difficult. What they do have, courtesy of those same decades under Victoria, is a deep familiarity with the operation of insurgencies. +2 with the French-Canadians.
-[ ][CONCESSION] Military Exchange: Various minor factions are interested in building up their militaries, now that Victoria (and California) are no longer factors opposing that. The CFC, having just crushed Victoria in two consecutive force-on-force contests, has significant cachet in military matters. Announce that members of this body will have the opportunity to send officer candidates to CFC military schools. This will give them the insights they desire and expand your own influence, although every spot in your academies is precious, at the moment, and if you're handing them out to others, you'll need to push harder for access to foreign academies than you were already going to have to. +2 with all minor American factions, all Canadian factions, and the northern Mexicans.
-[ ][CONCESSION] United Post Office: While the body itself will need to thresh out the details, you could establish as a part of its charter that it will create a postal service operating in all member states (associated groups as practical). This is a significant project to commit the body to undertaking, and with your own commitments, you can't be sure that you'll be able to help in a significant capacity if it needs support, but it is valuable and broadly popular, and could realistically be done in the early stages of things. +1 with all factions.
-[ ][CONCESSION] Mexican Autonomy: Agree to recognize the Mexican Revivalists' formal organization's current or future membership as beyond the body's scope, and grant them a non-voting representative with the right to address the voting council at any time, along with the right to petition for entrance to the body at a later date by simple majority. +3 with Mexican Revivalists and guarantees that they at least attend, but locks them out from joining the body proper right now and enforces a hands-off policy for their territory.

Final relation scores:
FCNY: +7
NCR: +1
Anglo-Canadian: +5
French Canadian: +4
Northern Mexican: +7
Mexican Revivalists: +1
Western Minor Americans: +5
Southern Minor Americans: +6
I'd drop Independence Referendum.
Both for the precedent, and for the practical reasons of preventing a post-WW2 Argentina forming to our North.

Yeah, well I'm really gun-shy about such measure
Cloture is not the Filibuster.
And as a means to ensure minorities are heard without affording them veto power, its a useful safety valve.

Brazil and Chile invest into port cities financially, along with other South American powers. If we threw out anybody with significant foreign investment, we would
Not all investment is benign.

I would invite you to look up the history of the Panama Canal, why the US supported Panamanian secession from Colombia and specifically the Hay-Bunau-Varilla Treaty. Look up the domestic opposition in the 1970s when Carter decided to give the Canal back to Panama.

Or check the history of British investment in Hong Kong, the Kowloon Peninsula and the New Territories.
Or Portugese involvement in Macao.
Or Goa.

Financial investment is fine. Political infiltration is not.
And its best to make it clear now, before they actually invest resources and it tskes on a life of its own
Do you want to sign off control of New Orleans for 99 years? Or fight a war there?

And we know the Mexicans and US southerns want to block south american influence from the region. Why? Wo knows! Maybe they hate the south american states for giving a loan to statelet they hate, maybe they want more control over trade themselves, maybe they consistently organize coups against revivalists. We simply have no idea. What people are suggesting is to get into a diplomatic conflict based on some southern members liking the idea. That is a concession hamstringing our diplomacy with a larger power.
But lets go a bit further and consult the world building threat on Brazil, specifically the second draft on South America.
3)
When both gringos and Latino locals over a thousand kilometres of border are worried about something, odds are that they are seeing something thats actually there.
 
Quebec has been subject to concerted efforts at cultural genocide by Victoria and has never stopped resisting. I highly doubt that we have to worry about Victorian sympathies surviving among the Quebecois.
 
Allowing foreign power to entrench themselves at a vital accessway to the rest of the world is a recipe for disaster. The Mississippi MUST be fully controlled by CFC or allied Revivalist state(s). And the mouth of the Mississippi is no exception. Otherwise we'll be left at the mercy of whomever controls the entrance to the Mississippi when Victoria shuts our access to the canal up north.

It has to be a redline.

Until a stable and secure route to California can be secured this won't change.
 
Quebec has been subject to concerted efforts at cultural genocide by Victoria and has never stopped resisting. I highly doubt that we have to worry about Victorian sympathies surviving among the Quebecois.
I dont agree. At all.

WE had the Unionists, who while hostile to Victoria itself, had internalized a lot of the attitudes and policies that Victoria espoused, and actively propagandized them.It took concerted action by all parts of the political spectrum to discredit and destroy them as a political force in the Commonwealth, and the people who supported them are still here.

I do not find it implausible for an Independence Referendum to involve a bunch of parties allying with a Vic-curious/Vic-sympathetic faction as a matter of convenience, and then to draw further people into the territory from New England.
Quebec is only 8.4 million people IRL. You dont NEED that many people to become an entrenched political force.

Edited for grammar and spelling.
 
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[X] Plan: Yeah that sounds good, what is political capital?
-[X] Steps On the Road
-[X] Web of Association
-[X] Cloture
-[X] Multilingualism
-[X] Southern Strategy
-[X] Financier
-[X] Lifeline of the West
-[X] Truth and Reconciliation Commission
-[X] Military Exchange
-[X] United Post Office

This sounds like a really healthy democracy free of foreign influence.
The moratorium on voting has not yet been lifted. You can post plans, but leave the X's unfilled for now. Also, it would be helpful and appreciated if you tacked on the final relation scores under your posted plan.
 
So with the updated clarification, it does seem like the Southern Strategy is a viable concession. It won't have any real effects on allowing us to combat Brazilian influence, and it will force us to forgo some of the less confrontational tools at our disposal and immediatly turn to the more confrontational ones, but at least it is going to require a majority vote of our gulf member states, so it won't be able to be an overt tool of corruption in the long term.

I'm not sure whether giving them this membership veto in the name of calming their fear of foreign influence will abate that fear in the long term (by giving politicians a procedural platform to pretend to their constituents that they are keeping out foreign influence), or fuel it (by giving politicians a procedural platform to gain power by stoking their constituents' fear of said foreign influence), but at least it is in a place where we are worried about hazy and unverifiable second-order effects rather than first-order effects. And given that this quest is supposed to be building a relatively wholesome polity, I doubt that PoptartProdigy is going to make us worry about our institutions being taken over by McCarthyism (without signposting and a way to avoid it, at least).
 
So with the updated clarification, it does seem like the Southern Strategy is a viable concession. It won't have any real effects on allowing us to combat Brazilian influence, and it will force us to forgo some of the less confrontational tools at our disposal and immediatly turn to the more confrontational ones, but at least it is going to require a majority vote of our gulf member states, so it won't be able to be an overt tool of corruption in the long term.

I'm not sure whether giving them this membership veto in the name of calming their fear of foreign influence will abate that fear in the long term (by giving politicians a procedural platform to pretend to their constituents that they are keeping out foreign influence), or fuel it (by giving politicians a procedural platform to gain power by stoking their constituents' fear of said foreign influence), but at least it is in a place where we are worried about hazy and unverifiable second-order effects rather than first-order effects. And given that this quest is supposed to be building a relatively wholesome polity, I doubt that PoptartProdigy is going to make us worry about our institutions being taken over by McCarthyism (without signposting and a way to avoid it, at least).
I normally try not to issue such a strong statement on ongoing votes, but given that this is a matter of your expectations of the narrative: I strongly caution you not to form the expectation that I will not include this or that manner of potential difficulty in my narrative. This is, ideally, about building a new state atop the legacy of the old Americas in a way that honors the good that legacy claims while avoiding repeating the mistakes of the past, but I am also of the opinion that a victory is the sweeter for the struggles encountered along the way.
 
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Does steps on the road exclude the possibility of creating a single state, or do we only get that from direct integration?
 
Please no. Nothing shaped like a filibuster is good for legislatures in the long run. We do not need the support of any of the factions that get a +1 from this, except arguably the Mexican Revivalists, but taking the 'Autonomy' proposal makes their support much less relevant anyway.

On the other hand, measures to stop narrow majorities from simply dominating everyone are good actually and cloture isn't a filibuster.

The French Canadians wouldn't benefit from it because the bulk of their people are under Victorian occupation, and it's unclear whether they'll want to join a future North American Union or become an independent state. Indeed, the scattering of Quebecois who have come to this conference cannot even know which it will be. The Mexican revivalists at least have their shit together and aren't under direct occupation (the latter assisting with the former) to the point where they can negotiate along those lines.

The Anglo-Canadians actually seem broadly interested in joining the North American Union, such that offering them that kind of guarantee might not make them happier.

Fair.

For one thing Brazil is already making noises about the mouth of the Mississippi and that is unacceptable. It's a bit late, if we're looking to make a major power out of the continent we're going to be interfering with Brazil anyway. And I'd prefer to wait for QM confirmation on the Southern Strategy being abused before taking that as a given.

Not only would Brazil consolidating power on the delta be bad for a re-united USA, it would be especially bad for the Commonwealth specifically. We're playing the major polity that needs river control the most.

With the QM's reassurances, I think the southern strategy is probably in our interests to do. We stake out a clear position and will gain some local allies, which we need for opening the river before round 2 with Victoria... The downsides of provoking a conflict with Brazil sooner are probably not too great considering how much we need control of the delta...

fasquardon
 
GOAL
Direct Integration is the only real choice. We want a federation; go on as you mean to continue
We want people to commit to the project of reuniting America(and Canada, and Mexico), and accelerating that before forces domestic or foreign can get to interfere, or factions find it in their interests to slowroll or block stuff.

Plus, this has synergies with other choices down the line, like Southern Strategy and Lifeline. If someone wants to play fuckfuck games at the mouth of the Mississipi, they have to take into account the possibility of the US becoming a political factor within the lifespan of whatever piece of fuckery they are trying to pull. And getting funding for reestablishing continental imfrastructure is likely to be easier if they are thinking we're heading to reunification fast.

Treaties are important, but they can be broken much more easily than actual integration.
California just repudiated the Russian treaty, and we ourselves forced Victoria to repudiate its treaties with other North American microstates. And we expect Victoria to break its peace treaty as soon as it can.

Besides, the EU didnt impress over the last forty years in its ability to respond to crises.
They are going to a more unified political structure for a reason.
We shouldnt be looking to emulate them.

STRUCTURE
Council Alone would only be worth taking if it was absolutely necessary to bring the NCR on board.
Since it doesnt seem to be, I'll pass for thematic reasons.
We want as much public buy-in as possible, and that is only helped by more representation

All-Inclusive would be hilarious, and Im tempted to do it for the memes.
But it costs us relationship points with NCR, which we cant afford. And frankly, given all the kooks that do exist IRL, I am not against having a filter mechanism. What if a Klan descendant show up and demand a seat?

So Web of Association seems to be a healthy mean.
It doesnt prevent even unaccredited NGOs from showing up, but it does allow us to ensure there's a healthy range of representation without overly offending some of the big players.


CONCESSIONS
Cloture YES
Cloture acts as an institutional guarantee to minor factions against getting steamrollered in council by the big boys without enabling minority rule or allowing them to permanently stonewall decisionmaking.
Think UK Westminster system, not 2020 US Senate.

Mexican Revivalist Special Status NO
This option is unpopular with literally everyone else. So pass.

Multilingualism YES
Up to the early twentieth century large parts of the United States were multilingual. There were around 2 million German speakers in 1910, of a population of 92 milloom. Two million Americans speak French or a French-based Creole as of 2010, and there are around 40 millions Spanish speakers in the US today.

There were requirements that state documents be translated into German in PA and TX till at least the First World War.
This is more or less a reversion to what the US was.And its just common courtesy at a diplomatic negotiation.

Southern Strategy YES
If both the Northern Mexican and Southeast Americans are worried about subversive political influence from foreign powers in their vicinity, its best to listen to the locals.
Note that this also applies to keeping the Arctic Conservatiate out while they still have a Russian hand up their ass.

I mean, its worth noting that the closest Brazilian port to New Orleans is Macapa. Its five thousand kilometers away.
Santa Marta, Colombia to New Orleans is twenty six hundred kilometers in a straight line.
South America is our closest regional neighbor, but it is not geographically close.

Note that this also applies to keeping the Arctic Conservatiate out while they have a Russian hand up their ass.

Financier YES
FCNY have a vested interest in making this work the way many foreigners would not.
Other than Cali, they are the only successor state with the trained economists and financiers who can make this work.
Just that unlike Cali, they have connections that Cali has been denied for the last four decades.

Lifeline of the West YES
This helps everyone, not just the NCR. Trade lifts all boats.
And for the Commonwealth, it adds a third connection to the outside world, after the St Lawrence Seaway and the Mississippi.
Which adds an additional layer of redundancy and provides leverage when negotiating with other people.

For reference, a mile of six lane rural freeway in the US costs around 7 million dollars to build today.
Its roughly 2500 miles from NYC to Las Vegas. Thats's 17.5 billion dollars. Even assuming that its about 20% the cost now, that would still come down to around 3.5 billion dollars.

And I dont even want to think of what a railway that long would cost.

Someone else has to arrange the funding because we cant.
The Commonwealth will probably have to be responsible for its security, and negotiating with communities along its length.
Principally because trust and access I guess.

Truth and Reconciliation Commission YES
We need to remember our past to move forward.
And frankly an airing of grievances is necessary to avoid a settling of them.

Independence Referendum NO
I have nothing against the Quebecois.

But I'd like to point out that the Commonwealth itself had Unionists as a significant political force who may have hated Victoria but shared most of its political and social views and goals. Quebec having Vic sympathizers after almost forty years of occupation is pretty much guaranteed.

Im not particularly inclined to commit us to a referendum now that might tie our hands in the future.
Especially since you have to recall that Quebec has never had more than 8 million people IRL.
It wouldnt take that many hardliners from New England to give them a solid bloc.

Then there's the Arctic Conservatiate, which is still a Russian puppet state and conduit for Russian influence.

Military Exchange YES
Passing an entire generation of military officers through Commonwealth training academies, with Commonwealth ethical classes and Commonwealth indoctrination and Commonwealth relationships and Commonwealth intelligence dossiers on each of them? Yes please.

Some will go bad, but this is somewhere the benefits outweigh the drawbacks.
And a corps of trained people serves as a set of caltrops in the path of any Vic invasion force, as they'd be looking at a lot more trained people eyeing their supply lines.

United Postal Service YES
I see absolutely no downsides to this. Communication brings the country together, and helps with trade
And it helps us keep tabs on other parts of the country.

Mexican Autonomy YES
No opposition.





Starting Relations
The FCNY (1):
The NCR (-1):

Anglo-Canadian Factions (0):
French-Canadian Factions (-2):
Northern Mexican Factions (2):
Mexican Revivalists (-3):
Western Minor American Factions (0):
Southern Minor American Factions (0):
Interior American Factions (N/A):

VOTE
[]Plan Reconstruction
-[][GOAL] Direct Integration: +0 with all minor American factions and FCNY; -1 with NCR, Northern Mexicans, and Canadians; -2 with Mexican Revivalists.
-[][STRUCTURE] Web of Association: +1 with Canadian factions, western and southern American factions, and northern Mexicans; +0 with NCR, FCNY, and Mexican Revivalists.
-[] Concession:
--[ ] Cloture: +1 with Canadian factions and the Mexican Revivalists.
--[ ] Multilingualism: +1 with all Mexicans and French-Canadians.
--[ ] Southern Strategy: +1 with southern American factions, the Mexican Revivalists, and the Northern Mexicans.
--[ ] Financier: +5 with FCNY.
--[ ] Lifeline of the West: +3 with NCR.
--[ ] Truth and Reconciliation Commission: +1 with all Canadian, minor American, and northern Mexican factions. -1 with NCR.
--[ ] Military Exchange: +2 with all minor American factions, all Canadian factions, and the northern Mexicans.
--[ ] United Post Office: +1 with all factions.
--[ ] Mexican Autonomy: +3 with Mexican Revivalists and guarantees that they at least attend, but locks them out from joining the body proper right now and enforces a hands-off policy for their territory.


Ending Relations
The FCNY (1): 1+0+0+5+1=7
The NCR (-1): -1 + -1 + 0 + 3 + -1 + 1 = +1
Anglo-Canadian Factions (0): 0 + -1 + 1 + 1 + 1 + 2 + 1 = 5
French-Canadian Factions (-2): -2 + -1 + 1 + 1 + 1 + 1 + 2 +1 = 4
Northern Mexican Factions (2): 2 + -1 + 1 + 1 +1 + 1 + 2 + 1 = 6
Mexican Revivalists (-3): -3 + -2 + 0 + 1 + 1 + 1 + 1 + 3 = +2
Western Minor American Factions (0): 0 + 0 + 1 + 1+ 2 + 1 = 5
Southern Minor American Factions (0): 0 + 0 + 1 + 1 + 1 + 2 +1 = 6
Interior American Factions (N/A):
 
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@PoptartProdigy Out of curiousity, how concerned is New York about Victoria using military force against them in the future? Would a mutual defense clause against victorian attacks for all members closer than X kilometers to Victoria be viable as a concession for members?
Significantly concerned, since their entire polity is within mortaring range and Victoria is erratic. Such a pact would be interesting to many people, but intensely inflammatory to the resilience of your current peace treaty, and well beyond the scope of these talks.
Does steps on the road exclude the possibility of creating a single state, or do we only get that from direct integration?
It does not. It means it formalizes tiers of membership intended to result in a single state, but that process would be much longer.
Note that this also applies to keeping the Arctic Conservatiate out while they still have a Russian hand up their ass.
It does not, see my post three above yours.
 
Things seem to largely be settled. Vote's open!

Write-ins are now closed; here's what I've approved:

[ ] United Post Office: While the body itself will need to thresh out the details, you could establish as a part of its charter that it will create a postal service operating in all member states (associated groups as practical). This is a significant project to commit the body to undertaking, and with your own commitments, you can't be sure that you'll be able to help in a significant capacity if it needs support, but it is valuable and broadly popular, and could realistically be done in the early stages of things. +1 with all factions.

[ ] Mexican Autonomy: Agree to recognize the Mexican Revivalists' formal organization's current or future membership as beyond the body's scope, and grant them a non-voting representative with the right to address the voting council at any time, along with the right to petition for entrance to the body at a later date by simple majority. +3 with Mexican Revivalists and guarantees that they at least attend, but locks them out from joining the body proper right now and enforces a hands-off policy for their territory.

Go nuts!
 
Oh boy votes are open now I just need to wait to see what plans people have hashed out fully one last time before I vote myself. And by that I mean I'll just wait until others vote and see what plans there voting for.
 
Getting my vote in now before I collapse from exhaustion!

[X] Plan To Form A More Perfect Union v1.67 Dream Drop Disco

Gets us to a good position with everyone without giving up anything too integral imo
 
[X] Plan: Party Up & Down the Coast to Coast v.1.2
-[X][GOAL] Direct Integration: The body will attempt to, over time, directly integrate members into a single, federal state. The resulting state will be functional faster and more capably. +0 with all minor American factions and FCNY; -1 with NCR, Northern Mexicans, and Canadians; -2 with Mexican Revivalists.
-[X][BODY STRUCTURE] Web of Association: While the decisions will be made by the above central council, non-state actors can seek association status and gain guaranteed audiences with said council and permanent representatives to deliver petitions for them. Adds a layer of complication, but this status is still up to the Council, so no states are going to be angry about it. +1 with Canadian factions, western and southern American factions, and northern Mexicans; +0 with NCR, FCNY, and Mexican Revivalists.
-[X][CONCESSION] Cloture: Nobody wants to enact the liberum veto, but you have several attending factions who are concerned with being swallowed up in the tide of voices. Filibustering and the legislative measures that enabled it are a dirty memory for Americans, but there are ways to guarantee that minority voices are heard and respected that avoid some of the pitfalls. Institutes a supermajority requirement to close debate and move to a vote, with that requirement declining with each attempt at doing so in a session until a simple majority is required. +1 with Canadian factions and the Mexican Revivalists.
-[X][CONCESSION] Southern Strategy: The Caribbean Sea and the Gulf of Mexico are becoming areas of increasing international interest in recent years, and the various people down there have virtually zero interest in any of that. Making a policy of not accepting the membership of any states found by the people in those regions to be inappropriately under foreign influence would be quite the draw to southern factions, but it would set a confrontational tone with Brazil and their bloc, given their newly-announced interest in the mouth of the Mississippi. +1 with southern American factions, the Mexican Revivalists, and the Northern Mexicans.
-[X][CONCESSION] Lifeline of the West: The NCR, despite presently being in the flush of victory, is also feeling uncomfortably exposed, at the moment. It wants the body to commit to a project of reopening an infrastructure link across the Rockies, so that aid can reach them overland. Fortunately, Burns has just cleared out the largest concentration of bandits along the I-70, so this simplifies the question tremendously. Still, this is a big project. Without the FCNY's assistance, finding the funding for this is probably going to be the body's first big hurdle to clear. +3 with NCR.
-[X][CONCESSION] Financier: This body is going to need a long of funding and the skills to manage it, and nobody on the continent is as wealthy as the Free City of New York. They are no longer the financial center of the world, but they know money, and have connections to get some. It'll mean handing quite a bit of power to them that cannot subsequently be taken back or controlled, but granting them the authority to handle the body's finances will invest them in it, freeing you up from having to manage them as closely as you're going to have to manage the other big players. +5 with FCNY.
-[X][CONCESSION] Truth and Reconciliation Commission: An idea lifted from pre-Collapse Canada intended to examine the impacts of their residential schools for First Nations children, you plan to adopt it on a far grander scale. Make, as part of this body's charter, a commission with the aim of documenting the history and lasting impacts of the Collapse in humanitarian terms, and then making recommendations to the body as to how it should inform their formal decisions -- such as whom to favor in terms of who is the legitimate controller of a given patch of land. Broadly popular, but the NCR is going to see this as a slight against them. +1 with all Canadian, minor American, and northern Mexican factions. -1 with NCR.
-[X][CONCESSION] Multilingualism: The body would doubtlessly vote to set its own language of business, and by simple majority, that language would doubtlessly be English, but you have an opportunity to reach out and accommodate the more...skittish...of your participants, here -- at the cost of a tripled administrative workload and the dire need for a large mass of translators. +1 with all Mexicans and French-Canadians.
-[X][CONCESSION] Military Exchange: Various minor factions are interested in building up their militaries, now that Victoria (and California) are no longer factors opposing that. The CFC, having just crushed Victoria in two consecutive force-on-force contests, has significant cachet in military matters. Announce that members of this body will have the opportunity to send officer candidates to CFC military schools. This will give them the insights they desire and expand your own influence, although every spot in your academies is precious, at the moment, and if you're handing them out to others, you'll need to push harder for access to foreign academies than you were already going to have to. +2 with all minor American factions, all Canadian factions, and the northern Mexicans.
-[X][CONCESSION] United Post Office: While the body itself will need to thresh out the details, you could establish as a part of its charter that it will create a postal service operating in all member states (associated groups as practical). This is a significant project to commit the body to undertaking, and with your own commitments, you can't be sure that you'll be able to help in a significant capacity if it needs support, but it is valuable and broadly popular, and could realistically be done in the early stages of things. +1 with all factions.
-[X][CONCESSION] Mexican Autonomy: Agree to recognize the Mexican Revivalists' formal organization's current or future membership as beyond the body's scope, and grant them a non-voting representative with the right to address the voting council at any time, along with the right to petition for entrance to the body at a later date by simple majority. +3 with Mexican Revivalists and guarantees that they at least attend, but locks them out from joining the body proper right now and enforces a hands-off policy for their territory.

Switched out Independence Referendum for Multilingual, leading to the final relation scores below:
FCNY: +7
NCR: +1
Anglo-Canadian: +5
French Canadian: +3
Northern Mexican: +8
Mexican Revivalists: +2
Western Minor Americans: +5
Southern Minor Americans: +6

EDIT: Approval-voting uju's plan, since it seems both of them have turned out identical. Whoops! :rofl:
[X]Plan Reconstruction
 
Last edited:
[X] Plan: Party Up & Down the Coast to Coast v.1.2
-[X][GOAL] Direct Integration: The body will attempt to, over time, directly integrate members into a single, federal state. The resulting state will be functional faster and more capably. +0 with all minor American factions and FCNY; -1 with NCR, Northern Mexicans, and Canadians; -2 with Mexican Revivalists.
-[X][BODY STRUCTURE] Web of Association: While the decisions will be made by the above central council, non-state actors can seek association status and gain guaranteed audiences with said council and permanent representatives to deliver petitions for them. Adds a layer of complication, but this status is still up to the Council, so no states are going to be angry about it. +1 with Canadian factions, western and southern American factions, and northern Mexicans; +0 with NCR, FCNY, and Mexican Revivalists.
-[X][CONCESSION] Cloture: Nobody wants to enact the liberum veto, but you have several attending factions who are concerned with being swallowed up in the tide of voices. Filibustering and the legislative measures that enabled it are a dirty memory for Americans, but there are ways to guarantee that minority voices are heard and respected that avoid some of the pitfalls. Institutes a supermajority requirement to close debate and move to a vote, with that requirement declining with each attempt at doing so in a session until a simple majority is required. +1 with Canadian factions and the Mexican Revivalists.
-[X][CONCESSION] Southern Strategy: The Caribbean Sea and the Gulf of Mexico are becoming areas of increasing international interest in recent years, and the various people down there have virtually zero interest in any of that. Making a policy of not accepting the membership of any states found by the people in those regions to be inappropriately under foreign influence would be quite the draw to southern factions, but it would set a confrontational tone with Brazil and their bloc, given their newly-announced interest in the mouth of the Mississippi. +1 with southern American factions, the Mexican Revivalists, and the Northern Mexicans.
-[X][CONCESSION] Lifeline of the West: The NCR, despite presently being in the flush of victory, is also feeling uncomfortably exposed, at the moment. It wants the body to commit to a project of reopening an infrastructure link across the Rockies, so that aid can reach them overland. Fortunately, Burns has just cleared out the largest concentration of bandits along the I-70, so this simplifies the question tremendously. Still, this is a big project. Without the FCNY's assistance, finding the funding for this is probably going to be the body's first big hurdle to clear. +3 with NCR.
-[X][CONCESSION] Financier: This body is going to need a long of funding and the skills to manage it, and nobody on the continent is as wealthy as the Free City of New York. They are no longer the financial center of the world, but they know money, and have connections to get some. It'll mean handing quite a bit of power to them that cannot subsequently be taken back or controlled, but granting them the authority to handle the body's finances will invest them in it, freeing you up from having to manage them as closely as you're going to have to manage the other big players. +5 with FCNY.
-[X][CONCESSION] Truth and Reconciliation Commission: An idea lifted from pre-Collapse Canada intended to examine the impacts of their residential schools for First Nations children, you plan to adopt it on a far grander scale. Make, as part of this body's charter, a commission with the aim of documenting the history and lasting impacts of the Collapse in humanitarian terms, and then making recommendations to the body as to how it should inform their formal decisions -- such as whom to favor in terms of who is the legitimate controller of a given patch of land. Broadly popular, but the NCR is going to see this as a slight against them. +1 with all Canadian, minor American, and northern Mexican factions. -1 with NCR.
-[X][CONCESSION] Multilingualism: The body would doubtlessly vote to set its own language of business, and by simple majority, that language would doubtlessly be English, but you have an opportunity to reach out and accommodate the more...skittish...of your participants, here -- at the cost of a tripled administrative workload and the dire need for a large mass of translators. +1 with all Mexicans and French-Canadians.
-[X][CONCESSION] Military Exchange: Various minor factions are interested in building up their militaries, now that Victoria (and California) are no longer factors opposing that. The CFC, having just crushed Victoria in two consecutive force-on-force contests, has significant cachet in military matters. Announce that members of this body will have the opportunity to send officer candidates to CFC military schools. This will give them the insights they desire and expand your own influence, although every spot in your academies is precious, at the moment, and if you're handing them out to others, you'll need to push harder for access to foreign academies than you were already going to have to. +2 with all minor American factions, all Canadian factions, and the northern Mexicans.
-[X][CONCESSION] United Post Office: While the body itself will need to thresh out the details, you could establish as a part of its charter that it will create a postal service operating in all member states (associated groups as practical). This is a significant project to commit the body to undertaking, and with your own commitments, you can't be sure that you'll be able to help in a significant capacity if it needs support, but it is valuable and broadly popular, and could realistically be done in the early stages of things. +1 with all factions.
-[X][CONCESSION] Mexican Autonomy: Agree to recognize the Mexican Revivalists' formal organization's current or future membership as beyond the body's scope, and grant them a non-voting representative with the right to address the voting council at any time, along with the right to petition for entrance to the body at a later date by simple majority. +3 with Mexican Revivalists and guarantees that they at least attend, but locks them out from joining the body proper right now and enforces a hands-off policy for their territory.

Switched out Independence Referendum for Multilingual, leading to the final relation scores below:
FCNY: +7
NCR: +1
Anglo-Canadian: +5
French Canadian: +3
Northern Mexican: +8
Mexican Revivalists: +2
Western Minor Americans: +5
Southern Minor Americans: +6
Is that not just the Reconstruction Plan though?
 
I will say again now that vote is open (I have not been following the discussion) I want plans with as FEW AS POSSIBLE CONCESSIONS. If we make too many compromises, the thing will be weighed down.
 
Voting is open
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