Just... hit their soul gems. Aside from that, there's also a lot of undone training we could do; on top of that, we're in a bad position right now, since we were ambushed. In short;
1. We lack preparation.
2. We lack proper defenses.
3. We were caught way off guard.
4. We haven't pulled out our Noble Phantasms yet, either. The enemy has.
After all, there's still a massive list of Runes for Bryn (and maybe Aife if willing) to teach us if we can get her to recover, we now actually know the names of our enemies and can produce viable counters, we've still got Hitomi and Caren to train up (which if done well will remove the need for Diarmuid to spend his time covering them) and I wouldn't say that Sigurd and Atalanta are 'stalling' us, moreso just particularly sturdy and hard to pin down respectively.
The enemy cannot regenerate if you destroy their Soul Gem.
Like you could spin it as,"Oh but this is just the opening skirmish. You guys are gaining information to make a better plan for next time." But the opposite is also true isn't it? And the enemy is getting a better deal; The still have most of their hand hidden, while most of our card are already on the table.
This, I am not prepared to answer for this just yet. But we will get there, eventually. As far as the information disparity goes, consider Plague's argument.
We've already ID'd their Archer and seen her use Phoebus Catastrophe. The only thing our girls don't know about is Agrius Metamorphosis, but Rider knows that and he can spill the beans on everything he knows about her.
We've ID'd their Saber and Rider, and Bryn, if she can be calmed down, can tell us everything she knows about them because she knows who both of them are.
We (not IC but OOC) know who the enemy's Assassin is and can at least guess at what she's capable of if we use her existing class vessel as a basis.
We're still missing information on Caster, Lancer, and Berserker of Blue, as well as the capabilities of the unseen masters; but at least for the masters, we have Hijiri Kanna who can fill us in. Lancer and Berserker will be coming soon, so we'll get to see who they are and what they're capable of as well within the next few days.
On the flip side, we haven't made our servants reveal anything about themselves that would give their identities away, outside of Bryn who both Sigurd and Ramesses know, and maybe Diarmuid if Moralltach and Beagalltach are easy to identify. Oh, yeah, and Achilles since Atalanta knows him. Can't forget that.
Thinking on it, we probably should retreat. But if we aren't, which might be viable but I'm against, then a command seal or two wouldn't be a bad idea.
Well, whether we are planning on retreating or not, we can only do it with votes. Plague, if you've got any additions or changes to make, now would be the time to make them.
For @NMS@SaintBenot@k4lepo@Swedish15@Yuri Vampire@WanderingTwix, if you guys want to add anything or make your own votes, now is the time. @Jefardi, if you have the time to come up with something and want to show up and help us not die, that is also appreciated.
[X] Plan: Panic & Falling Back
-[X] Change tactics
--[X] First, Master's Vision Sigurd.
--[X] Who needs to deal with the enemy Archer and her master?
---[X] Gilgamesh still, but since Brynhildr is preoccupied, send in Archer.
-[X] Who needs to deal with the enemy Rider and his master?
--[X] Aife and Achilles.
-[X] Who needs to deal with the enemy Saber and his master?
--[X] Lancelot and Brynhildr.
-[X] Protecting Hitomi and Caren
--[X] Diarmuid
-[X] Tell everyone to start falling back if possible, and if Brynhildr needs a Command Seal or two, so be it. We've got info on them, they don't have any on us, and we should recuperate and come back and hit harder.
Any thoughts? Should we stay on the offense instead of pulling back? Should we try to get a good hit in on a Servant before leaving?
@PlaguePaladin to be honest the problem here is information in universe our characters have recently encountered enemy servants with no info about and 2 of those will likely kill or injured the allied servants sent to fight them so the best bet is to retreat and gather info and fight them somewhere else. The enemy servants that we can actually kill right now is the enemy Archer but I don't know if she would delay our servants or retreat and Brynhildr and Lancelot can actually kill Saber but same with the enemy Archer if that happens the masters may redirect the enemy Rider on that fight. So it is best to retreat for now the grail war is just starting and we have plenty of time to fight them again.
To answer this, I need to know the ballistic coefficient of the particular sword Gil is firing at Atalanta. How far does the sword have to travel before it leaves GoB, how fast is it going when it leaves GoB, how far can it travel before it dips, how far away is Atalanta from where Gil is firing; that sort of thing. I'm not really confident in my aiblity to speak on Gil as a ranged combatant versus an actual Archer using proper, aerodynamic projectiles. The wiki doesn't even list a range for GoB.
I'm assuming he's nowhere near as good a ranged combatant, even if his volume of fire is greater, because Atalanta has the skills and tools required to actually hit a target at range. Gil would dominate her in a close-range encounter because I'm highly doubtful that she's got the agility to keep up with the volume of fire GoB is capable of sustaining, but at range I'm doubtful of his ability to accurately hit her with any one sword.
I'm assuming he's nowhere near as good a ranged combatant, even if his volume of fire is greater, because Atalanta has the skills and tools required to actually hit a target at range. Gil would dominate her in a close-range encounter because I'm highly doubtful that she's got the agility to keep up with the volume of fire GoB is capable of sustaining, but at range I'm doubtful of his ability to accurately hit her with any one sword.
In FGO, CasGil restricts himself to staves because he's letting the boys use his swords to defend Uruk. Since FGO isn't canon and the Babylon singularity doesn't exist, CasGil here has no reason not to spam swords is that's what he knows best how to do, so that's how I've been portraying him since his introduction. He can blast at Atalanta with magic staves, just like he can whip out a giant axe and cave your face in if he so chooses, but swords are his go-to because he's Gil and sword span is Gil's go-to.
I would still say that the same applies. Yes, Gil can hit you at range with swords/staves/whatever the fuck else he found in the back of his closet, but he's hitting you because of his high volume of fire, and not because he has the skills and tools required to be a ranged combatant by design; and someone with an actual ranged combat kit could and should be able to hit Gil before he can hit them. Get it?
I would still say that the same applies. Yes, Gil can hit you at range with swords/staves/whatever the fuck else he found in the back of his closet, but he's hitting you because of his high volume of fire, and not because he has the skills and tools required to be a ranged combatant by design; and someone with an actual ranged combat kit could and should be able to hit Gil before he can hit them. Get it?
-[X] Tell everyone to start falling back if possible, and if Brynhildr needs a Command Seal or two, so be it. We've got info on them, they don't have any on us, and we should recuperate and come back and hit harder.
I get that we probably have to use command seals here, but do you think the enemy will notice Oriko not having any disappear because they're not visibly on her hand? Hopefully, they won't notice and start being suspicious of her Unlimited Command Seals.
That, and the laws of writing state that defeating/killing some enemies now would be pretty anti-climatic this early into the story. In other words, it's not happening.
I get that we probably have to use command seals here, but do you think the enemy will notice Oriko not having any disappear because they're not visibly on her hand? Hopefully, they won't notice and start being suspicious of her Unlimited Command Seals.
Oriko is on top of a building and the nearest opponent is 700m away from her. Put yourself in Satomi's shoes and see if you can even see Oriko's hand from that distance, let alone see the absence of a Command Seal being spent.
In FGO, CasGil restricts himself to staves because he's letting the boys use his swords to defend Uruk. Since FGO isn't canon and the Babylon singularity doesn't exist, CasGil here has no reason not to spam swords is that's what he knows best how to do, so that's how I've been portraying him since his introduction. He can blast at Atalanta with magic staves, just like he can whip out a giant axe and cave your face in if he so chooses, but swords are his go-to because he's Gil and sword span is Gil's go-to.
Gil is actually a pretty strong long range combatant if more so if he is a Caster since his magical attacks can actually home in on their targets examples his fight with Ereshkigal in FGO his homing beams were following her attacks and neutralizing them. His fight with Enkidu we seen him create a portal in the sky and that is how many meters in the sky that can suck in the clouds and call in a powerful lightning attack. Finally his fight with Tiamat when he appear he was able to engulf Tiamat's body with lots NPs and Tiamat's body is huge if you campare to Uruk. So yeah Gil is a strong range fighter and doesn't matter how good you are with that bow and arrow since Gil can deploy defensive NPs surrounding himself with them as well like in Fate Strange Fake and other unknown NPs.
The enemy Saber servant is tall, with a stern face and piercing blue eyes hidden behind glasses. A padded black gambeson and heavy black pants cover his body from head to toe , and overtop his clothes rests armour coloured in grey and icy blue. From his shoulders, clad in imposing spiked pauldrons, a deep blue-violet cape falls down to the ankles of his armoured boots. In his right hand he holds a gleaming silver sword as long as he is tall, and as soon as he clears the rubble he with his left hand calls on a rune familiar to you. His armoured finger traces the Isa rune in the air, and in a flash the length of his blade is coated in a jagged layer of ice, while around his left hand floats a ring of dagger-like icicles.
"I've got good news and bad news," comes Archer's voice echoing inside your head. "The good news is, I recognise that sword and I know who our enemy Saber is."
"And the bad news?"
An unexpected guest lands beside you. Lancer's presence is not unappreciated, however; even with Saber, and now Berserker joining the fray as well, the presence of the enemy Ssaber chills you to your core. Her hands tremble and her eyes burn, and you hear her armour rattle as her whole body shakes in the enemy Saber's presence. Her eyes meet the enemy Saber's own, and she says but one word. "Sigurd..."
"We're completely boned."
It takes only a second to check Archer's claim with your master's vision. You only know the name Sigurd from Oriko's Lancer servant, but you know nothing about him aside from the fact that he was once Lancer's lover. Knowing that, you probably only have a brief moment to view Saber's parameters for yourself before he and Lancer engage in battle.
Strength - A+
Endurance - A
Agility - A
Mana - A
Luck - E
Noble Phantasm - A++
Magic Resistance - A
Riding - A
Divinity - B
Mana Burst (Ice) - A
Primordial Rune -
Wisdom of the Dragon - A
Gram - Dawn of Ruin - A++
Bearing the name of Wrath, Gram is the sword used by Sigurd to slay the dragon Fafnir. Gram is a sword passed down the bloodline of the Volsung, and to Sigurd's father Sigmund before him. After being broken by Odin during Sigmund's fight with King Lyngvi, Sigmund's wife kept the two halves of Gram for her son, who eventually received it, reforged, from the dwarf Regin.
As a sword, Gram is comparable in renown and power to King Arthur's Excalibur, and when used it converts the user's magical energy into offensive power, releasing it in the form of a directed blast of energy capable of slaying a dragon or leveling a fortress. It is an "ultimate killing technique" comparable to Excalibur. Even if the attack is dodged, those in close proximity can still be disrupted by the intensity of the blast.
Archer was right; you are completely boned. "That's incredible," you say, instinctively taking a step back as you close your master's vision on the enemy Saber. "Apart from his Luck stat, he's A-ranked across the board."
"Servants have stats?" you hear the voice of Hitomi asking.
You don't even need to see her to know Nurse Ortensia is nodding in response to Hitomi's quesiton. "When you get down to it, the Holy Grail War is just one big game."
"How appropriate," Asami Saki says. The air is thick with tension, and the intensity of the two servants standing between you and the enemy master is like a furnace. "Because I want to play a game with you. Saber, annihilate them."
"As you command, master." Saber doesn't even need his Noble Phantasm; the commanding presence of voice alone could slay a dragon effortlessly. "Brynhildr, it pains me to see you as my foe, but I shall do as my master commands of me. I hope you shall not hold it against me when I slay you."
You don't know what else you can say to Lancer, except "Don't die. Oriko would be upset if she lost you." You aren't sure Lancer can understand you now.
The ground gives way as Lancer is the first to charge, wreathing her spear in flames as she lets loose a cry of "SIGURD!" as her opponent readies his body to fight. the enemy Saber brings up his left hand, punching with rapid succession the dagger-like icicles one after the other, each one piercing Lancer's defenses as they find their mark. The attack does little to slow Lancer, and when the next volley comes she is ready, batting each icicle away with a swing of her spear.
"No way," Asami Saki says to herself. "Saber's attack had no effect?"
If your enemy is too busy focusing on her servant to worry about you, then you'll take the opportunity to remind her of who her opponent is. You bring up your bow, loosing a volley of arrows in her direction; only for the enemy Saber to stop your attack with a wall of ice as effortlessly as breathing, never once taking his eyes off the battle with Lancer. Berserker appears, and he as well charges into battle against the enemy Saber. Their swords clash, and the force of their swords colliding is enough to knock you back. You recover, but your worry now is how Hitomi and Nurse Ortensia will fare in the middle of a battle like this.
"Saber!" You don't care that you aren't his master. "Protect Hitomi and Nurse Ortensia!" You've got two squishy teammates who aren't prepared for what you've walked into tonight.
"Do you need me to intervene?"
"It's tempting, but the risk that you'll hit Lancer or Berserker is too high," you respond to Archer. The enemy Saber's movements are a blur; he effortlessly pivots between Lancer and Berserker, as if he were fighting a single opponent and not two. "Go help Caster deal with the enemy Archer. That was supposed to be Lancer's responsibility, but since she's here instead-"
"Caster probably won't need help actually fighting her, but I'll do what I can to pin her down so she can't target Tomoe or Mikuni."
Lancer lets out another cry as she charges, and Berserker comes to her aid, charging from the opposite direction to attack the enemy Saber in a pincer formation. Starting with Lancer, the enemy Saber launches another volley of icicles into her face; she brushes the attack aside, but the enemy Saber slaps her down with the broad side of his sword, before turning his attention to Berserker, clashing blades and forcing Berserker back.
"How is he doing that?" You don't understand it; even when both Lancer and Berserker attack at the same time, it's as if the enemy Saber knows ahead of time exactly how to move and react to fight them both off at once. His body is a blur, and his sword cuts a path of icy blue through the air with every swing and every parry. For as much as you've tried to keep your attention focused on pinning Asami Saki down, the enemy Saber's movements never fail to capture your attention in just the wrong way. You have to dodge a lashing bolt of electricity from Asami Saki, forcing you to keep mobile as you retaliate with another volley of arrows. "Can he see the future?"
"He doesn't need to see the future to beat those two!" AsamI Saki replies, weaving in and out of your arrows while she retaliates with electricity. "He knew your Lancer in life, and he's clearly the better fighter; I'm sure he could beat her with his eyes closed!"
That doesn't explain how her Saber is able to fight back both Lancer and Berserker simultaneously; but right now that isn't what's most important. Right now, what's most important is getting out of this battle alive. You've been separated from your teammates for too long; you need to take stock of their situations. "Report in; how are things going on your ends?"
"I managed to land a clean shot on the master of the enemy Archer, but she regenerated from her injury and we're now locked in something of a stalemate."
"I'm doing everything I can to keep her pinned for Tomoe-san, but that other master has good reflexes, and has managed to get in the occasiona hit on us."
"I've got a sword through my chest, and this pink bitch keeps whipping me with fire every time I try ta get up. It's really pissing me off."
"Also she's got an army of teddy bear familiars that don't die when you kill them. I didn't even know puella magi could make familiars."
"And how are your servants handling things?" A flash of gold in the distance gives me you something of an answer. The enemy Archer is sent crashing into a nearby building by a flurry of swords from Caster's golden portals. Ignoring the whirlwind that is Lancer, Berserker, and the enemy Saber clashing blades currently happening right beside her, she picks herself up from the rubble and returns fire with a volley of emerald, before dashing up the side of the building to avoid an incoming barrage from your own Archer. "... You'll all be happy to know that Archer and Caster are doing a good job of keeping the enemy Archer occupied," you say. "What about Rider and Assassin? How are they faring against the enemy Rider?"
"Rider's holding his own against this guy." That would be Kyouko. Despite her earlier griping, you doubt a sword through the chest would really be enough to keep her down. At least, not as long as it isn't the sword of a certain witch..."But Assassin's barely managed to put a dent in him 'cause he keeps swatting her away every time she gets in close."
"Is she really at that much of a disadvantage?"
"Nah. She did manage ta get in one really clean hit on the bastard, and I think it really hurt him 'cause he's been careful about keeping her away ever since."
"Good." Kyouko and Kirika are well out of your line of sight, so assessing the enemy Rider's abilities for yourself isn't something you can do. You'll have to trust in Kyouko's ability to work with Rider, and in Assassin's abilities and the class advantage she has over the enemy Rider. "Listen, I think we should start falling back if that's possible. We were blindsided and went into this completely unprepared for a fight."
"Are you kidding? Come on, Spooky, I can take this bitch!"
"Weren't you the one who said you had a sword through your chest? What would Sayaka think if she saw the state you were in? I'm trying to look out for you."
"Yeah, sure whatever. If this bitch'll gimme the chance, I'll see what I can do ta get me and Crazy outta here."
"Tomoe-san, Oriko, we're pulling out. Are you able to pull out from your current position?"
"We might be able to. What about the rest of you?"
Gods above, when was the last time you had to retreat? You can't even remember. "I honestly don't know." But you hope you will be able to. Lancer, Berserker, and the enemy Saber clash again; and again, and each time they do, the force of their weapons colliding with one another sends out shockwaves that shatter glass and send chunks of road flying in all directions. Countless numbers of massive craters dot what remains of the road; they aren't letting up. "Oriko, I don't know if Lancer will be able to understand your order to retreat the way she is now. Do you think you'll need to use any Command Seals to pull her out?"
"I hope not, but right now, Lancer must be..."
You feel the overwhelming, reality-warping power of a Command Seal being activated, ripping Lancer from her place in reality and leaving Berserker to face the enemy Saber alone. Their blades clash, once, before Saber launches a flurry of icicles at Berserker. He blocks them, but the two do not resume the attack. "You fight with the strength of many men, Ser Sigurd," Berserker says. "I wish we had met under better circumstances. A warrior of your caliber would have been a most welcome ally to my King."
"I am sure," the enemy Saber replies. "Tell me, knight; if you are of the Saber class, then perhaps you shall grace me with the pleasure to know your name? It is only fair; you know mine, but I know of you only as a black knight."
"A black knight is all you need know me as; for I am no Saber, and it is not my place to give that knowledge to my master's enemy."
"Understandable." The two stand still, their blades at the ready, their bodies tensed, but neither Berserker nor the enemy Saber makes a move. "Am I to assume that the battle is mine this night?"
Berserker hangs his head, saying with a voice thick with resignation "Regrettably."
"Then I shall let you go in peace."
"Saber!" Asami Saki barks at her servant, asking him "What do you think you're doing? Finish him!"
"This night is ours, master," the enemy Saber replies, to a stunned face from Asami Saki. "Besides, now that I know Brynhildr has been summoned, my enemy in this War has been decided for me. I shall allow Berserker to make this knight her quarry in my stead."
It appears the enemy Saber is letting you off the hook, at least for the moment. You can't speak for your teammates caught up in their own battles, but you won't look a gift horse in the mouth. "We're getting out of here," you say to Hitomi an Nurse Ortensia. "Let's get moving before their Saber changes his mind."
Sorry for leaving you guys off with a [ ] Wat do? and no guidance, but I had absolutely no idea what kind of options to give you from this position.
A bit about Sigurd- Obviously, this is not FGO's Sigurd. Now, I was stuck using the FGO portrait and couldn't do anything about the way he or Gram looked, but since I wasn't using Bölverk Gram I had to think of some other reason for why Gram looked so... FGO-ey. Thus, Mana Burst (Ice). Similar to how Bryn uses Mana Burst (Fire) by invoking Sowilo, Sigurd uses Isa to coat Gram in ice - that's my explanation for why Gram looks so FGO-ey - and he also uses it to make icicle-daggers that replicate the look and function of Bölverk Gram without having to explain why Sigurd is a moron who thinks throwing his sword makes for a more effective attack.
Wisdom of the Dragon takes elements from both Crystallised Wisdom and Dragon Kind Modification and boils them down into something that more closely resembles the Sigurd of myth. It acts as an all-around knowledge boon which Sigurd received after eating Fafnir's heart. In the original myth, it only gives him the ability to understand the language of birds, but since TM dragons are Pretty Big Deals, and because "understanding birds" is pretty low-tier compared to the caliber of abilities seen elsewhere in Fate, he gets an all-around knowledge boon instead.
Gram... Is just Excalibur now. Sure, it's got a bit of Nordic flavour, but at its core Gram is just a reskinned Excalibur. I don't have anything fancy to say about it.
EDIT: Oh, and Plague; I know we had this discussion about Divinity and whether it's a class skill or a personal skill, but I decided to move it back to being a class skill because Bryn has Divinity as a class skill, and I wanted to keep that between them.
"He doesn't need to see the future to beat those two!" "He knew your Lancer in life, and he's clearly the better fighter; I'm sure he could beat her with his eyes closed!"
Well, narrative weight really isn't on their side, huh? I think seen this behavior from literally everyone who's been on the losing side in a Grail War.
[X] Plan: Go Home and Freak Out a Little
-[X] Leave the hot zone
--[X] Find somewhere to debrief
---[X] Ask anyone if they know other Servants from different Grail Wars, and if so, what their abilities are
--[X] Diarmuid: Freak out a little once it's discovered that apparently Atalanta is part boar
Well, narrative weight really isn't on their side, huh? I think seen this behavior from literally everyone who's been on the losing side in a Grail War.
If this were a straight-up fanfic, I wouldn't have to worry about the balance between "They're supposed to be difficult for us to beat, but not impossible" and "These guys are too hard, I don't wanna play anymore!" and I could afford to give their aggro-talking a bit more weight to it without risking backlash from players dropping like flies.
