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General Exalted Thread

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Leetsepeak said:
If there's one infallible truth about art directing for tabletop games, it's that even if you ask them to draw people with dark skin you might still get someone who looks pretty light.

I can't recall who said that at Onyx Path (Dave Brookshaw maybe?), but it is apparently a really common thing, so that might explain it. That and redheads in the South of Creation being a thing that happens independent of your skin color (not quite redbone...) that might even be what tripped the artist up.
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That chick looks Scandanavian. If she's seriously supposed to be a bride of Ahlat from habourhead that's way worse because it's Whitewashing.
 
FBH said:
That chick looks Scandanavian. If she's seriously supposed to be a bride of Ahlat from habourhead that's way worse because it's Whitewashing.
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Which was... my point? That a recurring problem with commissioned artists is that sometimes they will whitewash the characters you ask them to draw, even when you tell them not to. It is entirely possible that Duah Omorose was whitewashed by the artist who drew that art, which seems to happen even when you ask them not to, and sometimes happens willfully (they prefer drawing light-skinned or white people) or it happens "accidentally" because the art notes didn't include an explanation that the place the character was from is not full of white people.

If it's supposed to be her, and I'm reasonably sure it is, then it's another one for the pile.
 
Robotninja said:
Yes, breeding 5 is rare as hell. So are level 5 artifacts. Actually, in the modern era they are probably rarer, as new breeding 5 DBed can be made, but level five artifacts are not possible to realistically make. As for not having two breeding five parents, I am pretty sure that most dragonblooded with breeding 5 have parents who both have it.
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Except for that whole point about Breeding 5 is that the Realm is doing it's best to maintain an intricate system of breeding and eugenics, and that is still implied to be failing despite all that is thrown into it; you have Lunars and Sidereals in the modern era, both of which can build level five Artifacts, and Dragon-Blooded who can cooperate-build their way to glorious victory (though this is probably like, a generational thing that bloodlines of Dragon-Blooded can engage in; the Sworn Brotherhood forging the haft of a Daiklave and passing it on to their children so they can continue the work and so on).

Robotninja said:
Okay. You can spend 5 background points to get an artifact that lets you turn a mortal into an untrained dragonblooded. Once. Or you could just spend 5 background points on allies and get a highly powerful and skilled dragonblooded who is willing to do anything for you. If we are just talking pure mechanics, no fluff involved, then picking this artifact would be suboptimal.
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Me: "This is broken; you shouldn't do it."
You: "No, it's okay; there are other broken things!"
Me: "But that just means they're broken and you shouldn't use them."
You: "No, look at these broken things!"

Robotninja said:
Because just about every noteworthy artifact N/a breaks the setting in half. The Eye of Autochton is the standard to measure things against when talking about artifact N/A.
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Ah yes, such as "get a level higher of sorcery" or "literally no system for this artifact, ask your GM please" or "can't die while wearing this obvious circlet on my head"; certainly these are pinnacles of good writing and compelling effects. The point where you can guarantee an Exaltation, you have broken the setting in half because it makes you a literal miracle-maker, even if it's only once. If you're a Solar, you are capable of making level five Artifacts yourself; you can make literally as many Dragon-Blooded as you want because making a five-dot Artifact isn't actually very hard from the viewpoint of the system.

But you know what, sure I'll write your Artifact idea on my list of Artifacts and get something written before Sunday.

FBH said:
That chick looks Scandanavian. If she's seriously supposed to be a bride of Ahlat from habourhead that's way worse because it's Whitewashing.
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Man, we covered this like five-hundred pages back; everything there is to bitch about with 3e has already been bitched about. :V

(also; speaking as a Scandinavian, she totally doesn't look like us :anger:)
 
Leetsepeak said:
Which was... my point? That a recurring problem with commissioned artists is that sometimes they will whitewash the characters you ask them to draw, even when you tell them not to. It is entirely possible that Duah Omorose was whitewashed by the artist who drew that art, which seems to happen even when you ask them not to, and sometimes happens willfully (they prefer drawing light-skinned or white people) or it happens "accidentally" because the art notes didn't include an explanation that the place the character was from is not full of white people.

If it's supposed to be her, and I'm reasonably sure it is, then it's another one for the pile.
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To be honest I assumed it was just random art.

I don't know how you'd go from the Bride of Ahlat art in any previous edition to that.
 
Also, yes you can begin play with multiple artifact 5s if you dump the BP into them during chargen. I just... don't think that I've ever played with any ST who would allow that, despite the RAW allowing it. Cause it's more than a little difficult to explain how you came across the Crucible of Tarim, the Crown of Thunders, a set of Celestial Battle Armor, an Emerald Thurible, and the Forgotten Blade when you're a starting exalt.
 
Leetsepeak said:
this seems kinda like the sort of thing that could and should go both ways. Sometimes you mistreat a corpse and the resultant ghost is deaf and dumb and that's horrifying. Other times a ghost might hold its head underneath its arm (a hypothetical example) and still be able to use it just fine. Ghosts are weird and there's a million little tiny reasons why these things might manifest differently or not at all depending upon the circumstances of a specific ghost's death and their existence afterward.

It seems kind of constraining if stabbing somebody in the brain always produces some kind of soul mutilation though. I guess if it's a thaumaturgy ritual that requires more specific effort though that seems totally fine to me, since it sounds like there's more to it than just stabbing someone in the brain when you kill them.
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I'd prefer people weren't hung on 'thaumaturgical rituals' (read point investment into magic that's overpriced) and not burial rites and practices. Which yes EVERYONE would know. of. At the least

Any priest/mortician has tricks or ritual processes that regularlyb work to honor/seal the dead. Necromancers or ghosts with an eye to business can mess with this. And always there are some souls who reject the prayer/supplication by the same reason 9/10 people just can't see the perfect allure of the work of Michael Rex's Fangbone.
 
Nospurratu said:
Also, yes you can begin play with multiple artifact 5s if you dump the BP into them during chargen. I just... don't think that I've ever played with any ST who would allow that, despite the RAW allowing it. Cause it's more than a little difficult to explain how you came across the Crucible of Tarim, the Crown of Thunders, a set of Celestial Battle Armor, an Emerald Thurible, and the Forgotten Blade when you're a starting exalt.
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Mystery box at the Nexus Auction.
 
Nospurratu said:
Also, yes you can begin play with multiple artifact 5s if you dump the BP into them during chargen. I just... don't think that I've ever played with any ST who would allow that, despite the RAW allowing it. Cause it's more than a little difficult to explain how you came across the Crucible of Tarim, the Crown of Thunders, a set of Celestial Battle Armor, an Emerald Thurible, and the Forgotten Blade when you're a starting exalt.
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Same way than Nanoha got her device or Jack his sword.
 
Nospurratu said:
Also, yes you can begin play with multiple artifact 5s if you dump the BP into them during chargen. I just... don't think that I've ever played with any ST who would allow that, despite the RAW allowing it. Cause it's more than a little difficult to explain how you came across the Crucible of Tarim, the Crown of Thunders, a set of Celestial Battle Armor, an Emerald Thurible, and the Forgotten Blade when you're a starting exalt.
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Power Rangers.
:V
 
Ellf said:
Clawstriders are unlikely in that area, right?
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Well, obviously, group of Clawstriders was resealed by oligarch of Nexan guild to populate a forest area for future sport hunting; fact that those predator might nab peasant or traveller is of on concern to anyone. The Guild caravan are too big and heavy guarded, so it's not a problem to them and Nexus government don't interfere outside city boarders.
 
On the note of 100%-assured DBs, bear in mind that we already know what manufactured Exalts cost, and the extreme lengths required to achieve them, and those are called the Alchemicals. Whatever kind of Dragonblooded you could create by this new method would certainly have crippling, inbuilt flaws which offset the certainty of the process, regardless of the morality of the people behind it, similar to the Charm Slot-Installation Limitation/Obvious Inhuman/Sterile/Clarity combination that Alchemicals suffer under.

Because at that point you're not trying to make a Heroic Person who is Exalted, but attempting to hone the Blood into a more effectively reproducible magical weapon, and that should have grievous enough costs to make it clear why those powerful enough to create and wield such a weapon (the Scarlet Empire, Lookshy, the First Age Realm, the Yozis seeding demonblooded with Terrestrials through the use of Neomah, among others) would find the idea ultimately untenable outside of a handful of select outliers.

Any type of 'guaranteed Exalt' should result in some manner of spiritually-malformed monster, which serves to reinforce there are reasons Why the various types work as they do, and be a stain on that heroic legacy such that fellow Exalts made the old-fashioned way would find the whole idea rather horrifying and necessary to be put out of its misery.
 
Nospurratu said:
Also, yes you can begin play with multiple artifact 5s if you dump the BP into them during chargen. I just... don't think that I've ever played with any ST who would allow that, despite the RAW allowing it. Cause it's more than a little difficult to explain how you came across the Crucible of Tarim, the Crown of Thunders, a set of Celestial Battle Armor, an Emerald Thurible, and the Forgotten Blade when you're a starting exalt.
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Or they go with the wonder that is magitech, in which case there's a lot of fun that can happen.

I once approved a double five dot artifact character thanks to what he chose and how interesting it made the game.

The character was a tomb raider who sought out his first age incarnation's tomb shortly after Exalting and found weapons of great power, but not great practicality: a royal warstrider and warstrider sized fiery solar cannon.

When looking over his sheet I had two questions for him.

"You do realize your character can't easily maintain these, right?"

"Yep."

"You also can't run both of them at the same time because you don't have the heartstones."

"Yep."

"Well, okay then."

The first arc of the campaign was the party, who his character had drawn together for a crazy idea, taking over a city with the right infrastructure to allow them to deploy the warstrider and cannon when needed.

The third arc was them needing to take over a gold mine to make repairs, with hilarious Sidereal interference, because the Realm dropped the hammer on them during the second and the party barely drove them off.
 
If I were to model Jacks sword it would be a mostly normal artifact daiklave other than being small for one of them that add the holy keyword for bonus damage against creatures of darkness.
Dif said:
On the note of 100%-assured DBs, bear in mind that we already know what manufactured Exalts cost, and the extreme lengths required to achieve them, and those are called the Alchemicals. Whatever kind of Dragonblooded you could create by this new method would certainly have crippling, inbuilt flaws which offset the certainty of the process, regardless of the morality of the people behind it, similar to the Charm Slot-Installation Limitation/Obvious Inhuman/Sterile/Clarity combination that Alchemicals suffer under.

Because at that point you're not trying to make a Heroic Person who is Exalted, but attempting to hone the Blood into a more effectively reproducible magical weapon, and that should have grievous enough costs to make it clear why those powerful enough to create and wield such a weapon (the Scarlet Empire, Lookshy, the First Age Realm, the Yozis seeding demonblooded with Terrestrials through the use of Neomah, among others) would find the idea ultimately untenable outside of a handful of select outliers.

Any type of 'guaranteed Exalt' should result in some manner of spiritually-malformed monster, which serves to reinforce there are reasons Why the various types work as they do, and be a stain on that heroic legacy such that fellow Exalts made the old-fashioned way would find the whole idea rather horrifying and necessary to be put out of its misery.
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Maybe render the mother infertile and the guranteed exalts breeding is reduced below what it would normally be by a dot. You get one slightly substandard dragonblood at the cost of any future children from that mother and weakening the bloodline.
Alternatively the created dragonbloods are incapable of passing down their power making their kids the most pure blooded mortals on the planet along with having breeding 0 themselves.
 
Regarding Jack's sword, it might just be an artifact 1 sword that is holy and unbreakable, I'm not sure if it has any actual powers beyond that.

Dif said:
On the note of 100%-assured DBs, bear in mind that we already know what manufactured Exalts cost, and the extreme lengths required to achieve them, and those are called the Alchemicals.
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I feel the need to point out that there is a difference between "Manufactured Exalt" (Alchemicals) and "Mass Produced Exalt" (Hypothetical DBs caused by mas producing a 5 dot artifact).

I recall the arguments on the old white wolf forums about how it should be totally possible to mass produce alchemcials and dragonblooded because they aren't "real" exalts and someone playing a Twilight wants to make an army of bespoke Exalts. I'd be hesitant on cracking the seal on that horror show and letting it out again.
 
Nospurratu said:
I feel the need to point out that there is a difference between "Manufactured Exalt" (Alchemicals) and "Mass Produced Exalt" (Hypothetical DBs caused by mas producing a 5 dot artifact).
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There is, and like I was saying, that difference is between "Magically-empowered Hero" and "spiritual abomination created by the twisting of the Exaltation-medium to create a weapon of comparable power."
 
Dif said:
Any type of 'guaranteed Exalt' should result in some manner of spiritually-malformed monster, which serves to reinforce there are reasons Why the various types work as they do, and be a stain on that heroic legacy such that fellow Exalts made the old-fashioned way would find the whole idea rather horrifying and necessary to be put out of its misery.
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"The Lothric bloodline was obsessed with creating a worthy heir, and when this proved impossible, resorted to unspeakable means. Suffice it to say, the path to linking the fire is a cursed one indeed."
 
EarthScorpion said:
"The Lothric bloodline was obsessed with creating a worthy heir, and when this proved impossible, resorted to unspeakable means. Suffice it to say, the path to linking the fire is a cursed one indeed."
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Is this a reference to something?

Also to anyone wondering, Jack's sword was very strong and sharp. and also the only weapon capable of harming Akuma. No other powers.
 
Leetsepeak said:
If there's one infallible truth about art directing for tabletop games, it's that even if you ask them to draw people with dark skin you might still get someone who looks pretty light.
I can't recall who said that at Onyx Path (Dave Brookshaw maybe?), but it is apparently a really common thing, so that might explain it. That and redheads in the South of Creation being a thing that happens independent of your skin color (not quite redbone...) that might even be what tripped the artist up.
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I remember a little anecdote about this;
One of the artists was requested to make a picture of Yu-Shan and was given the single instruction of "make lots of flying and airborn vehicles, but do not use airships" and the picture they drew was nothing but a group of airships.
 
Robotninja said:
Would a single use level five artifact be sufficient to ensure someone Exalts as a Dragonblooded? Fluffwise, it is something like a drop of blood from one of the Five Dragons.
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Why do you even want a canned Exaltation artifact?

It seems like bad news setting-wise, gameplay-wise, and theme-wise. I don't see any reason for such a thing to be possible at any rating.
 
It might be interesting to have a level five artifact that can either provide significant benefits for an entire society or can be used up to guarantee an individual Exalts as a Dragonblooded. The artifact could act as the seed for the story of a conflict between the civilization that wants to keep the artifact in order to reap the long term benefits that it provides and the individuals who want to gain the vast power of Exaltation in order to benefit themselves.

Some examples of this would be a Well of Endless Water that is powered by a drop of blood from The Dragon of Water and acts as the foundation for a thriving city in the desert or a Monument of Prosperity that is powered by a drop of blood from the Dragon of wood and acts to provide an otherwise barren region with plentiful harvests.
 
Ct613hulu said:
It might be interesting to have a level five artifact that can either provide significant benefits for an entire society or can be used up to guarantee an individual Exalts as a Dragonblooded. The artifact could act as the seed for the story of a conflict between the civilization that wants to keep the artifact in order to reap the long term benefits that it provides and the individuals who want to gain the vast power of Exaltation in order to benefit themselves.
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This isn't a 5 dot artifact, though. It's N/A.

I don't have a problem with dragon intervention being capable of Exalting new dragon blooded, or even of their blood doing so, but pretending that such things aren't out of the standard scale is inane.
 
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What about an artefact that used the fresh blood of the 5 elemental dragons that would guarantee an exaltation, and/or set breeding to 5, recharging the blood of the dragons from the source.

Production requirements needing materials unique to Gaia's world body meaning its no longer reproducible without finding her again.

And by fresh I mean you'd have to run 5 simultaneous campaigns if you wanted to get the blood back to the artefact in time.

Also, making it fairly simple to use so that any mortal could achieve greatness, at the low cost of risking an apocalypse to recharge.
 
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