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Threads Of Destiny(Eastern Fantasy, Sequel to Forge of Destiny)

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I'm going to go against the majority here.
I doubt any profits will materialise fast enough to help us. And i have zero interest in romance in general, and Bao Qian in specific.
Romance and/or marriage can wait.

[X] Li Suyin, her current projects and relationship with Bao Qingling. Bao Qian seems to know her, and you can learn more about him obliquely.
 
veekie said:
Actually if Zhengui's ash is as potent a fertilizer as it sounds we could probably set up a trickle within the month.

It'd be more difficult to scoop up his poop than to sell it...
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Maybe, but i am somewhat distrustful of any business deals that happens that quickly.
Well i guess a short term deal might work out.
Who would we sell it to? How would we transport it? Who would transport it? Will they pay in cash? Credit? Per delivery? Monthly?
Would anyone close by have the money to pay us enough to make it worth the time spent on that instead of cultivating or dungeon delving?

This deal sounds like a great long term thing, but i am bit doubtful on how much it would help in the time frame we have until the intersect thingy.
 
[X] Zhengui, and matters of profit. Try to learn more about Bao Qian's intentions and what exactly he is doing down here and why.
 
[X] Zhengui, and matters of profit. Try to learn more about Bao Qian's intentions and what exactly he is doing down here and why.
 
Valmond said:
Maybe, but i am somewhat distrustful of any business deals that happens that quickly.
Well i guess a short term deal might work out.
Who would we sell it to? How would we transport it? Who would transport it? Will they pay in cash? Credit? Per delivery? Monthly?
Would anyone close by have the money to pay us enough to make it worth the time spent on that instead of cultivating or dungeon delving?

This deal sounds like a great long term thing, but i am bit doubtful on how much it would help in the time frame we have until the intersect thingy.
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The discussion IC would be more accurate but based on what we just heard?
-Who would we sell it to? - The Bao JUST told us they can see profitable uses for it, to begin with they were scouting us for Zhengui based reagents.
-Who would transport it? - The Bao again, were planning to ship the stuff to begin with. This would be higher volume than originally expected, but nothing that they won't be able to arrange in a month or two.
-Will they pay in cash? - Green Stones. They're the largest conventional currency unit. I don't expect a very large number of stones, though they may front a sum to sweeten the pot as part of the courtship and diplomatic outreach.
-Will they pay enough to be worth our time -> How much time will we spend on it? - This we do not know yet, Zhengui vents ash constantly, and depending on the purity of the yield and the desired quantity, we could:
--Spend time to maximize yields by scooping up his poop as he goes. This is PROBABLY not worth it unless we give the job to Hanyi and she'd probably try to kill us with her glares if we did.
--Spend money to maximize yields by commissioning automatic poop scooper talisman to suck up the ash into sacks. May or may not be worth it, depends on how much it costs and how much the poop is worth, unless Suyin volunteers.
--Spend nothing worth noting, just lay out a giant asbestos napkin whenever Zhengui is eating and pick it up when he's done.

Fertilizer that can be verified(and it HAS been verified by a prospector's mole spirit) sells pretty easily. The Emerald Seas are very agriculture heavy.
 
veekie said:
The discussion IC would be more accurate but based on what we just heard?
-Who would we sell it to? - The Bao JUST told us they can see profitable uses for it, to begin with they were scouting us for Zhengui based reagents.
-Who would transport it? - The Bao again, were planning to ship the stuff to begin with. This would be higher volume than originally expected, but nothing that they won't be able to arrange in a month or two.
-Will they pay in cash? - Green Stones. They're the largest conventional currency unit. I don't expect a very large number of stones, though they may front a sum to sweeten the pot as part of the courtship and diplomatic outreach.
-Will they pay enough to be worth our time -> How much time will we spend on it? - This we do not know yet, Zhengui vents ash constantly, and depending on the purity of the yield and the desired quantity, we could:
--Spend time to maximize yields by scooping up his poop as he goes. This is PROBABLY not worth it unless we give the job to Hanyi and she'd probably try to kill us with her glares if we did.
--Spend money to maximize yields by commissioning automatic poop scooper talisman to suck up the ash into sacks. May or may not be worth it, depends on how much it costs and how much the poop is worth, unless Suyin volunteers.
--Spend nothing worth noting, just lay out a giant asbestos napkin whenever Zhengui is eating and pick it up when he's done.

Fertilizer that can be verified(and it HAS been verified by a prospector's mole spirit) sells pretty easily. The Emerald Seas are very agriculture heavy.
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Will the Bao use it, or sell it forward acting as middle men taking a cut? Because the two are very different.
This is talking about possible business deal, which may take anywhere from couple days to months after we agree on principle to materialize.
Not all business deals pay in cash, they might provide credit, other resources, cash eventually. Again, when the money appears is not guaranteed from what we already know.

Again, i'm not saying this would not be profitable, i'm just saying it might not be profitable enough, fast enough, to make a difference compared to just doing an extra dungeon run instead of scooping poop.
Ofcourse if they can provide us with people to deliver Zhengui food, and scoop the poop, that would be different matter.
I'm not opposed to making a deal here, just not interested in doing one personally, or talking about possibility of one instead of talking with Li suyin.

edit-
Also not really comfortable talking about a possible deal before talking about it with Zhengui first.
I'm pretty sure he would agree to anything mom big sis wants, but it's the principle of it.
 
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veekie said:
Dude...we're literally talking about it while on his back. And he's mouthy
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Talking with Bao.
I'm sure Zhengui will interject, yes.
But i want to talk with Zhengui, not near Zhengui.
It's about respect, he is not a tool, not an animal, not a servant, he is our family. Talk to him, explain what the deal is, and why it might be a good thing. Get his consent before even getting more details.
 
Valmond said:
Get his consent before even getting more details.
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We can't get his consent before hearing the details. He knows everything Bao Qian has offered and has yet to make a definitive comment so we should probably hear what exactly is offered so that wee can hear Zhengui's opinions.

If nothing else we might be able to hire Zhengui out. He can turn woodland into farmland without much attendance and I don't think he'd object to being sent into a forest to do his thing. If we can also use our Spirit Ken, MotSS Art and formations to ward off spirits we have a pretty good service for turning useless woods into productive farms. It'll be good practice for our future fief as well. Using him to create fertilizer is a good idea if he's willing and even if all this doesn't immediately solve our future financial difficulties by the time we need those extra spirit stones this little venture might have grown to earn a pretty penny.
 
[X] Zhengui, and matters of profit. Try to learn more about Bao Qian's intentions and what exactly he is doing down here and why.
 
dycouza said:
We can't get his consent before hearing the details. He knows everything Bao Qian has offered and has yet to make a definitive comment so we should probably hear what exactly is offered so that wee can hear Zhengui's opinions.

If nothing else we might be able to hire Zhengui out.
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That's pretty much what i was talking about.
I want Zhenguis opinion, not on details, not some final agreement on finalized agreement.
I want Zhengui's opinion on the principle of him taking on jobs like this.
And i want Bao Qian to treat him with more respect, i want to make clear that he needs to treat Zhengui like our family, not like a servant or a tool or a pet.

That said, i see how to square this hole so the peg fits.
Instead of us talking with Bao Qian about the possible business deal, let's have Bao Qian talk to Zhengui about the business deal.
If he can convince Zhengui to help him, we can then talk about fine details and make sure he is not taking advantage of our son little brother.
I suspect we could learn a lot from that.
 
Valmond said:
That's pretty much what i was talking about.
I want Zhenguis opinion, not on details, not some final agreement on finalized agreement.
I want Zhengui's opinion on the principle of him taking on jobs like this.
And i want Bao Qian to treat him with more respect, i want to make clear that he needs to treat Zhengui like our family, not like a servant or a tool or a pet.

That said, i see how to square this hole so the peg fits.
Instead of us talking with Bao Qian about the possible business deal, let's have Bao Qian talk to Zhengui about the business deal.
If he can convince Zhengui to help him, we can then talk about fine details and make sure he is not taking advantage of our son little brother.
I suspect we could learn a lot from that.
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He is right there we will talk he will but in if he hears somthing he dosent like. Your concerns would be little valid if he wasnt here.
 
exerty said:
He is right there we will talk he will but in if he hears somthing he dosent like. Your concerns would be little valid if he wasnt here.
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Except my problem is that he is there, and we are talking about him, but not with him.
Bring him into the conversation, treat him like a person who gets to make his own decision instead of waiting him to interject.
Which he might not because mom big sis knows best.
 
[X] Zhengui, and matters of profit. Try to learn more about Bao Qian's intentions and what exactly he is doing down here and why.
 
instantia said:
How do you know how we are going to talk about Zhengui or with him the conversation hasn't happened yet?
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How does anyone know anything about the vote? We make assumptions of varying quality.
The conversation started with me not being all that interested in the business deal, and doubtful of it being worth quickly enough to make a difference.

Then the conversation evolved about me wanting to talk to Zhengui first.
And people making claims about what is going on which are about as supported as my interpretations and predictions.
 
The claim that Ling Qi would do as you are worried about and not take into account Zhengui's thoughts and feelings when planning business about him is not at all supported by the narrative. If you can quote me a place were Ling Qi has so thoroughly disrespected Zhengui I will be happy to take your interpretation and prediction seriously.
 
instantia said:
The claim that Ling Qi would do as you are worried about and not take into account Zhengui's thoughts and feelings when planning business about him is not at all supported by the narrative. If you can quote me a place were Ling Qi has so thoroughly disrespected Zhengui I will be happy to take your interpretation and prediction seriously.
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Not take Zhenguis thoughts and feelings into account, is a very different thing from "not talking with Zhengui first".
I'm not expecting us to hurt Zhenguis feelings, or treat him badly, i simply wish for a thing to be done in a certain way, or more prceisly, in certain order.

Also, it would serve to show Bao Qian that Zhengui is not just a spirit to be talked about as a resource.
 
I recognize that one might take the position "we should talk to Zhengui before we even entertain the matter," since maybe he doesn't want to be hired out as an asset; I feel like this is not obviously morally better than "we should find out everything we can from Bao Qian first and then talk to Zhengui," since a conversation with Zhengui is probably going to involve our son(s) asking questions that we won't know the answer to and Bao Qian would. Both approaches have advantages and disadvantages.

But this is a quest. The QM, for his reasons, has chosen to structure the narrative this way. Within the confines of this ordering of events, I have enough trust in LQ's respect for Zhengui's sovereignty that I don't think it's likely we're going to approach the conversation in a way that treats him as a pile of negotiable assets. Our opportunity to do things in this quest is influenced by the choices we make to signal interest, and we've been presented with the choice of "Zhengui and Bao Qian" vs "Li Suyin and Bao Qingling"; I'm more interested in the former (especially following all the discussion of how we don't engage enough with our firstborn), and I am confident yrsillar will find a way to make it work.
 
I disagree that there is any necessity to talk about this business with Zhengui before we do so as a group with Bao. I'm not sure what cultural norms might be inclining you to feel this is necessary but from where I'm from there is no expectation to have a series of one on one discussions about business dealings before engaging in a group discussion. I'll admit I don't know every cultural way of doing business and maybe in China all parties are expected to speak in a one on one setting before doing group business.
 
instantia said:
I'll admit I don't know every cultural way of doing business and maybe in China all parties are expected to speak in a one on one setting before doing group business.
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Generally to save face on all sides, group discussions are used unless there is a clear dominant party setting the scene, though hashing out specifics are done in private once there is agreement that they want to do it and again to respect everyone involved, discussion is framed as sharing information and suggestions(and in turn, you aren't supposed to blow them off even if they're being stupid, you tell them you'd think about it, or bring up concerns/costs and then never get back to them).

In the present informal scenario, this IS the personal discussion part where both parties feel out whether they even want to try to make it work or not, with only close allies in attendance so that refusal does not cause offense to anyone.
 
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I'm coming from the place, that i would not be happy to learn someone has went and talked about me working to someone, worked out the details, and then come to me for final acceptance.
Unless there is a good reason, i would want to be involved from step one, or as early as possible.

This talk, depending on how it goes, may or may not work to my satisfaction.
I fear that Ling Qi might treat Zhengui like a child (which he is) and not involve him enough, or early enough.
And Ling Qi being visible for the deal will prejudice Zhengui towards this, i simply can't see Zhengui saying no if Ling Qi so much as hints that she wants Zhengui to do this.
It would be nice to provide Zhengui with opportunity to make this decision on his own, to give him a taste responsibility and decision making.
 
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