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Threads Of Destiny(Eastern Fantasy, Sequel to Forge of Destiny)

Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
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Jensaarai said:
We can continue along that path with future private sessions, instead of bringing it up in front of Meizhen like @Lena27 said already.
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We only have as much input as the voting options give us though. This isn't real life, we might not be able to bring up the topic again. Considering the mystical element, this could also be a pivotal moment.

I agree that socially there would be serious repercussions on CRX's trust of LQ. Again, I hate both options.


I would rather we not say anything at all tbh.

You don't always HAVE to say something, but that's something too many people forget.
 
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See, I'm not sure we'll be able to declare the result "bad" even if CRX gets mad. Sometimes hearing unpleasant truths makes people mad, and then they need to go off and think about it for a while and gradually think things over before coming to accept the truth that made them mad. It's happened to me personally!

I feel like the relationship here is strong enough to take CRX getting mad for a while. Or to quote a Tarrantino exchange that always come to my mind in these situations:

Col. Hans Landa : You'll be shot for this!
Lt. Aldo Raine : Nah, I don't think so. More like chewed out. I've been chewed out before.
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Briefvoice said:
See, I'm not sure we'll be able to declare the result "bad" even if CRX gets mad. Sometimes hearing unpleasant truths makes people mad, and then they need to go off and think about it for a while and gradually think things over before coming to accept the truth that made them mad. It's happened to me personally!

I feel like the relationship here is strong enough to take CRX getting mad for a while. Or to quote a Tarrantino exchange that always come to my mind in these situations:
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Issue here is humiliating her in public in Chinese culture might affect her ability to trust LQ in the future. She needs that relationship to provide a positive influence on her.

I say that as someone who still thinks second options is better. But both have major drawbacks. Neither is worth the breath it takes to speak them.
 
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[] Ask her if that is really so bad? The Third realm was where cultivators set the foundations which guided the rest of their road. Of course divergences would appear.
I was conflicted, but leaning somewhat towards this. After all, I didn't really like the idea of Ling Qi sugarcoating her words to the point of potential dishonesty.

But then, as I saw the votes start to roll in, I felt bad seeing votes for that option, and I realized which of the two I actually agreed with.

[X] Offer Encouragement. It was only a single art, and everyone knew that a cultivator could not perfectly copy another. Like Ling Qi's own problem, it was only a bump in the path.
 
Timewinders said:
We only have as much input as the voting options give us though. This isn't real life, we might not be able to bring up the topic again. Considering the mystical element, this could also be a pivotal moment.
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There's also nothing to really indicate that we won't, since LQ's probably gonna stay as Renxiang's sinister hand, and is going to continue to have private meetings over tea or whatever.

But, we did just get warned by Meizhen that being so upfront and stubborn is not the usual relationship between lieges and vassals, and Renxiang directly told us to mind our words and actions in public.
 
Timewinders said:
The smart reply would be to try to clarify what she meant by saying something like "Why do you think that is?"

One of my biggest frustrations with this quest is that the choices feel meaningless because we don't know either the question or the meaning of our response.

I don't like the first response because it encourages her to continue on her current path. The second doesn't show enough empathy.

I mean, it's CRX's life, we can't decide for her. We should be able to show empathy and suggest that she doesn't need to follow her mother's footsteps without trying to push her toward defying her mother.
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Ling Qi is not a thread avatar and has zero applicable knowledge for therapy as applies to in progress traumatized transhuman teenagers
 
veekie said:
Ling Qi is not a thread avatar and has zero applicable knowledge for therapy as applies to in progress traumatized transhuman teenagers
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Even she should know that sometimes it's better to not say anything at all if you don't know the right way to deal with a sensitive topic. Just being supportive is good enough.
 
Timewinders said:
Issue here is humiliating her in public in Chinese culture might affect her ability to trust LQ in the future. She needs that relationship to provide a positive influence on her.

I say that as someone who still thinks second options is better. But both have major drawbacks. Neither is worth the breath it takes to speak them.
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CRX is the one who revealed that this happened to her. She's asking for a response on it. I fail to see how "is that so bad" is more humiliating than "that's to be expected". The second might be an answer she likes hearing less and might make her unhappy, but one is not more or less humiliating than the other.
 
[X]Offer Encouragement. It was only a single art, and everyone knew that a cultivator could not perfectly copy another. Like Ling Qi's own problem, it was only a bump in the path.

A big too greedy, the other option is.
 
Ugh. It seems like most of the justification for picking option A is "option B is true, but now is not the time." So it seems like the thread broadly agrees that CRX needs to give up on trying to copy Shenhua.

So the question is: do we lie about that belief?

This is frustrating, because as people have rightly pointed out, we've had a lot of hints from the characters about not being brazen with our liege lady, and questioning her goal to be like Shenhua is nothing if not brazen... but we also have just been told that it's important to catch cultivation snarls early and not let them fester, and we have had negative consequences before from not being consistent with our previous choices. Both options feel like traps. But, as someone I moaned about this vote on Discord to pointed out, "If both options are traps, it doesn't matter which wins." This was a liberating insight; my instinct says we're walking into negative consequences either way. So, which negative consequences am I happier accepting?

I think I'm happier accepting the consequences of being straightforward Ling Qi than I am accepting the consequences of telling CRX that her path is right.
 
Lena27 said:
I also don't think people are appreciating how rude and out of line this sort of thing is in Chinese culture--especially in front of Meizhen. Unlike before, we're not alone with our liege now. While Meizhen isn't exactly CRX's peer, she certainly closer to that than we are. And regardless of the friendship Meizhen and CRX have, it doesn't change how impertinent the second option is.
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Perhaps you can explain in more detail how the second option is more impertinent than the first option? When you say "this sort of thing"... what are are you talking about exactly?

CRX opened the can of worms on this entire topic and we're giving a comment one way or another so there's no choice there. The master had a misfire in something they were trying and our choices are:

1. It's okay master, you'll get it next time.

2. Maybe you should consider trying something different, master.

CRX might like hearing the second one less because it's not what she wants to hear, but why is it somehow ruder and more disrespectful?
 
picklepikkl said:
Ugh. It seems like most of the justification for picking option A is "option B is true, but now is not the time." So it seems like the thread broadly agrees that CRX needs to give up on trying to copy Shenhua.

So the question is: do we lie about that belief?

This is frustrating, because as people have rightly pointed out, we've had a lot of hints from the characters about not being brazen with our liege lady, and questioning her goal to be like Shenhua is nothing if not brazen... but we also have just been told that it's important to catch cultivation snarls early and not let them fester, and we have had negative consequences before from not being consistent with our previous choices. Both options feel like traps. But, as someone I moaned about this vote on Discord to pointed out, "If both options are traps, it doesn't matter which wins." This was a liberating insight; my instinct says we're walking into negative consequences either way. So, which negative consequences am I happier accepting?

I think I'm happier accepting the consequences of being straightforward Ling Qi than I am accepting the consequences of telling CRX that her path is right.
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Sincerity. Ling Qi will not express an opinion she does not believe.
This isn't just what she says. She really means Renxiang should double down if we encourage
Timewinders said:
Even she should know that sometimes it's better to not say anything at all if you don't know the right way to deal with a sensitive topic. Just being supportive is good enough.
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Her experiences say thats how you get lakegate and Xiulan suicidal tribulation
 
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veekie said:
Sincerity. Ling Qi will not express an opinion she does not believe.
This isn't just what she says. She really means Renxiang should double down if we encourage
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...this is a good point. We literally can't vote for "tell her a comforting lie now and come back to it later." If we vote for option A, we are voting to have Ling Qi believe that thing.

Okay, yeah, in that case we kind of have to take option B unless we want LQ to believe CRX ought to continue trying to be as close to her mother's Way as possible.
 
[X] Ask her if that is really so bad? The Third realm was where cultivators set the foundations which guided the rest of their road. Of course divergences would appear.
 
[X] Ask her if that is really so bad? The Third realm was where cultivators set the foundations which guided the rest of their road. Of course divergences would appear.
Between the Mirror, and the simple fact that this seems like how CRX moves forward, I'm inclined to say this. And while this MIGHT be a step too far again...It's a familiar step too far, and it IS in line with how we've acted before.
 
I think the strongest argument for either choice are:

[] Ask her if that is really so bad? The Third realm was where cultivators set the foundations which guided the rest of their road. Of course divergences would appear.

Basically, we are challenging a preconceived notion that CRX should be following Shenhua's path. It's good in that we challenge CRX's underlying assumptions before they become a problem for her (if they do). The downside, I think, is that it's dismissive of CRX feelings and challenging her in a more public setting.

[] Offer Encouragement. It was only a single art, and everyone knew that a cultivator could not perfectly copy another. Like Ling Qi's own problem, it was only a bump in the path.

CRX doesn't really receive encouragement or praise from her mother. I get the impression CRX perceives all of Shenhua's evaluations as pass/fail, which can be harsh to deal with. Some encouragement might be what CRX needs. The downside is that this choice seems to be putting off the issue.
 
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[X] Ask her if that is really so bad? The Third realm was where cultivators set the foundations which guided the rest of their road. Of course divergences would appear.
 
[X] Ask her if that is really so bad? The Third realm was where cultivators set the foundations which guided the rest of their road. Of course divergences would appear.
 
I'd rather not bring this up in front of Meizhen
[X] Offer Encouragement. It was only a single art, and everyone knew that a cultivator could not perfectly copy another. Like Ling Qi's own problem, it was only a bump in the path.

Gawwwwwwwd where is Gan Flexington when you need him.
 
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We are the derpy country bumpkin who still doesn't know our place, the setting is informal(ish), and we have an emergency backup Meizhen to chop us on the head and lightly chastise us if something critically dumb comes out of our mouth. Snek damage control is best damage control.
*bop*
"No. Bad Ling Qi. Bad."
 
Ok, I'm gonna crosspost my analysis from Discord:

On the one hand, being rude might help CRX's cultivation and we JUST got dinged with a heart demon so this is definitely on LQ's mind

On the other hand, being supportive ignores the cultivation issue in favor of trying to be socially supportive

why can we not do both (´；ω；`)

Fuck it, this scenario isn't QUITE formal enough to be worried about being socially supportive. What are our relation dots with Meizhen and CRX? 4 and 3 respectively, I think?

It's just us three. LQ trusts Meizhen. LQ wants to be informal around CRX, sort of. If there were other people besides those three around, I'd vote social support. This is the one bloody place we can do the srs talk and not get actually chastised
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So, yeah. Being rude (even though it's the second time in as many interactions) is not going to overly embarrass CRX. If we said it in court, CRX would be well within her rights to smash us for our temerity. But now? CRX'd have to exercise personal pique to ding us for that. And on second thought, we're trying to bring out her personality anyway, so whatevs.

As I also remarked on Discord, we are turning into the apocryphal medieval 'court fool' whose entire job is to spout awkward, outrageous lines, and to call attention to the stuff that everyone else is too polite to bring up. Except we're not doing it in actual public like a court fool would. We're just Renxiang's personal, common-born, no-previous-biases fool.

I stand by my vote of rudeness.
 
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I wonder this:

If Gan Guangli (I think I wrote his name well), I am not sure was here, present as we were having this conversation with CRX, what would HIS reaction be at hearing us reply to CRX? What would he say to CRX if it was up to him? Would we both agree on being supportive and dismiss this incident as an unimportant setback? Would we both inist that there is some flaw into martirizing oneself for failing to live up to Senhua's designs?

Or would GG disagree with LQ and insist that she's out of place telling CRX that she is wrong? It's food for thought. But I believe GG would try to be supportive, and LQ would be the Honest counterbalance to that. We'd both have complementary roles in advising CRX, I think. It really is a shame that he did not progress ti the Inner Sect.

On the bright side, I don't think a CRX, Meizhen and LQ gathering like this would have happened with him around, without him somehow inserting himself in the situation.
 
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