No.

No, you cannot say "an N-dot artefact has power equal to an N Essence Alchemical Charm". The setting breaks if you do so, as suddenly any essence user has relatively easy access to Celestial Charms up to Essence 3. Therefore you do not do so, because the ramifications are stupid.

Oadenal's Codex says something similar, yes. That is because the artefact chapter of Oadenal's is to a large extent wrong and stupid, and the example artefacts combine useless shit like the Fur Merchant's Gift and broken shit like the Crimson Bow and the Ring of Being.

Welcome to Exalted, where "No, don't do what the book says, it's stupid and wrong and produces stupid output" is basically our motto.
There's the balancing factor of 'Alchemical Charms are fragile' to be considered. And the fact that damn near nobody outside of Autochthonia gets to learn how to make Alchemical Charms.

And it's more a case of one of the various non-artifact things that produce Charm-like effects being equal to an Alchemical Charm at the point the cost and methods are similar to an Artifact of X dots. At least that's what I think of the rules.

Seriously, Alchemical Charms are breakable by mortal weapons. That's a rather big difference over proper Artifacts.
 
There's the balancing factor of 'Alchemical Charms are fragile' to be considered. And the fact that damn near nobody outside of Autochthonia gets to learn how to make Alchemical Charms.

And it's more a case of one of the various non-artifact things that produce Charm-like effects being equal to an Alchemical Charm at the point the cost and methods are similar to an Artifact of X dots. At least that's what I think of the rules.

Seriously, Alchemical Charms are breakable by mortal weapons. That's a rather big difference over proper Artifacts.

These statements you are making. They are arguments against saying that a X dot artifact is allowed to have equivalent powers to an X Essence Alchemical charm.

Anyways, a thought experiment trivially demonstrates why this is wrong and incredibly foolish. A Essence 1 Alchemical charm gives a permanent, natural increase of +1 to an attribute for 1 mote and can be stacked up to Essence/2 times.

Why yes, I believe Invincible Nuclear Hellfire Princess, the Slayer Caste Infernal, should be allowed to run around with Str/Dex/Sta 8... and the ability to boost any of these attributes up to 16 for a scene, all for the cost of 9 artifact dots total and 9 motes. This is totally balanced and will not break anything, said nobody sane ever.
 
Question: how would Murder is Meat (killing a natural animal at least your size or a thinking being nourishes you for 1 day/week/year) interact with Hunger Without Satisfaction? Specifically, these bits:
HUNGER WITHOUT SATISFACTION
However, he starts developing hunger penalties after just (Stamina + Resistance) hours without eating a full meal, at a rate of one point per hour to a maximum of -10.

The Infernal ignores any hunger or thirst penalties affecting actions that would help him acquire food. This includes attempts to track or kill prey, forage for edible plants, persuade a grocer to give him leftover stock, and so on. Only actions that would directly alleviate his hunger benefit. The warlock cannot ignore penalties while tracking an enemy messenger unless he sincerely intends to devour them (or something in their possession).
I can think of arguments on both sides for the hunger penalties either starting (Stamina + Resistance) hours after the last kill or that long after the day it feeds you for.
Also, unless I'm mistaken, Murder is Meat would eliminate hunger penalties on most, if not all, combat rolls with this, right?
 
There's the balancing factor of 'Alchemical Charms are fragile' to be considered. And the fact that damn near nobody outside of Autochthonia gets to learn how to make Alchemical Charms.

And it's more a case of one of the various non-artifact things that produce Charm-like effects being equal to an Alchemical Charm at the point the cost and methods are similar to an Artifact of X dots. At least that's what I think of the rules.

Seriously, Alchemical Charms are breakable by mortal weapons. That's a rather big difference over proper Artifacts.

No, it doesn't matter. It's still not okay.

The Alchemical thing exists to emphasise that Alchemical Charms are not like the Charms of other Exalts. Other Exalts takes a few days of study, and learn a new way of handling their weapon or how to give people radiation sickness from their hate.

Alchemical charms are a massive infrastructural investment that takes man years of effort from specialised work teams and cost a fortune to make. Alchemicals can't ask for a new Charm to be made in a few days. Alchemicals have to justify every Charm purchase they make to the state, because the state is spending a fortune on the Charm and may be rather frownyface when you ask to have Thousandfold Courtesan Calculation made for you just because you want to give your boyfriend a good dicking.

That is the purpose of saying "you have to make an E5 Charm as if it was an E5 artefact" - because it says "Literally no mortal can make this for you and you need your Alchemical city to invest a lot of time into this, so the State is going to want a good return for this".
 
If the Artifact is a rigged up Alchemical Charm, then basically anything goes, because a 5 dot Artifact based on Alchemical charms is an Essence 5 Alchemical Charm.
Here's the thing about the "Artifact X as Essence X Alchemical Charm," they're not comparable scales. Because any Artifact trying to map the specific drawbacks to an Alchemical Charm wouldn't have the same strength anymore. Because Alchemical Charms:
- Require implicit surgical installation to function.
- Require a slot to place them in, an artifact unto itself.
- Require the user to be an Exalt in the first place, even forgoing the idea that you Must have a specific anatomical structure for some of them to even be possible.
- Require regular upkeep/are sustained entirely by the users life force, because they are about as durable as an organ or limb.

Take those drawbacks and apply them to say, an Artifact 3, and compare it to your average Ess3 Charm, let alone one of Alchemical design.

Well, that's a higher option infrastructure heavy inversion of what I'm looking for. What I'm looking for is taking a found artifact and rigging it into an Alchemical Charm on the spot, by having a separate Charm act as a dedicated socket for doing this.
Mechanically-speaking this is possible, but is very not the intended workaround. Because Charm slots are extremely valuable, and put an incredibly tight upper limit on base Alchemical strength before they start swapping around abilities to try and cover more bases, on the assumption you cannot have everything you want whenever you want it. While its possible to keep finding more and more 0m install Charms to fill more slots, the typical Alchie is never going to have more than 30, pushing the absolute maximum number of Personal motes they can possess. By contrast, the potential number of artifacts someone can carry around if they don't require hands to hold them is theoretically limitless.

To accomplish the idea you want, an Alchemical would need something like a universal rapid-attunement/commitment-reduction effect, which is already pretty sketchy mechanics territory because it risks creating a "katamari ball" gear-heavy focus, where at a given point other Charms suddenly become meaningless to advancement and your Alchemical is infinitely better served by paying for slots alone, finding/building and layering on as many artifacts as they can to achieve an exponentially-growing baseline competency, rather than something they have to regularly sustain via mote-spending.
 
Alchemical charms are a massive infrastructural investment that takes man years of effort from specialised work teams and cost a fortune to make. Alchemicals can't ask for a new Charm to be made in a few days. Alchemicals have to justify every Charm purchase they make to the state, because the state is spending a fortune on the Charm and may be rather frownyface when you ask to have Thousandfold Courtesan Calculation made for you just because you want to give your boyfriend a good dicking.

Relevant:

Vital Corporate Intelligence!
[09:58:51] <+T______N___> look M____
[09:58:54] <+T______N___> they spent 10% of their budget
[09:58:56] <+T______N___> on bangin' titties
[09:59:01] <+T______N___> that 10% could have gone to optimization
[09:59:10] <+T______N___> so they're gonna get every bit of RoI on those bangin' titties
[10:00:01] <+s___> T______N___, the git/svn changelogs for that dev team would be great
[10:00:01] a____u___ imagines T______N___'s argument about RoI being laid out in a memo, or perhaps part of a powerpoint
[10:00:45] <+T______N___> a____u___, s___: That's exactly why this statement is funny
[10:01:05] <+T______N___> "We are considering marketing our breast models as middleware"
[10:01:55] <+a____u___> imagine that as part of a prospectus sent out to investors
[10:02:10] <+a____u___> questions being raised about the prospect at stockholder meetings
[10:02:27] <+a____u___> i hope that there's some publicly-traded sex toy companies or the like, just for this reason
[10:02:38] <+T______N___> "What advantages would your breast modeling technologies hold over the previous generation?"
 
Question: how would Murder is Meat (killing a natural animal at least your size or a thinking being nourishes you for 1 day/week/year) interact with Hunger Without Satisfaction? Specifically, these bits:

I can think of arguments on both sides for the hunger penalties either starting (Stamina + Resistance) hours after the last kill or that long after the day it feeds you for.
Also, unless I'm mistaken, Murder is Meat would eliminate hunger penalties on most, if not all, combat rolls with this, right?

I'd rule that Hunger Without Satisfaction's timing has precedence by a strict RAW reading.

Murder is Meat says it nourishes you, but Hunger Without Satisfaction says you start getting hunger penalties. These two statements do not contradict - you can be physically nourished, but the gnawing famine of Metagaos is still telling you "EAT MORE". Hence, you start developing hunger penalties after just (Stamina + Resistance) hours without eating a full meal or killing someone.
 
I'd rule that Hunger Without Satisfaction's timing has precedence by a strict RAW reading.

Murder is Meat says it nourishes you, but Hunger Without Satisfaction says you start getting hunger penalties. These two statements do not contradict - you can be physically nourished, but the gnawing famine of Metagaos is still telling you "EAT MORE". Hence, you start developing hunger penalties after just (Stamina + Resistance) hours without eating a full meal or killing someone.
It also means that you can double dip your murder victims for a second meal! Truly, SWLIHN would be satisfied at the energy efficiency.
 
I SAW DR STRANGE

1) You should see Dr Strange too

2) Now I want to write Obsidian Shards for Ex3 except I already wrote Obsidian Shards for Ex3 and it would be an even different design


gnnnnn
 
I'd rule that Hunger Without Satisfaction's timing has precedence by a strict RAW reading.

Murder is Meat says it nourishes you, but Hunger Without Satisfaction says you start getting hunger penalties. These two statements do not contradict - you can be physically nourished, but the gnawing famine of Metagaos is still telling you "EAT MORE". Hence, you start developing hunger penalties after just (Stamina + Resistance) hours without eating a full meal or killing someone.
I was leaning that way (because "murder once per year" kind of ruins Hunger Without Satisfaction's negative reinforcement), but wanted others' opinions.

It also means that you can double dip your murder victims for a second meal! Truly, SWLIHN would be satisfied at the energy efficiency.
Eh, not really. Murder is Meat feeds you as you move away from the corpse.

Also, double-checking this: since Murder is Meat isn't Stackable, killing two people wouldn't nourish me for a day, and an army wouldn't feed me for years, right (unlike Sacred Kamilla's Inhalation, so long as the motes are spent)?
 
Hmm. I was contemplating going to see that. You recommend it then?
Dr Strange is flawed. The narrative is relatively basic, the character archetypes are either classic or clichés depending on how charitable you are, it has the most boring cosmic evil from beyond time imagineable, it overuses and misplaces humour at inappropriate time, it has a boring villain (although a great actor). It does enjoy a stellar cast, a fresh take or twist on several of its more classic aspects, a clever final confrontation.

On these factors it wouldn't be bad. It would be, like, Ant-Man level, maybe inferior.

But holy shit its visuals and sheer style are by far and away the best the MCU has ever had. This movie actually delivers on what Inception's trailers promised. People fight inside Escher paintings. Streets weave and unfold and collapse. Thin air shatters like glass. A man is kicked and space folds so that he falls hundreds of meters in a dozen yards. "I will trap this girl in the Sahara" is a functional fighting tactic.

It just blew my face off. Recommended.
 
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Sort of crossposted from SB:
What was so broken about the Cobra style martial art?

I heard someone say it made you unkillable, is that related to the false crane posture thing?
 
I SAW DR STRANGE

1) You should see Dr Strange too

2) Now I want to write Obsidian Shards for Ex3 except I already wrote Obsidian Shards for Ex3 and it would be an even different design


gnnnnn

But realtalk, there's a lot of derivative schools of martial arts inspired from similar predecessors in actual kung fu bullshit, and that's something that would be both: 1. Great for homebrew, 2. Best left to homebrew (because I don't think most Exalted fans want the Scroll of Esoteric Knowledge I: Scroll of All The Tiger Styles)*. So there might well be two similar-but-different mirror-based SMAs.

*(it has Stalking Tiger Style, Pouncing Tiger Style, Regal Tiger Style, Apex Predator of Creation Style...)
 
But realtalk, there's a lot of derivative schools of martial arts inspired from similar predecessors in actual kung fu bullshit, and that's something that would be both: 1. Great for homebrew, 2. Best left to homebrew (because I don't think most Exalted fans want the Scroll of Esoteric Knowledge I: Scroll of All The Tiger Styles)*. So there might well be two similar-but-different mirror-based SMAs.

*(it has Stalking Tiger Style, Pouncing Tiger Style, Regal Tiger Style, Apex Predator of Creation Style...)
In itself this is a good idea. But I sort of have a paradigm of sorts for SMA, in the absence of a solid canon guideline, which more or less precludes that kind of approach. SMA covers... aspects of cosmic truth, and are half-designed, half-revealed. A style lies partly in potential within the cosmos; while a Sidereal master could design it in several different ways, once it is designed it is to some extent part of Creation, of Fate. One cannot simply rediscover it or branch it off into a variant form.

Of course, as a writer, that wouldn't preclude me from designing several takes on a style and just picking whichever I prefer for a given game. I'm just too lazy to tackle an SMA as my first writing project in three months :p

Speaking of, I have so much stuff to procrastinate on now that I can properly write, I need a one-off to ease me back into things. Anyone's got some Exalted stuff they'd like me to write something on?
 
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