What should your focus for the rest of the Quest be?


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I never said my design was Ideal.

I just said that a good design that isn't intended to suck and die needs to have a margin for error. "Minimum health, virtually no defenses" allows for none, and maneuverability alone is not enough to eliminate the possibility of getting shot back in turn.
 
A bunch of this probably depends on what the range of abstraction between the game and reality is.

If you look at the numbers as if they were hard sci fi, then the macro cannons could never hurt a lance equipped ship, as the lance can simply stay at sufficient range to detect and dodge every projectile.
If you assume that the it works closer like the video games or tabletop does, then it's quite possible.

Of course, I doubt it's either of those, it'll be some third thing.
 
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Two questions!

One: Will we be able to unlock that Iconoclast Doctrine thing later as another add-on?
And
Two: How would my design stack up against the Cobra--the AK-47 of Voidships?

Actually, what would that even look like in this system?
1. Context please?
2. Uuuuh...badly. See below.

Length - 1.500 Meters
Width - 300 Meters
Acceleration 7.6 Gravities
Armor - Thick Double Hull
Shields - Double Array
Weapons - 4x60m Torpedoes, 1x Repeating Macro-Cannon Turret
Equipment - Armored Prow, Mass-Produced Alloying, Superior Gravimetric Engine Calculations, Old-Bitten Design, Cradle of Heroes
I don't think we can double up on equipment like that? Or at least I assumed we couldn't.
You cannot do so unless I specify such in the Equipment section for specific equipments.
unless we get multiple Destroyers each turn with each action choice
You do. 2 Destroyers for 1 Action, 1 Frigate for 1 Action, and 1 Light Cruiser for 2 Actions.

Proper Logistics. They fuck.
I doubt that the OP will model space battles at that level of detail anyway.
I won't. But your foes will generally react in an intelligent manner to your plays while making their own. If you won't bring the scrap to the Orks, they will just bugger off and nuke Droma III or VII. Which is bad, because I intend for them to be your conquest starting point.
 
1. Context please?
2. Uuuuh...badly. See below.

Length - 1.500 Meters
Width - 300 Meters
Acceleration 7.6 Gravities
Armor - Thick Double Hull
Shields - Double Array
Weapons - 4x60m Torpedoes, 1x Repeating Macro-Cannon Turret
Equipment - Armored Prow, Mass-Produced Alloying, Superior Gravimetric Engine Calculations, Old-Bitten Design, Cradle of Heroes

Good God

We're absolute fucking garbage, I must commit sudoku immediately. That's something like, 9-10 DP into that, huh?

EDIT: Make that 14, we are babies /EDIT

Uh, context as in when we picked our ability to pick something that all of our ships had, one option was an Iconoclast unlocked pick that would have helped preserve our crews and thus, increase our veterancy over time. Are we able to get that later?
 
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Equipment - Armored Prow, Mass-Produced Alloying, Superior Gravimetric Engine Calculations, Old-Bitten Design, Cradle of Heroes

Important thing to note here.

The other side has better tech than we do.
So any design that relies on a single gimmick executed to perfection is likely doomed, because we might not be good enough at our gimmick.

Aka, we might be able to outrange our own cannons, but that doesn't mean we can outrange the enemies.
 
Important thing to note here.

The other side has better tech than we do.
So any design that relies on a single gimmick executed to perfection is likely doomed, because we might not be good enough at our gimmick.

Aka, we might be able to outrange our own cannons, but that doesn't mean we can outrange the enemies.

Part of it is that the Cobra is so old and so well optimized and so simple that even the Imperium has been able to iterate on it over time, creating... Well, a hyper-optimized torpedo boat that's quite possibly the Best In Role in the galaxy today. (Eldar don't count, while their torpedoes are good, the thing they really like is stealth flying guns that can rip apart a cruiser in one or two salvos)

I imagine the Sword-class Frigate would be similarly daunting. As would most of the Imperium's iconic mainstays (Cobra/Sword/Dauntless/Lunar)

God, we suck.
 
so @Alectai if we can't dodge tank everything our enemies throw at us, what should be the slowest our ships be so we can actually dodge things that oneshot us while being able to avoid the smaller stuff?
 
so @Alectai if we can't dodge tank everything our enemies throw at us, what should be the slowest our ships be so we can actually dodge things that oneshot us while being able to avoid the smaller stuff?

Baseline's perfectly fine for that, even an unexciting Destroyer is still a Destroyer.

Specialized ships aren't necessarily a bad thing, but any design that's intended as more than a death-trap needs to have a way of absorbing a run of bad luck. It's why I'm so violently against reducing armor and shields.
 
I won't. But your foes will generally react in an intelligent manner to your plays while making their own. If you won't bring the scrap to the Orks, they will just bugger off and nuke Droma III or VII. Which is bad, because I intend for them to be your conquest starting point.
yeah, as I said, the harassers would still require a strong point for the harrassed enemy to break against at the end, which currently is only our own station, that absolutely makes sense to me.
 
Part of it is that the Cobra is so old and so well optimized and so simple that even the Imperium has been able to iterate on it over time, creating... Well, a hyper-optimized torpedo boat that's quite possibly the Best In Role in the galaxy today. (Eldar don't count, while their torpedoes are good, the thing they really like is stealth flying guns that can rip apart a cruiser in one or two salvos)

I imagine the Sword-class Frigate would be similarly daunting. As would most of the Imperium's iconic mainstays (Cobra/Sword/Dauntless/Lunar)

God, we suck.

Eh, not particularly? Like, we've had less than a century to do this. The fact that the Imperium, which has theoretically been at this for ten-thousand years, has 9-10 average Design Points is honestly really reassuring, if you think about it.

Like yes, a lot of that time has been spent not getting better and getting worse... but we've spent a fraction of that time getting significantly better.
 
But yeah, like, I'm not militantly for my plan so much as I'm militantly against boondoggles that can't hold up to pressure. If someone else can put together a decent plan that has a coherent strategy behind it that isn't "Fly around and hope we don't get shot", I'll be happy to approval vote for them.

For all my emotions are high and I'm in Despair, the fact we can produce independent Void Ships is already an insane benefit for such a small polity.
 
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Baseline's perfectly fine for that, even an unexciting Destroyer is still a Destroyer.

Specialized ships aren't necessarily a bad thing, but any design that's intended as more than a death-trap needs to have a way of absorbing a run of bad luck. It's why I'm so violently against reducing armor and shields.
hmm so the issue is what weapons and equipment we get for our first destroyer? should we lower length and width or no?
 
so whats our first type of enemies, more orks?

they typically are gonna charge us in one direction right?

so we can us batteries instead of turrets?

edit:
Baseline's perfectly fine for that, even an unexciting Destroyer is still a Destroyer.

Specialized ships aren't necessarily a bad thing, but any design that's intended as more than a death-trap needs to have a way of absorbing a run of bad luck. It's why I'm so violently against reducing armor and shields.
[] (SHIP)
-[] Sagittarius-class Torpedo Destroyer
-[] Length
- 1.300
-[] Width - 250
-[] Acceleration - 7.5 Gravities
-[] Armor - Single Hull
-[] Shields - Two Emitters
-[] Weapons - 2x60m Torpedoes/Light Missile Battery
-[] Equipment - Missile Swarms/Gravimetric Engine Calculations
if the base speed is acceptable can we lower the acceleration back to 7 and drop the Engines and use the 2 freed up DP to get the Auto Loader and another light missile battery?
 
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so whats our first type of enemies, more orks?

they typically are gonna charge us in one direction right?

so we can us batteries instead of turrets?

Orks aren't fancy, they charge in head first firing guns the whole time, some of them might have looted torpedoes or fighta-bommas, but for the most part, they're janky-ass junkheaps.

They're extremely dangerous in the forward arc though--their armor is incredibly thick there while most of their strongest weapons are concentrated in that region. Anyone fighting an Ork in face-to-face brawl is playing to their strengths. They also really do like boarding parties, which they're exceptionally good at due to their physical strength and toughness.

They do have weaknesses however, their tech is unreliable, and even their Destroyers have difficulty turning (Our ships can pull 90 degree turns per turn at the escort weights, Ork ships can only max out at 45--the turn speed of a proper ship of the line). Most importantly, they're completely incapable of shooting in their aft arc and their armor is famously weak there--if you can get in there, chances are good you can kill them quickly and cheaply.

The best countermeasure to Orks in general is to get behind them and then come about, doing your best to stay on their aft while you chip them down. This is effective against small numbers of Orks, but you're usually outnumbered by them. Fortunately, that's not so great a problem for us given we took the route that gives us very sophisticated shipbuilding lines.

Given our tech base, the ideal fleet composition to face Orks would be heavy frigates to shield a destroyer wing and do their best to endure the approach, where it's more difficult to strike them down. We can likely unlock Destroyers with another Void Industry purchase, though whether we'll have the ability to do that or not next turn is unclear.

so whats our first type of enemies, more orks?

they typically are gonna charge us in one direction right?

so we can us batteries instead of turrets?

edit:


if the base speed is acceptable can we lower the acceleration back to 7 and drop the Engines and use the 2 freed up DP to get the Auto Loader and another light missile battery?


We could probably reduce Acceleration down to 7gs, yeah, but I think we'll still want the maneuverability to help with winning the turnfight after the initial closing measure. Still, Autoloaders wouldn't hurt in that event, and would increase our Rate of Fire considerably. I'll consider it for the final draft. The ideal of course is that the design will have a place even in the future, which is why I still want it to maintain the torpedo functionality.
 
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We could probably reduce Acceleration down to 7gs, yeah, but I think we'll still want the maneuverability to help with winning the turnfight after the initial closing measure. Still, Autoloaders wouldn't hurt in that event, and would increase our Rate of Fire considerably. I'll consider it for the final draft. The ideal of course is that the design will have a place even in the future, which is why I still want it to maintain the torpedo functionality.

To be fair even if a Destroyer design without the Torpedo element wins they'll still be able to justify their presence moving into the future. Sure, they probably won't be able to semi reliably take down heavier ship classes but they'd still be able to complete other functions. A lot of missile spam for example may not be the most efficient logistically speaking but it could nonetheless play a useful part in the fleets greater strategy especially for home defense.
 
[] (SHIP)
-[] Brawler-class Gun Destroyer
-[] Length
- 1.400 Meters
-[] Width - 300 Meters
-[] Acceleration - 7 Gravities
-[] Armor - Single Hull
-[] Shields - Two Emitters
-[] Weapons - Light Macro Cannon/Battery x2
-[] Equipment - Auto-Loaders

The idea behind this class is that we're not going to be using it for very long, that we'll be able to make better designs soon and that our advantages encourage iterating on designs. So it aims for a decent baseline of speed and survivability, and aims to specialize in the most flexible weapon system we have at the moment.

I've posted this design mainly as a way of providing a point of contrast to @Alectai's design on grounds that shouldn't be immediately rejected as too much of an eggshell-with-a-hammer.
 
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[] (SHIP)
-[] Brawler-class Gun Destroyer
-[] Length
- 1.400 Meters
-[] Width - 300 Meters
-[] Acceleration - 7 Gravities
-[] Armor - Single Hull
-[] Shields - Two Emitters
-[] Weapons - Light Macro Cannon/Battery x2
-[] Equipment - Auto-Loaders

The idea behind this class is that we're not going to be using it for very long, that we'll be able to make better designs soon and that our advantages encourage iterating on designs. So it aims for a decent baseline of speed and survivability, and aims to specialize in the most flexible weapon system we have at the moment.

I've posted this design mainly as a way of providing a point of contrast to @Alectai's design on grounds that shouldn't be immediately rejected as too much of an eggshell-with-a-hammer.

It's a fair design, no complaints
 
I don't think a torpedo ship is the best choice for a first ship considering they are meant for large targets. If we get attacked by someone who could bring to bear a ship torpedoes would be good against so early into the quest we are probably screwed anyway.
 
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