Actually we do have serfs just not allowed to exit the estates or anything a slave can do since since there are differences in their treatment with the serfs working the land and the slaves working for their master. I saw from the original quest of the serfs' status in Eretrian society with them being less free than even a slave.
Ohh, right right right, the Eretrians reduced many of the Italian natives to serfdom!

I'm sorry, I'd honestly forgotten that bit from the last quest.
 
Night soil collection can actually be a pretty viable business model if you then sell on your "goods" to leather tanneries and the like. @Ironanvil1 and any other Discworld fans in the Quest will remember Harry King, the "King of the Golden River", the formidable pink-faced business giant who made his fortune via emptying the chamber pots of Ankh-Morpork.

With Eretria's system of officers interested in money-making schemes and improving the city, and our uniquely mercantile focus more generally, we're probably actually in a better place than many other cities to do something like this.
 
Urine and excrement are reasonably valuable commodities in a low population context, yeah.
It's when you've got vast numbers of people clustered in dense urban areas that they become so ubiquitous as to represent a public health problem over an annoyance/resource.
If Eretia is producing other textiles alongside sea silk, the urine in particular would be desirable as a mordant to set dyes.
 
Night soil collection can actually be a pretty viable business model if you then sell on your "goods" to leather tanneries and the like. @Ironanvil1 and any other Discworld fans in the Quest will remember Harry King, the "King of the Golden River", the formidable pink-faced business giant who made his fortune via emptying the chamber pots of Ankh-Morpork.
How successful were people like that in real life?
 
Turn 3, 347 OL: Wrestling with Diplomacy
Turn 3, 347 OL: Wrestling with Diplomacy


347 OL
Korinthian Gulf, Near Naupaktos


"Forward!"

We are the ones below the deck. They do not face us on a field of battle, they do not clash with us in narrow passes. They see neither the whites of our eyes nor the sweat of our brows, and they can hear only the lapping of the oars. The commanders shout, and the oars splash. Forward. Forward.

"Right!"

We are the ones below the great. They do not spot us in grand statues, they do not meet us on Olympic fields. They know neither our names nor the ancestry of our families, and they can hear only the lapping of the oars. The commanders shout, and the oars splash. Right. Right.

"Faster!"

We are the ones below the walls. They do not buy produce from our lands, they do not burn our groves of olives. They smell neither the scent of dirt nor the stench of dung, and they can hear only the lapping of the oars. The commanders shout, and the oars splash. Faster. Faster.

"Left!"

We are the ones below the stone. They do not hear our speeches, they do not rage at our arguments against them. They detect neither the politician's smile nor the liar's promise, and they can hear only the lapping of the oars. The commanders shout, and the oars splash. Left. Left.

"Ramming Speed!"

They fear us who are below the deck. We are the faceless ones, the nameless ones, the landless ones, the speechless ones. But we are the ones who cast the ballot, and we are the ones who row the oars. We are the ships of Athenai, the wall that evaded mighty kings, the ram that smashed great kings. We are the ships of Athenai, that triumphed in war and won in peace. We are the birds of prey that glide across the water, that hunt with alabaster-painted eyes and blue-white sails, the guardians of empire and the protectors of hegemony. We are the people and the people's shield, and all shall hear our roar.

But now, they hear nothing but the lapping of the oars. The commanders shout, and the oars splash. Ramming Speed. Ramming Speed.

We are the ones below the deck, and we will feed them to the sea.


"Collision!"

[X] [Prytanis] The Prytanis will remain a chosen citizen
[X] [Standardization] Allow a standard presentation of grievances every eight years, counting from 346 OL.
[X] [Marriage] Reform the laws so the Metic Father has the same rights in the marriage of his daughter.
[X] [Citizenship] If the city should bound citizenship grants by strict rules, then Metic heroes should be given it.
[X] [Juries] Allow Metics to appear on the city's juries if the situation involves their peers as defendent.
[X] [Epidamnians] Eretria Eskhata should host them. They are the representatives of liberty, and do not wish to cause trouble besides. They have conducted themselves honorably, and present advantage to Eretria without creating a route to war.
[X] [Immigration] Loyalty. What good are fieldhands who plot against you, or artists who sing one song among citizens and another among metics? If the city is to grow, it needs those who are loyal and grateful. Look among the refugees of war, or those from old Euboaea, and those who embrace Eretria's vision and government [If successful, random assortment of immigrants grateful to the city with random effects].


Goings on from around the Mediterranean, presented by Xenoparakletor Mnemnon Keylonos of the Demos Exoria

MNEMNON:
Greetings, citizens! I greet you well on the second year of my tenure as the city's exalted Xenoparakletor. I have sought to do my job well and justly, and from the reports I will present on the Messapii and our allies in the league and Peuketii, I think you will be pleased by the fruit that these efforts have given, blessed as they are by Athene and Apollon to whom I give homage. But the world does not stop for us, and so while all this has gone on, there have been happenings from across the Mediterranean that I am pleased to report on.

News from Hellas! Tragedy in Athenai. The strategos Perikles, who had been elevated by his people to pre-eminence at home and abroad, has passed. He leaves one son, Paralos, who has survived the new outbreak of plague that claimed his brother Xanthippos. But if the Gods have forsaken Athenai at home, abroad Poseidon and Demeter bless her still. The city of Potidaea in Chalidike has fallen to the Athenians, ending its rebellion, while in the Gulf of Korinthos the admiral Phormio has won a number of brilliant victories for the Athenians, foremost among them at the Battle of Naupaktos where the Athenians crushed a force almost four times their size. They have a Eusebian spirit! In Boeotia, the Athenian ally of Plataiai, site of a famed battle during the war against the Mede, has been put under siege by Sparta.

News from the West! The Sikeliotes have delivered another warning to Syrakousai for breaching their territory, and again Syrakousai pays for it! Perhaps the people of Syrakousai have become cowards who are afraid of war? The Campanian plain continues to be plagued by raiding by Oscan tribesmen, with both Etruscan and Greek complaining of the fearsome group. The Bruttii continue their raids on Thurii, though after the intensity of the previous year they have calmed in intensity. In Carthage, there are rumors that a vast shipment of gold has arrived from beyond the Pillars of Herakles once more, though none can know from where the Carthaginians have received such bounty. An Eretrian merchant reported seeing an aggressive, hairy and stupid man in Panormos in a cage with hands for feet unlike any seen before.

News from the North! Illyrian pirates have been spotted by merchants skulking among the little islands and hidden coves of Liburnia once more. Preferring pentekontors to triremes, these pirates move quickly and strike before disappearing once more into the web of islands. The Liburni refuse to take responsibility for the raiding of their people, and the chief of Iadar has told Eretrian merchants that they can continue to expect the same protection as before. Deceitful curs! Though an attack cannot be taken at this time, we must at the very least compensate the merchants whom have suffered from this new plague on our Adriatic shipping. In Macedonia, despite Athenian supplies, Sitalces of Thrace has had to retire before reaching the Macedonian capital of Aigai due to lack of supplies. In the process he has looted much of the country, however, and has struck terror in the Northern Greeks.

Goings on from within the city, presented by Proboulos Kyros Gennadios of the Demos Antipatria

KYROS:
Citizens! Progress continues on the city's glorification of the Gods. The renovation of the hill is almost completed; stones have been cleared from the plain of boulders that no longer serve their purpose, as well as loose stones from the foundation of Old Bare, and have been stacked to further raise the platform of the hill so that the place of the Gods looms down on the place of Men. Abroad, the agents of the city have reported some success in gaining Metics (2d10=11), though they complain that the city's emphasis on loyalty in its Metics has made the job harder, as they can choose only those who know of Eretria or are fleeing war, so there has been much destitution among these new Metics, grateful though they are. To this I say: Bah! The Metics who are loyal and dressed in sackcloth are worth ten times those who are treacherous but dress in pampered silks. Were not we so desperate when we scrabbled ashore to this land all those years ago, and now look at us! We shall take those who keel over in fear and transform them into upright Eretrians, I say.

The Metic Assembly was a success. The Metics were granted equality of rights of fathers over marriage, the rights to participate in juries involving themselves as defendants, the standardization of their assemblies, and the ability to be rewarded by citizenship. Already, one Metic has been granted the honor by my hand, the hero of the Battle of Egnatia against the Messapii when we had been at war with them, and we can expect those Metics who show themselves to be deserving of the honor through battle and civic heroism to receive it, within the restrictive limits put by the boule, which shall ensure that the fears of those against these reforms will not be realized. As is tradition for matters of such importance as the Metic Assembly, we honor some of the citizens who spoke at length on the matter: the words of Glaukommes son of Perixeontes, Phokion son of Aristedes the Younger, Ajax son of Lalage, Ekdromos, Leukos the Accountant, Skantarios the Hoplite, Erastos, son of Nikodemos, Nereos, son of Miltiades, Sideros the Younger, Arktos son of Arktos Arkadios, have all been elected by the citizens as the best of the speakers, and have been given a small cash reward for the quality of their oratory. To all other citizens who spoke or cast a vote, you are also honored for your presence!

The city's treasury grows even more this year, despite the expense of the temple. With such a reserve, Grand Mantis Polykarpos Lykos hopes to present a number of improvements to the construction of the city's new Hill of the Divine Marriage in the following year in order to better honor the Gods and take advantage of the opportunity presented.

Demography & Culture

Eretria Eskhata - 347 OL
Adult Freemen: 21,721 (Census of 345 OL)
Citizen Ratio: 45.0%
Adult Male Citizens: 9,774
Adult Male Metics: 11,947
Total Free Population: 75,683

Patron Gods: Divine Marriage of Athene & Apollon
Other Major Gods: Poseidon & Demeter, Zeus, Ploutos, Artemis
Political Offices
Next Election is 349 OL.

Proboulos: Kyros Gennadios (Demos Antipatria)
Xenoparakletor: Mnemnon Keylonos (Demos Exoria)
Lead Strategos: Only appointed in times of war.
Metic Prytanis: Timotaios Herais (Demos Antipatria).

Agoranomos: Arkadios Ambrosios (Demos Antipatria).
Assembly of the Mint: Paramonos Diokles (Demos Antipatria).
Chief of Public Lands: Arsenios Hermagoras (Demos Exoria).
Grand Mantis: Polykarpos Lykos (Demos Antipatria).
Elder Ekdromos: Alexandros Hilarion (Demos Exoria).

Great Works

Wide Walls: Proud stone walls that protect the city from enemies.
Sea Wall: Protect the city from any sea-based attack.
Arkadion: A small temple to Demeter & Poseidon (Under Renovation).
Temple of the Divine Marriage: A modest temple to the Divine Marriage of Apollo and Athena. (Under Renovation).
Naval Barracks: Where the city's rowers train.
Hill of the Divine Marriage: Under Renovation. Done beginning of 351 OL.
Treasury & Income
Treasury in 347 OL: 370.6 Talents
Income: 269.6 Talents
Taxation: 168.3 Talents
Commerce: 69.8 Talents
League Income: 8.7 talents
Tribute: 11.8 Talents
Public Revenue: 11.0 Talents

Expenses: 256.8 Talents
Navy Upkeep: 74.8 Talents
Army Upkeep: 44.0 Talents
Construction: 96.0 Talents (Great Work)
Misc: 0.0 Talents
Salaries & Subsidies: 15.0 Talents
Sacred Treasury Contribution: 27.0 Talents (10% into Sacred Treasury)

Sacred Treasury in 348 OL: 1326.9 (27.0 Talents)
Treasury in 348 OL: 383.4 Talents
Manpower & Possible Levy

Special Units

500 Sacred Ekdromoi [Medium Hoplites]
50 Kleos Exoria [Cavalry]

Total Levy: 7,011 (50% of all Adult Freemen minus men in special units and navy)
2,804 Hoplites (40% of available levies)
526 Cavalry (7.5% of available levies)
3,861 Psilloi (all remaining available levies)
Deployed Levy

Standing Army (Eretria Eskhata)

500 Sacred Ekdromoi (deployed at all times for 38.5 talents a turn)
50 Kleos Exoria (deployed at all times for 5.5 talents a turn)

None other deployed.
Navy


Trained Rowers: 3,300 Rowers
Crew Complement: 150 per Trireme
Crewable Triremes: 22 Triremes

Deployed Triremes: 0 Triremes
Inactive Triremes: 22 Triremes
Inactive Rowers: 3,300 Rowers (74.8 talent professional pay)
Trade

Maritime Trade Capacity: 9/10 Trade Routes
Tariff Efficiency: 45% Tariff Efficiency
Commerce Revenue: 69.8 Talents

1 Staple Trade Route to Athenai (Grain)
1 Staple Trade Route to South Italy (Anchovies & Wine)
1 Staple Trade Route to Sicily (Olive Oil)
1 Staple Trade Route to Southeast Illyria (Olive Oil)
1 Staple Trade Route to Northeast Illyria (Wine)
1 Staple Trade Route to North Italy (Olive Oil)

1 Luxury Trade Route to Athenai (Byssos Cloth)
1 Luxury Trade Route to Etruria (Pottery)
Subjects & Subject Levies

Epulian League
Members: Eretria Eskhata, Sipontion, Pylona, Garnae, Barletos, Ankon, Monopolis, and Aufidenos
Tribute: 8.7 (10% of yearly income of each city)
Epulian League Levies: 816 Hoplites

Peuketii Kingdom
Ruler: King Gorgos (son of King Batavorta)
Capital: Sannape
Tribute: 9.8 Talents a turn
Levies: 883 Peuketii Skirmishers, 196 Peuketii Cavalry

Other Subjects
Subjects: Egnatia, Turai
Tribute: 0.8 Talents (Egnatia), 1.2 Talents (Turai)
Levies: 94 Egnatian Skirmishers, 47 Egnatian Cavalry, 65 Turai Skirmishers, 32 Peuketii Cavalry

Alliances & Diplomacy


City of Thurii: Full alliance with the city of Thurii cultivated in opposition to potential ambitions by Taras or other Italiote powers like Krotone.
Estimated Levy: 4,000 Men


Sikeliote League: Full alliance with the Sikeliote League cultivated in opposition to the main power in South Sicily, Syrakousai.
Maximum Levy: 8,000 Men



Commercial Policy: Merchant Insurance

Despite the total and utter defeat of the Demos Drakonia, complained by some in their faction as an act of the Gods due to the augurs that destroyed their chance at the position of proboulos, Athenagoras Symmachos remained buoyant. Having taken up a volunteer position to plead the case of others in the courts of property and commerce, Symmachos soon earned a new reputation as a fine speaker who could sway the juries to his position and away from that of the opposition. In general, he took the cases of merchants and those who had their property damaged or stolen, and so it was no surprise that when an intersection of his new hobby and his political position as leader of what was once the dominant Deme of the city of Eretria he used the assembly's regular meeting to raise it as a serious issue. The recent increase in raiding by Illyrians, though menacing, has claimed relatively few Eretrian ships. What is more concerning is that the uptick in piracy is driving away trade from the upper Adriatic, and in particular the islands of the Liburni which are used as stopping points for ships journeying south along the coast.

This fear will only continue, and is certainly bad for business. But those who avoid this corridor are not just fearful or cowardly; many merchants are concerned that the lack of proper insurance for their ships has led to a situation where many are afraid to spare any hulks for long sea voyages which are not along the very safest routes. The city's indolence on this subject, as Symmachos describes it, has created a situation in which merchants have to shoulder the full cost of their losses or else turn to private and scandalously expensive lenders, who will refuse to lend to merchants who go on far-off voyages for fear that the loss of the ship will lead to them becoming paupers working on public works just to satisfy their debts. This is no way for a true Eretrian to behave, but as Symmachos argues, it is an inevitable consequence that as the city does nothing to protect its merchants, they can trust only in the fickle hand of Poseidon to protect them.

Obander Eupraxis, despite his experience at the sea, has voiced his skepticism. He argues before the assembly that the matter of merchant insurance is a matter that the city should not get involved in except exceptional circumstances. Why is this the case? As it represents the city placing financial interest in individual merchant and thus opens the door to corruption. It would require a large apparatus for the city to deal with and would be difficult to manage, and with such large sums of money going around, not to mention the potentiality of extreme expense to the city if there was some incident such as a massive increase in pirate raiding, it would be better for the city to deeply restrict the support it can provide.

Proboulos Kyros Gennadios, however, in a rare break with his mentor and the Deme as a whole, has offered a different idea. He says he has been in conversation with the Grand Mantis Lykos for some time, and that they believe they can in fact strike up a deal with the shrine of Ploutos. The shrine could shoulder the state's responsibility to provide insurance to merchants by being a stable lender of coin; the money it had set aside for insurance would be kept in its own sacred treasury, unbreachable by greedy priests on pain of death. At the same time, the shrine would need a considerable amount of money to start in order to begin providing insurance for merchants in order to ensure its own solvency. Both Obander and Mnemnon worry that a temple involving itself with matters of commerce, even one that is dedicated to a God of Wealth, goes too far.

The matter is left for the assembly to decide.

Should the City of Eretria Eskhata be providing insurance to merchants?

[] [Insurance] Accept full responsibility for the insurance of merchants against the loss of their ships [-4 public upkeep per turn].
[] [Insurance] Set large limitations on state insurance and have merchants pay a fee for insurance. [-2 public upkeep per turn].
[] [Insurance] Allow the Shrine of Ploutos to handle merchant insurance with state support [-20 talent one-time fee to Shrine of Ploutos].


Tributary Policy: The Grand Tour of the Allies

Every Eretrian with any degree of experience in the public eye had learned to be a strongman because of the demands that being a lifter placed on even the most pampered aristocrat. To be in the public eye meant one could lift heavy stones, and so around this culture had also arisen a physicality that, though known among all Hellenes, had been finetuned in Eretria. Discus-throwing, running, fighting and riding were all popular among the wealthy classes, and those middling men who could afford leisure on festival days enjoyed it as well in the gymnasia of the Ekdromoi, a plain but large collonaded courtyard, or the Pasture of the Exiles, where the Kleos Exoria kept their stables and spoke of politics or love, depending on the mood and the heat of the day (politics was less popular on hot summer days where tempers could easily flare, and the sight of men glistening with sweat also did much to lubricate discussions of love).

Among the most popular of Eretrian sports, besides the stone toss, was wrestling. Eretrian men had been winners of wrestling at the Olympic Games three times since landing, and the city had developed a Mediterranean reputation for the broad shoulders and rough disposition of its frontiersmen. Among these men was Mnemnon, the city's new Xenoparakletor, so unlike the more willowy and slim Drakonian Xenoparakletors, many of whom had volunteered as rowers or naval captains and been keen swimmers. So it came as no surprise to King Gorgos, even if it did to his attendants, that the new xenoparakletor challenged him to a wrestling match upon meeting him. Mnemnon had not been famed for many things, but had spent the days on his estate wrestling with serfs and friends to pass the time, and so on the frontier he was known as the Young Stallion not just for his skills at riding but because he could ride any man on the gynasium field.

Gorgos was no pushover, however, a heavyset man with Illyrian cap who had nothing of the lifestyle might expect from one called king, given his rough demeanor and dirty beard. The king had publicly renounced the behavior of his father Batavorta, who imported Epulian wine and held Hellene symposia. Though every bit as intrigued by the Hellenes as his father, Gorgos preferred the frontiersmen whose estates loomed near his kingdom's boundaries. And so, despite the advice of his attendants, Gorgos accepted Mnemnon's proposal, and the two stripped. Gorgos joked that the wrestling bout was unncessary because his grandfather had already submitted to Harpos after the man's javelin had pierced King Foetus and killed him on the spot, and Mnemnon replied that his javelin was just as long and his aim as true as his ancestor. Those in Mnemnon's party less fond of such behavior rolled eyes or covered their face with their hands, but those among the Exoria merely cheered him on.

Roll 5D4+2=16

The bout was over quickly. Gorgos was heavier and larger than Mnemnon, but Mnemnon had the experience and ability to use this weight against him, ending their spar with a suplex that plummeted the king down to the ground to the cheers of his supporters and the roaring of the Peuketii. To soothe the tension, Mnemnon helped the king up, who embraced the xenoparakletor like a brother and lifted up his hand; from this day forward the two would become inseparable friends. This was a legendary match, to be immortalized in song, of the xenoparakletor who felled the king, but it is said that among the women of Eretria that the match was a peculiar example once more of the strange ways in which Hellene men work, where fights end in friendships but symposia in brawls. Obander called it an 'unnecessary display of absolute manliness', and few could figure out if he meant that in a positive or negative way.

Leaving aside such adventurous escapades, the xenoparakletor had practical reasons to put on such a circus. Mnemnon was a keen believe in the importance of symbols and the necessity of ceremony in all things; he had entered the bout sure he would win, and his victory was a display of both camaraderie and domination over the barbaroi, earning instant respect among them. He toured the Peuketii kingdom and saw that it had become a prosperous country, full of cattle and shepherds and farmers along the Aufidos river. Canosa had recovered from the depradations it had received under Harpos, Rhyps was a quiet but prosperous place, and Sannape had grown into a town, with woolmakers gathering wool driven from as far inland as Samnium. It was here that Mnemnon was hosted. Prayers were said to Artemis and Orion, paired by the Peuketii in a cult growing more and more in popularity among the Iapyges as an expression of a pure and rustic form of love. Few plots could be found among the Peuketii, except grumblings about the existence of the city of Turai, which many in the kingdom felt was an affront to the Peuketii. Gorgos admitted, however, that he was happy that the city was not allotted to him, for it lie straight in the path of a Tarentine army.

Mnemnon also learned from the Peuketii that the frontier was mostly quiet. Most of the Lucanian energy had apparently been directed elsewhere, instead; the breakaway tribe of the Bruttii was furnished with new tribesmen every day, and were growing in power to the point where they would soon become impossible for the Italiote Hellenes to quell. The Samnites, on the other hand, were planning something, for there had been much activity in the northwest, especially in Campania. This did not much concern Eretria, however, and the situation with the Dauni remained unknown, and would be until the spies were dispatched in the following year.

Mnemnon did not intend to come without gaining something, however. He brought with him officials from the boule who assessed the size of Canosa, Rhyps, the size of the royal cattle herd, and other such measurements, and found that the Peuketii had not been paying their fair share into Eretria's defense as they should. Gorgos admitted so, but explained that it had not been his fault; he simply did not have the revenues to conduct such assessments himself, and so while the kingdom had grown the tribute payments had remained the same. He had little interest in making trouble, explaining that his grandfather Harpos had said that the Eretrians were much more fearsome in war than in peace. From war, the Peuketii had received destruction and sorrow, but in peace with Eretria they received wealth and stability, something that the tribe had not known for years. The reforms of the Demos Drakonia that ended Peuketii serf sales to Eretria also cooled much of the remaining tensions between the two.

Now all that lay before the assembly would be how to expand the obligations of the Peuketii, and in what manner to ensure a regular and fair system of tribute.

What part of Peuketii obligations should the city increase?

[] [Tribute] Talents. Better to receive coin and kind from the Peuketii in order to help fund the city's ventures [Peuketii tribute increases to 13.1 talents per turn].
[] [Tribute] Levies. More Peuketii allies in the cavalry and light infantry will serve to augment's the city's armies [+2.5% levy from the Peuketii, +654 Levies].

How should the city improve tribute collection from Egnatia, Turai, and the Peuketii?

[] [Collection] Have them come to us. We can maintain a bond of trust with the tributaries without impinging in their private affairs and expand the festival of tribute to build fraternal feeling. [-2 public subsidy upkeep per year].
[] [Collection] Dispatch inspectors to them. Better for our agents to be among them in order to catch any sign of suspicion or plotting than to hope the barbaroi will always keep us in good stead [-2 public subsidy upkeep per year].


League Policy: A Less than Perfect Union

Pleased with Peuketii loyalty, and after a short stint to the cities of Egnatia and Turai who paid him similar homage, Mnemnon now embarked to the Epulian League. Here he presented himself as an image of Hellene austerity, wearing plain but clean tunics and robes and touring the Epulian cities by land rather than by the coast, meeting farmers along the way and crossing the Aufidos at a shallow ford. The impression he received from the League was less positive than he had with the Peuketii. Many in the league cities felt put upon. Although they appreciated Eretrian protection and in no way wished to impose upon the city, the feeling was that the league was simply an avenue for Eretrian ambition and wealth, with little investment in the structures of the league and few meetings of the league actually called during a xenoparakletor's term. Although the league had been consulted and taken into Ankon's founding, otherwise it had little use except as the method by which Epulian gold, meager as it was, flowed into Eretria. Barletos and Aufidenos also raised concerns due to their considerable trade with Korinthos.

The league cities were led in this objection by the Pylonans, who felt that after a promising start the Epulian League had stagnated, with little reform or changes in a structure that had little of the indication of a normal koinon. The league cities pointed to the Sikeliote League, where a true union had been achieved, with common currency and more common institutions such as a common treasury. By comparison, all money gathered by the league went straight to Eretrian coffers. Mnemnon responded non-commitaly to these concerns, knowing they would not be well-received at home. The league cities owed their survival to Eretria, and those who had been settled after the original few settlements were done so with Eretrian acceptance. Was it really acceptable to grant the league even more, when the Eretrians had been so lenient in their treatment in the past? On the other side, suggested by Obander Eupraxis, lay the simple fact that if the Epulian League were to one day expand to unspecified horizons it had to change into more than a vehicle for tribute.

Citizens felt that change now was not appropriate; the city had just experienced a tense argument over the rights of Metics, and having the Epulian cities demand more rights as well after such massive concessions to the metics would have strained the city's extraordinary charity. Instead, Kyros Gennadios recommended that the city should instead shelve these concerns and have the demoi present their own ideas about it for the city's sake in the next general election. Athenagoras Symmachos argued it might be preferable to deal with the issue in the following year instead after calling the League Synedrion together so that a clearer picture of league issues can be put before the assembly.

Should the assembly look into the Epulian League's concerns next year, or wait for the demoi to put together platforms in the next election?

[] [League] Let us listen to the concerns of our Hellene allies [League Synedrion will be called next year].
[] [League] We have already conceded much to the Metics. The league can afford to wait a few years [Special League policies in 349 OL election platforms].


Xenoparakletor Mission: The Messapii Expedition

Along with the spies that would be dispatched in the following year to the Dauni, the mission to the Messapii by the Xenoparakletor would be among the most difficult of the tribulations and challenges faced by young Mnemnon as he sought to prove his worth as both diplomat and statesman. After all, unlike the friendly Peuketii and pliant cities, the Messapii, despite their weakening stature, had never been fully broken, and the tragedies of the past years had given them a ferocity and desperation which made them suspicious of outsiders. They were aware that they were surrounded by Hellenes, and that the town of Brention remained in danger due to its position on the sea from any Hellene adventurer or polis that thought its fine natural harbor would be an excellent place for a new colony.

Although the Tarentines and Eretrians had been unable to fully defeat the Messapii, the Tarentines especially had ravaged the Messapii countryside in two wars, destroying estates and capturing vast herds of cattle. In the south of the Sallentine Peninsula they had fully surrounded the city of Aoxenta, which was now cut off from the rest of the confederacy and confined to a small square of a few kilometers. Many of its inhabitants had fled north and the rest held it as a fortress rather than a settlement. Neriton and Manduria had become strong walled cities, as they lay on the road from Taras and had already been put to siege many times. Only the city of Caelia remained relatively unscathed from the fighting, nestled as it was in the hills further away from the main targets of Tarentine retribution.

Even now, the new Tarentine proboulos had announced a new wave of raiding targeting mostly the city of Manduria and its countryside, making even a normal journey a dangerous proposition for Mnemnon. That is why when he embarked, he did so by sea, first landing at the city of Brention after sending emissaries abroad to guarantee safe conduct.

2d10+2= 13

The result was an unimpressive but cordial welcome from the city, led by a chief who had been elected by a council of notables in the town to be their king. A coastal town, Brention was famed for the quality of the anchovies off its shores, and occasionally Hellene ships did in fact dock at the town's splendid harbor. Temples to Artemis, Aphrodite, and Zeus were seen in the town. The chief of the town, by the name of Magon, welcomed Mnemnon in and spoke to him at length. The town of Brention was not happy by the way in which the Messapii Confederacy's existence continually provoked Tarentine outrage and the town would have preferred to simply come under Eretria's protection, but it could only do so during a war in which such a move would not provoke conflict with the rest of the league. The Chief of Brention had seen the evenhanded and fair way in which Eretria had protected its other vassals, and although the city had been looted in the past by Eusebios, they were willing to put that aside if it meant escaping the league before another impending war with Taras potentially destroyed them all.

Not impressed with the man's courage, Mnemnon still saw the advantages in separate deals that could effectively cleave off parts of the Messapii Confederacy without coming into conflict with Taras. Certainly, a major concern with the Tarentines might be that if Eretria entered into a defensive alliance with the Messapii they would be unable to make war on the Dauni, because now there was always a threat that Taras would attack the Messapii while they were distracted and force them to either break the alliance to commit to a two-front war.

At the same time, losing the diplomatic of the entire Messapii Confederacy in favor of some its weaker members, though conflict-averse, stank of a lack of ambition to Mnemnon, who preferred forcing a war with Taras that he felt would come eventually. Better to settle the matter as soon as possible, with Messapii allies on the side, than to do so later when Eretria was distracted or Taras had been strengthened by good leadership or further victories over the Messapii. This would be a fine block for Tarentine expansion and ensure that they could no longer easily grow their domains without Eretria's opposition.

2d10+2=19

Having gained access to Messapii lands and the protection of the Chief of Brention, represented by a ceremonial Messapii cap that showed that this man would not be harmed, Mnemnon embarked to visit the minor cities of Messapia, such as Caelia, Rudiae, and Lupiae. Aoxenta remained inaccessible except through Lykai, a city which many Eretrians disliked for its part in their original dishonor of Taras and that Mnemnon was not particularly fond of either, and so that town was avoided.

On this journey, and having received the ceremonial cap, Mnemnon was now much better received. He ate grapes and enjoyed a symposium with the chief of Caelia, was paraded by the King of Rudiae, and welcomed by the assembly of Lupiae. The news that Eretria might pursue a defensive alliance with the Messapii had raised the spirits of many who feared that this coming war might put an end to the confederacy as a whole, though there were certainly those skeptical of the city's intentions. Them, Mnemnon was able to placate through a number of rough-spun anecdotes which convinced them of Eretria's lack of interest in conflict and reminded them of the prosperity the city of Egnatia enjoys, itself a Messapii town and one of Eretria's oldest allies. The Oath of Daxtus was mentioned, as well as stories told by the Messapii of the terrible things visited upon Daxtus by Artemis due to his betrayal. The city of Caelia, also interested in a secret treaty, broached the subject with Mnemnon but he gave no indication of his acceptance yet, knowing that accepting it would be impossible if Eretria wished for a defensive alliance.

At Neriton and Manduria Mnemnon now became familiar with the most important man in all of Messapia, King Avithos Artahias of Neriton. A poet and a scholar, Artahias knew well the stories of the Hellenes and regaled Mnemnon with a retelling of the Eretrian arrival in iambic pentameter. Deeply impressed by the man's knowledge, Mnemnon also thought that it might be possible to work with him, but was then again a young and impressionable person who thought in terms of honesty and trust, and so would not be able to well-detect the danger coming from a man with a silver tongue but black heart.

The King, however, indicated little of that heart if it so existed, and instead discussed the potentials of battle strategy against the Tarentines if it should come down to it. He offered the Eretrians that if he were to gain a small boon of some kind, perhaps only something as simple as ten or fifteen talents, he may be able to turn the Confederacy and strengthen it, while keeping it in good tidings and relations with Eretria. He would be elected its war leader, a new Oath of Artemis would be signed, and the restoration of the old peace between Messapia and Eretria would be complete. The only cost would be a defensive alliance between the two powers, and the mutual understanding that Taras was no friend of theirs.

Mnemnon thanked the king, but worried about the dangers that giving so much power to one man might do. Daxtus had been strengthened by Eretria, but he had turned the coin she had given back on them. Though the Messapii were stronger then than now, they might still attempt treachery, especially if they felt that they could count on other external allies. Athenai had already sent emissaries in the previous year to the Messapii and apparently given them about 10 talents in silver. Could Eretria trust loyalty bought with its own coin?

The matter of his journey was all recounted to the assembly, and two separate options put before it; in the first place, whether to accept a defensive alliance or pursue secret treaties with a few cities. In the second place, whether to provide funding to a single Messapii leader whether or not Eretria signed a defensive alliance with them, to make them more powerful in a war against Taras if nothing else.

Should the city accept a defensive alliance with the Messapii Confederacy, gaining an ally but putting it into potential conflict with Taras?

[] [Alliance] Accept a full defensive alliance with the Messapii Confederacy.
[] [Alliance] Better to conclude secret treaties with some cities without raising the specter of war with Taras.

Should the city promote a single ruler and point of contact for the whole Messapii Confederacy?

[] [King] Promote King Artahias as a strong leader for the Confederacy to lead it against Taras and keep the peace with Eretria [-15 talent fee].
[] [King] Better to keep the Confederacy weak and potentially reliant on Eretrian direction.


Please copy out vote text in its entirety in order to preserve the coherency of the vote. That includes the word with the vote brackets.

No plan votes; if you want to vote for someone else's plan in its entirety, copy and paste their votes.​
 
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The city's treasury grows even more this year, despite the expense of the temple. With such a reserve, Grand Mantis Polykarpos Lykos hopes to present a number of improvements to the construction of the city's new Hill of the Divine Marriage in the following year in order to better honor the Gods and take advantage of the opportunity presented.
Wow. What a shock. How impressive of him to have so many great ideas for additions. Who could have seen that coming. Truly, it's great to have such a dedicated Mantis to give such unbiased direction. (Our proboulous being magnificence 6 probably doesn't help matters)
 
[X] [Insurance] Allow the Shrine of Ploutos to handle merchant insurance with state support [-20 talent one-time fee to Shrine of Ploutos].

Who better to protect the merchants than the priests devoted to the god of wealth? Better them than some unscrupulous lenders, in my opinion!

[X] [Tribute] Talents. Better to receive coin and kind from the Peuketii in order to help fund the city's ventures [Peuketii tribute increases to 13.1 talents per turn].

Our military strength should not be overly entangled with barbaroi forces!

[X] [Collection] Have them come to us. We can maintain a bond of trust with the tributaries without impinging in their private affairs and expand the festival of tribute to build fraternal feeling. [-2 public subsidy upkeep per year].

We cannot risk sabotaging our relationship with the Peuketii, despite their barbaroi nature.

[X] [League] We have already conceded much to the Metics. The league can afford to wait a few years [Special League policies in 349 OL election platforms].

Let the demes have time to develop policy options for the reform of the league, instead of us rushing a crucial decision such as this.

[X] [Alliance] Better to conclude secret treaties with some cities without raising the specter of war with Taras.

Fair Eretria is in the middle of a period of reorganization and redevelopment. We cannot afford to distract it with a war against Taras, despite our poor relations with them.

[X] [King] Better to keep the Confederacy weak and potentially reliant on Eretrian direction.

The Messapii have shown their treachery once before. We will not let them take advantage of us again.
 
[X] [Insurance] Set large limitations on state insurance and have merchants pay a fee for insurance. [-2 public upkeep per turn]
[X] [Tribute] Talents. Better to receive coin and kind from the Peuketii in order to help fund the city's ventures [Peuketii tribute increases to 13.1 talents per turn].
[X] [Collection] Have them come to us. We can maintain a bond of trust with the tributaries without impinging in their private affairs and expand the festival of tribute to build fraternal feeling. [-2 public subsidy upkeep per year].
[X] [League] We have already conceded much to the Metics. The league can afford to wait a few years [Special League policies in 349 OL election platforms].
[X] [Alliance] Accept a full defensive alliance with the Messapii Confederacy.
[X] [King] Better to keep the Confederacy weak and potentially reliant on Eretrian direction.
Adhoc vote count started by Pempelune on May 23, 2019 at 5:43 PM, finished with 39 posts and 14 votes.
 
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[X] [Insurance] Allow the Shrine of Ploutos to handle merchant insurance with state support [-20 talent one-time fee to Shrine of Ploutos].
[X] [Tribute] Levies. More Peuketii allies in the cavalry and light infantry will serve to augment's the city's armies [+2.5% levy from the Peuketii, +654 Levies].
[X] [Collection] Have them come to us. We can maintain a bond of trust with the tributaries without impinging in their private affairs and expand the festival of tribute to build fraternal feeling. [-2 public subsidy upkeep per year].
[X] [League] Let us listen to the concerns of our Hellene allies [League Synedrion will be called next year].
[X] [Alliance] Better to conclude secret treaties with some cities without raising the specter of war with Taras.
[x] [King] Better to keep the Confederacy weak and potentially reliant on Eretrian direction.
 
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An idea: would it be possible to set up the League Synedrion as a regular thing like the Metic assembly just got? Preferably scheduled for the other 8 year cycle?
 
An idea: would it be possible to set up the League Synedrion as a regular thing like the Metic assembly just got? Preferably scheduled for the other 8 year cycle?

It's entirely possible, though such a reform would be done through one of the two options (either initiated by the xenoparakletor or through a synedrion meeting). So it's covered under the existing options.
 
@Cetashwayo would the Temple of Pluotus have oversight from the Mint, given that the huge financial scandal of the Eretrian Temples was only a generation or so ago?
Would King Artahias taking the same sort of deal Harpos did, of swearing to Eretria in return for tribal hegemony, be viable, with suitable inducements? A decent sized chunk of the Messapii seem interested in coming under our banner, and we've got a reputation for defending what's ours.
 
@Cetashwayo would the Temple of Pluotus have oversight from the Mint, given that the huge financial scandal of the Eretrian Temples was only a generation or so ago?
Would King Artahias taking the same sort of deal Harpos did, of swearing to Eretria in return for tribal hegemony, be viable, with suitable inducements? A decent sized chunk of the Messapii seem interested in coming under our banner, and we've got a reputation for defending what's ours.

1. Yes.
2. If Eretria signs the defensive alliance that could be a more long-term arrangement that could emerge, but for the moment it's a step too far.
 
No time for speechifying, but I can't resist...
[X] [Insurance] Set large limitations on state insurance and have merchants pay a fee for insurance. [-2 public upkeep per turn].
Leukos the Accountant would have a needlessly complicated plan for this.
...
Also, Greek diplomacy. Now with WRESTLING!
Obander called it an 'unnecessary display of absolute manliness', and few could figure out if he meant that in a positive or negative way.
Snrk snrk snrk
...
[X] [Tribute] Talents. Better to receive coin and kind from the Peuketii in order to help fund the city's ventures [Peuketii tribute increases to 13.1 talents per turn].
[X] [Collection] Dispatch inspectors to them. Better for our agents to be among them in order to catch any sign of suspicion or plotting than to hope the barbaroi will always keep us in good stead [-2 public subsidy upkeep per year].
...
[X] [League] Let us listen to the concerns of our Hellene allies [League Synedrion will be called next year].
Bring it on!
No specific plans regarding the alliance, no time to think about it.
 
[] [Alliance] Accept a full defensive alliance with the Messapii Confederacy.
This means war with Taras, make no mistake! I would strongly urge anyone who chooses this to also pick the increased levy from the Peuketti, because we are gonna need it.

[] [Alliance] Better to conclude secret treaties with some cities without raising the specter of war with Taras.
This means grabbing the Adriatic side of the Salento peninsula "for free". I'm quite tempted by this, because securing Brention means we control the only natural harbor in the region that surpasses our own. That said this probably also means we let the Messapii be conquered...

[X] [Insurance] Allow the Shrine of Ploutos to handle merchant insurance with state support [-20 talent one-time fee to Shrine of Ploutos].
[X] [Tribute] Levies. More Peuketii allies in the cavalry and light infantry will serve to augment's the city's armies [+2.5% levy from the Peuketii, +654 Levies].
[X] [Collection] Have them come to us. We can maintain a bond of trust with the tributaries without impinging in their private affairs and expand the festival of tribute to build fraternal feeling. [-2 public subsidy upkeep per year].
[X] [League] Let us listen to the concerns of our Hellene allies [League Synedrion will be called next year].
[X] [Alliance] Better to conclude secret treaties with some cities without raising the specter of war with Taras.
[X] [King] Promote King Artahias as a strong leader for the Confederacy to lead it against Taras and keep the peace with Eretria [-15 talent fee].
 
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New
[X] [Insurance] Allow the Shrine of Ploutos to handle merchant insurance with state support [-20 talent one-time fee to Shrine of Ploutos].
[X] [Tribute] Talents. Better to receive coin and kind from the Peuketii in order to help fund the city's ventures [Peuketii tribute increases to 13.1 talents per turn].
[X] [Collection] Have them come to us. We can maintain a bond of trust with the tributaries without impinging in their private affairs and expand the festival of tribute to build fraternal feeling. [-2 public subsidy upkeep per year].
[X] [League] We have already conceded much to the Metics. The league can afford to wait a few years [Special League policies in 349 OL election platforms].
[X] [Alliance] Accept a full defensive alliance with the Messapii Confederacy.
[X] [King] Better to keep the Confederacy weak and potentially reliant on Eretrian direction.
 
Hmm, well, you don't see anyone else doing so, so logically there's a untapped market ready and willing to be taken!

All joking aside, yeah, I'm honestly not sure what we can export ahead of time, as it were.

Well with the war starting it might be a good idea to look into arms production since there should be a marked increase in demand and I don't think we are that badly positioned in regards to access to the necessary resources. It should also make a useful trade good with a lot of the italoite and adriatic tribes.

Though on second thought I think I mistook your question and you were more interested in future technology in which case I am also drawing something of a blank.


And @Cetashwayo a quick question regarding the levy - what is our general policy regarding loot and allies? Do they get their "fair" share or are we taking all their staff? Because if romes history has taught me anything that there is no better way to strengthen an alliance than to give your allies a fair portion of the loot/land you conquer.
 
I bet you won't even let us be nefarious, conclude secret treaties with all the Messapii cities separately, and do a side deal with Artahias, that we'll back him as King of the Messapii in return for his fealty to us, when the Tarentine War inevitably kicks off.:(

Sadly such subtlety is somewhat beyond the city :V

And @Cetashwayo a quick question regarding the levy - what is our general policy regarding loot and allies? Do they get their "fair" share or are we taking all their staff? Because if romes history has taught me anything that there is no better way to strengthen an alliance than to give your allies a fair portion of the loot/land you conquer.

You give them their fair share.
 
And @Cetashwayo a quick question regarding the levy - what is our general policy regarding loot and allies? Do they get their "fair" share or are we taking all their staff? Because if romes history has taught me anything that there is no better way to strengthen an alliance than to give your allies a fair portion of the loot/land you conquer.
We've had a history of being pretty generous when it comes to loot distribution - the Peuketti auxiliaries got a nice big chunk of the proceeds from the Sicilian War.
 
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