Has anyone actually won a Grail War?
Confringentur 2; a Madoka Magica / Fate/Stay Night sequel
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The short answer is, you don't; you either lose, or you don't lose. The long answer is dependent on how you define 'winning'.
Just throwing this out there but Sigurd has a dragon aspect or something like that, so there's no way that shooting an altered Balmung at him won't do serious damage.
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He does in FGO because in FGO eating Fafnir's heart made... Him... A dragon? Kind of? I don't know. I never cared to pay much attention to what FGO was doing in the first place, and once it got on the Lostbelts that was when I stopped taking it seriously in the slightest because it was no longer taking itself seriously in the slightest. But this Sigurd only gained an all-around knowledge boon from eating Fafnir's heart; it didn't turn him into a dragon or part-dragon or whatever.
I mean, you can still shoot at him with big honking swords and it will still hurt because we're an Archer and he's a Saber and we have the advantage, but it's not going to cleave through him like a dragon made of butter because he isn't a dragon here.
PlaguePaladin
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Alternative: Secret-Calibur
Seriously, I don't know how people actually like the Lostbelts. That wasn't an insult to you Swedish. You're a good bean.
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I mean, once yous strip away the Fate brand name association, seeing Qin Shi Huang as Ultimate Lifeform Cars is kind of funny, in a "Was that a JoJo reference?" kind of way, although I still would rather have seen the actual Qin Shi Huang and not the JoJo reference version.
This guy, on the other hand, is completely inexcusable. At this point, he doens't even look like he belongs in the same universe as the rest of the available servants. And don't even get me started on Odysseus.
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To be honest Atalanta should have died on the first volley of Caster's barrage since that's what actually happens to most servants without strong defensive abilities. But I am satisfied in this outcome we may have not killed her now but we did bruise her ego. Hope their is an option to send Caster against her again just to see her reaction to him.
I'm pretty sure the other Servants are capable of dodging? If Shirou Emiya, a literal human can survive against Gil for any amount of time I'm sure that Atalanta can survive a single volley.
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He can only survive if Gil was not trying to kill him or was playing around and if Gil was trying to kill him then Emiya's body would been torn to shreds Gil can fire his projectiles to repel Heracles swings, create craters on the ground and sundered buildings.
But other than that the fight was good and it is good to feel the feeling of defeat once more it's been awhile after all. Nice to have an enemy capable of matching our servants again.
But other than that the fight was good and it is good to feel the feeling of defeat once more it's been awhile after all. Nice to have an enemy capable of matching our servants again.
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Something else that just came to me, the Saints regeneration is likely because of their Assassin. She is a doctor after all. Either that or their Caster but I find that far less likely than it being a product of Assassin of Blue, whether it's a skill or her Noble Phantasm.
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Eh, I get if people don't like certain developments in the Lostbelt. I like them, because there's a certain weight to the decision to continue playing; but there are more than enough flaws in the storyline, Plague.
I'll have to think more about my vote, sorry, but I overslept and I have a meeting in... 57 minutes.
I'll have to think more about my vote, sorry, but I overslept and I have a meeting in... 57 minutes.
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I have a bone to pick with this statement. Aren't the Lostbelts, literally, timelines that don't matter anymore? At least in the regular FGO storyline, you were fighting to stop the world from being destroyed, cliche as that is. The Lostbelts? Who cares what happens to China now that Cars has taken over? That timeline is getting erased. Who cares what happens to furry Russia? That timeline is getting erased. Who cares what happens to Greece when the gods are alien robots? That timeline is getting erased. Who cares what happens to Iceland, that timeline is getting erased whether you stop Ragnarok or not. Your actions are literally pointless because nothing you do matters at that point.
You can like them all you want, and that's fine, but don't try to pretend like fighting to save timelines that are going to be erased no matter what you do actually has any weight to it.
That's why I've gone and pruned the concept of pruning timelines from the canon. It was only introduced as a way to say "Nuh-uh, you're wrong and stupid and bad and wrong" to Amakusa to get around the fact that his plan was the objectively correct one.
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Yeah, well. I disagree. . Of course, I am playing a kinetic novel broken by gameplay elements - the story is strictly linear, so, really, what choice do I have?
But for Guda(ko)? For them, the journey is terrible, and if there is something I think that sucks, its that the lostbelts are all depicted as shitty places to live. Each fight against the tree is killing an entire world - with real humans that Gudako had met and befriended for the sake of a destroyed "real timeline". Guda is a bleeding heart idealist, whose first instinct is to help people. And they sacrifice a world each time they win a Lostbelt. They'll remember Gelda. They'll remember Paxti. And while they may hide behind the shield that they're only following orders.. they arent't, and they know it.
And really, if they win? If they go back to the normal time line? Everybody is dead, Dave. The Trees of Emptiness have killed 90% of humanity, *at least* - and that won't be undone by destroying the Trees.
We are the last warriors of a dying world. Gudako knows this. And the second we discover a "working" Lostbelt? Thats the second we become a Villain for good. Right now, we're a gun with seven bullets; an old, dying man who was here before, and seven clones, each of them trying to take their progenitor's place, and it is upon Gudako to decide which future will live. I don't know about you, man, but I consider that an interesting tale, though I'd like it better if this was a visual novel with multiple endings, certainly.
But for Guda(ko)? For them, the journey is terrible, and if there is something I think that sucks, its that the lostbelts are all depicted as shitty places to live. Each fight against the tree is killing an entire world - with real humans that Gudako had met and befriended for the sake of a destroyed "real timeline". Guda is a bleeding heart idealist, whose first instinct is to help people. And they sacrifice a world each time they win a Lostbelt. They'll remember Gelda. They'll remember Paxti. And while they may hide behind the shield that they're only following orders.. they arent't, and they know it.
And really, if they win? If they go back to the normal time line? Everybody is dead, Dave. The Trees of Emptiness have killed 90% of humanity, *at least* - and that won't be undone by destroying the Trees.
We are the last warriors of a dying world. Gudako knows this. And the second we discover a "working" Lostbelt? Thats the second we become a Villain for good. Right now, we're a gun with seven bullets; an old, dying man who was here before, and seven clones, each of them trying to take their progenitor's place, and it is upon Gudako to decide which future will live. I don't know about you, man, but I consider that an interesting tale, though I'd like it better if this was a visual novel with multiple endings, certainly.
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Okay, that changes things entirely; but not in a good way. I was just under the assumption that China under Cars, or Furry Russia, or Alien Robot Greece didn't matter because those timelines were just going to be erased no matter what; but now you've flipped the equation around and are saying that nothing the player does matters, but to the player's timeline. That's way worse. If I were playing, it's at this point that I would have stopped, because there's nothing to be gained from winning. The narrative push to keep playing would no longer exist because victory is just a slightly bleaker shade of grey than defeat is, and you're only sticking around because you've spent real-world money on pixel art of your waifus and it's very hard to let go of those sunken costs.
With the original seven singularities, you could at least still win. You could stop Goetia from destroying the world, and you could save the world. That's a fundamentally important element in, you know, winning. But here, you're saying that even winning isn't really winning, because even if you win the damage can't be undone. There's no longer a point to your victory, and if there's no longer a point to your victory then there's no longer a point in continuing to play because your actions have no impact. Regardless of the emotional investment you as a player may have in the characters, that's fundamentally bad game design to make it so that your actions as a player have no meaning because even if you win you aren't really winning at that point.
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I mean, there is currently the theory going around that we're going to be the eigth Lostbelt master, using the Fuyuki singularity - that's really a bit strange - to nurture our own Lostbelt, but yeah. Currently, stuff's bleak. But Guda has been written as someone who is simply incapable of giving up. I'll go along for the ride. Also, I'm on NA, so maybe there's stuff in Lostbelts 4+5 that I don't know about. Maybe it is possible to reverse the destruction of mankind - heck, with the dozen or so grails in our possession, we should be able to do sick shit. But maybe it's not; we'll see. I want to see how the story goes; but then again, if I'd be been offered the choice of Rodrick in Childhood's end, I hope I would have answered the same.
UNKNOWN01
Nobody knows me... I feel lonely!
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*Sees discussion*
*Goes outside of his cave*
Well, in my opinion, I actually like the concept the Lostbelts, even if they aren't perfectly used at times, I actually like the Losbelt arc too...
(Though, I'm not sure if I should talk much, considering my lack of participation outside votes here...)
I also like FGO Sigurd (especially his 1st ascention, the third gives me a 'meh' feeling, even if I think glasses makes almost everything better/hotter), but your version is also nice.
About the winning the Holy Grail War thing, if you count 'making a wish' as the winning condition, I think that the only ones to have done that would have been Angra Mainyuu, Hakuno and maybe Sieg (I don't remember if Astolfo staying materialized is due to a wish or just Sieg providing him Mana from the reverse side).
...And (Pls don't bully, I don't have the 'Protection against Bully' Skill) I'm the only one who liked the 'Alien-Mecha-Greek Gods' thing...?
*Retreats back into his cave*
*Goes outside of his cave*
Well, in my opinion, I actually like the concept the Lostbelts, even if they aren't perfectly used at times, I actually like the Losbelt arc too...
(Though, I'm not sure if I should talk much, considering my lack of participation outside votes here...)
I also like FGO Sigurd (especially his 1st ascention, the third gives me a 'meh' feeling, even if I think glasses makes almost everything better/hotter), but your version is also nice.
About the winning the Holy Grail War thing, if you count 'making a wish' as the winning condition, I think that the only ones to have done that would have been Angra Mainyuu, Hakuno and maybe Sieg (I don't remember if Astolfo staying materialized is due to a wish or just Sieg providing him Mana from the reverse side).
...And (Pls don't bully, I don't have the 'Protection against Bully' Skill) I'm the only one who liked the 'Alien-Mecha-Greek Gods' thing...?
*Retreats back into his cave*
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PlaguePaladin
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I thought it was cool. But I also don't like how this is Type-Moon, and not only that but Fate, so I they don't at all mesh with the setting.
The lostbelts are kinda cool in a vacuum but they don't suit the rest of the setting. The only thing I really like is Odysseus's Noble Phantasm because I think it's funny.
UNKNOWN01
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*Notices a lack of bullying*
*Goes outside again*
I mean, it is silly, don't get me wrong on that, I was also kinda unsure about it, but after I lurked into the Beast's Lair (A place of 50% good things, 50% bad things and 100% salt and Sakura bashing), and saw that some people made cool things with that, I kinda warmed a liitle to it.
...I still have mixed feelings about FGO in general, though.
*Goes back into his cave again*
*Goes outside again*
I mean, it is silly, don't get me wrong on that, I was also kinda unsure about it, but after I lurked into the Beast's Lair (A place of 50% good things, 50% bad things and 100% salt and Sakura bashing), and saw that some people made cool things with that, I kinda warmed a liitle to it.
...I still have mixed feelings about FGO in general, though.
*Goes back into his cave again*
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Well, now that we've all aired our thought on FGO's Lostbelts, I must regretfully beg for votes. Two votes, as a matter of fact. We have the regular vote, but one more.
See, Christmas is coming up, but I've got no ideas for a Christmas omake. So I'm putting it to a vote and letting you guys decide what I gift to you. The rules are simple- You get to pick one character to be the focal character, up to three additional characters whose interactions with the chosen character would make sense, and the general situation in which they're interacting. You can ask for a canon omake or a non-canon one, I don't really care. I just ask that you not make me juggle more than four characters, and that their interactions not be out of the realm of believability.
So, regular vote, and preemptive Christmas omake vote. What do you got?
See, Christmas is coming up, but I've got no ideas for a Christmas omake. So I'm putting it to a vote and letting you guys decide what I gift to you. The rules are simple- You get to pick one character to be the focal character, up to three additional characters whose interactions with the chosen character would make sense, and the general situation in which they're interacting. You can ask for a canon omake or a non-canon one, I don't really care. I just ask that you not make me juggle more than four characters, and that their interactions not be out of the realm of believability.
So, regular vote, and preemptive Christmas omake vote. What do you got?
UNKNOWN01
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[X] PlaguePaladin
About the omakes, what abbout one with Oriko and Kirika? or one about Archer and Minako? I would like to see more of those two pairings!
And now because I'm on a NTR mood for some reason (Don't ask why, I don't know), what about one with Berserker and Lancer?... this one is just mostly because of 'why not?', ok!?
About the omakes, what abbout one with Oriko and Kirika? or one about Archer and Minako? I would like to see more of those two pairings!
And now because I'm on a NTR mood for some reason (Don't ask why, I don't know), what about one with Berserker and Lancer?... this one is just mostly because of 'why not?', ok!?
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PlaguePaladin
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Archer and Minako meet Shirou and... whoever Shirou ended up with again in HA? I'm not sure how funny or how viable that would be but my brain seems to enjoy it.
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I'm not really sure how much more of Oriko and Kirika's relationship I could show without, uh, getting in trouble over the fact that they're not 18, if you know what I mean. Their relationship got plenty of focus in the last quest, and I don't know how much more of them being domestic and lovey-dovey I can show before it either gets repetitive or it gets me in trouble.
I think ShirouxRin is the canon HA couple, since there's a scene in HA where they go to a love hotel. Personally I like Sakura the most out of the three main heroines, but I've been working under the assumption that, if I ever have to make the Fuyuki crowd appear, it'll be Shirou and Rin who are together.
UNKNOWN01
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Well, HA timelines merge because Rin fucks up something with the Kaleidostick, so tecnically, every pairing is canon.
If you want SakuraxShirou to be canon, go ahead!
If you want RinxShirou to be canon, then go ahead too!
If you want SaberxShirou to be canon... well, you know the rest.
The same goes even if you want IllyaxShirou to be canon.
In general, if you want to deviate even a little from canon, use the Nasu answer to everything:
'It's just a sightly different timeline!'
...Though, this may be my Sakura fan heart speaking for himself.
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