Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)

[X] Plan everyone relevant
-[X] Fae Courts
-[X] White Court
--[X] Through Lara
-[X] White Council
--[X] Merlin only

We are looking at masquerade breakdown here, this is obviously a part of the setup by Nemesis (also, Uriel's comment to Charity about global warming feels much more multi-layered now). Involved people need to know. Fae courts can affect global weather. White Court are the ones holding a lot of media under their control. White Council is likely to be the target of Nemesis. So... Yeah, they need to know.
This and that are currently unconnected plots though. This is a means by which nemesis would advance the masquerade breakdown, but the actual plan they were created to facilitate is more standard outsider stuff.
White council already has nemesis assets we haven't figured out how to prove.
We have two answers to that. The first one is the method we've had nearly all quest; using Ebenezer as a hand off point for the white council list because he'll prepare for all reasonable scenarios instead of reflexively deny it.

The second is to roll it up in this situation to hand off to the Archive. Attribute as much information as we can to eating nemesis shards giving us temporary access to its knowledge. Ivy doesn't need to cite her sources to quite the same degree as we do in this, as shown by how things went with the summer court.

Lay out the various plots and pieces nemesis has on the board and its new counter plan so we can justify asking her to do some legwork herself here. Preferably after we use our three foci to steal as much as we can of nemesis's secrets to add in.

Best option would be to use both. Savage nemesis's resources to limit its ability to worsen and benefit from the masquerade coming down.
 
[X] Plan everyone relevant

If we do break the Masquerade, taking precautions so Nemesis doesn't benefits from it should be a priority.
 
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[X] No one else, let the Archive decide if she wants to bring others in

I don't think this move is one Nemesis engineered specifically for breaking the Masquerade; its been in the works since way before Molly exalted, if I read it right.

It is, however, a possible vector for shattering the Masquerade. Wouldn't surprise me if there were a few backup plans already made for people to go loud if they're discovered. And the more time we give 'em, the more they can build up.
 
[X] Plan everyone relevant
-[X] Fae Courts
-[X] White Court
--[X] Through Lara
-[X] White Council
--[X] Merlin only
 
So just brainstorming here so other people can start thinking on it aswell.

If we start looking into breaking the Masquerade before our enemies do after arranging for it as best we can with existing parties we'll probably want a method of bringing more people from our world at a faster rate without a portal.

The best method I can think of so far is to have Molly with the help of the smartest minds in her world create a "Shrink Station" to shrink down prepared containment units of somesort -boxes that can safely hold multiple people and or equipment maybe- then have soilders and diplomats ect, shrink themselves down and get into the containment cubes.

Molly would then only have to show up in her world to pick the shrunk containment cubes up and... She would need a way to unshrink them. So the effect would have to be temporary on top of that. It wouldn't eliminate the issue of Molly having to be the bridge so to speak but it would speed things up drasticly.

The way I see it if creating a portal to another world maybe possible given time and resource, then we should also have a lot of off-the-wall less conventional solutions that don't involve a portal to Molly's soul.
 
So just brainstorming here so other people can start thinking on it aswell.

If we start looking into breaking the Masquerade before our enemies do after arranging for it as best we can with existing parties we'll probably want a method of bringing more people from our world at a faster rate without a portal.

The best method I can think of so far is to have Molly with the help of the smartest minds in her world create a "Shrink Station" to shrink down prepared containment units of somesort -boxes that can safely hold multiple people and or equipment maybe- then have soilders and diplomats ect, shrink themselves down and get into the containment cubes.

Molly would then only have to show up in her world to pick the shrunk containment cubes up and... She would need a way to unshrink them. So the effect would have to be temporary on top of that. It wouldn't eliminate the issue of Molly having to be the bridge so to speak but it would speed things up drasticly.

The way I see it if creating a portal to another world maybe possible given time and resource, then we should also have a lot of off-the-wall less conventional solutions that don't involve a portal to Molly's soul.
Summoning.

We can't get mortals out that way, but spirits don't have the same risk of true death hanging over them.


Get some of our people trained up, personally call for volunteers among the spirits of the FCF, and set up the sort of large scale calling operation that would be madness if you didn't control both sides of the line.

The shrinking thing would only matter for equipment anyway, because the charm counts people and not mass. DP has said there's a size limit to Sutra we can bring through, so we're not going to be able to cheese it that way either.
 
I don't think that the White Council a whole is the best org to contact for this. If we had his number I would contact Rashid.

Edit: Actually I bet the Archive has his number.
[X] No one else, let the Archive decide if she wants to bring others in
 
@BoredMan

Another thing to note is that the Ancient Sorcery spell we planned to use for temporary portals got a ruling specifically saying it would trigger violence from Molly's exaltation. I'm not sure any lesser magic we can use would get around that for placing arbitrary permanent passages.

What we might be able to get away with is a splendor using this:

Private Idaho (3 pt. Root Element)
This Element creates a mystical "pocket" realm, accessible only through the Splendor. The
Splendor must possess at least one Form Element with a character, which both defines the style
and possibilities of the private realm, and defines the shape of the object which serves as means
of entry to the realm. The Splendor must also possess a location-type Form element, such as
Form of the Hearth. This dictates the size of the pocket Realm, rather than causing the Splendor
to affect a widespread area as it normally would.
As an Adornment, only the user may enter this pocket realm. They must pay a point of
Willpower while wearing the Splendor to do so. They leave a faint mystical imprint upon the
world while in their pocket realm, and must spend another point of Willpower to return to the
world at the point of that imprint.
As a Fascination, the Splendor itself serves as a doorway into and out of the pocket Realm, at
least for those who know the trick of triggering Private Idaho to admit them. Those already
inside may leave at any time through an obvious doorway, unless other Elements are used to
confound such attempts.
If the Splendor is destroyed or banished (or, in the case of Adornments, removed) while anyone
is inside the pocket realm, they are violently ejected back into the real world at their point of
departure, taking (Splendor's rating) in levels of lethal damage.

These are the form elements for reference:

Form of the Hearth (2 pt. Form Element)
This Element can only be incorporated into Fascinations.
The Exalt touches a building or a spot of land about the size of a family home or a local
playground when summoning the Splendor. It exists as an enchantment cast over the entire
structure or a small defined outdoors area ("the gazebo and the area right around it"). The
Splendor is coded with conditions and instructions on how to interact with the affected region.
Root Elements such as Beautiful Lie (see p. XX) can then go to work upon any valid target in the
area. Realizing that there's something weird about the enchanted area requires a Perception +
Awareness roll against difficulty (4 + Splendor's rating).
If this is the only Form Element a Splendor has, the difficulty of rolls to resist it are lowered by
one, and it manifests in the form of a feature that would make sense in the environment (a table
in a house) but is slightly out of date or out of fashion.
Form of the Keep (4 pt. Form Element)
This Element can only be incorporated into Fascinations.
The Exalt touches a spot of land, or building or collection of buildings about the size of a manor
house, high school, or large local park when summoning the Splendor. It exists as an
enchantment cast over the entire structure or a large defined outdoor area ("this entire street and
both of the sidewalks"). The Splendor is coded with conditions and instructions on how to
interact with the affected region. Root Elements such as Beautiful Lie (see p. XX) can then go to
work upon any valid target in the area. Realizing that there's something weird about the
enchanted area requires a Perception + Awareness roll against difficulty (4 + Splendor's rating).
If this is the only Form Element a Splendor has, the difficulty of rolls to resist it are lowered by
one, and it manifests in the form of a feature that would make sense in the environment (a tree or
bench in a park) but is slightly out of date or out of fashion
Form of the Castle (6 pt. Form Element)
This Element can only be incorporated into Fascinations.
The Exalt touches a spot of land and enchants up to several city blocks worth of ordinary
wilderness, urban, or suburban landscape, or touches a single megastructure such as a skyscraper
when summoning the Splendor. It exists as an enchantment cast over the entire massive building
or defined district ("all of Compton"). The Splendor is coded with conditions and instructions on
how to interact with the affected region. Root Elements such as Beautiful Lie (see p. XX) can
then go to work upon any valid target in the area. Realizing that there's something weird about
the enchanted area requires a Perception + Awareness roll against difficulty (4 + Splendor's
rating).
If this is the only Form Element a Splendor has, the difficulty of rolls to resist it are lowered by
one, and it manifests in the form of a feature that would make sense in the environment (a
mailbox on a corner, a parked car, an old Xerox machine) but is slightly out of date or out of
fashion.

Which is technically a separate pocket dimension you can enter into, and as long as we leave exit point anchored in a way we can carry they won't be ejected. Load it with goodies and people, then take it across without technically targeting anyone or anything with the thousand hells travel function.

It's a lot safer than a portal while effectively matching the throughput because even somehow stealing the thing, which should be essentially impossible, it doesn't actually perform the travel function itself.

A keep tier shipping space would be a good start, though it'd be an entire 3 dot itself so we couldn't do anything inherent to the item for security. Something smaller would let us do security, but upgrading to a 4 dot would be pretty pricy.


I think this might have been brought up before, but didn't find anything on a quick search. Either way worth considering again.
 
Catching up:
Old Squidhead was temporarily disrupted by a steamship.
I bet on Molly, ten out of ten times.
I'd also bet on a Methuselah vs Cthuhlu though, but we can make it stick with spirit-killers.
Disagree strongly.

According to the rest of the Cthulu Mythos, Cthulu is supposed to be a Great Old One.
Looking at the power levels of ExWoD, I would bet on Cthulu crushing the average Essence 5 Infernal 10 out of 10.
I'd bet on Cthulu against a full circle of E5 Exalts that didnt have a designated protagonist character.

GOOs arent really in our weight class.


The point is, the Exorcism is not something like a Vaccine that can be mass produced and shared. It is a Service that only a Specific few can do and is a massive time drain where it takes valuable time that Molly can use to do other things.

You said it yourself. Molly is a power and a head of state. Does the President of the United State, personally goes around to foreign hospitals to cure people?
No, a lot of politics are involved and deals are made.

That is the point we are making. Molly's time is both limited and Valuable.
Exactly. The context is entirely different here, it's not comparable.
For one thing, Nemesis Nfection is something that afflicts a very limited number of people at a time.
Its instructive that we have not seen more than four people simultaneously Nfested at the same time in either of the Fae Courts, its primary targets.

Butcher hasnt given a hard number, but I dont get the impression that it can simultaneously possess more than double digit victims, possibly even low double digits.


For another, Molly is closer to a fantasy head of state than a secular head of state.
The President of the United States might not go around to cure people because he has no special ability to.
King Aragorn Elessar of Gondor could and did.


And the only reason the Exalted never dealth with the Neverborn dispite having the means is Necromancy stop working once they remove them and the underworld collapses into oblivion.
This is not true.

Necromancy is a knowledge/skill like Ancient Sorcery. Its learned, it doesnt require an external patron to operate.
Furthermore, most Exalts are not and have never been practitioners of Necromancy.
Sorcery does what their charms cant.

The weirdass reckless assholes who broke into the Neverborn's tombs did it as much for bragging rights as much as any real utility.
No you just underestimate them what the Primordials could do is far less then what the Exalted can do. For example the Rakshasa where bound by Oaths, to the Exalted to be unable to enter creation in numbers enough to form a proper army without an invitation from someone inside creation. Where as before the Rakshasa could send armies at creation whenever they wanted.
Thats just untrue.
I find it fascinating to see that you actually take the tongue-in-cheek declarations of Exalted superiority as the literal truth.

First Creation does need the Wyld at all, it powered by the Elemental polls which generation energy by existing. Secondly the point of an infinite wall is that its infinite, in the same way that Malfus could expand infinity,and still be surrounded by the Endless dessert.

The Exalted would still be able to expand creation as much as they wanted and mess around with the Wyld, the wall would be set to keep the Rakshasa, out not the Exalted in. The wall would be around Creation, and if creation gets bigger the wall moves to the new boundary.
1) The Primordials would have simply built a wall and made the Wyld pay for it if that was at all possible to keep the pesky raksha away from their playground and prayer livestock, instead of having to have one of their number playing Border Patrol. The fact that they didnt suggests there are significant drawbacks to that plan.


2)We have had this particular experiment play out in Exalted 2E.
When Autochton the Great Maker, one of the crafters of Creation sealed himself off from the outside world, he took a reserve of energy before setting up the Seal, and even he eventually began to starve in his sleep.

That resource and energy crisis is a major plot point of the Autochtonia setting, which is a place where you actually have high-Essence Celestial Exalts running around and actively involved in the setting.

There's literally several times more Celestial Exalts in Autochtonia than Creation, with estimates of between 1000 and 5000 Alchemicals compared to ~700 Solars + Lunars + Sidereals. And they canonically havent figured out any workarounds to getting extra power short of opening the Seal

I consider the idea that building an impassable wall around Creation that would go better as wishful thinking.


You're missing my point. We were the counterpart here. We could have counter offered her a deal that wasn't technically free but effectively cost her nothing. To lose the enemy dots alone, or for her best beer recommendation. We could have screwed ourselves in that deal on purpose to make a point.

We could also have agreed to sell as a subscription; all serious exorcisms for outsider business in exchange for fey agents handling any business we're unable to continue as a result.
They don't have to agree with our value judgment or understand the benefit before they're allowed to agree.

It's exceedingly obvious to anyone looking in on this that we wanted to be well paid.

No it isnt.
Molly could simply be engaged in enlightened self-interest as a denizen of reality and an associate of Dresden, who has had multiple Outsider encounters thus far.

Or it could be viewed as spite against an entity that was involved by proxy in the death and injuries of her friends at Splattercon, the subsequent assault on her family home, and her kidnapping and torture.
That last bit is probably the leading hypothesis, I suspect.


Imma note by her nature mother winter was once a queen like mab.well at least as far as I know it's literally part of her title the queen that was.
Nope.
Mother Winter is the first Mother Winter. Mother Summer is the second Mother Summer.
Not sure if Mab is the first Mab.



Civil war? You're thinking too small.
The Reds dont want to break the masquerade.
Literally part of Arianna's husband Paolo's dayjob was as a wellknown professor of a Brazillian university who made media appearances and coordinated campaigns debunking the existence of the supernatural.

Spilling information there will likely have effects on Outsider agents ability to operate.

The same holds true for a lot of people collaborating with the Outsiders for their own purposes.
You kinda have to be Ethniu and the Formorians, or someone like her to be down with the burn the setting down and roast marshmallows in the embers, and they have the advantage of living at the bottom of the oceans/The NeverNever.


Ivy undoubtedly has contacts there as well.
This is the sort of thing why there exists a neutral coordinatior of the Oblivion War.
One who is credible to most sides.


Oh, I don't think they were wrong.
But their time is over and the next Archive can now choose her own path.
And if that path says that mushroom clouds are pretty?
Or something less controversial like the US and Britain are currently illegally occupying Mauritian territory in the Indian Ocean?
What if she simply passes through an edgelord phase like many teenagers do?

I have very little sympathy for the argument that we should jailbreak and hand over, among other things, nuclear launch authority and Summer/Winter Lady-plus occult muscle to an 11 year old girl with no restrictions or guidelines.
Thats incredibly reckless.


Actually, only Winter holds the Outer Gates.
Summer exists to keep Winter under control.
Not actually accurate.
Summer AND Winter both hold the Outer Gates; Winter are the soldiers, and Summer are the battlefield medics and support
It didn't take us long to get there, but as we came up to the base of the wall and walked along it, we started drawing the eyes of the wall's defenders. I felt myself growing tenser as a marching column of armored Sidhe soldiers came stepping lightly along the ground behind us, catching up quickly.
Mother Summer guided me slightly aside so that we weren't in the column's way, and they started going by us. I didn't think much of it until someone at the front of the column called out in a clear voice, and as one the Sidhe came to a halt with a solid, simultaneous stomp of a couple of hundred boots. The voice barked another command, and the Sidhe all turned to face us.
"Uh-oh," I said.
Mother Summer touched my hand with hers, and reassurance bathed me like June sunshine. "Shhh."
The voice barked another command, and as one the Sidhe lowered themselves to one knee and bowed their heads.
"Good morrow, cousins," Mother Summer said, her voice solemn. She took her hand off my arm and passed it in a broad, sweeping arch over the kneeling soldiers. Subtle, subtle power thrummed delicately in the air. "Go forth with my blessing."
One of the soldiers in the lead of the column rose and bowed to her, somehow conveying gratitude. Then he snapped out another loud command, and the column rose, turned, and continued its quickstep march.
"Huh," I said.
"Yes?" asked Mother Summer.
"I was sort of expecting . . . something else."
"Winter and Summer are two opposing forces of our world," she said. "But we are of our world. Here, that is all that matters. And showing respect to one's elders is never unwise."
"Yes, ma'am," I said.
Mother Summer gave me a small, shrewd smile.
We continued our walk in their wake, and soon reached the gates. There I saw a smaller set of gates—sally ports—built into the main gates. They were the size of the garage doors on a fire station. As I watched, someone shouted a command and a pair of heavily armored ogres each grabbed one of the sally ports and drew it open. The column that had passed us stood waiting to march out, but they did not immediately proceed. Instead, a column of carts and litters entered, bearing the groaning wounded of the fighting outside, being watched over by several dozen Sidhe dressed in pure white armor, marked with bold green and scarlet trim—Sidhe knights of Summer. Medics. Despite the massive numbers of troops I'd seen moving around, there were fewer than a hundred casualties brought back to the gates. Evidently the Outsiders were not in the business of leaving enemies alive behind them.
A lean figure came down a stairway built within the walls framing the gates, at first a shadowy blur through the layers and layers of crystal. He was a couple of inches taller than me, which put him at the next-best thing to seven feet, but he moved with a brisk, bustling sense of energy and purpose. He wore a dark robe that looked black at first, but as he emerged into the light, highlights showed it to be a deep purple. He carried a long pale wizard's staff in one weathered hand, and his hood covered up most of his face, except for part of an aquiline nose and a long chin covered in a grizzled beard.
He spoke to the Summer and Winter Sidhe alike in a language I didn't understand but they evidently did, giving instructions to Summer's medics. They took his orders with a kind of rigid, formal deference. He leaned over to scan each of the fallen closely, nodding at the medics after each, and they would immediately carry the wounded Sidhe in question back behind the wall, into what looked like a neat triage area.
"Rashid," I murmured, recognizing the man. "What is he doing here—"
I froze and stared up at the massive gates rising above us.
Rashid, a member of the Senior Council of the White Council of Wizards, had another title, the name he went by most often.
The Gatekeeper.
He finished with the last of the wounded, then turned and approached us with long, purposeful strides. He paused a few steps away and bowed to Mother Summer, who returned the gesture with a deep, formal nod of her head. Then he came the rest of the way to me, and I could see the gleam of a dark eye inside his hood. His smile was wide and warm, and he extended his hand to me. I took it and shook it, feeling a little overwhelmed.
"Well, well," he said. His voice was a deep, warm thing, marked with an accent that sounded vaguely British seasoned with plenty of more exotic spices. "I had hoped we would see your face again, Warden."
"Rashid," I replied. "Uh . . . we're . . . they're . . ."
The Gatekeeper's smile turned a bit rueful. "Ah, yes," he said. "They're impressive the first time, I suppose. Welcome, Warden Dresden, to the Outer Gates."
Their primary role in Creation is to counter-balance Winter, but they do send forces to the Gates as well.


Do we want the masquerade to stay up?
We do have advantages in that we have a nation of our own and can contact the UN as a Peer Nation. I mean we have a nation roughly the size of Mars and have a population in the Billions.

Being able to introduce it directly may do a lot to putt off any collapse, especially if the Governments make a few announcements to reduce or even stop panic.
Yes we do want the Masquerade running.
Generally, Nemesis and its peers arent trying to do things that will benefit the rest of the setting.
I see no reason to do their job for them.

Its worth noting that post-Battle Grounds, after sixty thousand people die in Chicago, with fullscale warfare involving hundreds of thousands of troops(counting the Little Folk), four five six major Powers throwing down in the streets, skyscrapers getting blasted out of the skyline by the Eye of Balor and a fullscale helicopter gunship strike murdering most of the retreating remnants of the Formorian legions?

EVERYBODY puts together a coverup. Mortal governments and supernatural powers alike.

A lot of people in Chicago know what happened, but even then thats maybe in the five figure range; if you werent a combatant, its kinda hard to tell what's happening at night in a city thats lost power. And with magic punching out cameras and similar electronic recording equipment, all you have is eyewitness from anyone who was reckless enough not to be barricaded indoors.

Outside Chicago? The story is terrorist attack and hallucinogens. And it largely sticks with a lot of the outside world, because the lack of recordings in a major US city just sounds like a hoax.


Major mortal govts arent entirely ignorant of the supernatural, both in canon and in this AU.
After all, PMCs like Monoc that are explicitly hiring out "consultants" to US underworld figures like Marcone dont get access to former USAF nuclear command centers unless they have serious fucking mojo at the highest levels.
 
VOTE
[X] No one else, let the Archive decide if she wants to bring others in


RATIONALE
I doubt this is the first time that something like this has occurred to Nemesis and its colleagues.

There's people for this.
Previous Archives have been doing this sort of cross-factional outreach for millenia.
And she already has a reputation with most of the factions and Powers interested in maintaining the Masquerade.

Unless we have reason to believe she cant do the job, delegate this to Ivy.
She has access to corroborating information to convince the other factions to play ball, and to notice initial attempts among the human population.
 
1) The Primordials would have simply built a wall and made the Wyld pay for it if that was at all possible to keep the pesky raksha away from their playground and prayer livestock, instead of having to have one of their number playing Border Patrol. The fact that they didnt suggests there are significant drawbacks to that plan.
It doable and they probably tried and failed Autochton could and probably did make death traps around creation that if defeated but not destroyed rebuild themselves much stronger eventually getting to the point where it nobody can damage them again ever. It just people would make a point of destroy them so they do not rebuild stronger.
2)We have had this particular experiment play out in Exalted 2E.
When Autochton the Great Maker, one of the crafters of Creation sealed himself off from the outside world, he took a reserve of energy before setting up the Seal, and even he eventually began to starve in his sleep.

That resource and energy crisis is a major plot point of the Autochtonia setting, which is a place where you actually have high-Essence Celestial Exalts running around and actively involved in the setting.

There's literally several times more Celestial Exalts in Autochtonia than Creation, with estimates of between 1000 and 5000 Alchemicals compared to ~700 Solars + Lunars + Sidereals. And they canonically havent figured out any workarounds to getting extra power short of opening the Seal
Autochtonia is the Primordal of bad ideas, and right down to his I am statement that is his excellency, i must continually improve or die. Literally the only Primoridal that cannot exist in a vacuum is Autochtonia, as it a part of his theme to be contioualy heading towards death. Even the Yozi do not have that limiation. Even then the Alchemicals might have been able to salvage the situation but bad ideas Autochtonia stricked again and put some of his spark into the Alchemicals infecting them with his spiral of death.
Like really Autochtonia is so bad at making choices, he make a God explicitly to hit him when he was making bad choices. And then that god got killed and Autochon in one of his patanted brillient moments somehow managed to forget that gods reform if they are not killed with a sprit killer charm, thought he was dead for real, and did not bring him with he left creation.

I consider the idea that building an impassable wall around Creation that would go better as wishful thinking.
Creation is designed to be and is power positive, with fresh energy continually injected into it form the elemental Poles.
 
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VOTE
[X] No one else, let the Archive decide if she wants to bring others in


RATIONALE
I doubt this is the first time that something like this has occurred to Nemesis and its colleagues.

There's people for this.
Previous Archives have been doing this sort of cross-factional outreach for millenia.
And she already has a reputation with most of the factions and Powers interested in maintaining the Masquerade.

Unless we have reason to believe she cant do the job, delegate this to Ivy.
She has access to corroborating information to convince the other factions to play ball, and to notice initial attempts among the human population.

They probably have not been doing precisely this kind of thing. The modern world is different in all kinds of way from what came before, but the Ventori have dealt with cults and infiltration before.
 
It doable and they probably tried and failed Autochton could and probably did make death traps around creation that if defeated but not destroyed rebuild themselves much stronger eventually getting to the point where it nobody can damage them again ever. It just people would make a point of destroy them so they do not rebuild stronger.
Yeah, thats just not true.
If they tried and failed there would probably be ruins, and stories among the gods and Primordials and 2CDs and 3CDs who were there when it was done.

Autochtonia is the Primordal of bad ideas, and right down to his I am statement that is his excellency, i must continually improve or die. Literally the only Primoridal that cannot exist in a vacuum is Autochtonia, as it a part of his theme to be contioualy heading towards death. Even the Yozi do not have that limiation. Even then the Alchemicals might have been able to salvage the situation but bad ideas Autochtonia stricked again and put some of his spark into the Alchemicals infecting them with his spiral of death.
Like really Autochtonia is so bad at making choices, he make a God explicitly to hit him when he was making bad choices. And then that god got killed and Autochon in one of his patanted brillient moments somehow managed to forget that gods reform if they are not killed with a sprit killer charm, thought he was dead for real, and did not bring him with he left creation.
The Primordial of bad ideas?
Autobot MADE the Exaltations.The Solars never figured out how to duplicate Solar exaltations, or even to extend the hardcoded lifespan in the shards. And its explicitly stated they'd never figure out how to make Alchemicals either.

He had a key part in shaping Creation. The Primordials kidnapped and vivisected his creation the Clay Man in order to make humanity. He is literally the only entity in Exalted 2E whose empowered agents are still making Celestial Exaltations; the Yozi and Neverborn had to steal Solar shards to mod them, and never figured out how to make their own.

If its a matter of craft and he couldnt do it, it almost certainly cant be done.
If he couldnt build a pocket reality where he could have a constant supply of Essence without access to the outside world?
It probably cant be done.
They probably have not been doing precisely this kind of thing. The modern world is different in all kinds of way from what came before, but the Ventori have dealt with cults and infiltration before.
Oh sure.
Not the exact same plan, but schemes along the same general intent.
And Ivy probably has memories of previous attempts.

Id just hand it off and trust her to ask for help if she thinks its necessary.
 
I still don't think we should bring everyone in on this cult right now, the Archive is literally built to manage this sort of thing and stepping on her toes is actively detrimental. That said, getting Ivy updated on everything else would be good.

This is incredibly important, and we have one of the best possible explanation to launder the crown through available if played right.

Maybe like this?

[] Plan Sleeping Giants
-[] No one else, let the Archive decide if she wants to bring others
-[] Take the opportunity to read her in on the list of other outsider pawns we have, and on Nemesis' current desire to end the masquerade to turn humanity against everyone else.
—[] Imply but do not outright state one way or another that part of what we can harvest in killing is knowledge as a source.
—[] Invite her to the Carpenter house to speak of something absolutely essential, or to some other location whose wards she trusts.
—[] Instruct Clippy to spill the beans to Charity on what Happened in Summer if we leave the house before Ivy does to trigger CCC.
—[] [Stunt]: Settling into her seat Molly lets the light air she's been affecting drain away, turning stone faced and as grim as the deep wastes to rest her gaze just above Ivy's eyes. "We have a problem"
—-[] Her eyes filled with awful certainty, Molly continued "I believe that nemesis plans to break the masquerade. To instigate wars that no one is ready for and break us on them"
—[] "The chaos will be bad enough, but I don't believe the war we're already fighting will do well if the enemy in all their forms is allowed to position themselves well" Hesitating for a moment Molly gave the pair of them a weighing look. "I don't have the full picture yet, still digesting things, but I have seen what that thing wants".
—[] Opening a notebook and beginning to write out all the details she has on the Outsiders, her caste mark shining brighter as she goes, Molly's voice took on a terrible weight. In it whispered winds whipped to flaying fury, rivers clawing murderously at their banks, and a Wheel's turning as it spun a child's wish into a promise to countless souls. "The enemy is not the only one who can expose things, and with its blood on my lips it cannot stop me"

I think my drama dial is broken again, but this is deadly serious. The cult is basically a Tuesday, bringing down the masquerade is setting up to start WW3 with magic and eldritch horror.

Constructive criticism on the plan would be welcome. Personally I'm still a little uncomfortable with the location and would like to fit in ritual room based crown questions before we have this conversation. The problem is the timing on leaving and the security of our current working spaces.

We do have a fair bit of lore to hand over though, and getting started now is likely better than waiting till we get through all our other actions this arc.
 
DELAYED COMMENTARY
Of Treachery Undone​
7th of January 2007 A.D.
COMMENTARY
Iku Turso was apparently knowingly collaborating with Outsider infiltrators attacking the Fae Courts.
Cant imagine how he expected to survive that; maybe the Red Court's use of Outsiders in combat without immediate repercussions gave him false expectations.

Interesting that he didnt even try to flee. Did he simply expect that True Immortal rules were in play?
We might want to use his reagent to ask a Crown question to find his contact(s)

Im assuming that it wasnt Titania or Lily who personally bound Sathar
Because if so, I have questions about how he got the power to break free.

Killing a member of a pantheon gets us the attention of the Finnish pantheon and those of its descendants, mortal and divine; good chance they felt him die in the first place.
Here's hoping Iku Turso wasnt linked to anything important.


Growing Pains​
7th of January 2007 A.D.
COMMENTARY
That poem has Sidereal themes, and implies that two more of the Maidens are dead.

Saturn/Endings/Violet is probably the last one who cuts the thread, so she didnt die then.
I am not sure who the other two survivors are, though; could be any of the other four, besides Mars. I would guess that its likely to be Venus/Serenity/Blue for the first, and Mercury/Journeys/Yellow for the middle.

Which would make the dead Maidens Jupiter/Secrets/Green, Mars/Battles/Red, and the forgotten one who died in the Primordial War iric. Not sure who the twin giants of frost and flame are referring to, though.
Raksha, perhaps?

===
Fear huh. Molly's gonna be hood infamous after this.
Interesting that Titania let Lily take the lead here. And for that matter, given Nemesis role in her daughter's death, a little surprising that she didnt jump at the opportunity to do it additional harm.

===
Huh?
Predation is very much in Summer's nature. As is destruction; Summer's fire is very much a thing, as are all the diseases on Mother Summer's shelf. Narhwals are not vegetarians; neither are Summer's ogres.

Is....Ivy lying to spare Molly's feelings?

Untwisting Truths​
7th of January 2007 A.D.
COMMENTARY
Those ribbons remind me of Sidereal prayer strips.
Only three of the colors correspond to Sidereal maidens though.

Huh.
It does speak of progress if Titania has unconsciously progressed to sighing at Molly ; it suggests that she isnt unconsciously assessing her as an enemy. All to the good.

Nemesis hates us? Progress. :)
Betrayers and Fools speaks to two different factions though. The Betrayers are probably the Fae.
But who are the Fools? Small-g gods? Its certainly not talking about angels.

3 Favors? Cool.
We'll undoubtedly find uses for them.
Poisoned Roots​
7th of January 2007 A.D.
COMMENTARY
Harry you're coming across as a very thirsty dude :V.
Then again, Appearance 5/5+ Demon.

Loling at the poster :)
If I had to guess, from the message, these are essentially this AU's version of Nephandi cults. Specifically, the Obliviate Faction, who want the extinction of Humanity.
And it probably explains where people like Sandra come from and get their training and orders. Looking at the Wiki:
Though all Nephandi serve Oblivion, they maintain a fairly rigid hierarchy based on power and closeness to Oblivion. This theocratic despotism is prone to constant violent infighting and backstabbing plots at the Lower (greater) levels. the hierarchy is loosely broken into the following categories:


  • Pawn (Dregvati) - The scum (hence the nickname dregs), these are the lowest on the roster loosely divided into non-awakened servants of the sect such as hired thugs, cultists or pimps, as well as more powerful dupes of the cult. Minor supernatural servants or non-Nephandic mages who are being manipulated by the Nephandi. The "weak link in the chain" so to speak, these poor bastards are usually unaware of what they serve. Of course, there is always a chance of promotion through the caul...
  • Nephandus - A true Nephandi is first born by emerging from the Caul. This term also broadly refers to any member of the hierarchy upwards from here, and later ranks can be considered "titles." It is at this rank that most of the Nephandi's Shaytan (those Nephandi who are highly violent and act as soldiers and assassins) can be found. The fist of the Nephandi forces, these are the guys who are the most likely to be encountered in direct confrontation.
  • Adsinistratus - The sergeants. After building a network of supporters, a Nephandus begins to have the clout to command lesser Nephandi and act as a full-time tempter. The Adsinistrati are primarily responsible for luring Pawns into the Caul, as the lower ranks lack the subtlety and skill to do so. When necessary, the Adsinistrati are also the diplomats of the Nephandi, making contact with other beings of corruption such as Black Spiral Dancers.
  • Prelatus - The generals of the Nephandi are almost always powerful, inhuman, and inscrutable. Most Prelati are able to visit Earth for short periods but generally find long-term residence difficult. These Nephandi direct large-scale operations.
  • Gilledian - The highest ranking Nephandi are the rulers of the Labyrinths, Nephandic realms in the Umbra. Most are very old, very powerful, and very experienced. While unable to leave the Umbra, these beings exert tremendous political force from a distance. They are not even by the loose standards of their colleagues usually anything even resembling a human. In fact, quite a few are technically dead.
We are probably looking for something along the lines of an Adsinistratus.


That comment about the second string? Conservation of detail suggests that the second string being referenced, the teacher/mentor for selected initiates is probably the Ashraah we pinged on with both Simon Peabody and Vito Malvora. The one who used to be human that we see referenced in this vision.
On that unremarkable path in the shadow of a fake chateaux, the smell of night flowers and fine parfume applied perhaps a bit to liberally you encounter something you had not since taking up the Crown of Wisdom, the Crown of Eyes: a shadow in its sight, a void that looms above the vampire's left shoulder up and up until it seems to eat the stars.

Lost 1 Essence -> Now at 13/15

His master's work.

Ashraaah's work


The word, passes into your mind like a worm crawling through silt and you know that were you merely a mortal wizard so too would it seek to pass out of mind without a trace in memory. But you did not overhear it on the night air, not did you read it in some pilfered scroll or upon a screen left carelessly open... open for the careless. You took it and what you take you keep. Meaning you draw from it as one might drill an oil well down to hell.

Not-Man, Once-Man, Husk. All that was of him in the Image of God is Not and in the place of God, something else, a hunger, a need, a Howling.


All at once the world snaps back into focus, all the sights and sounds of nocturnal gathering spinning around and round in a haze of of blind gaiety, knowing not for the servant, the puppet of darkness that walks among them, for you do not think the Ashraaah is capable of keeping servants that its influence does not devour.
Could also be Sandra, of course. Remains to be seen.

Speaking of Sandra, we should probably go to her former apartment and use it as a Crown focus.
And any other significant spot we can think of.

We can probably scoop up everyone in every cell and begin to narrow them down based on internet activity and publicly available information. But we might need Electric Devil Caress for the ability to directly transfer information to electronic records for our cyberdevils to access.

Or maybe our Hell has an external mind to computer interface design we can borrow to speed up things.


White council already has nemesis assets we haven't figured out how to prove.
Correction:
The White Council has moles. At least one of them works for Nemesis, but we're unsure how many of them do.
 
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[X] No one else, let the Archive decide if she wants to bring others in
 
No it isnt.
Molly could simply be engaged in enlightened self-interest as a denizen of reality and an associate of Dresden, who has had multiple Outsider encounters thus far.

Or it could be viewed as spite against an entity that was involved by proxy in the death and injuries of her friends at Splattercon, the subsequent assault on her family home, and her kidnapping and torture.
That last bit is probably the leading hypothesis, I suspect.
This strikes me as a self serving interpretation of our behavior that allows us to get paid and be viewed as a philanthropist for the same action.

I don't think there's anything wrong with charging for risky and important work, but you can't do that and expect a plurality are going pay attention to every detail other than the check you cashed. Especially when you're making legendary profits.

There can be lots of motivators around why someone did something that shape but don't tip the balance of their actions.

It's objective fact that four of the five SCE castings we've performed (all of the nemesis ones) have been for significant profit. We probably aren't going to be thought of as a greedy bastard, but anyone with more resources than a literal penniless orphan is going to make some accurate assumptions about how we do business.

Trying to say that we shouldn't dare charge for an exorcism while pocketing the equivalent of "IOU one Desert Storm" tokens from the US/China/[Insert world power metaphor of your choice here] in 80% of all prior transactions is ridiculous.

The Reds dont want to break the masquerade.
Literally part of Arianna's husband Paolo's dayjob was as a wellknown professor of a Brazillian university who made media appearances and coordinated campaigns debunking the existence of the supernatural.
I wasn't suggesting they'd cooperate with Nemesis, just that they couldn't stop it. I'm not sure anyone can, it spreads too fast and can take such powerful pawns that making the supernatural undeniable should be easy for it.

The red court uses so many outsider summons that I'd be surprised if they weren't hilariously compromised by now, and the war further limits their resources. They're too perfect a propaganda target to pass up if your goal is to push the mortal world into clashing with the supernatural one on multiple fronts.


Spilling information there will likely have effects on Outsider agents ability to operate.

The same holds true for a lot of people collaborating with the Outsiders for their own purposes.
They're not deliberately trying to end the world, but they clearly think it's worth risking to win. I don't trust them to do the smart thing instead of trying to exploit their new knowledge of Nemesis' goals with the intent to betray him after their 'inevitable victory' if Ivy thinks she can make it work then I'd leave it to her.

Huh?
Predation is very much in Summer's nature. As is destruction; Summer's fire is very much a thing, as are all the diseases on Mother Summer's shelf. Narhwals are not vegetarians; neither are Summer's ogres.

Is....Ivy lying to spare Molly's feelings?
My thought was that it was related to the type and context of the predation.

DF fey are elementals of the soul and Summer is passion, intuition, spontaneity, and similar concepts. They can be just as bad as Winter, but when they hurt you it definitely won't feel the same.

There are exceptions to this, but my rough distinction would be that a Summer fey hunting humans for sport would give them a weapon and head start "for a sporting chance" while Winter would just eat you because they're hungry.

Not that the summer fey wouldn't tear your throat out with their teeth on the spot or a Winter fey wouldn't set things up so they can sadistically enjoy a victim running for their life, but it seems like a good example.

Titania couldn't do it because our method was too cold blooded. She might legitimately believe there's a distinction between this and an ogre running across an open field to club people for snacks and only refer to the winter one as a predatory. Which would be a wise standard to adhere to when speaking inside her magical possibly sapient self renovating castle.
 
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