Traveller, The Rise of Empire: A Naval Design, Procurement and Command Quest
- Thread starter 4WheelSword
- Start date
- Original Art Quest Sci-Fi
Perhaps. We ought to consider contracting the Steenbeck Security Industries to experiment on and develop reliable tight-beam variants of their products. As soon as we get an update with choosing research options.
This post is sponsored by the Steenbeck Security Industries, your trusted weapons procurement partner.
4WheelSword
The original N-body Problem
- Pronouns
- It/She/They
I really do want you to get some research at some point.
Doubloon
Quelle horreur!
Military-Industrial Complex? I find it quite simple.
If I may ask a question as well; is there anywhere in your notes that keeps track of our total construction expenses by year? The amount Home spends on upkeep is really small compared to the total budget, and I'm curious if we've ever come close to exceeding it.
So seriously, do people have any thoughts about what's going on with the Daughters of the People?
That was, uh, real weird them just showing up like that in the middle of tense diplomatic negotiations. We don't have a lot of leverage to do anything about them. That's not our job. But it sure was unnerving.
I wonder if maybe as a write-in we should start including some greater internal security measures on future ships. I'd be willing to sacrifice a ton here or there to make sure that we don't end up with the Service set against itself in a future civil war.
That was, uh, real weird them just showing up like that in the middle of tense diplomatic negotiations. We don't have a lot of leverage to do anything about them. That's not our job. But it sure was unnerving.
I wonder if maybe as a write-in we should start including some greater internal security measures on future ships. I'd be willing to sacrifice a ton here or there to make sure that we don't end up with the Service set against itself in a future civil war.
4WheelSword
The original N-body Problem
- Pronouns
- It/She/They
Not even slightly. Right now, you barely have the construction capacity to reach it. Buying the monitor cost uhhhh a third? of your annual budget.
Doubloon
Quelle horreur!
They really just gave us the vault and told us to go wild, huh? Still, hell of a price tag.
Well, reviewing what we know about them...
- They're dominant in certain regions, but not for the overall population of Home.
- They have a tense (countercultural?) but apparently non-violent relationship with the government.
- Headed by a figure who commands both spiritual and political authority.
I'm curious who their messiah is and what they actually want from the government, because I wonder if space Mormon::space Fed could hold up as well as regular Mormon::regular Fed does.
- Location
- Here, there, everywhere.
My opinion is I'm not willing to jeopardize our current oligarchic but quite mediocre government in favor of one influenced by religion, at least the market makes sense.
Coyote Niff
the most transbian obligate scavenger on the 'net!
- Location
- Misery!
- Pronouns
- She/Her
>"at least the market makes sense"
look into my eyes and tell me that again. [^•_•^]
It's unclear to me that their messiah is currently a living biological human being.
envision a future for Home which is led by a messianic figure
This reads more to me like the messiah is expected to appear in the future as a fulfillment of prophecy thing.
Doubloon
Quelle horreur!
Well, there's this:
I'm not gonna say I'm not concerned by all this, but I guess we'll see where it goes? They don't command majority appeal and apparently a lot of people are more in it for the philosophy than the prophecy.
- Location
- Here, there, everywhere.
At least the market makes sense.
[X] Ensign 2
-[X] Modified:
--[X] 1
Or perhaps with the black hexagon expanded out to provide a backfield.
Certainly I don't see how calling them "Space Mormons" makes them sound less subversive.
-[X] Modified:
--[X] 1
Or perhaps with the black hexagon expanded out to provide a backfield.
IMO that makes it worse, like a flexible vehicle with vague beliefs beyond giving the leader ever more power.
Certainly I don't see how calling them "Space Mormons" makes them sound less subversive.
How many rounds of combat with a meaningful opponent is a ship like that likely to survive?
Could this be tweaked so that they pause to scan ahead before jumping into unknown space? Or do they do that by default?[X] Ensign 2
-[X] Modified:
or
[X] Plan 4+5
-[X] HSWS Aditi and HSWS Tishtrya always jump in tandem. In case of unexpected calamity one of them is meant to reach Home with the news.
-[X] Blue Lines represent standard 4-jump exploration routes for Deep Space Surveyors.
-[X] Yellow-Green Lines represent 5-jump exploration routes for Deep Space Surverors. Beforehand, Interstellar Surveyors jump in to confirm whether the yellow jumps are safe for exploration team. Then HSWS Aditi and HSWS Tishtrya (both with full tanks), HSLS Lakapati and two Insterstellar Cruisers jump through the yellow route. HSWS Aditi and HSWS Tishtrya resupply and continue jumping green routes. HSLS Lakapati recovers empty drop pods and jumps back with its escorts.
-[X] Priotize the southern route. Afterwards, prioritize S'taxu routes. Continue jumps as the availability of HSLS Lakapati and Deep Hope infrastructure permits. Use Interstellar Surveryors to follow up on interesting finds (suitable for their mining drones and labs) or explore remaining light hexes.
The above plan is conservative, but still saves on time by utilizing 5-long jumps.
EDIT: @4WheelSword S'taxu has no refuelling symbol? How long until refuelling options for Deep Hope become available?
Yeah, with no pre-established mythos or moral codes there's nothing preventing them from just tailoring their message for popular appeal.
I think that happens at the same time the current hex is being explored.
Presumably they do have something but... the vibe seems very new-agey. And it's very likely I'm seeing them through a lens tinted with a lot of baggage of my own since we haven't really been told much in specific about their beliefs or philosophies.
But the messianic leader destined to bring us to glory and blessed by a non-specific cosmic blessing-giving entity is super mega ultra sus.
Edit: at least if that figure is currently leading them. The wording is unclear. A prophesied divine leader who'll lead Home to its rightful place of power among the stars is still a problem, just a different kind.
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4WheelSword
The original N-body Problem
- Pronouns
- It/She/They
The messianic figure is currently alive and well.
0t4n1z3r019
Member of the HAFPTG
- Location
- Philippines
Lisan al-Gaib!
4-2: Space Out There
4WheelSword
The original N-body Problem
- Pronouns
- It/She/They
Which of the above will be our new ensign and emblem? Ensign 3
How are we going to go about charting efforts? Conduct short ranged scouting and long-duration missions in the light grey sectors to assess details about the more distant sectors.
With the Home Space Warfare Service now fully embedded and reoriented in its new axis of operations, those operations can now continue in a more focused and more prescient way than before. With new maps drawn up and stellar cartography considered, scouting parties can be dispatched to conduct short and long range missions into neighbouring systems in order to work out just who or what is out there.
Two rocks are found - one in the 'North' not far from Deep Hope, a small clump of ice and rock that can be used as an aiming point for deep space jumps and another, similar accretion to the 'South' of S'Taxu. Neither of them will have utility for producing fuel or resources - they're far too small for such operations to be conducted - but they could be useful as station points for deep space ports and fuel caches' supplied by fuel transports.
The first deep space surveys are conducted from close by to these rocks. The DSS ships jump out to one of these rocks before settling in for a month long observation operations on the distant star sectors. It's three months of work, taking until 05y04m00w before the ships finally return home via S'Taxu and Deep Hope, and what they bring with them is remarkable. Five systems have been detected, inside the jump capabilities of the Deep Space Surveyors, each of which is detailed below (at least as much as we know about them):
'North'
- 01-03 - Binary (Distant) - Twin type K stars. Thirteen significant planetary objects. No Gas Giants.
- 02-03 - Trinary (Main Star with Binary companions) - Type K Main Star, Twin type M companions. Four significant planetary objects. No Gas Giants.
'South'
- -02 02 - Trinary (Binary with distant third) - Twin type K with distant type M. Three significant planetary objects. At least one Gas Giant.
- -01 02 - Binary (Distant) - Type G with type K companion. Thirteen significant planetary objects. No Gas Giants.
- 00 02 - Solo Star - Type M star. Ten significant planetary objects. No Gas Giants.
With five new systems within jump range (see the following map) there are decisions to be made about our next steps.
How does the Navy's scouting proceed?
[ ] Conduct deep space surveys of the other unknowns before any penetration of potentially hostile space.
[ ] Plan and conduct a deep-penetration survey of two systems: Which?
[ ] Plan and commit to a penetration and survey in force utilising the logistics ship to extend the range of Interstellar Cruisers.
[ ] Other - write in.
Equally, there are plans to make at home. With the completion of the Flotilla Supply Ship, the yards begin work on the Interstellar Monitor, cutting the first of the keep plates and laying down the largest ship ever envisioned by Home thus far. It will be the equal of any other known warship, and greater than many. However, it also leaves some 1,200 tons of yard space open and available to the Home Space Warfare Service.
What would we fill that space with? Select up to 1,200 tons worth of ships.
[ ] An Interstellar Cruiser (1,000 tons)
[ ] A Deep Space Surveryor (500 tons)
[ ] An Interstellar Surveyor (700 tons)
[ ] A smaller fleet logistics ship.
[ ] A small, long range escort of some kind.
[ ] Something else entirely - write-in.
Vote opens at
I think the Surveyors should keep doing long range surveying. Pushing back the edge of the map is what they're for.
Recon in force is more threatening than I'd like.
The southern objects are closer to known space. If someone's exploring, they seem like they'd be easier to bridge with short-range ships, so they should be an early priority to check, and equally all 3 are next to -1,01.
So, my thought: use the logistics ship to forward-deploy fuel and supplies to -1,01. Then have it boost the interstellar surveyors and a flotilla of cruisers - 3 or 4 or whatever makes the math work - forwards, then have it running a supply chain to them.
One of the cruisers carries a proper diplomatic team.
The scouts then survey the three systems. Carefully, in accordance with lessons learned.
If things do go shit-shaped again, the cruisers and diplomats can go in to try and settle things down. If things go truly shit-shaped and we find a hostile interstellar power which tries to backtrack the route, the cruisers can provide a backstop.
And if we find someone willing to chat, we have a diplomatic team on standby one jump out.
This would be a fairly lengthy mission for those ships, but they'd also be only one jump from civilised space if something goes wrong, so even if they turn out to be unnecessary it's a useful training exercise for long-range deployments. IE the sort of multi-stage Black Buck type mission we'd have to use to reach more than a couple of hexes away. Assuming we actually can rendezvous in empty sectors.
As for ships I dunno. More deep surveyors? Another pair of scouts, since we're committing to the buddy system? Or maybe we start using scout-dss pairs for extra capability? A small logi ship to boost dss range even more? Idk.
How much range do those light escorts have? Are they actually capable of surviving in a full-up fleet engagement?
Recon in force is more threatening than I'd like.
The southern objects are closer to known space. If someone's exploring, they seem like they'd be easier to bridge with short-range ships, so they should be an early priority to check, and equally all 3 are next to -1,01.
So, my thought: use the logistics ship to forward-deploy fuel and supplies to -1,01. Then have it boost the interstellar surveyors and a flotilla of cruisers - 3 or 4 or whatever makes the math work - forwards, then have it running a supply chain to them.
One of the cruisers carries a proper diplomatic team.
The scouts then survey the three systems. Carefully, in accordance with lessons learned.
If things do go shit-shaped again, the cruisers and diplomats can go in to try and settle things down. If things go truly shit-shaped and we find a hostile interstellar power which tries to backtrack the route, the cruisers can provide a backstop.
And if we find someone willing to chat, we have a diplomatic team on standby one jump out.
This would be a fairly lengthy mission for those ships, but they'd also be only one jump from civilised space if something goes wrong, so even if they turn out to be unnecessary it's a useful training exercise for long-range deployments. IE the sort of multi-stage Black Buck type mission we'd have to use to reach more than a couple of hexes away. Assuming we actually can rendezvous in empty sectors.
As for ships I dunno. More deep surveyors? Another pair of scouts, since we're committing to the buddy system? Or maybe we start using scout-dss pairs for extra capability? A small logi ship to boost dss range even more? Idk.
How much range do those light escorts have? Are they actually capable of surviving in a full-up fleet engagement?
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Omake: HSWS Traditions
- Location
- Fort Worth, TX
HSWS Traditions
Coffee: whether instant, vacuumed sealed or fresh ground, each vessel stocks and is always on the lookout for replenishment of this essential item. Ever since the prohibition of alcohol in the 20th century old earth by the United States Navy, naval crews have been steady Coffee drinkers. Many local merchants have made immense profits supplying naval vessels. The HSWS has their own brand called Spacers Choice sold in many markets.
Mascots: Despite strict procedures to prevent biological contamination and invasive species there have been cases of pests that take up residence in a vessel. This has led to naval vessels adopting various sterilized cats like the Russian Blues and Maine Coons breeds as pest control. The mascots are treated as crew members with the same pay and benefits and even have ID Badges!
Tea and Tea ceremonies: The consumption of Tea and the Tea Ceremony are reserved for officers and are part of their training to be a 'person of culture'. Some officers will even purchase or use family tea sets and select blends while serving. This is a way for the commanding officer to speak to their subordinates in confidence personally in a less stressful situation. For a non officer or civilian to have tea with an naval officer is an deep honor. Officers who are invited to tea by civilians will also treat the occasion with the same respect.
Spacer's Encyclopedia
Coffee: whether instant, vacuumed sealed or fresh ground, each vessel stocks and is always on the lookout for replenishment of this essential item. Ever since the prohibition of alcohol in the 20th century old earth by the United States Navy, naval crews have been steady Coffee drinkers. Many local merchants have made immense profits supplying naval vessels. The HSWS has their own brand called Spacers Choice sold in many markets.
Mascots: Despite strict procedures to prevent biological contamination and invasive species there have been cases of pests that take up residence in a vessel. This has led to naval vessels adopting various sterilized cats like the Russian Blues and Maine Coons breeds as pest control. The mascots are treated as crew members with the same pay and benefits and even have ID Badges!
Tea and Tea ceremonies: The consumption of Tea and the Tea Ceremony are reserved for officers and are part of their training to be a 'person of culture'. Some officers will even purchase or use family tea sets and select blends while serving. This is a way for the commanding officer to speak to their subordinates in confidence personally in a less stressful situation. For a non officer or civilian to have tea with an naval officer is an deep honor. Officers who are invited to tea by civilians will also treat the occasion with the same respect.
Spacer's Encyclopedia
There's no room on our cruisers for proper diplomatic team.
As for ships, two extra Deep Space Surveryors should be in order.
As for exploration direction, I think the priority is south -02+02, the system with the gas giant. Storing fuel and supplies on -1+1 does make sense, but can we do that with just the Flotilla Logistics Ship or do we need to first build infrastructure there?
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There has been no commitment to the buddy system! That was offered in a plan which did not win the vote.
Yes but defacto it seems to be SOP now to not do lone jumps into unknown star systems and more recon ships would let us probe more systems.
Didn't a diplomat team go out to S'taxu in a cruiser?
Do we actually get any benefit from gas giants?
That's another thing that could be a good idea: making a semi-mobile space station that can be jumped out to some distant system and give us local fuel supply.
Or if not that, then a smaller modular station that the FSS can carry out in pieces.
Ideally we'd have something like the flotilla manufactory ship from a while back, but we don't strictly need the parts manufacturing - the key problem is the fuel.
I figured they'd just weld shipping containers together or smth.
Didn't a diplomat team go out to S'taxu in a cruiser?
Do we actually get any benefit from gas giants?
That's another thing that could be a good idea: making a semi-mobile space station that can be jumped out to some distant system and give us local fuel supply.
Or if not that, then a smaller modular station that the FSS can carry out in pieces.
Ideally we'd have something like the flotilla manufactory ship from a while back, but we don't strictly need the parts manufacturing - the key problem is the fuel.
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Yes, we get our fuel from them. These are valuable finds.
I understand that happened over several jumps?
This is what FSS is. We could build more of them after the first Monitor.
Anyways, looking at the numbers, logistic ship carrues 1500 tonnes of fuel and 400 tonnes of supplies in one go. This is easily enough to establish a staging area for 4 cruisers, 2 deep space surveyors and 2 interstellar surveyors. From there, we could keep 4 Interstellar Cruisers on stand-by and have 2 deep space surveyors make just one trip surveying 3 planetary systems. In the meantime, 2 interstellar surveyors wait for two weeks and start hopping into those systems and do mineralogical research. Logistics ship goes back to S'taxu for fresh supplies. Consult map for details:
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