- Location
- washington
oh please for enacting mass change in their settings basically none of the current ck quests do shit.
Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)
- Thread starter DragonParadox
- Start date
- Crossover Fantasy
- Location
- washington
not really none of those have or will change greater chicago in any meaningful way. You can argue we've made a world of difference for individuals not chicago much less the whole setting. Also I said yet and even that is just a really useful skirmish really no kind of game changer for the red court.
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You cleansed Meave, that has a worldwide impact in that Winter now has less infiltrators in it.
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- washington
yeah thats fair its the one thing I can think of which is a big change to the books. Mind you its one of the least noticeable changes to the setting from the outside. I mean even killing some skinchangers is likely more noticeable to most than what we did for maeve. I don't think most who could tell what we did to maeve can tell from such a large distance.
Edit: Also you know the pivot moment where it would matter isn't for several years more actually.
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Goldfish
Friendly Spider-Fish Abomination
- Location
- Formerly of the Far Realm
The death of a Walker, even a relatively minor one, is probably going to have far-ranging effects which we just haven't had a chance to notice yet.
When something everyone thought was unlikable gets ganked, that makes waves. Gods and Fey Queens can die, Dragons can die, etc., but Outsiders like the Walkers can only ever be banished back to where they came from, with varying degrees of violence. Until now.
Considering how much Outsider activity takes place in DF canon, the butterflies have well and truly flapped up what will eventually be a massive hurricane.
- Location
- washington
that was not that long ago and doesn't actually much change the setting simply because outsiders are well for the most part outside it. Their an existential threat for sure but their also you know nearly that present in the world as plenty of other things and killing one other than making others impressed doesn't change much.
Goldfish
Friendly Spider-Fish Abomination
- Location
- Formerly of the Far Realm
It's not a matter of impressing people, but potentially impacting the way Outsiders operate, including how quickly they might move to target us. There are a lot of Outsider shenanigans that happen in DF, after all.
Up until now, Outsiders like the Walkers could act with relative impunity once they get past the Gates, since they've had little to fear beyond the inconvenience of being banished or possibly imprisoned temporarily. They can still do this, for the most part, but now there is a Molly-shaped exception to the rule running around with a flaming sword and a hunger for XP.
- Location
- washington
Yes which overall does jackshit for the overall setting. Like its its important but can you really say it has any affect whatsoever on the world? We've effectively damaged something so intesmally small to the whole it makes a toenail seem like a giant.
Let me refresh your memory on events since July. In order:
We killed Eldest Fetch, a senior Winter fae who was either posessed by Nemesis, or getting orders from someone possessed by him. This reduced Outsider abilities to affect events.
We prevented Kattrin Sigfridsdottir of the Thule Society potentially bootstrapping herself into a god by eating Arawn, and Corpsetaker getting a new, even more powerful body by possessing Lydia permanently.
We also made sure both Kattrin and Corpsetaker were introduced to Final Death.
In so doing, we alerted Odin about Johann of Cleves, leading to the prevention of the assassination of a Senior Council member, preventing a mass casualty event in Boston, and avoiding a major Masquerade breach.
We drove Iku-Turso back into his prison and slammed the door.
We also destroyed the plot by Rhys the Ragged and that splinter of the Pathfinders cult to use gossamer harvested from Iku-Turso to design and disseminate mutagenic pharmaceuticals and cosmetic care products that would make humans into servitors.
We killed a greater akuma of Kakuri, personally altering the balance of power among the Yama Kings by a small but measurable amount, and affecting Emma-O's willingness to put powerful servitors at risk. And in talking to Eiko, we have also altered the trajectory of the conspiracy to fix Emma-O.
We informed Mab of the identities of three senior Winter Sidhe subverted by Nemesis, allowing her to purge her ranks.
We also exorcised Maeve, and may exorcise Lea.
This results in a considerably more active Winter, as compared to this point in the canon timeline.
Thats going to have an impact on shit like the ability of the Red Court to summon lesser Outsiders in Faerie without retribution, or to use the Ways through Faerie to move war materiel and troops; the White Council has permission from the Fae Courts, but the Reds do not.
And in facilitating the passing of the Ankou mantle from Arawn to Mathews, we gave Mab back one of the servitors she uses to afect events in the real world, in this case hunting necromancers.
We personally spiked a White Court coup attempt sponsored by the Red Court and Outsiders.
If it had succeeded, it would have resulted in the White Court entering the Vampire War on the side of the Red Court, and possibly an expansion of the murder campaign against lesser talents.
We are committed to killing Arianna Ortega, the daughter of the Red King.
The prime mover behind the Chicken Pizza plot to use a bloodline ritual to kill Dresden and his grandfather Ebenezar in canon.
We have had a massive impact on the setting in less than half a year.
You just dont see it because Molly is the person causing these effects, not the person feeling its effects.
I guarantee you that if you ask the Red Court, or the White Council, or Cauldron, or even the Library, we have had significant effects on the setting.
The Red Court in particular is going to be hurting.
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- Location
- washington
I mean other than the future thing and the maeve thing none of those actually affect the setting at wide. Like at all big and small gribblies sure and peoples lives yes. But, for the setting as a whole they don't change anything. So no I still don't believe we've made big changes to the setting at least not for a long ass time. Also pissed off things that do matter which could eventually start big change right now not so much though. Also I see that as an upside.
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Would it happen again or her approaching death will delay/stop this plot from happening?
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- washington
also the odin things nice.
DF doesn't allow omnipotent beings to change its setting with impunity, so, the only way to change it is by small changes enacted by individual actors
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- washington
no no thats not how it works at all Dresden has 100% changed the setting we just haven't gotten to things that change the world as much as he did. Dresden has objectively saved billions of lives multiple times.
1) You cant just except the major things we have done and say that we have done nothing.
We killed an ex-Valkyrie necromancer, set up the death of Corpsetaker (go read Dead Beat and Ghost Story again if you need a refresher on what she is), and provided the information that led to the death of Johann of Cleves.
All of these are Senior Council-tier threats in their area of expertise, and both Kattrin and Corpsetaker had the strength and expertise to attempt ascension rituals.
To say their deaths did not affect the setting is untrue. We have fucked up the plans of a LOT of people in killing them.
2)There is a supernatural world war currently in play between the Red Court and the White Council for the last four or five years, with hundreds of wizards and tens of thousands of civilians dead so far.
The Thule Society has been known to work with the Red Court.
Nemesis and the Outsiders have supported the Red Court.
Every move we have made, with the possible exception of the Kakuri plot, has materially affected the course of that war.
Even just killing Rhys the Ragged and disrupting his operation?
Has destroyed one avenue for the Fomor to build up their military forces by developing tools to servitorize mortals in the wild, instead of having to kidnap them and take them to their homeland first.
This means they are less of a military threat to the White Council, Winter, Summer, and everyone who has an interest in maintaining the status quo.
Not every setting altering moment requires that you ride a zombie T-rex through downtown Chicago.
Depends on if she told anyone else that Dresden and Ebenezar are related.
Maggie was born around 3 years ago this November, so all the elements still exist, including her residence with a family in Mexico.
Id personally bet on someone still trying; its too good a narrative storyline for the QM to discard.
All it needs is someone to find her records/files.
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- Location
- washington
Yes I very much can because as important as these characters are for plot lines they are not important to the world. They do not affect thousands of lives on any immediate basis at least not anytime soon and they surely don't actually change things on any huge political level. Having two things that to the wider setting no one will ever know about do not make that big of a change in the setting. Fuck we don't even know they'll make big changes.
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Or the admittedly less likely chance that someone gets enough of Dresden's blood to scry his family, it is known that he is Ebenezer's grandson, just not by him so if you can find his other family you have leverage.
I'm sorry, did you even read what Uju wrote?
He very explicitly points out that the things we did do in fact affect thousand of lives and changed the political landscape.
Like, I don't agree with Uju often but on this one, I'm on his side, you are completely missing the very visible impact we had there.
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- washington
the raksha thing may as well be an ocp to most of the world as it hadn't been active for a long time, the valkyrie is a rogue agent and doesn't matter to almost anyone else other than those shes harmed, kinda the same for corpse taker. Killing them has almost zero impact on the world as almost no one knows about them. All the things they do later have no real impact on the world now and even when they did none of them did anything more important than several others villains. So its same old same old.
I mean for all you made Molly interested in ruling over her small patch of Chicago it is worth keeping in mind she has no politics skill, no finance skill, not even a law skill. She just does not think of things in terms of the larger picture unless it is pointed out to her because she does not have much in the way of experience with it. Leadership on the other hand... leadership she has in full which leads to someone who is inspiring and, in combination with her other social skills, means she is much better at personal scale politics. Put a person in front of Molly, friend or foe and she will dissect their intimacies, manipulate their desires and turn their hopes to her own ends.
fictionfan
Please sir, may I have some Meows?
- Location
- Tempe, AZ
Basically if we want to do any large scale ruling we need to assemble a council of talented people to delegate to. Just like basically any other human.
- Location
- washington
if you asked much of the supernatural world about those things we've killed without any context but their names how much do you think they matter? We can ennact great change but for the broader setting all we've done is kill a few dudes who are fairly powerful.
You are actually asserting that the death of a Senior Council-tier NPC, with all the power and connections that such a character wields in the supernatural, is not important to the world.
That the demise of someone like Kattrin, who was explicitly more than a thousand years old and spent that much time gathering power and expertise and connections, and had the skill and connections to survive the personal enmity of Odin for that long, is unimportant.
Or that someone like Johann of Cleves, who was more than five hundred years old and part of the governing body of the Thule Society, old enough and personal enough to count a Senior Council member as an enemy, is not important.
No offense? But you're just blatantly wrong.
Do you seriously think that people mentioned in the same breath as the current holder of Thorned Namshiel grow on trees?
That would be like saying the death of Cowl or Nicodemus Archleone or Polonessa Lartessa is not important to the world.
Yeah.
Of course, Martin is still a deepcover triple agent who is several hundred years old and Susan's partner to boot; Susan was pretty blatantly dating Dresden when the war broke out, and Im pretty sure that he would have been a suspect for her pregnancy.
Furthermore its not like Margaret LeFay being Ebenezar's kid was ever that much of a secret; a surprising number of people have been in on that secret from the beginning, including every member of the Senior Council, Lord and Lara Raith, Arianna Ortega, Lea and Mab.
Hell(lol), Im pretty sure Chaunzaggoroth and his colleagues know, and are willing to sell the information for an appropriate price.
Or even for free, if it causes enough chaos.
Which supernatural world? Joe Random psychic? He does not know what a Pathfinder Society is, but if you explained what their goal was you bet they would care. Do you want to explain to 'much of the supernatural community' what a Walker is? You can, but watch out for pissed True Ventori, they would rather you did not. Maybe you could explain Katrina instead? All the veterans of the war against Kemler will toast you, those who do not know do not know. On it goes.
Or we manifest representations of our mind in a form of divine ministers / third circle devas as any other primordial does. Probably through the act of wonder-forging.