Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)

As an aside, think we're going to get a response from the Library over this?

We kind of turned into a planet and terrified everything what can understand horrified ghost screaming* across a large slice of Mexico since the last time we talked.

The feds might be a little curious. :V

* And possibly everything not shielded by the curvature of the earth when we activated Shintai.

Yes, but none of this changes this specific case, how keeping people (who you have no moral right to detain, just to protect your secrets) from trying to save their families, without trying to do something about it yourself, is not just merely not being good... it seems pretty line-crossingly evil.
While I don't disagree with the general line of reasoning, I think it's worth noting that letting them go on their way with a shrug wasn't the right decision either.

The most likely scenario involved there is that they and their families are tortured then executed by sadists who don't care that the people we rescued don't know that much and couldn't have done anything to stop us.

The kind of society that has slang like book of pain in it to refer to how leadership will keep a spreadsheet of twisted punishments inflicted for their amusement isn't going to be reasonable about something like this.

We should also save their families, but it would be equally irresponsible not to make the argument to them that they should stay in the FCF. It might save us trouble, but it would almost certainly save them a lot of pain if it doesn't outright save their lives.

That doesn't change once we save their families either, because this whole thing unavoidably draws attention to them. The reds don't care about them directly, but special consideration from us is enough reason for them to take a stab.
 
People, please, even if you don't want to do everything (and we rather need to do everything at some point), please at least check up on Daniel. We have been given several warnings about him already. We are nearly there in terms of having what we need to at least make him do his questing in a survivable manner.
The QM says we are doing everything. Everything on that list.
We are just choosing what we do FIRST. Hence my vote to talk to Lydia first.

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OOC: Since you have eight days left of the month you can do all of the above, I am not going to give you guys an artificial time limit, this vote is more about the order and maybe any write ins you want to make. Again the way to dealt with Broken Seeker kind of surprised me.
 
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[X] Catch up with Lydia

Lydia is good. Honestly, we need to unpack a little.

In regard to Seeker, the man is not being redeemed. Cruelty is the truest of arts within his eye and his heart, an expression of himself and proof of his own freedom. But it leaves him bored, empty, and deprived of nearly all pleasures and comforts. My hope, though, is that he will pick up other flavors of evil, other ways by which it might be expressed, that the world can better suffer. If a few vices can be bent into twisted approximations of virtues along the way that would be the truest success we could ever hope for.

There is a certain beauty in paying evil unto evil, showing something that revels in monstrosity that it didn't even know what a true monster was, that you won't find within the innocent. There are pains that can force a man to build himself up, pains that can kill a sickness while leaving the man as if it was chemotherapy, and sometimes you yearn to give rise to something that can fight you rather than cowering. Rules, like in poetry, give you something to build off of and conquer rather than burdening you. If you play the part of something that isn't a rabid dog even the most wicked can walk in silk, as any Denarian can tell you. How much of that he already knows, though, is in question because his own words and teachings came across as hard earned.

I picture him, some day, delighting in warring against the things mounting and worming around the Outer Gates. The finest prey is that which can make you bleed and which brings with it infinite novelty.
 
I quote:

I think it was pretty explicit that its initial plan was to throw Seeker at Molly.
Which was confirmed by Arianna's first words when we entered the plane.
Initial plan - Seeker rejected it because he doesn't work for experience. The job he was paid for was killing Harry.

I would rather he does not die, or get crippled, or suffer a fate worse than death while doing so.
What if we send him questing in the FCF over the summer?

It probably wouldn't work the same as what he's thinking of trying, but he could explore and train with some very skilled people.

He wouldn't make the same progress, though I'd argue infinite lives could facilitate certain kinds of training.

But it'd be pretty engaging as a way to soak up his time until we work something better done.
 
[X] Catch up with Lydia

Lydia is good. Honestly, we need to unpack a little.

In regard to Seeker, the man is not being redeemed. Cruelty is the truest of arts within his eye and his heart, an expression of himself and proof of his own freedom. But it leaves him bored, empty, and deprived of nearly all pleasures and comforts. My hope, though, is that he will pick up other flavors of evil, other ways by which it might be expressed, that the world can better suffer. If a few vices can be bent into twisted approximations of virtues along the way that would be the truest success we could ever hope for.

There is a certain beauty in paying evil unto evil, showing something that revels in monstrosity that it didn't even know what a true monster was, that you won't find within the innocent. There are pains that can force a man to build himself up, pains that can kill a sickness while leaving the man as if it was chemotherapy, and sometimes you yearn to give rise to something that can fight you rather than cowering. Rules, like in poetry, give you something to build off of and conquer rather than burdening you. If you play the part of something that isn't a rabid dog even the most wicked can walk in silk, as any Denarian can tell you. How much of that he already knows, though, is in question because his own words and teachings came across as hard earned.

I picture him, some day, delighting in warring against the things mounting and worming around the Outer Gates. The finest prey is that which can make you bleed and which brings with it infinite novelty.
eh I don't really wanna do it but worse things have been redeemed. There's probably some ability that lets you force personality traits on something.
 
What if we send him questing in the FCF over the summer?

It probably wouldn't work the same as what he's thinking of trying, but he could explore and train with some very skilled people.

He wouldn't make the same progress, though I'd argue infinite lives could facilitate certain kinds of training.

But it'd be pretty engaging as a way to soak up his time until we work something better done.
I mean if he decides to embrace transhumanism he can become super optimized for specific tasks.
 
While I don't disagree with the general line of reasoning, I think it's worth noting that letting them go on their way with a shrug wasn't the right decision either.

Oh, I completely agree that it would have been a bad choice to let them go. It was only the specific potential combination of not letting them go and refusing to help ourselves that I objected to, as a choice worse than just letting them go.

Context matters. Temporarily restricting an innocent person, out of their depth, for their own genuine good might be technically wrong without proper authority, but it would be Lawful Stupid not to here. But it's an entirely different matter if you are stopping someone from trying to save their loved one in the process. Cause if you are making that your choice, then you are also making it your responsibility. No avoiding that.
 
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In regard to Seeker, the man is not being redeemed.
Your probably right given how old he is although the seeming lack of interaction with anyone he considers to be "equal" should make shifting his perspective easier. Assuming he does see Molly in that sort of light if inexperienced.

Also we are planning to redeem that Yozi Emma'O right, or am I recalling this wrong? I'm asking because that guy is way worse yet people didn't seem bothered by the prospect IIRC.
 
Your probably right given how old he is although the seeming lack of interaction with anyone he considers to be "equal" should make shifting his perspective easier. Assuming he does see Molly in that sort of light if inexperienced.

Also we are planning to redeem that Yozi Emma'O right, or am I recalling this wrong? I'm asking because that guy is way worse yet people didn't seem bothered by the prospect IIRC.
If anything redemption of Broken Seeker should be easy mode compared to Emma'O.
 
Your probably right given how old he is although the seeming lack of interaction with anyone he considers to be "equal" should make shifting his perspective easier. Assuming he does see Molly in that sort of light if inexperienced.

Also we are planning to redeem that Yozi Emma'O right, or am I recalling this wrong? I'm asking because that guy is way worse yet people didn't seem bothered by the prospect IIRC.
Emma-O is a Yama King, not a Yozi.

We didn't so much plan to do it ourselves as agree to provide limited support to one of his own looking to try.

I think a substantial part of this is that we know Emma-O's tragic backstory, and that he feels regret even if he doesn't let it stop him from being an inhuman monster, while Broken Seeker is mostly a mystery to us.

Harder to envision his situation and how it might change.
 
As an aside, think we're going to get a response from the Library over this?
We kind of turned into a planet and terrified everything what can understand horrified ghost screaming* across a large slice of Mexico since the last time we talked.

The feds might be a little curious. :V
* And possibly everything not shielded by the curvature of the earth when we activated Shintai.
Eventually yes.
They'll get a heads up from Murphy after Molly updates her on the skinwalker situation.
But I expect it wont be until the New Year when we hear from them directly.

Federal agencies arent swift outside emergencies.

In regard to Seeker, the man is not being redeemed.
Uriel specifically says otherwise. Its possible. Not inevitable, but possible.
Depends on us and how well our dice like us.
And I suspect, how his greed and arrogance interact with his loneliness.

Initial plan - Seeker rejected it because he doesn't work for experience. The job he was paid for was killing Harry.
But the intent was clear.
That Arianna had to default to her fallback plan doesnt change the fact that this particular agent was contracted specifically in the hope that he would run into and kill Molly in the process.

When she wanted Dresden dead in Changes, she bombed his office building, then sent a bunch of mundane hitmen.
What if we send him questing in the FCF over the summer?
Its currently November 2006 IC.
Summer is around six or seven months away.

Yes, one of those things Harry is making the terrible mistake of not having brain-sex with as we speak.
^^^
If the Shadow of a Fallen Angel is mutable and can have their mind changed?
A naagloshii can too.

Admittedly, Lash didnt really have anywhere to go and anyone to talk to besides Dresden.
Still, Seeker is self-isolating by choice and arrogance, so much the same thing. And Molly is a much scarier social threat than Harry.
And the whole serial killer schtick can be read very much as a sign of insecurity.

Uriel didnt tell us no. The way he didnt say no about Emma-O.
So its worth exploring.
Emma-O is a Yama King, not a Yozi.
We didn't so much plan to do it ourselves as agree to provide limited support to one of his own looking to try.

I think a substantial part of this is that we know Emma-O's tragic backstory, and that he feels regret even if he doesn't let it stop him from being an inhuman monster, while Broken Seeker is mostly a mystery to us.
Harder to envision his situation and how it might change.
Pretty much.

That said?
We may not be a Solar with You Can Be More, but we are still a social Celestial Exalt. Sufficient exposure has its effects.
Depends, in part, on what we roll. In part. The rest is on him.
 
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Pretty much.

That said?
We may not be a Solar with You Can Be More, but we are still a social Celestial Exalt. Sufficient exposure has its effects.
Depends, in part, on what we roll. In part. The rest is on him.
Yes, but I think we want a bit more leverage to force him to listen to us. My suggestion is False Springs Beckons. He is repeatedly said to be under some sort of curse for breaking his oaths. No I don't know the nature of the curse or oaths, but assuming that he does actually find the curse unpleasant we can surppress it and then Broken Seeker would have to regularly interact with us and listen to us to keep it suppressed.
 
Its currently November 2006 IC.
Summer is around six or seven months away
Having a goal to work towards is a pressure relief itself. Get him doing research and maybe some short trips and we can delay his suicide charge.
If the Shadow of a Fallen Angel is mutable and can have their mind changed?
A naagloshii can too.
That's not really a fair example. In canon it's pretty explicit that it's only possible because the imprint isn't really the fallen and is made out of mortal soul stuff.

Angel fell once, which proves changing them is possible, buts Harry didn't reach that level.
 
Adhoc vote count started by Yzarc on Sep 26, 2023 at 3:28 AM, finished with 57 posts and 17 votes.
 
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