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If they aren't going to go after Adom for what he did they aren't likely to go after Grayven for Darfur.
Teth Adom didn't unilaterally decide to do that.

Adom tried to work things out peacefully for months, and then under the cover of peace they allied themselves with Apocalypse a hostile to Earth alien government, invaded, and tried to kill him.

And even with all that the UN was still rather unhappy with his actions.
 
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remember, this is not mainline dc comics. Politicians are allowed to react in more than just the worst possible way. Neither the intent nor capabilities they demonstrated where particularly scary.
Also, Grayven is the Guy Who Killed Klarion. He's got a large amount of political/psychological capital from that.

I rather suspect that the general response among the political elite over him killing some genocidal leaders and ending a war is going to be approval or indifference, not running around in panic like some people are postulating.
 
I hope you meant "magic-using Ponies", otherwise this sentence has a ... mildly disturbing meaning.
Thank you, corrected.

Though... Thinking about some of the episodes on cutie marks, I have to wonder exactly who is using whom.
Ahh... teaching impressionable youth about the joys of utilitarian justice.

I don't know who that is.

I am going to read that big post a page back, but I'm probably not going to get time until this evening.
 
They probably aren't going to be given much of a choice.
China, Israel, Russia, along side various Middle East and African countries would realistically all demand he be taken out out of fear that he will do the same to them.
And this would be done because he has now shown that at any time he could arbitrarily decide a country's government is evil attack them.
Bullshit.

The world stood by and watched as Queen Beena ruled her nation by liberal application of mind control superpowers.
As in, so liberal that mind control precautions were a routine check for a lot of diplomats assigned to the region.
They did nothing official either when she attempted Grand Theft Qurac; that was stopped by superpower intervention in both Paragon and Renegade timelines.

The idea that superpower intervention in a minor conflict in Northeastern Africa will trigger any sort of censure is not supported by the known facts.
Not to mention that anyone with access to intelligence files has been well aware that any of the Green Lanterns could topple any government they so choose at the will of their bosses.
It's not exactly a new development.

It's one thing to dislike Grayven, but it shouldn't affect your actual critical thinking skills.

Now, the ethical issues behind having a tween and multiple teens do the actual work are a whole different issue.
THAT is where IMO Grayven fucked up.
Where he could do with someone like Renegade Zatanna or M'gann to slap him upside the head everytime he drifts too far into his Hard Man doing Hard Things while Hard mode of thinking.

For example, he just had Lynn do the same thing to those people that she did to her parents.
And it didn't occur to him that there might be bad associations there for his daughter.
And the idea that arming the civilians makes things better is just stupid; give it a couple weeks before they start fighting each other or raiding for food and cattle.

Nor was there any forward planning for intervention forces to keep the peace.
Entirely too much like what we saw in RL Iraq when the Americans went in; no real plan for managing the peace.
 
I would expect a phone call from the same us president that (wanted to) pardon his killing of Klarion. And if he's smart, he'll start by asking for Graven's estimate for casualties if the US military tried to stop things conventionally before offering a fig leaf of us endorsements to this and any future operations - if Graven is kind enough to propose them in advance.

"I know you don't need it, and we might not offer our endorsement every time, but it would prevent some problems, and put others off for longer than otherwise."

"And you want some way of knowing what I'm up to."

The president smiled, not even trying to hide it.

"And we want some way of knowing what you're up to."
 
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They probably aren't going to be given much of a choice.

China, Israel, Russia, along side various Middle East and African countries would realistically all demand he be taken out out of fear that he will do the same to them.

And this would be done because he has now shown that at any time he could arbitrarily decide a country's government is evil attack them.
please go back and read it again, because it explicitly said that he has physical proof of their genocide. he is not arbitrarily deciding anything.

I am going to read that big post a page back, but I'm probably not going to get time until this evening.

An Open Letter to Mr Zoat:

and mr.zoat,
good work on the latest renegade, despite what some people say, I like the si's I read to be very powerful. its just that most of the time, they don't have challenges and it gets boring. but you have managed to overcome that problem. I'm sick and tired of reading stories where the si's are "realistic" when they are just really weak in a simplistic narrative that has them fighting just people. here you have that but also include the si trying to solve actual problems.I LOVE PROACTIVE SIs. though I do agree with mr.wall of text that I found the pulling of deathnote and my little pony to be a little disturbing. were they ever part of dc? but it is a minor problem. tho misa's worship is getting seriously creepy.
another thing is, are you sure having a little girl who was experimented on and subjected to cosmic force that degrades the self, go out and kill people(even if they barely qualify to be called people) really a good idea? how does renegade paul not know that, that is [probably going to mess her up down the line. the wall of text is also right about the fact that both main pauls are big fishes now and pargonpaul should think about leaving the team behind to focus more on his efforts to save the world? or does he use them for companionship and to ground himself?

anyway good work and please continue. I cannot wait for tomorrow. I hope reneage paul heads to north korea next. there somebody there that needs to die.
 
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I'm kind of curious what the SI's rationale for not interfering in this sort of conflict is.
Quite frankly? It's the "million deaths is a statistic" thing. He might be able to go after one group or another after a personal check of this or that refugee camp, but as a whole there isn't enough emotional connection to make it a viable use of his power.

Grayven, on the other hand, has his budding Super Squad he can sic on the problem as a school project, no emotional light of any sort required.

They probably aren't going to be given much of a choice.

China, Israel, Russia, along side various Middle East and African countries would realistically all demand he be taken out out of fear that he will do the same to them.

And this would be done because he has now shown that at any time he could arbitrarily decide a country's government is evil attack them.
Lessee here...
China is on good terms with Grayven.
Israel doesn't have any reason to be concerned about Grayven.
Tsar Vladimir of All the Russias would probably call him up to discuss it personally while wrestling bears.
And the little countries that are run by tin-pot dictators with delusions of godhood would be told exactly where they could stick their complaints, very diplomatically.
 
Why did they have to _kill_ anyone except the magic using baddie? Couldn't they have easily kidnapped and imprisoned the other genocide leaders in a secret private prison that Graven can ward and hide with Apokolyptian tech and Shimmer's magic and such, and keep managed by drones or something?

Edit: Perhaps better possible prison managers might be the Genomorphs...
 
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Why did they have to _kill_ anyone except the magic using baddie? Couldn't they have easily kidnapped and imprisoned the other genocide leaders in a secret private prison that Graven can ward and hide with Apokolyptian tech and Shimmer's magic and such, and keep managed by drones or something?

Edit: Perhaps better possible prison managers might be the Genomorphs...
They didn't have to; most of the people there were normals, and they can be neutralized non-lethally.
But if you re-read the update, one of Grayven's explicit goals was to, and I quote:
That's the first time Lynne's spoken in this debriefing. I feel a little concern as I carefully watch her, trying to work out how she feels about that. Obviously I want her to be able to kill people if she decides that it is the appropriate response, but I also want her not to be afraid of her own abilities.
And we already know that Grayven is entirely comfortable with lethal force.
So you will see his biases coloring precisely how his wards would operate.
 
On the ''too proactive'' criticism, there's something too it. On phone, but how many people are that proactive in their every day life? Additionally, his proactivity comes at the cost of other characters (apparent) agency.

Also, SpaceBattles competence is on full display.
 
Mr Zoat said:
"You know… Now I think about it…" Miss Shimmer taps her chin with her right forefinger. "The same thing happens in Equestria. I read up on dozens of ancient evils that Princess Celestia banished or imprisoned, but I don't remember anything about her flat out killing any of them. Which means that eventually they're going to get out. And given that they were bad enough to make Celestia angry enough to do that in the first place… They'll just go back to whatever they were doing. Hurting more Ponies. Which means that the whole thing was pointless. Huh." Her gaze grows a little distant, a small frown creasing her brow. "When I go back, I'll have to ask her about that."

I give her a stern look. "Aaaaah?"

"Oh. Um. And.. try to.. kill them myself?"

I nod. "Better."

This is the best part of the update. I like the style here.
 
The last character I cared about was Zatanna and even that has gotten tiresome. She depends on the SI for far too much and her role hovers on a boundary between pitiful and disgusting. Does anyone else care about the fact that this girl is effectively an orphan? Have the other Super-Orphans (I can recall a few in the original seven: Batman, Superman and Flash. There's probably more in the expanded League.) bothered checking in on her, talking to her, trying to help her cope with the fact that her father's colleagues, the heroes of her world, have not only allowed his kidnapper to go unpunished, but they've also let the bastard into their club? I guess not.

I don't understand the point you are trying to make here.

The current League members voted unanimously to have Fate join the League. They all explicitly approved the current situation with an ancient lich possessing her father's body. Why... how could she believe or accept any comfort coming from them?
 
If the SI had a home city and it got destroyed, he'd wave his hand and it'd be back to normal, probably with compensation for everyone's property as well as free ice cream and puppies for the children.

That kind of happened with Shiruta and it was not an ice cream and puppies outcome. Thousands of people murdered, and they're not coming back. Democracy for Kahndaq suffered a major setback.

The very worst possible outcome was avoided by Captain Marvel's last second reveal, but that was a close thing too. If Teth Adom went too far down the road of turning all who oppose him into meat paste... well, that would be bad for all concerned.
 
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I don't understand the point you are trying to make here.

The current League members voted unanimously to have Fate join the League. They all explicitly approved the current situation with an ancient lich possessing her father's body. Why... how could she believe or accept any comfort coming from them?

Any number of ways. I'm sure that someone who wasn't seemingly convinced that Fate's name was Lucifer "Nabu" Morningstar would be able to think of at least some.

1. "We need to keep an eye on him because-
  1. -we don't want him wandering off with your father's body to fight demons or something and potentially getting him hurt. Fate was willing to join, which in itself indicates that he acknowledges that he can't survive single-handedly, so at least now we can be certain of your father's physical well being."
  2. -we don't exactly trust him, seeing as he's possessing someone, but we have no way of containing him at the moment. The only way to make sure he doesn't do anything worse is to get him to join on."
  3. -he could eventually be convinced to let your father go, but only if he's present to be convinced."
2. "Yes, well the League has no possible way of solving this situation with any kind of Justice right now, and seeing as this entire thing is kind of completely your fault, its rather unreasonable for you to be mad at me about it."
Jamie, you don't need me to tell you why this one is tactless.
Fine, but you know it's true.
3. "Before he sacrificed himself to save the world*, your father was a good man and a dear friend of mine. He entrusted me to ensure your wellbeing in his absence. If you don't want to talk to me a right now, I will understand that, but know that I will always be here for you if you need me."​



This is just what comes to the top of my head. To circle back to the point, I'd say that the argument that 'this is a weakness in the writing' is a valid criticism.

*Not technically accurate; Zatanna sacrificed herself to save the world, G. Zatara only sacrificed himself to save her. However, as my Editor kindly reminds me, pointing out that Zatanna has nobody to be mad at but herself would be tactless.
 
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Were they ever part of dc?
Not to the best of my knowledge. Though Star Trek has crossed over with both Marvel and DC.
tho misa's worship is getting seriously creepy.
It's supposed to be.
another thing is, are you sure having a little girl who was experimented on and subjected to cosmic force that degrades the self, go out and kill people(even if they barely qualify to be called people) really a good idea? how does renegade paul not know that, that is [probably going to mess her up down the line.
Sure? No. But his reasoning is that she was already at maximum messed upness. His view is that after being as thoroughly Anti-Lifed as she was she simply can't ever have a normal childhood, even if -given her abilities- it was safe to try to give her one. She's simply been through too much, and is too powerful and too dangerous. He believes that showing her what good can be done with her powers, uncontrolled and destructive as they are at present, is a good way to encourage her to be a responsible goddess in future.

Is he right? Eeeeerrrr. Maybe? His way will produce a particular outcome and Lynne is by this point a fairly resilient soul. It is unlikely to harm her, though it will lead to her having an atypical view on the utility of violence for the purposes of conflict resolution.

The SI ends up in a similar situation during canon series 2 and handles it the opposite way, isolating his charge from 'weiredness' as much as possible in favour of giving her as close to a normal childhood as possible. That isn't exactly a complete success either.
the wall of text is also right about the fact that both main pauls are big fishes now and pargonpaul should think about leaving the team behind to focus more on his efforts to save the world? or does he use them for companionship and to ground himself?
If it wasn't for the Nabu matter, the SI would receive and accept an invitation to join the League once his year was up. As it is... Brace for interesting times.
anyway good work and please continue. I cannot wait for tomorrow. I hope reneage paul heads to north korea next. there somebody there that needs to die.
North Korea doesn't exist on Earth 16. My version of North Rhelasia is more like Burma, not exactly a fun place to live but not aything like North Korean level.
 
19th April
10:34 GMT -6
Yeah, getting board of the 'righteous face punchers are useless' speeches.

Nice debrief though.

Shame the 'refugees' they armed are almost certainly going to turn into a giant lynch mob. These are very angry, often traumatised, people with legitimate reasons to hate people who no longer have guns. I foresee a lot of score settling in the near future. That is the good ending of course. The bad ending is those newly armed people deciding they don't want whatever settlement is about to be rammed down their throats and resist.
Both of these are possibilities are going to be exacerbated by the lack of anyone taking credit for it. This will lead many to conclude that it was a miracle in the literal sense and that them being given guns is a sign of divine favour. Thus giving them an unquestionable mandate to do whatever they want.

A for effort. C for execution.
…D for style.

"I welded a knife onto one of your drones and made it fly into him at the speed of sound."
"I used the drone's purple death ray on Ahmed Haroun
Rather harder to Love and Tolerate when you don't have a variably-lethal god-smiting artefact.

I read up on dozens of ancient evils that Princess Celestia banished or imprisoned, but I don't remember anything about her flat out killing any of them.
In fairness a significant proportion of the things she imprisoned/banished are not even alive in the conventional sense. It is entirely possible that 'turned to stone' is as close to dead as Discord can get.

I'm kind of curious what the SI's rationale for not interfering in this sort of conflict is.
Keep in mind that Grayven's rational for interfering was 'my girls need practice'.
 
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Wonder what this fic would be like if it were an ensemble fic? To reflect the show.

Basically, the main POV is still Paul, but we get regular cuts to other members of the Team from their perspective, to see what they're doing/thinking/feeling. Maybe something like 3-4 updates per episode devoted to other characters.
 
If it wasn't for the Nabu matter, the SI would receive and accept an invitation to join the League once his year was up. As it is... Brace for interesting times.
Any chance I could convince you of the utility of mini time skipping a month here or there? It's fairly clear that there's a need for the greater threats of the wider galaxy to provide proper challenges at the current power level, and it seems a reasonable way to make that happen.
 
"When I go back, I'll have to ask her about that."
I give her a stern look. "Aaaaah?"
"Oh. Um. And.. try to.. kill them myself?"
"So how come you're Human?"
"The stupid portal turned me into one. I just hope it turns me back when I go through again."
Semi-OT: What will Sunset Shimmer be the Alicorn/NewGoddess of?

As a conceptual compliment to Miss Ayame's death and Grayven's conquest, I was thinking Sunset Shimmer could be a "liminal guardian" who embodies Change similar to Janus* the Greek god of beginnings and endings, transitions, doorways, and passages. She has two faces (one human and one pony), a connection to portals (the Crystal Mirror), underwent a literal and metaphorical transformation, and she "walks in two worlds yet belongs to neither".

This could also be a metaphor of adolescence since ponykind lives in perpetual childhood and defer to Celestia as a mother figure.

*Janus and Eris: "CHAOS!!! "

Link: Liminal being - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Link: Liminal deity - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 
Wonder what this fic would be like if it were an ensemble fic? To reflect the show.

Basically, the main POV is still Paul, but we get regular cuts to other members of the Team from their perspective, to see what they're doing/thinking/feeling. Maybe something like 3-4 updates per episode devoted to other characters.
I don't think Zoat can do that + SI and Renegade...

Let's put it on vote

[X] SI + Ensemble
[X] Renegade + Ensemble
[X] SI + Another Lantern
[X] Another Lantern + Ensemble
[X] Upload copies of Zoat's mind to his spare clone bodies
 
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