Noroboro
Consistency is key and I’m consistently tired :)
- Location
- Canada
"Paint me like one of your Bretonnian girls"You guys, I've seen something.
Now you have to see it too.
Behold! Stupid Sexy Slannders!
Respect Your Elders v2 - Galactic Boogaloo [Warhammer Lizardmen Quest]
- Thread starter Xantalos
- Start date
- Sci-Fi Fantasy
The Froggy Ninja
The Blade Will Never Die
That was my thought as well. Lizardmen with gear would almost certainly be better for the same amount of effort in practically all situations.
Thebigpieman
I've got this, I think.
- Location
- United States
Might've been a useful idea before we researched how the spawning system actually worked, but we did that so using Automata seems somewhat less worth it for mass use.
That said Automata might still have uses so it could be something to look into. Plus the idea of Lizardmen robots is funny to me.
That said Automata might still have uses so it could be something to look into. Plus the idea of Lizardmen robots is funny to me.
- Location
- Warsaw
@TripleTango
My idea was brought on by the orks. Namely the number disparity between them and us. Our spawning numbers are linked to the web and number of cities. It would take several turns to get to the same kind of numbers. I want the golems to act as supplementary forces and possibly sources of labor for task that are harsh on living things. The fact they would be expendable helped.
My idea was brought on by the orks. Namely the number disparity between them and us. Our spawning numbers are linked to the web and number of cities. It would take several turns to get to the same kind of numbers. I want the golems to act as supplementary forces and possibly sources of labor for task that are harsh on living things. The fact they would be expendable helped.
@Xantalos If we were to take another race as war captives/slaves/other forms of control, how would general treatment of them go? (as it depends on how aggressive the race is most likely)
Also is there a standardized starting point/ending point for what marks different Slann generations? I know the hypothetical 6th slann generation would be known from them being the first slann spawning since the Old Ones, but what would mark the 7th and 8th if we get to that point?
Also is there a standardized starting point/ending point for what marks different Slann generations? I know the hypothetical 6th slann generation would be known from them being the first slann spawning since the Old Ones, but what would mark the 7th and 8th if we get to that point?
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- Pronouns
- He/Him
Honestly, now that the orks are going to be wiped out mostly by the ritual, we just need to wipe clean the remnants off the north continent. We don't need the numbers anymore. Besides, the Rangdan-lot could be controlled if that's what you're looking for.
For the record, I don't, Traumatize the Oversoul and get back to our uninterrupted research projects. Such as spawning new slaan/resurrecting the Relic Priests.
For the record, I don't, Traumatize the Oversoul and get back to our uninterrupted research projects. Such as spawning new slaan/resurrecting the Relic Priests.
I still think that the rangdan could be useful slaves or allies, but only if we can have loads of risk assessments. I'm more than happy to exterminate or traumatise if those assessments go to hell.
Maybe we can ask Isan about the rangdan if she isn't too pissed about what we've done to the Orks.
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- Location
- Warsaw
I think it would be best to traumatize and then later bind the hive mind parasites. We can use the former to buy a few turns of peace for our projects. After that we can make use of them.
K von Carstein
Likes to go for a walk
- Location
- Belgium
- Pronouns
- He
I'd rather do that too. Enslaving or exterminating them leaves a bad taste in my mouth, and allying with them leaves open the possibility of a hive-mind of bodyjacking parasites spreading across the galaxy and trying to kill us. Terrifying them and leaving them stranded on one planet is imo the most humane and pragmatic option.
The Froggy Ninja
The Blade Will Never Die
It seems significantly less humane than extermination. And I think we could avoid betrayal if we go the ally route.
- Location
- Toril
Honestly, I feel that if we do ally with them, it will be on our own terms, meaning we will have ample opportunity to prevent any possible future betrayals, be they intentionally or accidental.
Edit. Plus, their usefulness is immense. The Rangdan have shown that, even without being sapient, they fought off ork hordes in the past, even fully exterminated the orkoid biosphere, and that's just with animal instinct and ferocity. Imagine what they could do with full sapience, and more importantly, direction from us. And the the fact that we can traumatized the Oversoul shows that, if they do betray us, we have options to deal with them.
Edit 2. And I doubt the Slann would just give the Rangdan sapience and let them run willy nilly.
Edit. Plus, their usefulness is immense. The Rangdan have shown that, even without being sapient, they fought off ork hordes in the past, even fully exterminated the orkoid biosphere, and that's just with animal instinct and ferocity. Imagine what they could do with full sapience, and more importantly, direction from us. And the the fact that we can traumatized the Oversoul shows that, if they do betray us, we have options to deal with them.
Edit 2. And I doubt the Slann would just give the Rangdan sapience and let them run willy nilly.
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The biggest problem with magical Automata is that we already have them. Their called Skinks and Kroxigors. Straight up, thats the whole point of why they exist: To do that work.
K von Carstein
Likes to go for a walk
- Location
- Belgium
- Pronouns
- He
How is making them terrified of us less humane than killing them all?
The Froggy Ninja
The Blade Will Never Die
Because living with extreme trauma on a planet with the thing you're traumatized by (because we're definitely not leaving) is more unpleasant than the sweet release of death?
K von Carstein
Likes to go for a walk
- Location
- Belgium
- Pronouns
- He
First, let's agree to disagree on that part. Second, we can just leave them a place where we don't go so they don't have to stay near us and see us.
The Froggy Ninja
The Blade Will Never Die
I mean, torture is bad. It's one thing to kill an active threat to your safety, but inflicting deep trauma on the psyche while simultaneously crippling them so they can never accomplish anything of value seems needlessly cruel. Both actions remove the possibility of growth, betterment or happiness, but the first option leaves behind a corpse, compared to the second option leaving behind a creature capable only of neutral existence or suffering. I view it similar to the way we treat animals with degenerative diseases. It's considered more humane to euthanize them than it is to force them to live longer in pain. In this case, the degenerative disease is "being a threat to lizardmen" but if we're already going to neutralize them, crippling seems like a half measure. Like if you were attacked by a lion and, instead of killing it, you cut off its paws and locked it in a cage with a sufficient supply of food and water. It's extra steps and not really a better situation for the lion.
K von Carstein
Likes to go for a walk
- Location
- Belgium
- Pronouns
- He
You can find purpose and happiness while staying on the same planet. And I disagree that forcing the Rangdans to stay in a defined territory is torture. Animals lives in reservations without suffering from it, and we just have to not send Lizardmen in those to prevent them from getting panicked.
The Froggy Ninja
The Blade Will Never Die
They can't find true purpose without sapience, and their natural instinct is to expand. Their groupmind means they would be constantly aware of their captivity, unlike normal animals which might be placed in a reservation large enough that they're unlikely to roam to the edge. How would we even keep them contained to the reservation if not by having Lizardmen at the borders? Also the torture is the initial psychological scarring.
K von Carstein
Likes to go for a walk
- Location
- Belgium
- Pronouns
- He
Well, let's agree to disagree that imprisonment is torture and worse than dying. And them reaching sapience has nothing to do with the matter at hand.
The Froggy Ninja
The Blade Will Never Die
I'm not saying imprisonment is torture. I'm saying inflicting enough psychological trauma to establish a permanent phobia is torture, and questioning the practical viability of imprisoning them while maintaining zero contact or awareness that the target of their fear is constantly controlling their living conditions.
- Pronouns
- He/Him/It
What if we hijacked the hive mind? Like have A slann become the focus point. That way we have powerful creatures and they are under our direct control!
- Location
- Poland
- Pronouns
- He/Him
I imagine it runs into same problems as we run with Aya's- it'll be a difficult project and the hivemind will freak out when we try to take control. On top of that, Aya's are a young, undeveloped hivemind. Tyranids are on whole other level.
Oh, and there are different fleets. Big fleet- big problem. And a small fleet... what do we need it for? They're like Aya, except more ugly and I guess more thorough in it's assimilation.
Also, wouldn't be surprised if a Lizardmen controlled fleet met a "native" fleet, it'll try to free it's sibling through whatever shared connection they have.
map of Yenehectua?
A Recap of the Ork War, Turns 1-13
Xantalos
Turtle-Speed Writing
I get the meaning of the question, and of course I understand English isn't everyone's first language, so this isn't meant as a diss or reprimand, but if possible, please try to state your questions a bit more clearly - I'm probably going to be able to grasp them, but just to ensure I understand what you're asking and don't miss what you're trying to say.
In any case, there's a research option for that, you've had it for a while. Under Divine Research, I think.
You can make golems - the ones down in the Relic Tombs weren't entirely there for show - but I will let you know right now that you likely won't be able to bolster your numbers up to comparable levels with other factions using them. They'll have their uses, yes, but you can't replace your main military forces with them.
Right now, the treatment of captives and such would largely depend on votes by you guys, truth be told - why you took them as captives, what you do with them, what role you have in mind for them.
The thing that delineates slann generations isn't necessarily age so much as what spawning they were part of - much like other lizardmen, slann were made in batches, there just weren't that many of them compared to the others. Where a saurus warrior spawned now, for instance, could be referred to as part of the ... I dunno, 34,092nd Spawning/Generation (not an accurate number, time broke during the Great Catastrophe and mucked up a bunch of your records), there have only ever been five instances where slann were spawned, each a singular event. Any further iterations of slann coming into existence will follow this format, so the seventh time slann are spawned will make the Seventh Generation.
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I also realize it's been quite a while, so to prevent any confusion as to why the orks have escalated as far as they have, I'm gonna put down effectively a summary of the situation with them up to now, split up turn by turn, with explanations as to why things then happened as they did. I realize their stubbornness and repeated resurgences may have felt a bit ass-pully at times, particularly since I was tweaking their mechanics as I went, and also effectively left the mechanisms of how they operated relatively opaquely to y'all, so perhaps some retroactive clarity might help on that end.
Turns 1-2: Orks muddle about on the north continent, warboss generation rolls fail.
Turn 3: Warboss Wurkaz Slashytoof spawns, spends the turn uniting the various warbands and clans under his control.
Turn 4: Wurkaz goes south to the main continent, makes landfall and begins fighting the Ayacmanik. Strength for strength he's about on par with the Ayacmanik, with both sides unable to bring the majority of their forces to bear straight away - Wurkaz has his Big Mek begin construction of the giant boat hangar that would facilitate more naval transport for his boyz, and the Ayacmanik begin pulling back from the cordons they'd set up around your cities. Astral projecting slann find the orks.
Turn 5: Not much happens here, mostly continuing the grind against the Aya. The boat super-factory nears completion.
Turn 6: Pretty sure Wurkaz hit a high roll here or something, resulting in him making major gains and establishing a proper beachhead. Seeing this, and wishing to prevent the orks from building up steam, the lizardmen send chameleon skinks to assassinate Wurkaz, and destroy the boat super-factory with a geomantic ritual, courtesy of Mazdamundi. Big Mek Orkfred remains on the northern continent.
Turn 7: Ork momentum completely stops with the death of the warboss, as the hordes begin to fight each other to decide the new leader. Ayacmanik press them back, but aren't able to fully evict them, only shrink their territory somewhat. Orkfred becomes a Mek-Boss, and starts building multiple smaller boat assembly factories, losing boyz to desertion since he ain't fighting anything. Warphead Squinty Deffstare recieves vague premonitions hinting at lizardmen presence, and begins recruiting to go find them. He is promptly assassinated by chameleon skinks and his entire expedition is slaughtered. Grungrok Ironfist successfully proves himself as the next warboss. The Mind Fog is purged from the Sublime Communion.
Turn 8: Orkfred completes a number of his boat factories and sails south with a huge force of 104 million boyz. He promptly crit-fails his navigation roll and half of his forces wind up with Grungrok, enabling him to withstand the surge of Ayacmanik that effectively repels Orkfred from making a substantial landing point at all. A three-way war begins between Orkfred, Grungrok, and the Ayacmanik, causing ork XP gain to increase. Orkfred invents aircraft.
Turn 9: Orkfred makes gains against Grungrok due to higher tech levels and non-bungled reinforcements from the north. Grungrok rolls high against the Ayacmanik, and levels up, gaining an underling (Pain Dok Hurkwitz) and massively increased territory. He begins to industrialize, marking the point where both ork factions can effectively out-attrition the Ayacmanik so long as they retain territory. A few Thunder Lizards wander into Grungrok, but don't accomplish a whole lot beyond killing a bunch of orks that then respawn from claimed territory. In response, the lizardmen assassinate Hurkwitz, Orkfred, Grungrok, destroy Orkfred's dakkajet factory to prevent him from discovering the lizardmen's (rapidly growing and teching up) presence, and straight-up erase the 200+ million orks on the northern continent with a Mag 3 Tsunami, which also damages the ork coastal settlements and wakes up Isendral. Fortunate turn planning means the lizardmen meet her shortly afterwards, and prevent her from forming any cranky preconceptions about what might be going on.
Turn 10: Orks collapse into massive infighting with every viable leadership candidate killed. Ayacmanik throw everything at them, but the spread of technology and collective XP accrual from Orkfred and Grungrok's legacies respectively mean that the orks can outcompete them at a baseline level, and so conflict with the Aya no longer causes any meaningful casualties - over the multi-year timespans this game runs on - but instead actually causes their population to grow at an increased rate. The lizardmen decide that enough is enough and dispatch a sizeable chunk of their population (roughly 4 million or so) to go fuck the orks up, as well as using a geomantic ritual or two to piece up the boyz (and the continent as well, which they literally split down to the bedrock as a large-scale divide and conquer strategy). A few cracked tectonic plates and vaporized cities later, roughly ten percent of all the lizardmen alive (roughly 1 million, or a quarter of the forces deployed) have died in exchange for roughly 72 million dead orks and 2 warbosses, as well as stealing a shit-ton of their tech for reverse engineering - at a 72:1 casualty ratio, this is relatively respectable, particularly since about 30 million of those were done by the actual lizardmen rather than their magical nukes. 30:1 K
with your mooks when you're fighting an industrialized war with swords and shields is pretty decent, all in all. Of the emerging warboss candidates, only Urdgob Noseskorcha and Gardakka Worldhamma remain.Turn 11: Urdgob and Gardakka continue to battle against each other and everything else in their general vicinity, including throwing around 50 million boyz at the lizardmen. Each take in excess of 50% population casualties, but since Urdgob's the only one to lose a bit of territory, his population shrinks by roughly 20 million, while Gardakka's grows by about 20 million. This is pretty much the orks at their most annoying, where you can literally kill more of them in a turn than they started with and they'll still end up with higher population so long as their territory is intact (well, at higher levels, these guys couldn't quite manage that). The lizardmen, having invented magitek machine guns, sniper rifles, bombs, artillery, anti-air guns, and a god of death in the meantime, have the slann fart out 1.4 times their previous turn's casualties in freshly spawned reinforcements and throw several hundred mega-tornadoes at one of the orks (Gardakka, closer to the north coast) as a preliminary warmup. They smack down the ork attacks in exchange for basically negligible casualties, assassinate Urdgob, whose territory they didn't muck up, and bulldoze through to claim Gardakka's territory while he's scooping up the remainder of Urdgob's forces, which also happens to strategically cut Gardakka off from retreating onto the main continent. He tries to punch through with an army but the slann turn sunlight into a giant mass of razor blades and chop them all up, so it doesn't work and Gardakka is surrounded.
Turn 12: The Ayacmanik, who still try (and fail) to finish off Gardakka, prove of use to the lizardmen as they vacuum up stray feral orks, preventing any armies from spawning in newly-claimed territory and saving many lizard-hours in cleansing it. Gardakka, who's managed to maintain roughly the same population as he had last turn by conquering the remainder of Urdgob's boyz. This combined with all the fighting causes him to level up again, gaining a Big Mek underling named Tunzak, who he sends with a bunch of land-boat tanks to get to a river and sail to the south ocean, in an attempt to escape the lizardmen cordon while he does the same to the north by punching through the blockade of Ayacmanik and creating a small city on the north shore. In response, and fresh off of learning that they and the orks are distantly related, the lizardmen teleport Gardakka and his city, despite his best efforts, on top of Tunzak's force, squishing both. Then they throw a 2 million strong army at the disorganized survivors and crushed them utterly. Gardakka tries to blow himself and the city remnants up to take the lizardmen with him, and instead gets his head removed and his body thrown into space. He's still alive because ork, just taken captive for Lizardy Purposes. Also the attacking force the orks sent to lizardmen territory got deleted unceremoniously again.
Turn 13: Gardakka's territory shrinks some and the Ayacmanik press in due to some minor infighting happening among the horde. Some boyz try to rescue Gardakka, some rush off to conquer territory, some fight each other. An enterprising mek invents the nuclear bomb, and they're a quick fad, poised to massively expand ork territory if all goes well for team green. Unfortunately for them, the lizardmen have thought of an Appropriate, Reasonable, Proportionate Response to their continued shenanigans, and use the captured Gardakka as the centerpiece of a ritual that will explosively delete the entire Waaagh!!! at once. The ork ecosystem panics at this and hits the big red button that lets them massively increase their population growth and cohesion for a short time (at the probable cost of Consequences later if they succeed) and beelines with all available forces towards where the ritual is being held. Which is of course Itza, the oldest and strongest lizardmen city that is an exponentially harder nut to crack than the newer frontier settlements, that themselves have previously repulsed double-digit million strong ork armies without suffering significant damage. And there's a Geomantic Ritual buffing all of Itza's defenders while all of this is going on, among many other things.
And that's about it up to this point! May have been a slog to get here, but when you view it end to end, it's actually been a pretty steady upward climb for you guys.
I mean, if you want to make one, go ahead, but I don't have one. I do the good wordings, I'm only a dabbling amateur when it comes to visual art.
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