Remove ads

Threads Of Destiny(Eastern Fantasy, Sequel to Forge of Destiny)

Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
Reader mode
picklepikkl said:
That's because Meizhen isn't being sent on war missions. Her clan is holding her back.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Meizhen: Damn, no combat missions because clan say so. Guess I go production tract now.

And Meizhen never went back to combat tract ever again.

Edit:
Whats the difference between combat tract and production tract when we can see Xuan Shi and Li Suyin have pretty good combat options?
 
Last edited:
angelofwhim said:
Edit:
Whats the difference between combat tract and production tract when we can see Xuan Shi and Li Suyin have pretty good combat options?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Combat tract: super powers
Production tract: gadgets
Well, more seriously, i think combat tract is about gaining strength through fighting ever thougher opponents and cultivating (pun intended) innate abilities, while production tract is about boosting yourself through better gear and self modification.
combat tract cultivator would probably have better sustainability over long time without major downtime, while a production tract one would run out of stuff eventually, but could, in theory, gain a major temporary boost in exchange for consumable items and talismans.
 
AbeoLogos said:
Ling Qi musing to herself that just spending time together is fine and fulfilling while she uses that time together to compose a song thematically linked to their shared efforts, which is literally cultivation for her.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Ling Qi can compose songs just because she likes doing that and has something to express, you know? The fact that she happens to cleanse some of the impurities during the process doesn't detract from the effort or reasoning.

AbeoLogos said:
I'm a little sour by missions trampling over Zhengui arcs, too.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Honestly, I agree that the timing of Zhengui's arc is a little unfortunate, but it's not specifically targeted or anything: any arc that happens now is interrupted by war and its plots. It's just that all other arcs have gone on hiatus completely (like Bao business, Luo & Bao troubles, Qiggne's stuff, Fen Fen). Compared to them, Zhengui's still is moving forward because to Ling Qi it's just as important as the war is. If that's not dedication, then I don't know what is.

AbeoLogos said:
This is kind of an annoying copout, considering the playerbase was actively trying for a bit of overlap as recently as the last archive vote, which is the last time it was possible at all. And overwhelmingly so, at the opportunity.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

But playerbase doesn't control Ling Qi entirely (example: lake gate). It's been pointed in the narrative that while Ling Qi's domain and insights have nicer parts, Ling Qi considers herself to be a "cold girl", fitting right among deadly winter blizzard and nightmare-ish shades that lurk in it. I think it's entirely reasonable of her to come to the conculsion that she has little to no existing connections to Zhengui. The question is how can she make those connection without changing either herself or Zhengui too much? At the moment a small fun hobby is a good place to start, and rushing it is counter productive imo.
 
Last edited:
Candesce said:
Hmm.

I wonder how that will hold up as she advances in Realm and her progress slows down. How little progress can she get and still see it as a reward?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Put it into home improvement?
Valmond said:
Combat tract: super powers
Production tract: gadgets
Well, more seriously, i think combat tract is about gaining strength through fighting ever thougher opponents and cultivating (pun intended) innate abilities, while production tract is about boosting yourself through better gear and self modification.
combat tract cultivator would probably have better sustainability over long time without major downtime, while a production tract one would run out of stuff eventually, but could, in theory, gain a major temporary boost in exchange for consumable items and talismans.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Also the division is mainly based on what you're willing to spend time on, the first year had a more distinct difference due to the two tournaments, but in practice the big difference is that to craft professionally requires experimentation rather than imitation, and combat requires spars rather than just cultivation.

So you can see Ling Qi with her Formations and now Gardening hobby, Meizhen as an poison(and some embroidery) hobbyist, Renxiang likely is a fairly good tailor, etc.
Its not TOO hard to flip between or hybridize the approaches in Green I think.
Varder said:
But playerbase doesn't control Ling Qi entirely (example: lake gate). It's been pointed in the narrative that while Ling Qi's domain and insights have nicer parts, Ling Qi considers herself to be a "cold girl", fitting right among deadly winter blizzard and nightmare-ish shades that lurk in it. I think it's entirely reasonable of her to come to the conculsion that she has little to no existing connections to Zhengui. The question is how can she make those connection without changing either herself or Zhengui too much? At the moment a small fun hobby is a good place to start, and rushing it is counter productive imo.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Also kind of the point being made here is that neither of them should need to change to make a connection. It'd be nice if they had more of a connection, but changing yourself for another is something that could be used in limited doses.

By looking past the difference, Ling Qi started actually making true progress, rather than awkwardly try to make compromises which Zhengui doesn't want her making, and Zhengui looks past trying to be useful to Ling Qi to understand her more.
Before changing yourself, understand each other first.
Otherwise you just wind up hurting each other for no reason, like when Zhengui offered up his dream to make her happy and neither were happy as a result.
 
veekie said:
Also the division is mainly based on what you're willing to spend time on, the first year had a more distinct difference due to the two tournaments, but in practice the big difference is that to craft professionally requires experimentation rather than imitation, and combat requires spars rather than just cultivation.

So you can see Ling Qi with her Formations and now Gardening hobby, Meizhen as an poison(and some embroidery) hobbyist, Renxiang likely is a fairly good tailor, etc.
Its not TOO hard to flip between or hybridize the approaches in Green I think.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I suspect it depends a lot on individual.
Combat vs production is lot about temperament, and while many could make the switch, plenty of others would be unable to do so, depending on their personal cultivation concept.
Any cultivator can learn combat and production techniques, but advancing in cultivation at green requires more than just working at it, you need to travel through the path you have chosen, and switching it will be hard, if even possible at all due to incompatible insights.
 
Thinking more about this garden project, I'm actually really happy that it turned out the way it did. While I think it would have been fun to see at least a semi-completed garden, this abject failure will give Ling Qi more experience on what not to do when generating weather phenomena and how to work those into the garden.

It would also be interesting, if we continue developing our gardening skills which I think we really should, if there is any synergy between formations and gardening. Can planting specific types of plants in certain places in relation to each other create various effects?

I'm excited to see the final project regardless!
 
We keep at it, and our garden will one day be one of the wonders of he Ling Clan, alongside our favorite sitting rock (that we are definitly nicking for ourselves when we leave the sect).
 
Valmond said:
I suspect it depends a lot on individual.
Combat vs production is lot about temperament, and while many could make the switch, plenty of others would be unable to do so, depending on their personal cultivation concept.
Any cultivator can learn combat and production techniques, but advancing in cultivation at green requires more than just working at it, you need to travel through the path you have chosen, and switching it will be hard, if even possible at all due to incompatible insights.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Well, theres a fairly large bit of flex between "Devoted to a Craft", "Supports a Craft", "Allows a Craft" and "Forbids a Craft".
Very few cultivators, I think, are going to be forbidden from creation by their Way, and many paths of development would at least partly intersect with a craft at some point, though it may not be a good use of time to do so.

Ling Qi's Home(Shelter, Family) anchored Domain for instance should allow her to completely flip over to crafting if she was so inclined, without any conflict with her music and combat attributes, though admittedly without much synergy either.

Most people should be somewhere between Supports(where the craft is of direct and relevant contribution or consequence of the Way), and Allows(where the Way is silent on the matter entirely).
 
veekie said:
Well, theres a fairly large bit of flex between "Devoted to a Craft", "Supports a Craft", "Allows a Craft" and "Forbids a Craft".
Very few cultivators, I think, are going to be forbidden from creation by their Way, and many paths of development would at least partly intersect with a craft at some point, though it may not be a good use of time to do so.

Ling Qi's Home(Shelter, Family) anchored Domain for instance should allow her to completely flip over to crafting if she was so inclined, without any conflict with her music and combat attributes, though admittedly without much synergy either.

Most people should be somewhere between Supports(where the craft is of direct and relevant contribution or consequence of the Way), and Allows(where the Way is silent on the matter entirely).
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I was not thinking of someones way forbidding production arts or activities, though there might be some.
My point was more about advancement, and how some ways might require the cultivator to advance through combat.
They could take up production, but it would not move them ahead in their cultivation in a meaningful way, so would either slow them down, if not completely halt their progress.
Though i guess even someone whose way gets no benefit whatsoever from production, could move to production tract, at the cost if simply not advancing as long as they remain there (or advance in glacial pace compared to combat tract).
Might even be a decent option for someone who is just burned out and needs a rest, but does need to remain active to either remain in the sect, or just not get bored.

edit-
Elsecaller said:
I'm pretty sure that Zhengui is our favourite sitting rock. :V
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Zhengui is our favorite hill and a cultivation site.
But i was talking about an actual rock mentioned in an earlier update, and that i made a joke how it would become a sacred relic of the Ling Clan (that nobody is allowed to sit on).
 
Last edited:
veekie said:
Ling Qi's Home(Shelter, Family) anchored Domain for instance should allow her to completely flip over to crafting if she was so inclined, without any conflict with her music and combat attributes, though admittedly without much synergy either.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
If Ling Qi continues with "cycle of seasons" themes, I wouldn't be surprised to see her regularly switching between combat and crafting specialties.
 
yrsillar said:
"I had fun though," Ling Qi said absently. She actually had, to her surprise. Composing Songs for Cai Renxiang's parties had always felt kind of perfunctory. Composing her own songs was more enjoyable but ultimately just idle fancy. This was more like cultivating. They had a concrete goal to work for, things they could improve. Visible progress to be made.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Anyone else feel like this suggests that Ling Qi wouldn't be worse off with a bit more production? We really should ask Yrs to rework crafting to be more compelling in relation to Arts.

[X] Plan Communication
 
angelofwhim said:
Edit:
Whats the difference between combat tract and production tract when we can see Xuan Shi and Li Suyin have pretty good combat options?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
The fact that they fight well is like the fact that LQ still has a good formation skill and equipment. Production tract are better at crafting, while combat specializes on fighting. Li Suyin can fight good, but even with equipment, she cant equal Su Ling for example, at least unless she uses pretty much anything she has at once. Same for Xuan Shi and Ling Qi
 
[X] Plan Communication
-[X] Presence
-[X][new] Communications

Now let us hope that Presence wasn't in fact what made the echo tech possible.
 
Blademaster said:
The fact that they fight well is like the fact that LQ still has a good formation skill and equipment. Production tract are better at crafting, while combat specializes on fighting. Li Suyin can fight good, but even with equipment, she cant equal Su Ling for example, at least unless she uses pretty much anything she has at once. Same for Xuan Shi and Ling Qi
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
In general, what you're saying is valid but Xuan Shi and Ling Qi isn't really a good example. For one thing, I'm pretty sure Xuan Shi is one stage above LQ in the Green realm. Even if Xuan Shi didn't have anything other than his basic stuff prepared and was only able to use his regular arts, a fight b/w him and LQ would be a close call. Remember that in the underground mission, he tanked a hit from a Green enemy in the 6th stage. He wasn't even wounded from that first attack and after that, he was still able to go on fighting and defending his teammates for a while.
In general, you're correct that without their prepared items/weapons, crafters dont really match up to combat cultivators. However, that sort of thing can vary widely. If I recall correctly from Forge, when LQ, Su Ling and Li Suyin were fighting Huang Da, at the Red or Yellow realm Suyin used the fragments she had of her old family art--which she hadn't mastered or even fully pieced together--to partially dissolve Huang Da's respiratory system or something. Of course since he was a higher ranking noble, he was able to buy enough medical help in time that he was okay. However, it cost him a lot of money and took several days for him to completely recover.
Suyin at the time was upset that she was forced to use her family medical arts in a way that they weren't meant to be used but the point is she could be pretty badass and give Su Ling a hard time, whether or not she had crafted materials/equipment available.
So long story short, I wouldn't use Suyin vs Su Ling or Xuan Shi vs LQ as examples.
 
Lena27 said:
In general, what you're saying is valid but Xuan Shi and Ling Qi isn't really a good example. For one thing, I'm pretty sure Xuan Shi is one stage above LQ in the Green realm. Even if Xuan Shi didn't have anything other than his basic stuff prepared and was only able to use his regular arts, a fight b/w him and LQ would be a close call. Remember that in the underground mission, he tanked a hit from a Green enemy in the 6th stage. He wasn't even wounded from that first attack and after that, he was still able to go on fighting and defending his teammates for a while.
In general, you're correct that without their prepared items/weapons, crafters dont really match up to combat cultivators. However, that sort of thing can vary widely. If I recall correctly from Forge, when LQ, Su Ling and Li Suyin were fighting Huang Da, at the Red or Yellow realm Suyin used the fragments she had of her old family art--which she hadn't mastered or even fully pieced together--to partially dissolve Huang Da's respiratory system or something. Of course since he was a higher ranking noble, he was able to buy enough medical help in time that he was okay. However, it cost him a lot of money and took several days for him to completely recover.
Suyin at the time was upset that she was forced to use her family medical arts in a way that they weren't meant to be used but the point is she could be pretty badass and give Su Ling a hard time, whether or not she had crafted materials/equipment available.
So long story short, I wouldn't use Suyin vs Su Ling or Xuan Shi vs LQ as examples.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Li Suyin is really a badass and so is Xuan Shi. But I am pretty sure that even with prepared stuff, production cant equal combat at the same level. Suyin and Shi are the among the most combat oriented production, and I am still not sure they can equal them. Xuan shi used his teracotta armor to take the blow of the green enemy, and LQ has taken a blow from an enemy of similiar strengh several times, and dodged others. Also, in forge, I remember the fight. Ling Qi and Su Ling took most of his attention, but given their lack of offense at the time(seriously, Ling qi strongest attack was 2 dv, and Su ling didnt have any better attack) , they couldnt finish him and were down from posion. So Suyin, who had that good attack, got behind him and attacked, taking him down while he focused on Qi and Ling. They can still have great abilities and be strong but they wont equal combat them in sheer prowess, at least unless they expend anything they have
 
Varder said:
Honestly, I agree that the timing of Zhengui's arc is a little unfortunate, but it's not specifically targeted or anything: any arc that happens now is interrupted by war and its plots. It's just that all other arcs have gone on hiatus completely (like Bao business, Luo & Bao troubles, Qiggne's stuff, Fen Fen). Compared to them, Zhengui's still is moving forward because to Ling Qi it's just as important as the war is. If that's not dedication, then I don't know what is.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Nitpick, but the business with Bao Qian subplot isn't on pause. Hanyi's performance is its continuation, and that's moving forward without apparent interruption, even with her injury. Fortunately!

Again, my concern isn't how the gardening went- I liked it for the most part. My concern is how little it went in the context of a month+ gap. With that gap there, it would have been preferable to have a broader exploration of the issues, but not deeper per se, just to have them actually established to some extent. It creates a smoother, more coherent narrative arc in the end.
 
Last edited:
Blademaster said:
Li Suyin is really a badass and so is Xuan Shi. But I am pretty sure that even with prepared stuff, production cant equal combat at the same level. Suyin and Shi are the among the most combat oriented production, and I am still not sure they can equal them. Xuan shi used his teracotta armor to take the blow of the green enemy, and LQ has taken a blow from an enemy of similiar strengh several times, and dodged others. Also, in forge, I remember the fight. Ling Qi and Su Ling took most of his attention, but given their lack of offense at the time(seriously, Ling qi strongest attack was 2 dv, and Su ling didnt have any better attack) , they couldnt finish him and were down from posion. So Suyin, who had that good attack, got behind him and attacked, taking him down while he focused on Qi and Ling. They can still have great abilities and be strong but they wont equal combat them in sheer prowess, at least unless they expend anything they have
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Theres nothing keeping a production focused cultivator from punching with the best of them, production students are bottlenecked by Workshop, Designs and Materials, while combat students are bottlenecked by Combat Experience and Raw Cultivation.

The main reason most production students aren't good fighters is because most production students are stuck grinding so that they can get materials to practice and raise their craft skills with, and then the ludicrously expensive workshop rental. Remember Yan Renshu's pill furnace and how much money that made us?

Theres absolutely no conflict with being both a skilled crafter and a skilled fighter, provided you had money. Because we've seen that the actual act of creation doesn't take that much time on the crafter's part, many processes just need them to start it and then let the item process over a period of time.
Its only timeconsuming because gathering materials, making entry level items and selling them to barely recoup the material and workshop costs until you can buy access to the design libraries for better crafts so you have the margins to upgrade your workshop is a soul crushing treadmill.

Put another way, independent crafters essentially need to invent their own arts as a yellow. Unless they luck into a secret manual of a faction.
 
veekie said:
That was...a nice trick?
Just how did that happen?
A source of heat, a source of cold and water and you do have a water cycle.
Insufficiently anchored mudslides. Probably want a tree or a shrub to anchor hillsides but its funny that they all just didn't realize rainclouds accumulate static electricity.
And Ling Qi dessicated the area so its ready to burn.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

This is actually a pretty important exercise for Ling Qi and Zhengui to work through: how to be gentle with their qi. Most of their practice with their powers is in combat where you want to have as strong a manifestation as possible. However gardening requires a much gentler touch.

So what happens? Ling Qi applies freezerburn to everything nearby, Zhen creates enough fire to alter to weather, and Gui didn't do enough to anchor the hillside. From this we can gather that Ling Qi needs to calm down a bunch and get Gui to be much more assertive against her and Zhen.
 
veekie said:
Theres absolutely no conflict with being both a skilled crafter and a skilled fighter, provided you had money. Because we've seen that the actual act of creation doesn't take that much time on the crafter's part, many processes just need them to start it and then let the item process over a period of time.
Its only timeconsuming because gathering materials, making entry level items and selling them to barely recoup the material and workshop costs until you can buy access to the design libraries for better crafts so you have the margins to upgrade your workshop is a soul crushing treadmill.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

I think you seriously underestimate the time it takes for a production track. While the processes might not require constant management, research behind them surely takes a lot of time and I'd say is the main time sink for someone like Xuan Shi. Remember our Assuary Horrors project, the one we learned from the dead barbarian kid? Li Suyin had to spend a half a year researching it before it started showing any use in practice. And I expect this is average speed for such things.
 
Varder said:
I think you seriously underestimate the time it takes for a production track. While the processes might not require constant management, research behind them surely takes a lot of time and I'd say is the main time sink for someone like Xuan Shi. Remember our Assuary Horrors project, the one we learned from the dead barbarian kid? Li Suyin had to spend a half a year researching it before it started showing any use in practice. And I expect this is average speed for such things.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
And Meizhen made a poison herself for Sun Liling's duel. And it worked.

The difference is that Suyin has one incomplete manual to reverse engineer blueprints from and Meizhen has her family's library of poison arts, her personal poison atelier kit, and the ability to just go down to the market and buy ingredients rather than hunt across the mountain for beasts and herbs then test to see whether they work for her desired recipes.

The difference is between learning how to make a bomb from an instruction manual, with standard reagents and recipes in a workshop with state of the art equipment, and learning how to make a bomb from a chemistry textbook, your garden shed and figuring out how to make ammonium nitrate by collecting and distilling birdshit.

Suyin took so much time and effort because she's essentially inventing her own tech tree.
Meanwhile Xuan Shi was seen reading lewd novels in the library a lot of the time. He was innovating, but he was leaping off the established Xuan Formations, tweaking existing recipes to get a better result.
 
Last edited:
Reader mode
You must login or register to reply here.
Remove ads
Back
Top