Molly pretty much has to assume she knows as much as Harry knows about her as while he could have cut out her feed at any point most of the revelations Molly dropped on Harry were unexpected. He would not have had the time to lock Lash out of seeing the scenes as they unfolded.
Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)
- Thread starter DragonParadox
- Start date
- Crossover Fantasy
Molly pretty much has to assume she knows as much as Harry knows about her as while he could have cut out her feed at any point most of the revelations Molly dropped on Harry were unexpected. He would not have had the time to lock Lash out of seeing the scenes as they unfolded.
- Location
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We have two foci. The crystal and our recording of the conversation.
We can answer at least some of those that way without using up Lash herself or her body.
BoredMan
Dinosaurs came in many flavors. Like potato chips.
You hear that guys?
If we give Lash a body we'd need to drop her in the Five Courts to minimize the risk her knowledge of the Crown poses. That opens up other problems however.
fictionfan
Please sir, may I have some Meows?
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- Tempe, AZ
This is an amazing opportunity for Molly to do a villain song.
"Sit down at my table.
Put your mind at ease.
If you relax it will enable me to do anything I please!"
Or do you think that Lash counts as a poor unfortunate soul?
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Im not entirely sold on rushing this right now, even if everyone else is.
That said:
We have gossamer. Harvested from Iku-Turso.
If the Pathfinders were able to use it to jump over a lot of actual magic and biological testing?
So can we.
There's no reason why we should be dealing with inanimate materials.
That said:
Point of order:
We have gossamer. Harvested from Iku-Turso.
If the Pathfinders were able to use it to jump over a lot of actual magic and biological testing?
So can we.
There's no reason why we should be dealing with inanimate materials.
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They had equipment built around using it and more to the point they had dots in both Medicine and Occult, the former of which Molly does not share. You are correct in that Gossamer can substitute for many things, but you have to know what you are substituting it with and Molly's knowledge of anatomy is... You know what song about which bone goes where? She knows some of the verses, may or may not be in order.
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Clippy can look up the knowledge online.They had equipment built around using it and more to the point they had dots in both Medicine and Occult, the former of which Molly does not share. You are correct in that Gossamer can substitute for many things, but you have to know what you are substituting it with and Molly's knowledge of anatomy is... You know what song about which bone goes where? She knows some of the verses, may or may not be in order.
Surely that works for us.
(We'll still roll int + 2 dice stunt + 2 dice WHWH, potentially DC -4 (-1 water, -3 exploding door cheat to trigger escape dc reducer)
Yes. The Exalt with no knowledge of medicine is better than the best trained expert.
Thats not a physical threat tho.
We were talking about a physical threat if that wasn't clear.
BoredMan
Dinosaurs came in many flavors. Like potato chips.
If u guys really vote to make her a body and don't later vote to drop her in our Hell her knowledge of the Crown is going to cause problems for us. Even then putting the socialite in the FC opens up entirely new issues even if it gives her personality building opportunities.
This is an odd hill to die on.
She could use her vast knowledge of the universe and magic to become a physical threat.
This is an odd hill to die on.
Lash shouldn't be considering her chances at direct confrontation, because she shouldn't believe it to be possible for her to be extracted from Dresden and given her own body. Both of these (extraction and given her own body) she should consider absolutely impossible.
Lash is smart, but she shouldn't be thinking about fighting us. As far as she knows how the world works, she's stuck inside Dresden's head, and there's nothing anyone can do about it.
BoredMan
Dinosaurs came in many flavors. Like potato chips.
That doesn't matter at all??? If we give her a body like you want she will obviously start to entertain those kind of thoughts.
We have a good idea of what her social dicepool is atm.
High end human, near-max.
Superhuman at base is unlikely; we've seen Mab, Maeve and Lily, and it gives some idea of what we can expect.
If she borrows physical skills, they are likely to be benchmarked off Dresden's physical skills.
A supermode might be a thing.
Im more fuzzy about what form the magic takes. Because there will almost certainly be magic.
Her being a physical threat is not really the issue.
Magic? Social? Sure.
Physical no.
Agency for one.
Preventing a situation where someone can just walk in and pick her up off the shelf like with Bob is the other.
I remember the events of Dead Beat, and Cowl/Kumori literally walking off with Bob in their pocket.
There's a lot of secrets in that head.
For her own sake and ours, she needs to be capable of defending her own autonomy.
There's no real measures you can take to limit risk in creating an independent person.
None that arent likely to backfire, at least.
Remember, this isnt a child. Its a fully realized adult.
There are limits to what you constraints you can reasonably justify when your argument is that they have a right to self-determination.
Its fair if you dont want to incarnate the person. Its not to incarnate them and put in a kill switch.
Lash can be a deadly threat, make no mistake about it.
But its magical and social.
Not likely to be physical; you're not going to see her attempt to cross swords with Molly, or try to use weapons.
1) Occult 5 + Excellency makes up for a whole lot of sins here.They had equipment built around using it and more to the point they had dots in both Medicine and Occult, the former of which Molly does not share. You are correct in that Gossamer can substitute for many things, but you have to know what you are substituting it with and Molly's knowledge of anatomy is... You know what song about which bone goes where? She knows some of the verses, may or may not be in order.
So does the ability to simply call on any of the medical and magical specialist teams in the Brass Courts who specialize in high-end magical biology stuff; they kinda have to be, to allow for cross-species fertility in the Courts.
That's a major reason Im considering this.
2) Molly has a SUTRA with a history of independent operations hooked up to the Internet right now in Last Station; Im pretty sure Iris is not unfamiliar with sapient biology, given what its previous job was.
And Cyberdevils 2 is on our stat sheet as well. The medical/biology part is more or less covered.
3) Remember when Dresden literally willed himself a physical, breathing body in Ghost Story?
Or when he used a Hexenwulfen belt to change into a wolf in Fool Moon?
Or Lea changing the strike party to hounds on their way to Chitchen Itza?
And I am pretty sure the Alphas are Medicine 0; doesnt prevent them shifting into wolf form.
Ditto Goodman Grey, the naagloshi scion.
There really isnt a lore impediment to doing biology if you have sufficient Occult.
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She can try. People that are also great magican got their shit kicked in by ethinu and she had basically the same powers that we do. So magic isn't an arbitrary thing that lets them scale that far. And we have seen denarians in the book, their physical buffing is turning into a giant demon gorilla or whatever hardly a foe for molly.
Only if i die.
BoredMan
Dinosaurs came in many flavors. Like potato chips.
Not something I was arguing for. I'd rather us dump her in Hell since thats the only thing I can think of with our current charmset.
these fucking typos I hate doing this on mobile
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We were told that the maximum here is Arcana 5+. Arcana 5 are almost expected to have at least one superhuman stat - their main category of attributes starts at 2 dots, and you distribute 7 more dots, and the maximum of any attribute in that category is 7. And then you can buy 5 more dots to spend.
As I understand it, we are making a body, and Lash is the "spark of creation " that animates it. This probably translates to magical effects, not necessarily changes to the physical shell. So, I would assume full wizard gift at least.
This would be a point I would start arguing against the expenditure, honestly. Yes, Lash is very important, narrative-wise, but we kinda can use gossamer for other projects (I want that power ring, dammit). We would at least need to learn where gossamer can be found.
I do have reservations. It's us reading Lash not daring to hope that pushes me over the edge here. Also consequences of Dresden learning that we could get her out and not told him later. This is the first time where we could get her out safely, as this is the first time we can make essence vessels. We had justification before. No such thing now.
The question to ask is - what's her motivation? Right now she is seemingly motivated by self-preservation. If we give her a gilded cage inside our kingdom and an immortal comfortable body, what's her motivation for working against us? This is a big gamble, yes.
If you guys really want to roll Medicine instead of Craft to make the body you can, but it is going to at the very least take longer to get the requisite amount of successes and since it is not a key roll you can botch that and explicitly a botch means that you have to start the process again
The Gossamer would make the design roll vastly easier though by its mutable nature.
I wouldnt vote to put her in the Brass Courts anyway.
What existing social links she currently has are here.
And like I have previously pointed out, our Hell does not have the Panopticon/Gaol option and has a Resistance movement.
Both of which were decisions I pointed out would come back to bite us.
We cannot put people there willy nilly.
Physical threat is really not the issue here.
Unless you expect her to become like Worldbreaker Hulk.
Im not sure how that follows.
1) She has no social links or touchstones in the Brass Courts
2) No Panopticon in the Courts, so we have no idea what she will be doing
3) There is a Resistance movement in our Hell, so its not like she's safe. Or that we are safe.
All round bad idea.
The social links thing is a good point, but the harping on our hell build is getting old.
Modern nation states with considerably less technological (and magical) capacity manage to operate without omniscience and our particular resistance movement isn't exactly looking to ram truck bombs into the palace.
A different build would offer different advantages, but I don't think the FCF are going to shatter at the lightest touch.
BoredMan
Dinosaurs came in many flavors. Like potato chips.
Wdym?
She can make some. It's not like she has plenty now.
We would only do it if we had people watching her. So we would know.
They aren't everywhere. They should be confined to the super prisons. Lash won't be anywhere near.
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BoredMan
Dinosaurs came in many flavors. Like potato chips.
@DragonParadox Would Lash have Free Will in another body? If so could she maybe use her origins to summon the coin to her even if she has never made contact with it before?
We have people for that. Spies. And that's assuming she's given freedom of movement.
Dresden, her main social link, is going to be moving into the Courts in two weeks time as part of the WC delegation.
Molly does not know if coin summoning would be possible since she is not sure what the resulting being would look like. That said once that flash of joining happens it would be valid to ask with the Crown 'can the being before me summon Lasciel's coin?'
Ok, before we proceed further, or at least before we commit to the arcana level, can we use either Clippy's recording of the talk, or the talk / situation itself to learn Lash's motivations? If she's motivated by survival, that's one thing. If she's fully onboard with bringing apocalypse, that's another.
BoredMan
Dinosaurs came in many flavors. Like potato chips.
We would have to ask frankly. If that answer ends up being yes that shuts the entire FCF argument down and lets us know to keep her the hell away from Hell.