[HALP] me! (WORM quest)

[unsanity]

Does Sophia consider the Protectorate/Wards to be enemies, considering that she was forced into the Wards? I'm worried that one of the heroes will be fighting against an unpowered gang member, and she'll want to fight against the hero. Of course, Sophia wouldn't necessarily act on that urge for conflict because of the risk of being thrown into juvie for breaking her probation. I just don't know if we can trust Sophia to do the logical thing.

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Not necessarily. Right now, Sophia's conflict drive is always on, full blast, all the time (or, that's what I gather). Even if she feels the urge to fight heroes for picking on gang members, she was already feeling that in the first place. Her behavior in that specific context shouldn't change.

Granted, I'm banking on the assumption that her drive is maxed in all areas, and [Shift] can't (or won't) do anything screwy like pushing it even higher to compensate for something that isn't always on.

 

[Kejmur]

I kind of want to contact [Charge], so we can see what Cauldron powers/shards look like.

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Cauldron shards are kind of dead, so I suspect that we wouldn't get an answer. But it could also mean no problems in eating those shards or freely taking information they produce (if they keep doing it). In a way manipulating situation where host decides to get close to Palanquin would be most ideal here. It is possible for Eden shards to be still alive though (like L33T's shard is supposed to be Eden shard).

I don't want to contact any more Shards until we get an offensive power to use against Shards if necessary. The power would also be useful if talking to Shift doesn't work out, and The Administrator has to eat it. After all, if Shift is stunned, it can't broadcast to all of the other addresses it has that it's being eaten.

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I think it would be possible to 'stun' it indeed as Administrator is capable of pulling Khepri after all, which means full control. In other words here Administrator would 'paralyze' Shift and eat it afterwards or eat it while it's paralyzed.

Does Sophia consider the Protectorate/Wards to be enemies, considering that she was forced into the Wards? I'm worried that one of the heroes will be fighting against an unpowered gang member, and she'll want to fight against the hero. Of course, Sophia wouldn't necessarily act on that urge for conflict because of the risk of being thrown into juvie for breaking her probation. I just don't know if we can trust Sophia to do the logical thing.

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Timeline wise I don't think Sophia is part of the Wards yet? Taylor mentioned words 'only 1,5 years more for this to end' which... means that bullying didn't seriously start to escalate yet? I think if I remember right it was 18 months of constant bullying campaign before she triggered, right? So I may be wrong, but I think that whole 'Emma betrayal' thing barely started if my assumptions are right.

And frankly? I don't think Sophia would attack a hero, but if for example she ended up in a situation where hero saves a Nazi, I think she could do something aggresive. Especially earlier in timeline where there is no 'juvie' thing over her head.

 

[Mount. Elements]

I think it would be possible to 'stun' it indeed as Administrator is capable of pulling Khepri after all, which means full control. In other words here Administrator would 'paralyze' Shift and eat it afterwards or eat it while it's paralyzed.

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We can research Overload I and/or DDoS I in order to figure out how to "stun" Shards. I prefer Overload because it requires Thinker info instead of Trump info.

 

[Vhalidictes]

I think it would be possible to 'stun' it indeed as Administrator is capable of pulling Khepri after all, which means full control. In other words here Administrator would 'paralyze' Shift and eat it afterwards or eat it while it's paralyzed.

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Note that you can do this. In fact, you can attempt to perform any action you can think of (including unlocked but not complete Research options).

Of course, instead of an auto-success, you would be subject to rolling for successes (every time). In effect, you would be doing the equivalent of "live testing" research with no safeguards.

In an emergency situation that isn't always a bad idea...

 

[Parzival95]

Though of some more goals to pursue. Saving Mouse Protector and Canary

Both are comin up relatively soon and would require talking to Taylor and giving her a mover power, or jacking their shards. Canary would be easy to stop the accident, Mouse Protector we could second trigger under Bonesaws knife with some ridiculous escape power. She would ping off the S9 too, now that I think of it, so something trump.

P.S. Another wild idea. Either we befriend Ziz or not, we either have Ziz pretend Canary's scream negates hers, or actually buff it that way in case Ziz is unavoidably hostile. Maybe so that her master power overrides all other?

 

[Mount. Elements]

Does anyone know whether Sophia is part of the Wards yet? I think we're a couple of months from the locker, and the Trio turned down the bullying for a while beforehand because the PRT caught her, but I don't know exact timelines. If Sophia isn't part of the Wards, it's a bit safer to eat her Shard.

Generally though, I'd like to try negotiating with any Shards we meet for a bit before possibly eating them unless they're currently trying to murder The Administrator or its host(s). I just feel like jumping to eating other Shards first thing would result in a bad end, even if we manage to hide The Administrator's aberrance. Plus, negotiation with Shift gives us more experience on how we can deal with other Shards once we meet them.

 

[Kejmur]

Though of some more goals to pursue. Saving Mouse Protector and Canary

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It may be interesting to be closer to Mouse Protector to also learn how to understand better Cluster Trigger kiss/kill dynamics as a shard. Also depending on mechanics in this quest contacting one of those shards also means gaining access to other shards by proxy as they have 'stable connection' with each other if they are part of cluster trigger. Although this also possibly means that if they are hostile, they may 'team up' against us so I would be careful.

Canary pretty sure has dead shard, so this may be more tricky to do. Although... it may be possible to simply eat her shard and save her this way. Because they can't send her to the Birdcage if she isn't parahuman anymore. It will cause A CRAPLOAD of problems and if they connect it to us... it may mean trouble. Also whole 'Canary case' is a pretty public case with good amount of shards being around her, so it may bring attention we don't want if this goes wrong.

Both are comin up relatively soon and would require talking to Taylor and giving her a mover power, or jacking their shards. Canary would be easy to stop the accident, Mouse Protector we could second trigger under Bonesaws knife with some ridiculous escape power. She would ping off the S9 too, now that I think of it, so something trump.

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Personally I would still go for something close to 'human projections' power. Or even something similar to Genesis power would work perfectly fine as well. It won't be absurdly strong (human limits are human limits), but taking into account how versatile we can be as humans (and deadly with proper equipment), it should cover all we need really. Including for example 'driver' which could act as our 'Mover'. I just need to think on how to make it work trigger and data wise... if people are interested that is.

Second trigger on MP is a pretty good idea though with good amount of Mover data in. It should be also more then traumatic enough to cause that trigger. And yes, it should end up with a Trump as parahuman directly causes trigger, although I wonder what Bonesaw ping could provide Mover-wise... so maybe it may need something else, like Biological Breaker where Mouse Protector 'melts' to escape while freely manipulate her own biomass or something. No idea how second triggers work with Grab-Bag capes though.

P.S. Another wild idea. Either we befriend Ziz or not, we either have Ziz pretend Canary's scream negates hers, or actually buff it that way in case Ziz is unavoidably hostile. Maybe so that her master power overrides all other?

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In this case I think we need to find living Eden Shard as those should still be able to directly contact Endbringers, as Eden is the one responsible for them? Also Simurgh works against Zion, so if we do this, we need to be very, very careful about it.

Does anyone know whether Sophia is part of the Wards yet? I think we're a couple of months from the locker, and the Trio turned down the bullying for a while beforehand because the PRT caught her, but I don't know exact timelines. If Sophia isn't part of the Wards, it's a bit safer to eat her Shard.

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According to timeline at August 31st, 2010. Then... she may actually be a Ward member if we are currently about 4-5 months before Taylor's trigger. Never mind then. Correct me if I'm wrong though.

Generally though, I'd like to try negotiating with any Shards we meet for a bit before possibly eating them unless they're currently trying to murder The Administrator or its host(s). I just feel like jumping to eating other Shards first thing would result in a bad end, even if we manage to hide The Administrator's aberrance. Plus, negotiation with Shift gives us more experience on how we can deal with other Shards once we meet them.

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Dead shards I would suggest to simply eat. Non-sentient ones give few turns to check how they react to us. If it's too much work to 'teach' them anything - eat them.

With sapient ones - full cooperation unless they are hostile. Researching 'stun' technique should work here just in case. Also research on 'sneaky' way to steal their data would also be something worth to consider.

 

[unsanity]

Note that you can do this. In fact, you can attempt to perform any action you can think of (including unlocked but not complete Research options).

Of course, instead of an auto-success, you would be subject to rolling for successes (every time). In effect, you would be doing the equivalent of "live testing" research with no safeguards.

In an emergency situation that isn't always a bad idea...

Click to shrink...

Does "live testing" count as researching?

 

[Vhalidictes]

Does anyone know whether Sophia is part of the Wards yet? I think we're a couple of months from the locker, and the Trio turned down the bullying for a while beforehand because the PRT caught her, but I don't know exact timelines. If Sophia isn't part of the Wards, it's a bit safer to eat her Shard.

Generally though, I'd like to try negotiating with any Shards we meet for a bit before possibly eating them unless they're currently trying to murder The Administrator or its host(s). I just feel like jumping to eating other Shards first thing would result in a bad end, even if we manage to hide The Administrator's aberrance. Plus, negotiation with Shift gives us more experience on how we can deal with other Shards once we meet them.

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It is 58 days until the Locker, from today (assuming I'm calculating this properly).

Re: NOM NOM - Maybe you should consider the difference between [Zion] and [Eden] Shards. It's reasonable to assume that even if Scion notices you eating a "disconnected" Shard there's any number of (good) explanations you could give. Aside from that it's not like anyone is recording [Eden] Shard deaths right now. At this point it would practically count as Information salvage.

Does "live testing" count as researching?

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Sure, if it's pre-planned. If you're doing it as a emergency move, likely not.

 

[w34v3r]

Jury rig might also be train wreck.

 

[Redshirt Army]

Maybe you should consider the difference between [Zion] and [Eden] Shards. It's reasonable to assume that even if Scion notices you eating a "disconnected" Shard there's any number of (good) explanations you could give. Aside from that it's not like anyone is recording [Eden] Shard deaths right now. At this point it would practically count as Information salvage.

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Hmm.

[x] Contact [Charge], and check if it's a dead Eden shard, as we'd expect it to be if it is Battery's power.
-[x] Check if Cauldron granted shards are capable of communication/autonomous functionality at all.
-[x] Decide after a thorough examination if you want to eat [Charge] / take all its data.

 

[Parzival95]

So we're go for eating Cauldron shards then. More ideas for shenanigans:

Create a personal avatar or monstrous cape in the form of Incubator that can only be seen by young girls 18 and under, that grants magical girl powers via contract. Variety of powers all with transformation breaker states, as anime as we can make them. Maybe even with soul gem lichdom. Works even on people with powers. Magical Girl Dinah, something math themed.

Have an avatar or host with a high end stranger power to hide themselves and the trump power to manipulate the settings on other parahumans, maybe even to steal powers and give them to other people, but not be used by the host. Called Admin, of course.

 

[Ducats]

I have some power builds and ideas here.

[] Shaman
-[] Thinker 100. Can talk to the deceased by calling up their spirit (either a post-cog reconstruction or actual soul (I would not be surprised if the entities can fuck with souls if they exist)), this is done through going to the location they died, using a piece of the body of the deceased or a precious item. Spirits can share memories and senses with the host if they so wish allowing scouting and increased understanding between host and spirit.
--[] Shaker Assist power: Can make the spirit visible and audible, but not corporeal.
-[] Trump 50. The host can synchronize with spirits they summon, allowing them to use the skills of the deceased. This can be done with multiple spirits with no upper limit, but dependent on host and spirits cooperating with each other, if a spirit is uncooperative the host will have to compensate for their lack of assistance (Basically the host can either get help with the synchro form the spirits, if they don't they will have to do it completely by themself splitting their attention, cooperative spirits can compensate for uncooperative ones). In a willing synchro the spirits thoughts and memories will be completely open to the host and vice versa (This is done to actually make a willing synchro something not as easy as befriending a spirit, there will need to be actual trust or extentuating circumstances).
-[] Trump 100, Striker 50. Spirits can be infused into compatible items (items of significant value to the spirit) giving the item a power based on the item, spirit and compatibility with between item and spirit, this will take a lot of effort dependent on the hosts familiarity with the spirit (So a spirit the host is very familiar with can be infused without taking a lot of time, but a spirit the host is unfamiliar with would take a decent amount of time). An infused item can synchronize with a wielder of said item the same way the host can with spirits in general, synchro between item and wielder can have an effect on the power of the item, some wielders will make the power weaker if they are not a good match (up to the power not being possible to use at all) or if the compatibility is high will increase the power's strength (As you might imagine, if the spirit and wielder is synching a lot their compatibility will get higher over time).
--[] Trump Assist Power: The spirit in the item can disenchant themselves if they want to, the host can do this too at touch range, concerted effort is needed to disenchant and item so no battle disenchants.

The shaman power is mostly inspired by shamans from Shaman King, but is also a power that allows for rezzing someone if they were to be infused into a clone, a person or a body they are compatible with (if someone want to be a dragon, they can).

Also @Vhalidictes what is the state of metaphysical realms in this universe, Wildbow was not interested in talking about it since it is not relevant to the story he told. So are there any astral planes, afterlives, souls in your quest. I am mostly asking since I would not be surprised if the entities had cracked psionics, magic and souls if they exists (Having a soul is only comforting until someone figures out how to turn souls into an energy source (FMA)).

[] Detective
-[] Thinker 150, Striker 50. Touch based psychometry, allows host to gather information on an item, location or person they are in physical contact with, allowing them to get an analysis of the target and information from its history. The host can mimic the information that they gather from their power (Allows them to use the skills previous wielders, reenact a situation they have gathered from a location, or to mimic a person they have been in contact with for a short while)

The detective power is more or less designed to be given to an investigator and I hope that we will be able to get a host that is on the force or part of an organization that will put their skills and power to good use. Also, if the host gets high mastery of the power they should be able to do touch-based mind reading.

I also have a proposal that is not based on giving a host power, but instead us using a master effect to affect a large populace. I propose that we zap a town with an effect that will give every inhabitant in the town the urge to build things, this will be a one time thing and not a field. I also want us to not give any of them any tinker powers, I would mostly just want to see what thousands of people would build and invent if you gave them a tinker urge without a power. I came up with this when I was thinking about how few worm fanfics have non-tinkers make homemade devices, I find that weird since a regular person could make a lot of gadgets that would be helpful without alien tech (you don't need to be the most dedicated nerd or an engineer to make a tracker for example)

 

[Parzival95]

I was just think of a power called Shaman.

My idea was to second trigger Bitch like full on Animal Man, with power over and understanding of all animals, not just dogs. And a changer/breaker power to shapeshift partially or entirely into animals.

P.S. Other people may be tired of the undersiders, but I still like them as sympathetic villains trying to be your friendly neighborhood yakuza.

Other second triggers:

Grue: change his darkness into psyhadelic disorienting tye-dye. Full senory suppression, power dampening/negation and copying

Regent: Body jacking chain lightning, with electrical themed flight mover/breaker state. Master effect is very short lived, requires repeated uses or long zaps. Control over lethality/ stunning/knock out

Tattletale: increased senses and awareness of everything around her, sees through objects, Batman detective visoion basically, and unblockable invisible blaster power. Similar to stilling or sting but not quite as powerful or lethal

 

[Ducats]

I was just think of a power called Shaman.

My idea was to second trigger Bitch like full on Animal Man, with power over and understanding of all animals, not just dogs. And a changer/breaker power to shapeshift partially or entirely into animals.

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Sounds a bit more like totem to me. Also would this power give her better understanding of humans or does she still need a lot of therapy for that to happen?

 

[Kejmur]

The shaman power is mostly inspired by shamans from Shaman King, but is also a power that allows for rezzing someone if they were to be infused into a clone, a person or a body they are compatible with (if someone want to be a dragon, they can).

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If this is possible, then I would possibly vote for this one. It's a fun power, but also not completely broken as skills gained this way aren't supernatural. Unless it would also work with 'dead capes' then it suddenly become that much stronger. In Brockton Bay there are some dead capes like Iron Rain or All-Father which could be really good spirits to 'summon'.

The detective power is more or less designed to be given to an investigator and I hope that we will be able to get a host that is on the force or part of an organization that will put their skills and power to good use. Also, if the host gets high mastery of the power they should be able to do touch-based mind reading.

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There is very few stories which actually touch on an idea that parahumans may work with forces like FBI, CIA or BPPD and do it in secret, while for example being dissapointed with PRT / Protectorate as a whole.

In Deputy there is mention of Synod in FBI, but this one isn't... exactly willing. But interesting idea anyway.

In Taylor Hebert: Death Knight (Worm/Warcraft Crossover AU) she works with BPPD only in Brockton Bay as a hero and refuses to do the same with PRT/Protectorate. Which is also an interesting idea.

Another idea I would like to consider is to create parahuman(s) which directly help out US Military in secret, which could also be interesting. Thinker which train very quickly troops and may learn mundane skills very fast or something similar.

I also have a proposal that is not based on giving a host power, but instead us using a master effect to affect a large populace. I propose that we zap a town with an effect that will give every inhabitant in the town the urge to build things, this will be a one time thing and not a field. I also want us to not give any of them any tinker powers, I would mostly just want to see what thousands of people would build and invent if you gave them a tinker urge without a power. I came up with this when I was thinking about how few worm fanfics have non-tinkers make homemade devices, I find that weird since a regular person could make a lot of gadgets that would be helpful without alien tech (you don't need to be the most dedicated nerd or an engineer to make a tracker for example)

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It could be permanent if place isn't too big enough and presence of PRT / Protectorate is minimal. Like canon Stafford. Like a very mild version of a Heartbreaker, which can grant 'building urges' in some isolated town or something. I agree this is a fun and interesting idea.

Sounds a bit more like totem to me. Also would this power give her better understanding of humans or does she still need a lot of therapy for that to happen?

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Humans are in theory animals, so... human totem could be possible? But this also sounds intriguing.

 

[Parzival95]

Well since I'm all about trying to help sympathetic hosts, sure, no reason not to fix her people problem. I added the rest of the original undersiders above, trying to think of what we second trigger Parian, Imp, and Flechette as now. Also if we seconded triggered them, they could just pretend to be new capes. Who would believe someone could wholesale alter powers like that, or that a whole team would second trigger at once?

P.S. I like how flexible your mechanics are Vhal. Let's us be more narrative focused and hand wave annoying details.

 

[Parzival95]

Kejmur we could do your thing pretty easily, just find a small town in the middle of nowhere with no parahumans. Just got make sure there's no sentient shard nearby to notice.

P.S. After all those edits I finally double posted by accident. Woe be me.

 

[Ducats]

Well since I'm all about trying to help sympathetic hosts, sure, no reason not to fix her people problem. I added the rest of the original undersiders above, trying to think of what we second trigger Parian, Imp, and Flechette as now. Also if we seconded triggered them, they could just pretend to be new capes. Who would believe someone could wholesale alter powers like that, or that a whole team would second trigger at once?

P.S. I like how flexible your mechanics are Vhal. Let's us be more narrative focused and hand wave annoying details.

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Thank for clarifying the power, also I am with you on having a soft spot for the Undersiders, they are very interesting, but they tend to get annoying fast since people tend to whitewash them because admitting that you find people who are just straight up not good people interesting is something that most people are averse to.

 

[Parzival95]

Well they're not squeaky clean Legend or New Wave or even Dragon (there's a joke) but they're not really heels either. They're people trying to get by best they can, they've made some mistakes, but they come through for the light side when the chips are down and even the heroes have failed. Bunch of no good meddling kids.

And that just makes it all the more embarrassing for the PRT, that the kids they screwed over, Parian and Foil too, turn around and accomplish even greater deeds.

S.P. What's SV policy on swearing does anyone know? I've caught myself a few times, never know if someone will be offended.

 

[Vhalidictes]

Also @Vhalidictes what is the state of metaphysical realms in this universe, Wildbow was not interested in talking about it since it is not relevant to the story he told. So are there any astral planes, afterlives, souls in your quest. I am mostly asking since I would not be surprised if the entities had cracked psionics, magic and souls if they exists (Having a soul is only comforting until someone figures out how to turn souls into an energy source (FMA)).

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That's a really good question. In fact I think you'll find that asking the right questions is a big differentiator between you and Cauldron.

Things you know:
1) You exist and aren't the original QA.
2) Dimensions and something something 1982. [Warning! Memetic hazards, Things Shards Aren't Meant To Know.]
3) The QM has implied that you can research true telepathy.

Edit: I wrote a story about Scion eating a Sailor Scout's star seed, packaging it as a Shard, and connecting it to Taylor. (THE SUN, if you're curious). That should tell you everything at you need to know. That was a multilevel statement.

 

[Parzival95]

Good to know you're going to be looser than Wildbow or even Unsanitys hard sci-fi, no psionic, impenetrable clarketech interpretation.
I find it's better, especially in quests, to allow for narrative hand waving. Trying to maintain rigid consitinceny in mechanics is one of those narrative traps.

You want something like the last Airbender, where viewers can extrapolate how the system will develop without relying on cliches but leaving enough room that hithero unknown mechanics can be introduced and slot into place. It's a fine line.

P.S. just realize that Flechette and March's Sting is almost certainly sentient. On the one hand, it's insanely powerful and probably one of the original shards, a step above the rest in terms of eating shards. On the other hand, Zion and Eden would've been wary of letting a single sentient shard have that much power, and probably gave it ridiculous restrictions on intelligence.

P.S.S. Either way, I think we can all agree that pissing off Sting is an automatic bad end.

 

[TigerTitian]

[] Shaman

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[] Detective

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Power list updated.

 

[The_GrandMage]

Things to consider with [Shift]: Does it even have a way to keep sorted data we give it back as separate things? I think we need to try branching off a fraction of our mind, patterning it on the pre-sapience [Shift] has, and work out a way to program it to properly store data so we can have a way to automate this process going forward.

Second, [Shift] and Sophia is an issue. Mostly for [Shift]. That type lack of pack mentality when dealing with a Shard-Net is bad and needs to be addressed. However, we have to watch out for, you know, negating our Host's Trigger. I suggest we wait until they start backing off to plan the locker in December, then slowly have Sophia's conflict toned down to removal at the Locker incident. Work [Shift] up to either proxy allowing us into Sophia's dreams, or setting it up to Dream Master itself if that's not possible so we can torment her with the locker after it, showing she's no better than the Villains she hates, and basically try to shock her into actually experiencing guilt. If we work Taylor over right that should hopefully cut the Trio down, after the Trigger, to levels Taylor can deal with. Depends how long it takes [Shift] to hit sapience. We've got a year, it says, so I think trying to correct Sophia after the Trigger is fine.

Hey, QM, I noticed the addresses we got had some labels applied. Is that because we guessed them correctly, or just what we think they are? Want to know how much to trust the ones we have.

[X] Contact Emote.
We need to see what Cauldron Shards are like and he should have plenty of useful data for harvesting.
[X] Try to create a copy of [Shift] in our mindscape to figure out the best way to program non-sentient shards to do specific tasks, IE, sort their damn data.

 

[Parzival95]

Well have to cull options any way so you may well as ultimate trump to the list.

Basically slender man from Manager fanfic

Taylor can manipulate powers in their entirety. She can steal powers, keep them for herself, and give them to other people. She can trigger potential parahumans if it can be done in a way that pleases the shards. She can manipulate the settings on the power. Since she can only powers up to her slot limit, she can also combine power into greater powers, and divide them into smaller powers. Powers will take a different form from the original if taken and given to another host. Striker/trump for initial theft and manipulation power.

Theft may be replace with copying if we can't do it without pissing off shards.