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[X] Total Industry MK7 DC 30

[X] Budget Cuts 2: Budget Cut Harder
 
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[X] General All the Way (DC 30)
[X] Peace is the Lifeblood (DC 30)
[X] Total Industry MK7 DC 30
[X] Budget Cuts 2: Budget Cut Harder
[X] Victorian Response

Yes it's a crapload of different plans, but fuck it.
 
[x] Plan Copyleft
-[x] War Reparations Clause, Acquisitive: s. +5 DC.
-[x] Penal Labor Clause: . +20 DC.
-[x] War Guilt Clause: . +5 DC.
-[x] Geneva Conventions Clause:. +20 DC.
-[x] Militia Clause: . -5 DC.
-[x] War Brides Clause, General: " +30 DC.
-[x] Prisoners of War Clause, Immediate: T -20 DC.
-[x] Hostile Neutrality Clause:-15 DC.
-[x] Seaway Clause, General: . +50 DC.
-[x] Lakes Access Clause: -20 DC.
The plan is DC 35, it needs to drop 5 since this is the second phase, and we have a plus 5 to DC.
 
The plan is DC 35, it needs to drop 5 since this is the second phase, and we have a plus 5 to DC.
Nope, last 5 DC is from the renegotiation, which our plans also have to account for.
I got a different answer the last time I asked.
30 is the target DC; that is the DC you must achieve for a free pass. That is the target because we rolled a 34, and to automatically pass, we must get the plan's DC under the roll. The +5 plan DC is making the voted, DC 90 plan a DC 95 plan.


[X] Guilt-Free Soldiers Take Time
-[X] War Reparations Clause, Acquisitive: +5
-[X] Artifact Reclamation Clause +5
-[X] Militia Clause -5
-[X] Prisoners of War Clause, Delayed -10
-[X] War Brides Clause, Exchange +15
-[X] Free Migration Clause +30
-[X] Johnson Doctrine Clause +10
-[X] Annulment Clause +25
-[X] Hostile Neutrality Clause -15
-[X] Seaway Clause, Commonwealth: +30
-[X] Lakes Access Clause: -20
 
[x] Plan Copyleft
-[x] War Reparations Clause, Acquisitive: s. +5 DC.
-[x] Penal Labor Clause: . +20 DC.
-[x] War Guilt Clause: . +5 DC.
-[x] Geneva Conventions Clause:. +20 DC.
-[x] Militia Clause: . -5 DC.
-[x] War Brides Clause, General: " +30 DC.
-[x] Prisoners of War Clause, Immediate: T -20 DC.
-[x] Hostile Neutrality Clause:-15 DC.
-[x] Seaway Clause, General: . +50 DC.
-[x] Lakes Access Clause: -20 DC.
 
[] Take The Money And Run DC30
-[] War Reparations Clause, Acquisitive: +5
-[] Artifact Reclamation Clause +5
-[] Militia Clause -5
-[] Prisoners of War Clause, Immediate -20
-[] War Brides Clause, Exchange +15
-[] Free Migration Clause +30
-[] Johnson Doctrine Clause +10
-[] Annulment Clause +25
-[] Non-Intervention Clause +10
-[] Hostile Neutrality Clause -15
-[] Seaway Clause, Commonwealth: +30
-[] Lakes Access Clause: -20
[ ] Plan Copyleft
-[ ] War Reparations Clause, Acquisitive: s. +5 DC.
-[ ] Penal Labor Clause: . +20 DC.
-[ ] War Guilt Clause: . +5 DC.
-[ ] Geneva Conventions Clause:. +20 DC.
-[ ] Militia Clause: . -5 DC.
-[ ] War Brides Clause, General: " +30 DC.
-[ ] Prisoners of War Clause, Immediate: T -20 DC.
-[ ] Hostile Neutrality Clause:-15 DC.
-[ ] Seaway Clause, General: . +50 DC.
-[ ] Lakes Access Clause: -20 DC.

For the record, both of these plans are DC 35 as presented, due to failing to account for the additional 5 renegotiation DC.
I got a different answer the last time I asked.

See, I read those answers as supporting my perspective here, so there's clearly some ambiguity in the phrasing. You know what isn't ambiguous? The factual contents of the Victorian counteroffer. This offer was presented as a DC 30 plan, so logically, the "missing" 5 DC come from the fact of renegotiation occurring. The alternative interpretation is that (a) contrary to initial explanations, there's no actual renegotiation penalty and also (b) Poptart fucked up their math. The renegotiation-penalty explanation seems much more plausible.
 
[X] General All the Way (DC 30)
[X] Peace is the Lifeblood (DC 30)
[X] Freedom is the Right...!! (DC 30)
[X] Take The Money And Run DC30
[X] Commonwealth Hardball
 
This offer was presented as a DC 30 plan, so logically, the "missing" 5 DC come from the fact of renegotiation occurring. The alternative interpretation is that (a) contrary to initial explanations, there's no actual renegotiation penalty and also (b) Poptart fucked up their math. The renegotiation-penalty explanation seems much more plausible.
Well...
Wait, but Foreign Aid Clause is still on the treaty.
*quietly fixes*

No it isn't.

(Thanks!)
The version quoted in Horologer's post had Foreign Aid (+15) instead of Johnson Doctrine (+10). That's where the "missing" 5 DC came from.
 
[X] Total Industry MK7 DC 30
[X] Total Industry MK7 DC 30
[X] Total Industry MK7
[X] This Or No Deal
[X] Commonwealth Hardball
[X] Total Industry MK7 DC 30
Given that you're voting Total industry, any chance I could convince you to also approval vote the similar Budget cuts? I think the war guilt is important enough to go down to demilitarization from johnson clause, but even if you disagree the differences between them are quite small.
 
I think the war guilt is important enough to go down to demilitarization from johnson clause,
I think you might be underestimating Johnson Doctrine. One of the really big benefits of it is that it gives extra credibility to the "Defender of the Midwest" narrative, which is the main thing mitigating the effects of the "Hostile Neighborhood" right now. Demilitarization is just about keeping Victorian forces off of Lake Eerie.
 
Given that you're voting Total industry, any chance I could convince you to also approval vote the similar Budget cuts? I think the war guilt is important enough to go down to demilitarization from johnson clause, but even if you disagree the differences between them are quite small.

sure. works for me.
 
I think you might be underestimating Johnson Doctrine. One of the really big benefits of it is that it gives extra credibility to the "Defender of the Midwest" narrative, which is the main thing mitigating the effects of the "Hostile Neighborhood" right now. Demilitarization is just about keeping Victorian forces off of Lake Eerie.
I'm aware of it's benefit, yes, but war guilt is also a really important part of the treaty option. There's a reason it was included in the Versailles treaty, and it's not because it made the winners feel better about themselves; it was considered a required reasoning for reparations payments. While I don't expect to get a lot of overseas dislike for extracting resources from victoria, it's historically used to define the difference between tribute and reparations; ie, that we aren't simply the winner extracting resources from our target.
 
[X] General All the Way (DC 30)
[X] Peace is the Lifeblood (DC 30)
[X] Freedom is the Right...!! (DC 30)
[X] Plan: Do the Right thing
[X] Total Industry MK7 DC 30
[X] Budget Cuts 2: Budget Cut Harder
[X] And STAY OUT! DC 25+5= 30
[X] Take The Money And Run DC30
[X] Protector's Sandwich Mk. II DC 30
[X] Plan Copyleft
[X] Victorian response

I am, for now, approval voting all peace plans. Once we determine which are the front-runners I may drop some, but only in the case that they have a clear lead over the war options.
 
Well...


The version quoted in Horologer's post had Foreign Aid (+15) instead of Johnson Doctrine (+10). That's where the "missing" 5 DC came from.

That's my part (b), yes. You still haven't accounted for (a) and are assuming that Poptart didn't correct for the change.

EDIT: or for that matter that the plan wasn't correctly calculated in the first place assuming its actual contents, with the error only being made when writing those contents out initially.
 
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