Sterbelicht - One Sacrifice At A Time Against The Galaxy (40K)

[Alectai]

True enough. "You betrayed the one law laid down by Omnissiah and Emperor alike, Thou Shall Abhor the Soulless Machine. You failed in your duty to ward off the powers of Chaos, and that doesn't even begin to get into the atrocities involved in your so called miracle weapons. Justice is coming, stand aside or be deemed complicit"

 

[HeroCooky]

Is that the kind of thing that the Orrery can do @HeroCooky ? ID systems that normally wouldn't be visible on the map?

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It shows a perfect 3d map of the nearest system and its stellar bodies and their paths.

 

[Alectai]

It shows a perfect 3d map of the nearest system and its stellar bodies and their paths.

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... So it basically lets us map systems from a system away?

That's... Really, really strong.

 

[Neablis]

@HeroCooky I don't feel like I understand the implications of the surrender decision. Questions.
1. The megafreighters are already mostly on our side anyway with 2 infiltration actions? What do we gain by accepting their surrender apart from not fighting the fleet? (and waste the infiltration of the freighters? Or is the infiltration why they're surrendering?).
2. Will this make the Voxx war harder? How much? We won't have the food lever anymore, which seems important. But it will also probably total keep casualties lower... Which means we'll need more housing. I don't understand what this means for Voxx. Will people on Voxx be more likely to surrender?
3. How sure are we that the SDF won't play games and backstab us? The answer seems to be pretty sure based on how the thing as written.
4. Will accepting the surrender improve our chances at Echish? Don't need to repair damage or replenish munitions, give them less time to set up?
5. Will the surrender effect how long it takes to conquer the agriworlds? Will they also surrender?

For the second vote I'm very in favor of taking Echish. I don't think people understand that coordinating attacks through the warp across interstellar distances should require a minor miracle... And give them a slight tactical advantage that might turn into a chance to defeat them in detail. Not even to say that the more ships we kill now, the fewer we'll have to fight when they counterattack.

Another way to think of the cruiser scout ship is that the choir is the expensive part of the scout, not the ship. I like the idea of having a few, in addition to destroyer-sized ships. Not sure now is the time to make it.

[] [Light Cruiser] Cygnus-class Exploratory Cruiser
-[] Length - 4.000 Meters (+1 DP)
-[] Width - 500 Meters (+1 DP)
-[] Acceleration - 5 Gravities (-1 DP)
-[] Armor - Medium Double Hull (-1 DP)
-[] Shields - One Matrix
-[] Weapons - 2x Medium Mixed Hangars/2x Medium Plasma Macrocannon Turrets (-6 DP)
-[] Equipment - Ship Shrines/Strict Pilot Training/Veteran Pilot Gene-Lines/Enhanced Supply Generation/Superior Gravimetric Engine Calculations/Anti Radiation Hardening/Stealth Engine Dampeners/The Celestial Orrery (-19 DP)

Broadly, this is our "Federation Explorer" ship. Fast, capable of running quietly even if it can't sneak up on a fortified planet to drop stuff on and repeat the feat again and again, hardened against stellar phenomena so as to be able to explore places that would normally be out of reach--excellent range, excellent speed and agility, and teeth enough to take down anything it can't flee from. We're only liable to build a couple of these, but they can range further and in deeper places than anything else--which makes them excellent for being first movers into a new region, because they're stealthy enough and have long enough legs that they can Translate out far away from a system and then bypass it safely, and the Orrery is enough to pick up on locations that normally would be beneath notice, meaning we just need to get close enough to get a detailed astrographical map of a large region.

We don't need many of these, but it's very much designed in the same spirit as the Yeeni Spirit of Discovery cruiser. Just better protected and with sharper teeth, with the kind of equipment our more conventional scouts only dream they have.

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Do you know what I think would make this design GOATed? Micro-jump capability.

Then we've got a fleet of basically starship enterprises running around doing merry hijinks.

 

[PurposefulZephyr]

It shows a perfect 3d map of the nearest system and its stellar bodies and their paths.

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How big does a stellar body have to be to count as a stellar body?
Do meteors count?
I assume ships regardless of their size, even hulks, don't count?

 

[HeroCooky]

1. The megafreighters are already mostly on our side anyway with 2 infiltration actions? What do we gain by accepting their surrender apart from not fighting the fleet? (and waste the infiltration of the freighters? Or is the infiltration why they're surrendering?).
2. Will this make the Voxx war harder? How much? We won't have the food lever anymore, which seems important. But it will also probably total keep casualties lower... Which means we'll need more housing. I don't understand what this means for Voxx. Will people on Voxx be more likely to surrender?
3. How sure are we that the SDF won't play games and backstab us? The answer seems to be pretty sure based on how the thing as written.
4. Will accepting the surrender improve our chances at Echish? Don't need to repair damage or replenish munitions, give them less time to set up?
5. Will the surrender effect how long it takes to conquer the agriworlds? Will they also surrender?

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1. Nothing. You actually lose the ability to starve your enemies. It's just that they don't really care to fight you if they can continue plying their routes.
2. It will make it harder because your enemies won't starve. It will also mean that you gain propaganda to make enemy forces surrender faster because you are the ones allowing them to continue eating.
3. You will be closely watching them blow up their engines. If they want to play fuck-fuck games, they'll need to do so without any engines at all.
4. You won't need to fight here, so your forces are fresher when they fight there.
5. It will make the liberations faster, due to the PDFs realizing they won't need to fight to the death.

How big does a stellar body have to be to count as a stellar body?
Do meteors count?
I assume ships regardless of their size, even hulks, don't count?

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Pluto-sized. And it does show hulks, but only if they seem to be interesting? You have no idea why, or how, that is possible, but the people who made it just said: "Warp Bullshit" and everyone agreed.

With that: Night!

 

[The Laurent]

1. Nothing. You actually lose the ability to starve your enemies. It's just that they don't really care to fight you if they can continue plying their routes.
2. It will make it harder because your enemies won't starve. It will also mean that you gain propaganda to make enemy forces surrender faster because you are the ones allowing them to continue eating.
3. You will be closely watching them blow up their engines. If they want to play fuck-fuck games, they'll need to do so without any engines at all.
4. You won't need to fight here, so your forces are fresher when they fight there.
5. It will make the liberations faster, due to the PDFs realizing they won't need to fight to the death.
Pluto-sized. And it does show hulks, but only if they seem to be interesting? You have no idea why, or how, that is possible, but the people who made it just said: "Warp Bullshit" and everyone agreed.

With that: Night!

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Wait! Are the PDFs on Voxx Secondus fighting us?

 

[HeroCooky]

Wait! Are the PDFs on Voxx Secondus fighting us?

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Yeah. They are the fuckers who keep the serfs from rebelling. They definitely are curently shooting at the people you've incited to rebell as they weren't told jack shit about the massive fleet currently in the system by their superiors and are mostly operating on "this is enemy propaganda" regarding any news about you.

Don't worry, some Knights and ortillery will stop them right quick! :>

 

[10ebbor10]

1. Nothing. You actually lose the ability to starve your enemies. It's just that they don't really care to fight you if they can continue plying their routes.
2. It will make it harder because your enemies won't starve. It will also mean that you gain propaganda to make enemy forces surrender faster because you are the ones allowing them to continue eating.
3. You will be closely watching them blow up their engines. If they want to play fuck-fuck games, they'll need to do so without any engines at all.
4. You won't need to fight here, so your forces are fresher when they fight there.
5. It will make the liberations faster, due to the PDFs realizing they won't need to fight to the death.

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1. Heh. Did they do their generational crew indoctrination so hard that their food crews consider it their duty even if they don't understand why, or did we encounter some merchant crews that actually care about billions dying?

Anyway, I'd like to see people actually discuss tactics and ideas, instead of just going with the default in an hour and a half.
I certainly don't have all the answers, and there must be stuff we can do?

 

[Alectai]

Yeah. They are the fuckers who keep the serfs from rebelling. They definitely are curently shooting at the people you've incited to rebell as they weren't told jack shit about the massive fleet currently in the system by their superiors and are mostly operating on "this is enemy propaganda" regarding any news about you.

Don't worry, some Knights and ortillery will stop them right quick! :>

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So, basically, it's not going to be a huge investment pacifying Secundus because it's virtually impossible to defend an agri world on the ground, right?

 

[Neablis]

1. Nothing. You actually lose the ability to starve your enemies. It's just that they don't really care to fight you if they can continue plying their routes.
2. It will make it harder because your enemies won't starve. It will also mean that you gain propaganda to make enemy forces surrender faster because you are the ones allowing them to continue eating.
3. You will be closely watching them blow up their engines. If they want to play fuck-fuck games, they'll need to do so without any engines at all.
4. You won't need to fight here, so your forces are fresher when they fight there.
5. It will make the liberations faster, due to the PDFs realizing they won't need to fight to the death.

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Ok, with those clarifications I'm 100% on team Merciful. Be the good guys, accept surrender, cause fewer deaths and (mostly) benefit from it. Sounds like a winning strategy to me.

And, of course it means we'll be in better shape to take Echish!

 

[PurposefulZephyr]

I am tempted to demand of the Mega-Freighters to add some samples of our propaganda material to their food shuttles. Like even a Federation logo on some of the food crates. Maybe some posters with "Surrender now to receive free cookies and fluffy butts" messages.
I mean it will be burned down/cleaned out by soldiers, but it will be an even more pointed message of "we allow you to not starve".

But it's a minor thing and honestly just letting them get food while we just control the skies should be message enough.

 

[10ebbor10]

I am tempted to demand of the Mega-Freighters to add some samples of our propaganda material to their food shuttles. Like even a Federation logo on some of the food crates. Maybe some posters with "Surrender now receive free cookies and fluffy butts" messages.

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No need to demand it of them. Their plan is to unload the food onto the ringyards (which we control) and then we drop it onto resisting areas via shuttles.

We can mess with it as we like.

 

[Neablis]

Anyway, I'd like to see people actually discuss tactics and ideas, instead of just going with the default in an hour and a half.
I certainly don't have all the answers, and there must be stuff we can do?

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Alectai had a pretty good write-in:

[] We Fight!
-[ ] Hold our Aries-S Corvettes back to protect our backline, if any Flyssa arrives concentrate all fire on them--the Lover's Dance Lances in concert combined with their impressive speed and our Sagittarius-S classes in the backline should do much to run them down, and they're no longer suited for front line duty.
-[ ] Bomber Strikes are to concentrate on Light Cruisers in the skirmishing phase, especially of models or specific hulls known to carry Null-Nets, ideally weakening them or deploying their superweapons before our battle line closes.
-[ ] Leos are to focus on bullying enemy light craft when possible, spread in such a way so that Null Net attacks are less likely to overtake them, their great armor and high rate of fire should let them reap a grim toll.
-[ ] Sagittarius-S are to prioritize sniping down enemy escorts or capitalizing on openings made by escorts, staggering fire in such a way that there remains at least some reserve to counter any Flyssa interference.

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I think the only thing I would like to change is to try and figure out a better approach to the null-nets - maybe just keep the Leos & battlecolonies out of close range of the ships with null-nets, maybe we charge them with Scorpios and accept losing light cruisers in exchange.

 

[10ebbor10]

Alectai had a pretty good write-in:

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That's what I meant with going with the default.

Anyway, to discuss it specifically, I'm not sure it's a good write-in?
- Point 1 is partially good. The Aries-S can't do any good in the front line, so bringing it back is good. However, I fear that this is too little defense for the carriers. The Saggitarius can not actually defending against Flyssa's as the plan proposed, because it's weaponry is prow mounted. By the time you've swung the ship around, the enemy will be long gone.
- Point 2 is a massive risk. Dedicating the bomber forces to taking out the light cruisers might negate the null lances, at the risk of opening us opening us up to massive damage via torpedo strikes because those bombers and their escorting fighters were essential in holding the torpedos back.
- Point 3 is just "try the same thing we did last time, but this time without dying to null nets". It's not really actionable?
- Point 4 is, as noted in point 1, impossible. These are prow mounted weaponry, you can't have shots in reserve because you'd have to point the ship in 2 different directions.

 

[Neablis]

That's what I meant with going with the default.

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Fair enough. Let's see. @Alectai It's your plan, but below are some alterations that we can bounce back and forth before the vote opens. To be clear, I'm happy with your version, I'm just trying to polish it up. What you proposed:

[] We Fight!
-[ ] Hold our Aries-S Corvettes back to protect our backline, if any Flyssa arrives concentrate all fire on them--the Lover's Dance Lances in concert combined with their impressive speed and our Sagittarius-S classes in the backline should do much to run them down, and they're no longer suited for front line duty.
-[ ] Bomber Strikes are to concentrate on Light Cruisers in the skirmishing phase, especially of models or specific hulls known to carry Null-Nets, ideally weakening them or deploying their superweapons before our battle line closes.
-[ ] Leos are to focus on bullying enemy light craft when possible, spread in such a way so that Null Net attacks are less likely to overtake them, their great armor and high rate of fire should let them reap a grim toll.
-[ ] Sagittarius-S are to prioritize sniping down enemy escorts or capitalizing on openings made by escorts, staggering fire in such a way that there remains at least some reserve to counter any Flyssa interference.

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My version:
[] We Fight!
-[ ] Hold our Aries-S Corvettes & Sagittarius-S back to protect our backline, if any Flyssa arrives concentrate all fire on them--the Lover's Dance Lances combined with their impressive speed and our Sagittarius-S classes incredible firepower and range in the backline should do much to run down the Flyssa-class ships.
-[ ] Bomber Strikes are to concentrate on Light Cruisers in the skirmishing phase, especially of models or specific hulls known to carry Null-Nets, ideally weakening them or forcing them to deploy their superweapons before our battle line closes.
-[ ] Leos, Battlecolonies & Lamenter heavy cruiser ships are to focus on bullying enemy light craft when possible, spread out and keeping their distance from the light cruisers so that Null Net attacks are less likely to overtake them.
- [ ] Scorpio & Crux-class ships are to focus on the light cruisers carrying null-nets, forcing them to be lost or deployed against imperfect targets that can dodge.

Notably, the Scorpios have 5 gravities of acceleration to the Null-net's 4, so they actually stand a pretty good chance of dodging and the 26 of them (mostly undamaged still) should still be able to wreck the 13 enemy light cruisers. We might take some torpedo hits doing it, but they've got lattice hulls and as long as we hold the system they should be recoverable.

 

[Neablis]

- Point 1 is partially good. The Aries-S can't do any good in the front line, so bringing it back is good. However, I fear that this is too little defense for the carriers. The Saggitarius can not actually defending against Flyssa's as the plan proposed, because it's weaponry is prow mounted. By the time you've swung the ship around, the enemy will be long gone.
- Point 2 is a massive risk. Dedicating the bomber forces to taking out the light cruisers might negate the null lances, at the risk of opening us opening us up to massive damage via torpedo strikes because those bombers and their escorting fighters were essential in holding the torpedos back.
- Point 3 is just "try the same thing we did last time, but this time without dying to null nets". It's not really actionable?
- Point 4 is, as noted in point 1, impossible. These are prow mounted weaponry, you can't have shots in reserve because you'd have to point the ship in 2 different directions.

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To address in turn
1. the Sag's are actually good against the Flyssa's. Not only was it confirmed by HeroCooky

Yeah, they would be able to snipe as their weapons are hitscan.

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but they have Superior Gravimetric Engine Calculations, so they can actually pivot quite fast. They might need to be aimed in the 'rough' correct angle to begin with, but with their armament we only really need to get lucky once.
2. They don't have any voidcraft or specific voidcraft defenses, so our bombers don't need a ton of escorts. We could send 20% of our fighters (which is still like 500?) to escort the bombers and have the rest on anti-torpedo duty. Or we could just edit this out and rely on the Scorpios to take on the null-nets.
3. Naww, it is specific instruction. The Leos/battlecoloines are to stay away from their light cruisers. It'll make them less effective, but it should protect them. And maybe the enemy will hold fire trying to get them into range long enough for most of the light cruisers to get taken apart. They probably can't hit the Scorpios, they're 60% faster than the Leos and have Superior Gravimetric Engine Calculations.
4. Really the same point as point 1. In my variant I've updated this point to be about the Scorpios taking on the enemy light cruisers with a 2-1 advantage.

 

[10ebbor10]

Notably, the Scorpios have 5 gravities of acceleration to the Null-net's 4, so they actually stand a pretty good chance of dodging and the 26 of them (mostly undamaged still) should still be able to wreck the 13 enemy light cruisers. We might take some torpedo hits doing it, but they've got lattice hulls and as long as we hold the system they should be recoverable.

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The problem is that the Scorpio's main armament is it's torpedoes, and when I asked about how our torpedoes, did, the answer is that they don't really do anything.

They had heavily invested into additional defenses on most of their ships, so your torps only got a hit ratio of 1-to-15.

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They might need to be aimed in the 'rough' correct angle to begin with, but with their armament we only really need to get lucky once.

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Well, that's kind of my point. You can't have them simultaneously be pointed forwards towards the enemy, and backwards to to the carriers. Not unless we want to place them beyond the carriers, but if we do that we're just going to see our Saggitariuses sniped in the first attack by the Flyssa's, removing the overwatch that then allows them to hit the carriers.

2. They don't have any voidcraft or specific voidcraft defenses, so our bombers don't need a ton of escorts. We could send 20% of our fighters (which is still like 500?) to escort the bombers and have the rest on anti-torpedo duty. Or we could just edit this out and rely on the Scorpios to take on the null-nets.

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The enemy has extensive point defenses, the only reason our bombers were effective in past battle was the massive swarms of fighters and missiles distracting those point defenses.

Yeah. That's why your fighters weren't getting shot down by the dozen in attack runs.

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[sunrise]

How well would the Bloody Sunset-Class do in protecting the carriers vs the Flyssa's?
The Lamanters got 4 of them.

Bloody Sunset-Class Light Cruiser
-Length - 4.400m
-Width - 600m
-Acceleration - 5 Gravities
-Armor - Thin Triple Hull
-Shields - One Matrix
-Weapons - 3x Medium Rotary Macro-Cannon Batteries/2x Medium Plasma Macro-Cannons Turrets
-Equipment - Auto-Loaders/After-Burner Macro-Shells/Internal Security Systems/Armored Bridges/Ship Shrines/Medium Teleportarium/Tuned Shields/Snapshot Pinpoint Targeting Solutions

@HeroCooky With our enemy having a lot of point defences can we replace the Scorpio of the next SBD we build with Bloody Sunset-Class Light Cruisers when we build them?

 

[One Autumn Leaf]

[X] Accept the Terms of Surrender



[X] We Fight!
-[X] Hold our Aries-S Corvettes back to protect our backline, if any Flyssa arrives concentrate all fire on them--the Lover's Dance Lances in concert combined with their impressive speed and our Sagittarius-S classes in the backline should do much to run them down, and they're no longer suited for front line duty.
-[X] Bomber Strikes are to concentrate on Light Cruisers in the skirmishing phase, especially of models or specific hulls known to carry Null-Nets, ideally weakening them or deploying their superweapons before our battle line closes.
-[X] Leos are to focus on bullying enemy light craft when possible, spread in such a way so that Null Net attacks are less likely to overtake them, their great armor and high rate of fire should let them reap a grim toll.
-[X] Sagittarius-S are to prioritize sniping down enemy escorts or capitalizing on openings made by escorts, staggering fire in such a way that there remains at least some reserve to counter any Flyssa interference.

 

[10ebbor10]

Anyway, whatever we do, we should broadcast the evidence of the Duchy using AI to the fleet.

They are dogmatics, they should have something to say about their own leaders breaking their own dogma.

 

[Picio]

[X] Accept the Terms of Surrender



[X] We Fight!
-[X] Hold our Aries-S Corvettes & Sagittarius-S back to protect our backline, if any Flyssa arrives concentrate all fire on them--the Lover's Dance Lances combined with their impressive speed and our Sagittarius-S classes incredible firepower and range in the backline should do much to run down the Flyssa-class ships.
-[X] Bomber Strikes are to concentrate on Light Cruisers in the skirmishing phase, especially of models or specific hulls known to carry Null-Nets, ideally weakening them or forcing them to deploy their superweapons before our battle line closes.
-[X] Leos, Battlecolonies & Lamenter heavy cruiser ships are to focus on bullying enemy light craft when possible, spread out and keeping their distance from the light cruisers so that Null Net attacks are less likely to overtake them.
- [X] Scorpio & Crux-class ships are to focus on the light cruisers carrying null-nets, forcing them to be lost or deployed against imperfect targets that can dodge.

 

[Alectai]

[X] We Fight!
-[X] Hold our Aries-S Corvettes & Sagittarius-S back to protect our backline, if any Flyssa arrives concentrate all fire on them--the Lover's Dance Lances combined with their impressive speed and our Sagittarius-S classes incredible firepower and range in the backline should do much to run down the Flyssa-class ships.
-[X] Bomber Strikes are to concentrate on Light Cruisers in the skirmishing phase, especially of models or specific hulls known to carry Null-Nets, ideally weakening them or forcing them to deploy their superweapons before our battle line closes.
-[X] Leos, Battlecolonies & Lamenter heavy cruiser ships are to focus on bullying enemy light craft when possible, spread out and keeping their distance from the light cruisers so that Null Net attacks are less likely to overtake them.
- [X] Scorpio & Crux-class ships are to focus on the light cruisers carrying null-nets, forcing them to be lost or deployed against imperfect targets that can dodge.

 

[sun tzu]

[X] Accept the Terms of Surrender
[X] We Fight!

 

[10ebbor10]

2x Dauntless Mk1 Light Cruiser + 6 new
5x Lancer Light Cruiser (1x Prow Lance, 1x Lance Battery, 1x Lance Turret)
16x Shatterpoint Heavy Frigates (3x Macro-Cannon Turrets) + 11 new
9x Falchion Frigates + 6 new
11x Sword Frigates
28x Cobra Destroyers + 24 (new)
0x Flyssa Destroyer + 2 (new)

Anyway, I compared the stats a bit, so that we can see which forces came out of the previous battle with us, and which are new.

(Also, I can tell this strategy vote is going to be a mess, because you have multiple very similar plans getting mushed together).