That's not the issue.

The problem is, if you want a industrial city, you should make one.

Not rob one that it's conveniently there for you to take.

(And really, if you want to keep the mountain folk, sidekick-minion race for Exalts it's an awful role for a species of enlightened beings).
 
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That's not the issue.

The problem is, if you want a industrial city, you should make one.

Not rob one that it's conveniently there for you to take.

(And really, if you want to keep the mountain folk, sidekick-minion race for Exalts it's an awful role for a species of enlightened beings).
Unless, of course, the GM and PCs want to interact with the kinds of stories that involve them having an industrial city without spending X sessions on the many and sundry problems that come with building one, especially if part of their interest is having an industrial city that they don't actually know how to use very well.

They're also not sidekick-minions. They have their own agendas and are easily capable of pushing back against Exalts, violently. The Circle is a tool they're using to regain control of something that's theirs–one easy outcome is that they operate the city, rule it, etc. but the PCs are their allies.
Could I have a link to that, please?
*DayDreamer's craft revision is a part of DayDreamer's Exalted revision, which has significant alterations to pretty much every aspect of the game, especially the engine, which was an older version of Horizon Break's choice system. It really isn't something you can plug and play effectively because there's some pretty fundamental retooling of what Exalts can do and how powerful they are, especially in intellectual areas.
 
... Those are the same dwarves.
The tomb with the book in Moria is Balin's tomb. He's one of the dwarves in Thorin's group. It was written partially by Ori, another of those dwarves.
...my point was that the dwarves in the Hobbit are presented as scattered, diminished figures trying desperately to recover their lost glories, while the dwarves in the Lord of the Rings are much more established and stable, closer to the canonical Jadeborn.
 
...my point was that the dwarves in the Hobbit are presented as scattered, diminished figures trying desperately to recover their lost glories, while the dwarves in the Lord of the Rings are much more established and stable, closer to the canonical Jadeborn.
That's a bit of focus bias in my opinion. After all, one of the five armies in the end is a dwarven army. The story follows a group that was driven from their home, but it doesn't seem like all are.
 
How do people feel about the Mountain Folk?Are there any details about them you've added or changed?

Are they dwarves? I'm not a huge fan of dwarves.

Mountain Folk are actually Elves (Fair Folk pretend to be Elves because it amuses them and confuses others). They're the ancient precursor race with magical powers and an affinity to nature and the elements. It's just that Autocthon cursed them and now the majority of them that are 'born' are dwarves.

Mountain Folk exist for two reasons; they allow you to have elves and dwarves if you really, really want them and they justify keeping all the horrible things locked under Creation from getting to the surface due to their constant and unrelenting blood war nobody on the surface either notices or cares about (mainly because those things can't escape or if they did would burst into fire the next sunrise so the blood war is kind of pointless from a 'living on the surface' perspective).
 
That's a bit of focus bias in my opinion. After all, one of the five armies in the end is a dwarven army. The story follows a group that was driven from their home, but it doesn't seem like all are.
That's fair, the differentiation isn't quite as strong as suggested within the source, but the point is still pretty clear hopefully.
 
ES Homebrew: Mountain People
How do people feel about the Mountain Folk?Are there any details about them you've added or changed?

Are they dwarves? I'm not a huge fan of dwarves.

How did I put it before?

Oh yes.

Hmm, let me try to remember the exact details.

Firstly, and probably critically, they're de-PCised. Without the chains of "having to be constructed as a PC group despite the fact I've never even heard of anyone playing a Mountain Folk game", they can be built from the ground up to enable their use as interesting narrative tools for the games people actually play.

Secondly, and almost as importantly, they're de-dwarfised. Dwarves as a "separate race" can fuck right off. If I wanted bearded short hard drinking people in Exalted, I'll go and put some humans with the Small mutation (and Cosmetic (Female Beards)) in some area. Yes, even the mountain-dwelling bits of dwarves. LotR dwarves are humans in Exalted. And then we can have weird sects of humans living in Shogunate mines that they've turned into cities, keeping themselves separate from others, and if they and other people consider themselves a separate race, that's just good ol' racism. "Humans" in Exalted are way, way broader than most fantasy - so any legit non-human non-spirits need to be stranger and more distinctive. As it stands, the Mountain Folk really aren't that distinctive.

Thirdly, the "endless war in the darkness and without them Creation would be dooooooomed" aspect needs to go, too. It's one of those too-large, all-consuming things and thus should be attacked in the shower with a knife while memorable violin music plays. That means breaking the Darkbrood's role up into smaller bits, and that also means that the Mountain Folk can be much more Balkanised and vary by region. A GM can totally just drop a small city of Mountain Folk into their campaign as a thing that's in the area without touching any greater plot or larger scale organisations.

(Also, as a 4th personal preference, any use of them as "lol lol lol Celestials have super-crafting mooks just waiting for you to show up" can fuck right off. I hate plot elements that basically only exist to hand free things to 'the glorious returning Solars' or 'the Alchemicals are here, here's lots of allies for them'. Any reworked Mountain Folk have to primarily stand alone as an independent plot element with any utility they provide strictly secondary at best.)

So, within those constraints you've got quite a way to go in whatever direction you like.

What I was leaning towards is the idea that, effectively, the "shape" of a Mountain Folk doesn't matter. They're almost a golem-race, so to speak; their form is set by their statue-body which their heart is placed in at 'birth'. They don't have a childhood - they're made in their adult form. And there's nothing about them which means they have to be humanoid. Sure, Mountain Folk made to interact with surface worlders are built to resemble statues of humans, but that's no more them than the spider-like mining creatures who gnaw at the rock to extract gems. They're both, equally, Mountain Folk - because they're living statues animated by the heart which is a calcified fae.

When they were the People of Adamant, they all used bodies of perfect, flawless adamant. They made no mistakes. Each progeny they crafted was perfect - taking ages to craft - and possessed their full capacity. They made no progeny who were inferior. In the Primordial War, to make up casualties they made the first "slave soldiers" - made from inferior jade, less attuned to their nature, but the jade-born were only a short-term solution to the losses of the war. They were inferior, and they were never meant to make their own progeny. Jade clouded their minds and meant that errors crept in. If the jade-born were to make progeny, they might be even worse.

Only the Exalted came to trust the jade-born more than the distant, cold, calculating adamant-born. They had fought alongside the jade-born, while they could read the actions of the adamant-born after the war and they knew that the People of Adamant would not consider themselves servants of the Exalted - only peers, at best. And they, too, were outraged by how their blood-brother People of Jade were treated by their makers.

So the Exalted Host acted, and the People of Adamant were no more. No wonder Autochthon fled.

But the jade-born realised that they were never meant to be, that they were flawed copies of the People of Adamant. Errors crept in. Within a thousand years, some jade-born were so flawed, so clumsy that they could only work in lesser materials like marble and other stones. The sickening society of the jade-born tried to stop such flawed jade-born from furthering their decline, repeating the sins of their forefathers. They forced quality controls, prevented the construction of new jade-born without vetting, and desperately tried to keep as many of the elder jade-born alive. They begged the Deliberative to try to help them make more adamant-born, to lessen the decline. But the Deliberative was overthrown and the jade-born found that they were presented once again with a choice - swear allegiance to the Shogunate, or face another pogrom.

They swore allegiance.

The Balorian Crusade and the Contagion together irrevocably shattered the Mountain Folk society. The plague wiped out most of their cities, but then the Balorian Crusade trapped vast numbers of new hearts of calcified chaos princes. In the scattered post-apocalyptic remnants of their societies, all the constraints that had maintained their standards were cast aside. Soon the jade-born were a rare elite among the stone-born masses.

Shambling, clumsy, crude - the stone-born are mockeries compared to the grace of the jade-born, and even they were just parodies of the adamant-born. Their minds are limited by their mediums. The elite caste of jade-born try to preserve and expand their ranks, but the stone-born outnumber them and there are ruined cities below the earth where stone-born shamble through, carrying crude club-shovels and following their mountain-deep instincts to make things. Their minds can still contemplate beautiful things, but much of the original savant-like genius is lost to them. Some of the brighter stone-born have learned their old magics which let them alter their bodies and they fortify their selves, but the Mountain Folk will never regain their old glory.

Narratively, the Mountain Folk can play the traditional role of fantasy orcs, dwarves or trolls as the GM sees fit - because they're all of them. Also, they can be giant stone spiders living beneath the earth. They turn to unliving stone in the sunlight, so they're certainly part troll there, but they have a genius with tools and can be cunning even when they're not that bright (somewhat orcish) and the jade-born provide the dwarf-like 'dying race' thing.
 
Wow, I like that a lot. I think I'm gonna use it. Thanks!

What kind of powers would you give to the adamant-born or the Jade-born versus the stone-born? Charms or some other capability?
 
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Wow, I like that a lot. I think I'm gonna use it. Thanks!

What kind of powers would you give to the adamant-born or the Jade-born versus the stone-born? Charms or some other capability?
Higher Social/Mental Attributes, for one thing. Presumably the People of Adamant were sitting at Enlightenment 3+ at minimum, and so had Essence and Spirit Charms and Terrestrial Circle Sorcery and the ability to buy Abilities above 3. The Stoneborn would generally be Enlightenment 0 from their description, with rare prodigies with Enlightenment 1.

This is under the Kerisgame rules, mind.
 
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I'm reminded a lot of Steven Universe of all things there, @EarthScorpion - your Mountain Folk sound rather similar to the Homeworld Gems.
 
Friend of mine running 3e Exalted is telling me about TNs. Apparently the characters have so many dice that they're all but guaranteed to pass the highest TN, 5, on basically anything they do that's remotely covered by an Excellency.

She's said it's led to steamrolling of non-combat (and combat, to some extent) challenges as long as an Exalted isn't facing them, and those are supposed to be sorta rare.

To answer this again.

A part of this problem is that mote costs are balanced around their use in combat (Where you have a rather limited supply). In combat, using full excellencies is kinda expensive, and your effective dice pool is going to be lower that your max one.

Out of combat, motes are much cheaper to use, and you can easily use full excellencies without much trouble. Since most things will be resolved with a single roll.

(And isn't it curious, that buffing yourself for a whole performance cost the same that buffing yourself for a single second?).

Other part is that the difficulty scales isn't really consistent.

And of course, there is the thing that even without magic, Exalts are basically max-leveled humans, and you have to work with that in mind.

(If you are playing with a whole circle, is almost certain that at least one of them will have a maxed dicepool for any conceivable action).
 
Besides Crafting and Sorcery/Necromancy, what other options in Exalted are a path to the road of broken dreams and hopes?
 
Higher Social/Mental Attributes, for one thing. Presumably the People of Adamant were sitting at Enlightenment 3+ at minimum, and so had Essence and Spirit Charms and Terrestrial Circle Sorcery and the ability to buy Abilities above 3. The Stoneborn would generally be Enlightenment 0 from their description, with rare prodigies with Enlightenment 1.

This is under the Kerisgame rules, mind.

Thank you! This is helpful.

Are the Kerisgame rules collected somewhere?

Also, are the Jadeborn all made of White Jade?
 
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What do you mean, "most suited"?

(I'd also like to reaffirm my opposition to any character being described as "a crafter". Don't be "a crafter". Be an architect, an artist, a calligrapher, a smith. Embrace the elements of the concept that aren't just "I sit in a corner and make artefacts". An architect needs bureaucracy, they need the capacity to coax their patron into accepting their plans, and they need to know about geomancy. An artist should make art for a purpose - and so make their work as social attacks. A calligrapher can be a poet as well - and a scholar. A smith is a big tough person who is at home in combat. Find something your concept does in tactical resolution time.)

True- in this case, she's mostly the last one, forget of hell spawned wonders- and with a side of Malfean punching things with radiation and wrathfire. :V

One question regarding the Coadjutor rules- would it be safe to assume 'mindless' demons, under this system, can't ever carry an Exaltation?
 
TFW you sit there and type up a long post about your new homebrew idea for something like the Jadeborn and then your browser crashes and the draft isn't saved beyond the very first sentence.

Fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck.

Alright, I'm too annoyed to type up everything again so bullet points.

  • Geas on the People of Adamant is different. Autobot instead largely cripples their crafting abilities, reducing them from Celestial tier to equal to or slightly above Terrestrial so that they wouldn't be a threat to the Exalted.
  • People of Adamant consider this a betrayal and Autobot is ashamed of crippling his favorites, one of the probable major causes for his exile and his leaving the People of Adamant behind.
  • People of Adamant are salty, but deal with it. They kick back with a bucket of popcorn come Usurpation and ooh and aah at all the pretty explosions.
  • Shogunate happens, but largely ignores the People of Adamant aside from trading with them.
  • Great Contagion happens and kills huge amounts of People of Adamant, even managing to infect their cycle of reincarnation.
  • Balorian Crusade comes around and rips up the People of Adamant and totally destroys their cycle of reincarnation, trying to release/revive the chaos within them.
  • People of Adamant panic and send their souls into the earth and the Dragon Lines in the hopes of somehow surviving.
  • Empress fires her lazor.
  • The souls of the People of Adamant end up all over the place and end up in Jade veins around Creation.
  • They start popping out of Jade, fully formed.
  • Giants(and Cyclopes and Hundred Handed Ones) instead of dwarfs.
  • Maybe kin to Elementals and possibly becoming akin to Lesser Elemental Dragons. Up in the air.
  • Transformation from People of Adamant and all of the repeated kicks to the balls may have knocked Autobot's geas loose. Up in the air.
  • No longer in the narrative role of "Dying race." They're climbing out of the pit they got drop kicked into, same as everyone else in Creation.
I started coming up with this idea about a week ago, so I'm still trying to work out a lot of kinks and figure out what I want out of this. In general, I wanted to move the change from Adamant to Jade to the modern age(if at the beginning of the modern age) instead of in the ancient past. Wanted to change the dwarf aesthetic, but keep crafting, so I made them the Cyclopes forging Zeus's lightning instead.

Still a bit iffy on what their place in the setting as a whole should be.

If anyone's got any comments, criticism, ideas, or anything, I'd be happy to hear it.
 
It seems as if these "People of Adamant" are somewhat similar to the original Lintha. You should probably provide a strong explanation for how they managed to survive in the First Age when the Exalted were eliminating the patron races of the Yozi and potential rivals to humanity.

If you want their story to be more optimistic than that of the Lintha and contrast with the theme of "Dying Race" then you should also provide some solid information on how they reproduce. What happens after a few of them pop out fully formed from large collections of Jade? Can they reliably make more of themselves or do they have to rely on the vagaries of spontaneous generation?
 
It seems as if these "People of Adamant" are somewhat similar to the original Lintha. You should probably provide a strong explanation for how they managed to survive in the First Age when the Exalted were eliminating the patron races of the Yozi and potential rivals to humanity.

If you want their story to be more optimistic than that of the Lintha and contrast with the theme of "Dying Race" then you should also provide some solid information on how they reproduce. What happens after a few of them pop out fully formed from large collections of Jade? Can they reliably make more of themselves or do they have to rely on the vagaries of spontaneous generation?

Stuff that was in the original post. :sour:

Okay, couple things. People of Adamant(and the Jadeborn they became) are canon in Exalted, but are changed and ignored by people for a variety of reasons.

Baseline for canon and this is that they were created by the Clayman who was created by Autobot and were his favored people. They sided with the Exalted during the Primordial War and fought alongside them.

After the War, tensions rose between the two for a number of reasons. In canon, the Exalted told Autobot to deal with his people or they would, which he did via the Great Geas. In this version, Autobot acted first and laid a different Geas from canon on the People of Adamant to prevent the Exalted from feeling threatened by them and taking it out on the People of Adamant(and possibly him).

In terms of reproduction, the Jadeborn spontaneously generate from Jade deposits. While they can't yet get the souls of their unborn to pop into jade when they want it, they can accelerate the growth and birth of Jadeborn by "feeding" them things like essence tokens or hearthstones from demesnes and manses.
 
What kind of powers would you give to the adamant-born or the Jade-born versus the stone-born? Charms or some other capability?

The basic idea would be that Mountain Folk cannot ever raise their Enlightenment. They're stuck with what they had when they were made. Now, the Adamantborn are Enlightenment 5, every last one. It also takes a master Adamantborn craftsgolem something like a century to carve a new Adamantborn from a single giant adamant, and that's with all their craft-enabling powers. Adamantborn basically operated on a similar tier to Alchemicals (but were, ironically enough, even more expensive to make).

That's why they were seriously worrying to the Exalted. They were operating in the "low-end Celestial" space, though not with a combat focus.

Anyway, Jade can support an Enlightenment of up to 4, and stone can support it up to 2.

Then you just allocate them Charms so their falling Enlightenment locks out all their best crafting Charms. You put all the really, really good stuff at Enlightenment 5. Then there's still some good things in the 3-4 range, and then by the time you get down to 2 they're a pale mockery of what they once were.

And since they can't ever raise their Enlightenment, they're fucked if they're made imperfect.

(pity the crudely pieced together Enlightenment 0 Stoneborn who can't even perceive essence and has less room for spiritual growth than a mortal human)
 
If I wanted to use the Mountain Folk in my games and wasn't satisfied by canon, I would probably draw upon @Crumplepunch's 2e rewrite, which sadly appears not to be collected in one place. It's a labor of love and Artisans carving themselves into fantastic shapes akin to Hindu demons for power and simple vanity is just pretty great.
 
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