Meguca Micro Empire Quest (PMMM)

What should I do regarding a change in system?

  • Notgreat's proposed simplification of hunting, leave rest intact.

    Votes: 5 55.6%
  • Chapter system vastly simplifying everything.

    Votes: 4 44.4%

  • Total voters
    9
  • Poll closed .
Except that we can't do it in 3 months because we'll have school.

Actually, won't we be between school terms in three months? Japanese schools years start in... April? March? So three to four months.

Maybe target the school break, masquerade it as the junior trip overseas before buckling down for the senior year. I think that's actually a thing in Japan.
 
Okay. Does that x3 cost for tandem cast apply to both GCU cost and meguca cost? Or is the GCU cost x2, and the meguca cost x3?
Both.
More like, if he's not not involved.
"This outcome is a normal scenario following collapse of Contracted population."

However, there are simply too many variables and too many unknowns to come up with a solid answer (not to mention that the tactics used by the Tokyo girls have changed over time). I tried the model it with a bunch of different numbers and the most I can say is that there are some conditions where chipping away at the demons from the outside can solve the problem and other conditions where it merely prevents the problem from getting worse. There are some conditions where the contracting rate is primary and others where it is negligible. Ugh. I need better numbers to work with.
This really isn't something meant to be closely modeled, there's so much complexity to it that you'd need to do some economic statistics regression just to build something close. I don't even have a model, I just do it by feel.

Basically, To The Stars was Tutorial Mode compared to MMEQ.
Yup that's the general idea.

Now, now, no need for player grief-spiraling. We still have several options.
This.

@inverted_helix

Would you be willing to count the "interviews" with Mary Hopkins as omakes?
I might threadmark them because they're amusing, but they're awfully meta to count as omakes.

"Thank you sir, may I just say: Today is a good day to die!"

"Sigh... at least you have the right attitude for a PMMM quest."
lol

@inverted_helix what would it take to get Homura's location? I imagine the info should be cheap, if not free, given this whole Class 3 apocalypse is costing dozens if not hundreds of cubes per month in lost productivity.
He'll give you her location for free, but you getting to her is still up to you.
 
A 40~50 cube city, comparable to us. Even if they control their whole prefecture, they still have only ~100 cubes of territory. Certainly not enough to challenge Nagoya.

Kagawa/Okayama area,
Supports ~150. Could maybe compete with the city itself, if for some reason they had NO territory outside Nagoya and Kagawa/Okayama was united.
Nagasaki/Saga/Kumamoto area
How the hell would three whole prefectures unite? Even if they did, they wouldn't even match half the population of Aichi prefecture.
Population density of 66.4/km2​. There is no way in hell this whole place has been united.
Tiny at max ~120.
Outright smaller than us.

The only sane equivalent here seems to be Osaka/Kyoto.
Important Rule: Keep the Mind Screw Powers far away from us.
And serena AGREES with that rule. She is putting considerable effort into protecting people from her power when she could just settle down and enjoy the adoration. What exactly do you think she is going to do to us?


Anyway, now that you are on, @inverted_helix , could you tell us what Nagoya says it's plans for Tokyo are? Or would we have to spend an action to find out?
 
Analysis of differences between Kinematics plan and mine:

I have 1 vet left over to assign, Kinematics has 0.5 vets.

EDIT: I have assigned that 1 vet to creating 200 barrier charms (-1% risk) to stockpile for now.

Kinematics has grief management and I do not:

Grief Use Tracking/Management (1.5 vets)
Cost: 1 Veteran per 40 Meguca; Reward: Meguca upkeep GCU cost reduced 5%

This means he is training less girls than I in Tandem casting. (Also, Kinematics, you made a math error here, it costs 1.75 vets to train that many girls, you'll need to drop one girl from training).
Tandem Casting Training: Now that you've deciphered how to combine two girls magic for greater effect they have to be taught it.
Cost: 1 Veteran per 4 girls trained in the task.
- Healer: 2
- Teleporter: 2 (Seto + other)
- Stealth: 2 (Kyouko + other)
- Clairvoyant: 2 (Taya + other)
- Barrier: 2

- 1.0 elite = Taya, Kyouko, 2x Seto participation (mitigate penalty for training in nomadic area)
- 1.5 vets

As said, I am training 4 additional girls in Tandem casting. One other difference is that I skew heavily towards barrier and teleporters. Completely training all our teleporters and barrier girls in tandem casting. However, this means I train no more healers beyond the two we already have.

Tandem Casting Training: Now that you've deciphered how to combine two girls magic for greater effect they have to be taught it.
Cost: 1 Veteran per 4 girls trained in the task.
- Teleporter: 4 (Seto + other)
- Stealth: 2 (Kyouko + other)
- Clairvoyant: 2 (Taya + other)
- Barrier: 5

- 1.0 elite = Taya, Kyouko, 2x Seto participation (mitigate penalty for training in nomadic area)
- 2.5 vets

Other difference is Kyubey questions:

Discussion with Kyuubey about certain concerns.

Ask whether the Hong Kong epidemic is due to a collapse in demon strength due to a lack of magical girls to hunt that area.

If so, ask whether he can assist in making contact with one of the head investigative doctors in the area (how much?).

If so:
Hong Kong Contact: Have Mami (with Hainako as translator) attempt to convince one of the lead investigative doctors in Hong Kong to attempt an experiment: Move one or two individuals who are currently infected to an isolated rural quarantine zone on the mainland, well away from Hong Kong, and monitor them for progression of the disease. A collection of (unrelated) research Mami has been working on indicated that the locality issue of the disease may be far more significant that previously assumed. It may be possible to force the disease to non-lethal levels by removing the patient from the Hong Kong environment. Make every effort to convince him to at least try.
Cost: Finding contact? Kyuubey assist? Cover persona for Mami? (?? vets/cubes)


Kyuubey

Have a chat with Kyuubey about concerns that have arisen over the Tokyo issue.

Discuss possible solutions. Get the dossiers on Class 4 Contracted (Legendary Girls). Ask for the contact information of all the large magical girl organizations in Japan (we already have Nagoya). Ask for the contact information for girls in the Tokyo area (so we could send useful tools to aid them). Ask for information on general demon strength levels in Tokyo city, the number of class 3 demons, and the number of surviving magical girls - so that we can more accurately estimate both the cost of cleaning up the class 3 demons, and the cost of stabilizing the area after cleanup. (How much will this cost us?)

Also, this is the new fluff I came up with. What do you think Kinematics?
Fluff

With recent training events, and a warning from Kyuubey, you let the girls know that you'll be taking measures to keep the masquerade risks to a minimum for a while. Tandem training is going to be moved out to the nomadic area to the north so that any fancy displays of magic are unlikely to be seen.

With the recent influx of money from Nagoya, we now have enough money for some more expensive purchases to facilitate the storage of magic charms to further increase safety. Additionally, one of our long-term goals has begun moving within reach: Purchasing a central base that will provide privacy and security for our organization over the long run.

The easiest way to achieve this is by buying Kyouko's family church.

Located in southern Kasimono, the church itself is a beautiful old-style building, and will be a great benefit for the group. In addition to providing a new housing location, so that people can be moved out of apartments, it's on private property that will allow the group to do serious magical training without the worries of being seen and breaking the masquerade. Also, the main chapel is large enough that gatherings for the entire group can easily be held there.

Between this goal and the large purchases for charm storage, we will not be able to expend additional money on more personal items, however you hope they'll look forward to when we have a place that we can truly call our own.
 
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Um... didn't the bunny cat warn us that we are straining the masquerade? I don't see anything addressing that issue.

Yes, and we asked why, and it was due to Tandem Casting Training and Fun With Magic. So no Fun With Magic this turn, and we moved the Tandem Casting Training out to the Nomadic area.

How the hell would three whole prefectures unite? Even if they did, they wouldn't even match half the population of Aichi prefecture.

Look at the map, they are a single metropolitan area with the boundaries of the various cities running over into each other. You think meguca boundaries are going to care about lines on a map?

Population density of 66.4/km2. There is no way in hell this whole place has been united.

Not sure why low population density would prevent unification. In fact it might help, since organizations won't grow so quickly and will be spread out more evenly. Might be a bit more of a coalition than a monarchy, but I don't see why that would bother us.

The only sane equivalent here seems to be Osaka/Kyoto.

Except we don't need an equivalent when we got 3 to 5 other areas all 2/3rds to 1/2 the size of Nagoya. That's what balance of power means. So basically Nagoya will be Spain in the 17th Century, Osaka will be France, we will be the Dutch, Nagasaki will be Sweden, Kagawa will be England, Sendai will be Saxony, Miigata Austria, and Hokkiado can be Russia. If we can just avoid the 30 years war we'll be fine!

Plus, as you say, Osaka is equivalent, and likely a natural rival of Nagoya.

And serena AGREES with that rule. She is putting considerable effort into protecting people from her power when she could just settle down and enjoy the adoration. What exactly do you think she is going to do to us?

And we should respect Serena's wise decision and not bother her.
 
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Third, you are absolutely crazy to send a single Elite and Vet off into the wild unknown. That's a good way to get ganked by the local megucas.

Minimum we need at least Mami and 4 additional vets to act as bodyguards. That doesn't even really seem safe to me, but that is the minimum.

So that's 0.5 Mami, 2 vets, and probably a cost of around $10,000 (wild guesstimate). And that comes with risk of Mami being killed by foreign megucas. This is not a cheap Hail Mary. It would require giving up scouting Kofu completely.
Okay, on one hand you're right about the cost being more: even if you can find cheap, decent hotels, food, translators, etc. in South Africa, the flight alone costs around $900 per person, round trip, so estimate of $1250-1500 per person for this trip seems more accurate. You're also right that Hainako probably isn't necessary; at the very least it'd be cheaper to just call her on the phone if we need someone to translate Afrikaans to Japanese and haven't hired someone yet.

On the other hand, Kyubey almost certainly has accurate intel on Homura's location, so it's likely only an issue of travel time to get to her and back, and I really really doubt we're going to be bushwhacked by South African megucas when we're passing through. Although I guess that depends on how @inverted_helix has adjusted the scouting rules; from what I remember the previous rules with their 30% chance of an un-transformed meguca being detected was considered wildly high and has since been lowered by a lot.

If we are going to do this, I think in 3 months is the best bet in resources wise. (Since I expect an extra hunting cost next month). It would also give us a chance to find out what other organizations are doing, and see if any of them want to participate in this petition to Homura as well.

(Plus at that point we could take some charms along, and Mami could see about selling them to the local meguca and so plan the seeds for a possible export business in the future, that way the trip won't be a total loss.)
Do we even have three months? Tokyo just lost a fuckton of Elite level megucas to Class 3 demons:
Original Class 3 demons typically arise from extreme overhunting as you have surmised. However when they have consumed enough Contracted they are able to split. This divides the powers possessed by the progenitor and therefore reduces the individual threat of the offspring. In some cases they do not split and eventually reach Class 4 status when they have consumed enough Contracted. It is not clear what dictates whether they split or simply continue to accumulate power. Feeding off of humans alone can sustain Class 3 and Class 4 demons in sufficient numbers, but cannot allow them to gain power or replicate. If human population is diminished it can cause them to starve.
I don't think it's unreasonable to assume we're about to have either a mass-meiosis event on our hands... or a Class 4. In either case, 3 months is an eternity away; if we haven't called in a Legendary by then, it'll probably be too late.
 
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Not sure why low population density would prevent unification. In fact it might help, since organizations won't grow so quickly and will be spread out more evenly. Might be a bit more of a coalition than a monarchy, but I don't see why that would bother us.
You answer your own question; organizations won't grow as quickly. Thus, it will take longer to unify.

In general, you assume here that all those areas are unified, when, despite our incredible luck over here, our area is quite definitely not.
And we should respect Serena's wise decision and not bother her.
And we are back to knee jerk rejection. I understand that, at first glance, her power is disturbing, but we really do not have the leeway for bias here.
 
And we are back to knee jerk rejection. I understand that, at first glance, her power is disturbing, but we really do not have the leeway for bias here.
My concern is that our meguca would have to spend significant time around her in the effort to deal with Tokyo's Class 3 Demon infestation. Good chance of losing at least a few of our Vets to her power.
 
From what I read, Serena as I understand it basically makes every girl under her power totally immune to grief buildup. Imagine for a moment how stupid Mami could be if she could just repeatedly do Tiro Finale every second of a fight, and then apply a toned-down version of that to every girl she's with. Even if she's only got two or three girls, that's two or three girls who are perma-casting their best spells the entire fight, a teleporter or barrier user... even a healer of the right type would have better regeneration than a class 3.
 
Anyway, now that you are on, @inverted_helix , could you tell us what Nagoya says it's plans for Tokyo are? Or would we have to spend an action to find out?
Would you believe them regardless?
This can be read so many different ways it's basically white noise for all the information it conveys.

Good work Helix.
Yup.

@inverted_helix has adjusted the scouting rules; from what I remember the previous rules with their 30% chance of an un-transformed meguca being detected was considered wildly high and has since been lowered by a lot.
I actually changed mechanics to make more sense of meguca being detected.
 
In general, you assume here that all those areas are unified, when, despite our incredible luck over here, our area is quite definitely not.

No, I assume that at least half of all these different areas are unified sufficiently to make them a major player. That would give us enough to get a 5 way division of Tokyo, and make balance of power possible.

Would you believe them regardless?

Well, interperting their lies would at least be entertaining!

Actually, I'd be very interested to hear what they have to say. Probably beleive 80% and take the rest with a grain of salt.
 
It's also an unacceptable answer IC.

"Kyubey, your insistence on giving a cute little Faerie non-answer is hindering our ability to deal with a mess that, ultimately, is the fault of you, your people, and your inability to quickly adapt to new information. You can pretend to blame the megucas for the outbreak of Class 3s, but if there is a group out there with access to enough information to have prevented this situation in the first place it's not the teenaged girls whom you hoodwinked into making a contract, all the while disclosing the minimum amount of information possible.

"This crisis is a direct result of the Incubators' decision to play Faerie Queen and not disclose necessary and important information; the solution is to not persist in making the same mistakes multiple times. I'm asking you the first of many questions that I need to know to hopefully think of a fix to this mess: is the plague currently hitting Hong Kong an engineered Incubator plague, or the result of low DS causing a localized mass extinction of the human population?"

@TheEyes, have you gotten to a computer yet?
Yes. Trying to adapt a vote now, but I keep falling asleep standing up. I might need to try this in the morning. And then there's:
I actually changed mechanics to make more sense of meguca being detected.
If detection is the default, then traveling possibly could be as dangerous as @Elder Haman supposes, which means we'd need an escort, and all that entails: more money, more risk, maybe the need to bring Taya along to scry for people, tandem stealth specialists, ugh. Kofu would definitely be out; we'd lose a few trade deals maybe too. Might not be worth it after all.

We might have to roll the dice and hope the situation in Tokyo can hold for three or four months; I'm not sure anymore.
Probably, I think we got an estimate of 6 months.
All we got was a vague "months":
Some are suggesting it may only be months before the only ones left are new recruits.
I think six was a number that we in the echo chamber came up with arbitrarily; unfortunately unless Kyubey decides to stop making things worse by playing at being a Faerie Queen while the forest is burning down I doubt we'll be getting more precise numbers.
 
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Imagine for a moment how stupid Mami could be if she could just repeatedly do Tiro Finale every second of a fight, and then apply a toned-down version of that to every girl she's with. Even if she's only got two or three girls, that's two or three girls who are perma-casting their best spells the entire fight
Pretty much.

Depends. I certainly wouldn't expect them to tell us about their plan to bring us all underneath their boots, but if they actually have some kind of idea about how to keep this disaster from reoccurring, then it would be a good idea to hear them out.
Well, interperting their lies would at least be entertaining!

Actually, I'd be very interested to hear what they have to say. Probably beleive 80% and take the rest with a grain of salt.
Hmm now I have to put some effort to composing their reply.

Their current plans for Tokyo essentially aren't highly developed: they are barely slowing down Tokyo's deterioration. They haven't planned much for it being cleared because it seems unlikely. If they somehow managed to clear it they'd probably want to control the area, but there's not that much thought put into it. At best their current goal is to make the Class 3 demons head the opposite direction when they finish with Tokyo.
 
It would not be a heavy penalty. It's like the US Senate: 2 senators per state, no matter what the state's population.
True, but states also have representatives based on the state's size. Democracy (and common sense) require that larger organizations have more representation than smaller states. The small states still have a voice (and that minority voice is important), but it's still a minority.

And merging gets them benefits such as more efficient support (thus more free total meguca), ease of 'crop rotation' to go with rotating tactics, two elites working for the same group, and just a general stronger group as a whole. The council member restriction is to make sure that that extra power and strength doesn't translate into unbalanced influence of the political process.
All of these benefits would also be available to groups who "ally" without officially "merging". Unless there are benefits to officially merging which go along with the penalties, then people will simply do what they want and call it something else in order to avoid the penalties.

Why would you think not, given the threat the class 3 demons represent? Pretty much all groups directly adjacent to Tokyo are at risk, so they'd all be interested in making sure that didn't happen again. And the cost is only one meguca per group.
Err. Sending one meguca to Tokyo to vote in council meetings is not where the cost comes from... You have to train all of the girls in Tokyo how to operate an organization efficiently. You have to create all these new organizational structures and force people to move around. You have to come up with a system of rules that allows things to work. And you have to convince everyone else to go along with it. These things are (potentially) doable, but they're quite expensive in terms of time and I can't really see any groups who are less optimistic than the Serene being willing to pay that cost. Some groups might promise to pay that cost if it means that the incubators will send their pet Legendary to clean things up Tokyo, but putting the rubber to the road is where they'd start to flake.

We 'can' tax the Tokyo area. Say, 2 cubes per councilor, maybe up to 10 groups surrounding Tokyo, means an effective tax of 0.5 cubes per m-ward. There would likely be rebellion against anything higher than that, though.

However I'd think the greater benefit would be to have a hand in the growing trade market of a city the size of Tokyo. Buy or sell meguca time from the various m-wards for services like training or equipment or research assistants, or just expanding/franchising a business. How about 40 branches of our restaurant throughout Tokyo, with a franchise fee of just $1000 per month?
These sorts of benefits are more of how we might sell the plan to other groups. But many of the benefits are outside of anything that most of them have experienced, so it would be a hard sell. I'm not sure exactly how difficult it would be to create a whole magical economy from scratch (even if girls have some idea of how economies work from the real world), but I imagine that this would be rather difficult.

Actually, it's more important the that balancer be flexible and mobile. Historically the balancer position in Europe was played by Great Britain. Britain propaganda aside, Britain was almost always the weakest or 2nd weakest great power in Europe (in pure military power, and certainly in demographics).

Their advantage was due to first, geography providing them a shield against retaliatory attacks; and second, a superior tech/trade/financial system.
These are quite potent strengths. Britain's technology level and industry and trade meant that (despite their smaller size) they were a strong nation at any point after (say) the Norman conquest. But these are strengths that we simply do not have. Other more aggressive groups doubtless have more cubes (due to being able to claim land by conquest and kick out the girls who were there before and not accepting any refugees or new contractees unless the labor is desired). And they probably have better tech due to cube surpluses. And they probably have better finances due to accepting a certain level of criminal activity. These advantages come with proportionate disadvantages which will doom those organizations to failure eventually (only to be replaced by other similar organizations), but any large organizations that currently exist are (almost invariably) going to be stronger than us. Our strategies are designed for long term stability and we have the potential to outlast any of them and eventually build an organization that is stronger than they could ever hope to be. But that takes time and right now we're still a little fish in a big pond.

Historically, Great Britain was the least populated, and not extremely powerful in their military. Nor did Great Britain have allies - they were even proud of it. They made allies as needed, based on appeals to the interests of the other party, not based on historical alliances. Historically Britain was an enemy of Russia and France, and an ally to Germany. But when the balance of power shifted, Britain easily switched sides.
Great Britain was not able to balance Europe without allies; they were able to balance Europe by not having permanent allies and switching allies frequently as needs must (while relying on the Sea to protect them from direct retaliation). As things currently stand, we don't have any allies. To be sure, we ought to rectify that problem if we're going to be dealing with the groups of Japan at large, but as things stand we have no business trying to be a power balancer.

Serena comes with her own group of meguca by default. She's a giant lure for any class 3's.
I could see this plan working. But do remember that Tokyo Bay is far from deserted. Serena can't just park her (shiny new) boat there indefinitely, she'd still be forced to operate under a timescale of a few days. But hey, maybe that would be long enough.

On the other hand, with our tech and logistics focus, we will very much "win the peace" compared to the other, larger groups, who will likely continue to squabble even after Tokyo is stabilized. It is in this environment that we can start making solid gains, absorbing neighbor groups and showing them a different, better way to be a group of megucas.
Sure, it's quite possible for us to "win the peace". But in order to get the incubators to agree to send Kei, we would have to first have a workable plan to stabilize Tokyo. What you are describing is not a "workable plan" but merely us sweeping up the pieces after a disaster.
 
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Seeking an Angel Investor (0.5 Hainako, 0.5 Mami, $1,000, ?? cubes) - Kyubey gave you a set of dossiers for "available" Legendary-level magical girls. One of them, "Akemi Homura," is Japanese, has a powerset that isn't highly corrosive (poor Serena), and isn't a tool of the Incubators, with all the attendant baggage, like Kesi. Perhaps she would be willing to help save her home country from orbital bombardment by the Incubators?

Bribe Kyubey what it takes to get Akemi Homura's location. Fly there during the winter break from school, track her down, and try to appeal to her to come to Japan to help us save the country from being devastated by Class 3s, and then possibly destroyed by the Incubators as a "protective measure".
You know what would be way cheaper and easier than this (and not much less likely to work): giving Homura a phone call. She may not have a cellphone herself, but we could easily call a phone near her and ask to speak with her (or have Kyuubey drop a cell phone on the path in front of her, if need be).
 
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