Status
Not open for further replies.
It's also just a really bad habit to get into to let attacks hit you in the face when they could be blocked. Given the vast array of things that she fights, just assuming that her divine durability will protect her is kinda dumb.
Brute.

The things that can hurt her through her armor, as evidenced over fifty plus years of hanging around Man's World, are pretty few, and that's why she has the bracelets.
Besides, their primary job is law enforcement, so to speak, not war.
The mindset you foster in your LEOs matters.

The Justice League may have been a little lax on security and professionalism, but people need to worry about going too far in the other direction.
There are reasons why everyone is not rocking chameleon stealth-enhanced powersuits with full atmospheric filtration, multispectral sensors systems and rocket boosters that can break Mach 5 in atmosphere.

It's not like Kal-El doesn't have access to the technology.
I love the idea of Greek gods modernizing and 'getting with the times'.
Oh certainly, this is a Good Thing.
I wouldn't be particularly fussed at the idea that OL/Kord/Sephitian made a suit that could do things that Hephaestus never bothered to figure out.
Enhances her flying speed, maybe, or something else.

But the idea that a god of Craft, with thousands of years of experience in making armor, was commissioned to make protective armor for a divine champion.
And then made something that was improved on by a bunch of mortals in a couple months? Rubs me the wrong way.

Especially given that the initial threat environment for Greek demigods included shit like magical piercing weapons, contact poisons, gases, energy weapons, magic and more.
 
Last edited:
Our cops do not regularly show up in MRAPs and Modular Tactical Vests, nor does Obama wear body armor at public speeches.
Threat levels matter, and Diana has done everything from fight a world war to interstellar invasions to invading Apokolips in her current gear.
This is also a matter of comfort and practicality (more difficult to run in heavy armour etc). If we had heavy armour as cheap and easy to carry as light then things might be different.

Besides once things are bad enough that the JL is called in then the police would also have their heaviest armour on if they have to do the fighting rather than just crowd control.

Methinks you give them entirely too much credit.

It should have gotten much easier by having her original armour to reverse engineer (still quite a feat however). Particularly since the Sephtian technique is basically "take any enchantment and make it better by having many spells rather than one large".

Not to say that you don't have a good point however.
 
Last edited:
This is also a matter of comfort and practicality (more difficult to run in heavy armour etc). If we had heavy armour as cheap and easy to carry as light then things might be different.
As long as it looks as obvious as it is IRL? Probably not.
There are PR and efficacy costs to looking like an occupying army.

It should have gotten much easier by having her original armour to reverse engineer (still quite a feat however). Particularly since the Sephtian technique is basically "take any enchantment and make it better by having many spells rather than one large".
That assumes she gave up her armor for that long.
Or that they were able to get any useful readings from examining it; divine-linked stuff often is resistant to OL scans.

And that brings up a second point:
Sephitian's work can be overloaded. We've seen it happen several times with Spell Eaters.
And yet Diana's gear has never lost it's potency, even when she's had to deal with major sorcerers/sorceresses.
Given that she's been using it since WW2 against mundane mooks and reality warpers alike, that's one hell of a warranty.
 
Or that they were able to get any useful readings from examining it; divine-linked stuff often is resistant to OL scans.
Sephtian would have to be the one doing the reverse engineering; OL wouldn't be able to scan for how the magic works at all.
And that brings up a second point:
Sephitian's work can be overloaded. We've seen it happen several times with Spell Eaters.
And yet Diana's gear has never lost it's potency, even when she's had to deal with major sorcerers/sorceresses.
Given that she's been using it since WW2 against mundane mooks and reality warpers alike, that's one hell of a warranty.
The Spell Eaters need to recharge their spells from the storage of magic they get by absorbing hostile magic directed at their user. Since Diana is a low level god/Titan, her armor can presumably be fueled by her divine presence, meaning the spells on the armor don't need to store any hostile magic that they protect against, preventing the overloading magic that the Spell Eaters get.
Does anyone here wonder how Paul would take Brexit?

@Mr Zoat: How do you take Brexit, and how does Earth-16's Europe compare to OTL?
I'm American, and don't have strong opinions either way, but I know that if we actually start with this topic the thread will turn into a shitshow. Please, no. It's a big important event that has no place in this thread.
 
I don't believe it does.
And there would be issues with spell-spell interaction if it did.
Diana's new armour currently doesn't have any enchantments on it, outside the arcane nature of the metal itself.
I don't agree.
Our cops do not regularly show up in MRAPs and Modular Tactical Vests, nor does Obama wear body armor at public speeches.
Threat levels matter, and Diana has done everything from fight a world war to interstellar invasions to invading Apokolips in her current gear.
Diana has a wide range of skills, but if you're calling her in as a superhero then you've done so because someone needs punching. She isn't an investigator, she'd struggle to fight spacecraft and she isn't all that good at disaster recovery.
A jumped-up Elemental,
Olympians born after the war with the Titans are noticeably less powerful than their forebears.
working in his domain,
Hephaestus' domain is smithing. As I said, it isn't magic. He's perfectly capable of making a clockwork robot in what is nearly a cave with little more than a box of scraps, given sufficient time. Magic? Not usually his thing. He would have to barter for information, and then he'd be little better at using it than a Human. Or he could outsource, but he doesn't like doing that.
with materials that he pioneered and invented,
And taught everything he knew about to Io. Io didn't have to work from first principles as he did.
is supposed to be outdone by a Lantern user and a DC scientist a couple months after he gave them access to the base materials?
Sephtian was drawing on hundreds of years of magic research done all across Atlantis. Hephaestus has none of that.
It's one thing for them to be able to fuck with shit like Dolmen Gates, which Hephaestus would have no experience with, and which is more pure magic.
This? Is stuff he literally has thousands of years experience making.
Orichalcum is orichalcum. You either get it right or you don't. Hephaestus is perfectly capable of making the armour Diana is currently wearing. It would take him longer because he can't build something to automate the chain linkages, but he could do it. Magic effects, not so much. He could repeat the ones he used on the original armour but -as I said- he lacks the theoretical understanding to modify that part of the design.
 
One thing to note, Hephaestus is an antique god. Sure, he's still in the common consciousness, so to speak, but he barely has any active worshippers as of yet, and most of his worshippers aren't tech-savvy. It's entirely possible that as he gains resurgence, his portfolio expands to all sorts of technology. However, right now, it's like assuming a retired car engineer knows all about the latest Tesla's assisted driving features.

Orichalcum is orichalcum. You either get it right or you don't.
This... seems silly. I mean sure, magic is bullshit, but it's not like steel is steel. There are loads of varieties, each differently suited for a different purpose.
Alternatively you could compare it to manufacturing microchips from silicon, and even then processors... aren't processors. Depending on the quality, they can take different amounts of heat, function at different clock rates, and sometimes get sold with different branding, if only parts of them are bad.
 
Does anyone here wonder how Paul would take Brexit?
"Huh. Okay."

He's a citizen of Themyscira who barely spends any time in the UK. It would be a nonevent for him.
@Mr Zoat: How do you take Brexit, and how does Earth-16's Europe compare to OTL?
Please don't derail as a response to this, but I voted 'leave'. Mostly because of things like this. Free trade great, free movement okay (for countries with economies on a similar level to our own at least), please stop overruling our courts.

If you wish to ask me further questions on this topic, please PM me.

Britain 16 is in a similar place, only rather than being incompetent their rulers are also evil. This will -I'm afraid- only be explored in any detail in the Renegade part of the story.
This... seems silly. I mean sure, magic is bullshit, but it's not like steel is steel. There are loads of varieties, each differently suited for a different purpose.
Okay, but orichalcum is orichalcum. It is what it is. Mess up the purity and the transmutation doesn't work. If you want different properties, try a different metal.
 
This... seems silly. I mean sure, magic is bullshit, but it's not like steel is steel. There are loads of varieties, each differently suited for a different purpose.
The difference however seems to be that while steel can be made for a number of different applications with different properties depending on the precise mix of elements in it, orichalcum in this story seems to have all properties get better the purer the base metal, with 100% pure being innately better than any other possible combination of elements prior to transmutation (at least with the properties one looks for in orichalcum). As Paul (or someone who knows the proper magic) can fairly readily get 100% pure base material, they can make orichalcum that matches the best of the material that Hephaestus can create, with the difference in final product thus falling to the craftsmanship rather than quality of the metal.

owrtho
 
He's perfectly capable of making a clockwork robot in what is nearly a cave with little more than a box of scraps, given sufficient time.
MCU Tony Stark confirmed better than Haphaestus at making robots.
Magic? Not usually his thing. He would have to barter for information, and then he'd be little better at using it than a Human. Or he could outsource, but he doesn't like doing that.
How did he do Diana's armor and braces then? Step by step instructions from Hekate or someone similar?
This... seems silly. I mean sure, magic is bullshit, but it's not like steel is steel. There are loads of varieties, each differently suited for a different purpose.
Alternatively you could compare it to manufacturing microchips from silicon, and even then processors... aren't processors. Depending on the quality, they can take different amounts of heat, function at different clock rates, and sometimes get sold with different branding, if only parts of them are bad.
It's magic. It doesn't necessarily work in the mechanistic, reductive way that we are trained to think in. There could be irreducibly complex effects that work with the base materials to produce a single material that doesn't inherit traits from the material chemistry of the impurities, aside from just being 'lesser orichalcum' with all around worse qualities.
 
MCU Tony Stark confirmed better than Haphaestus at making robots.
MCU Tony Stark actually had tonnes of advanced equipment. Stane was just exaggerating for effect.
How did he do Diana's armor and braces then? Step by step instructions from Hekate or someone similar?
I don't have a firm answer in my own mind for that. He probably did something which he wasn't supposed to.
 
Last edited:
Evilly incompetent, I suppose. They certainly don't perform their offices in the way the electorate expect them too, though they do have the mental capacity to.
 
well Hephaestus is thousands of years old, and has spent a lot of that time making high end artifacts. He's probably picked up the tools tricks and contacts for creating high end enchantments. He may well have commissioned or crafted magical foci that do the actual spell work of the enchanting for him if he provides the raw power. His nature might also let him cheat a bit when working enchantments into objects as he forges them.
 
Ok, this is drawing from main DC continuity

Power levels differ, but I honestly have never come across the piercing attack thing before.
Magic yes, but piercing attacks no.

Mainstream continuity? My understanding is that picture is from the comics for the Injustice the Regime video game, where Green Arrow can go toe to toe with Superman thanks to nanites.

Now if you want mainsteam continuity, here's Wonder Woman being shot by Devastation in the New Earth continuity-


Then here's an admission straight from the horse's mouth-



Now later in New Earth continuity Wonder Woman's durability was enhanced, because she died, achieved apotheosis, and was then exiled back to earth for the crime of interfering too much, but apparently Zeus wasn't so annoyed that he took away her Olympian invulnerability that doesn't care about things like bullets.

However, I think it's safe to say that if Wonder Woman had died and become the goddess of truth, it would have been mentioned, so while of course Zoat can do whatever he wants, there's no reason to believe that Wonder Woman is bullet proof, since no, that is not a default assumption of the character, and if that's the case in Prime Earth, well, Zoat doesn't care about Prime earth continuity.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top