Chimeraguard
We do deserve to exist.
Specifically, Initiative First are the guys who are led by a guy who just did a public speech that was described as "Basically Hitler, but replace Jews with Yellow Zoners."
Attempting to Fulfill the Plan: GDI Edition
- Location
- Queensland, Australia
I believe you are misunderstanding what that party is. The Hawks split into the Militarists, who support building up the military forces needed to crush Nod and hopefully repel any return from the Scrin, but also care about the fact that a Hearts and Minds campaign in the Yellow Zones actually have the possibility of living up to GDI's promises whilst reducing Nod's warfighting ability. And then there's the Initiative First party. Which are all about completely ignoring the Yellow Zones in favour of the Blue Zones and building up the military might needed to crush Nod.
It's the Initiative First party that is against Yellow Zone Arcologies, and previously were the part of the Hawks which caused them to dislike that action. The Militarists don't particularly care about at least the current stage of Yellow Zone Arcologies. Might change in future, but right now we're just securing our forward bases and cities in the Yellow Zones and ensuring we can rapidly evacuate them if Nod places them under siege.
- Location
- The Underdark
Some of the largest engines ever built by human hands, dozens of square meters of PESAs and AESAs, some of the most avanced electronic warfare systems ever constructed. I thought this was kind of obvious.
- Location
- canada
That's the xenophobe party. They're against it because it benefits the YZ, not because of anything related to military.
???
If the Initiative First party was formed from the split of the Military's Hawks party, then wouldn't that make them still part of the Military's overall opinions? or does being bigots and anti-YZ-ers somehow reduce their proportions within the Military?
After all, just because there is now a more official-sounding Militarist Party shouldn't mean that party represents the entirety of the Military's opinions, not if the Military still has the same people that are now supporting the Initiative First party.
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Little Blue Dot (Canon)
BoSPaladin
The Paladin
There are of course a variety of 'alt-history' novels and boardgames exploring the 'what-if' questions of what would the world look like if Nod won the third tiberium war instead of GDI. Mostly detailing dystopia's where rampant science experiments run loose and civilisation is collapsing, there are some scenario's which posit a world where with Nod in complete control, their most advanced technology, hoarded by the highest ranking warlords and members of Kanes inner circle is brought into wider production, and twinned with GDI's greater industrial output leading to a golden age for the world.
Most are thinly veiled fantasy's and pipedreams, revealing their author's political leanings or otherwise satire making fun of the former. However, sweeping the bookshelves and Electronic Market is "Little Blue Dot." An innocuous enough sounding name. It details a world in which, as indeed it did, GDI won the third Tiberium world. However, leaning heavily into the recent hawk split, and tensions within the free market party and individuals within the developmentalists. It diverges from our original timeline with the famed Doctor Granger not heading up the treasury. But Director Boyles replacement instead being his own handpicked protege.
Picked for reasons of nepotism and 'alleged' (alleged by the press) erotic favours between Boyle and his student. Which the novel takes great delight in describing in Lurid prose. Little Blue Dot details how an unprepared graduate chosen through corruption and blackmail almost ruins GDI in the wake of the war and botched rebuilding effort.
Said rebuilding effort is marred by further corruption, intense lobbying from corporate pressure groups, and yet more pages of filth ridden smut and exquisitely detailed crude blackmail material. The new government limps from crisis to crisis. Doubling down on xenophobic rhetoric the government sought to prop up their popularity through the complete destruction of Nod cells. This approach works for a time. With Heavily armed and armoured GDI columns rolling up Nod outposts and razing bases from orbit with the complete dominance enabled by the ion cannon network. This works, at the cost of a further Two Liquid tiberium detonations, whether deposits accidentally ignited, or the result of nod Bombs is unclear.
But the effects speak for themselves. Spreading tiberium at a vast rate, as former blue zones lie in ruins and more blue zones lie on the cusp of falling to the status of Yellow, this provokes rioting and protests. leading to the government enabling the use of further emergency powers during martial law. Their slipshod attempts at governance are finally ended with the order for the military to shoot on protestors and the ranking officers refusal of such orders. Leading to first an attempted purging of GDI's officer corps, but instead has the military arrest dangerously incompetent leaders.
From there, with GDI's democracy dubbed a 'failed experiment' military officials cement control over GDI. Returning it to something resembling it's original structure. Almost purely a military, varying generals and admirals have wide ranging authority, running the remaining blue zones akin to a collection of police states at best, and more closely resembling personal fiefdoms or dictatorships at worst.
Despite this, the Military Junta proves adepts at the challenges of leadership. And, using captured Nod combatants. Swiftly presses them into service as forced labour. Criminals soon share the same fate. And when that is insuffient. Captured Cybernetic tech is employed too.
Nonetheless, despite the harsh measures used. It is, eventually successful, in revamping GDI's industry and abatement efforts. Protecting the Blue zone populace, at the expense of much of the rest of the world.
The book has inspired much discussion. And a rabid following among Initiative first voters. However, it has also gained an unlikely fan following among many yellowzoners who point to it as an example of GDI as it could have been, enjoying it for it's supposed 'gritty realism'.
Most are thinly veiled fantasy's and pipedreams, revealing their author's political leanings or otherwise satire making fun of the former. However, sweeping the bookshelves and Electronic Market is "Little Blue Dot." An innocuous enough sounding name. It details a world in which, as indeed it did, GDI won the third Tiberium world. However, leaning heavily into the recent hawk split, and tensions within the free market party and individuals within the developmentalists. It diverges from our original timeline with the famed Doctor Granger not heading up the treasury. But Director Boyles replacement instead being his own handpicked protege.
Picked for reasons of nepotism and 'alleged' (alleged by the press) erotic favours between Boyle and his student. Which the novel takes great delight in describing in Lurid prose. Little Blue Dot details how an unprepared graduate chosen through corruption and blackmail almost ruins GDI in the wake of the war and botched rebuilding effort.
Said rebuilding effort is marred by further corruption, intense lobbying from corporate pressure groups, and yet more pages of filth ridden smut and exquisitely detailed crude blackmail material. The new government limps from crisis to crisis. Doubling down on xenophobic rhetoric the government sought to prop up their popularity through the complete destruction of Nod cells. This approach works for a time. With Heavily armed and armoured GDI columns rolling up Nod outposts and razing bases from orbit with the complete dominance enabled by the ion cannon network. This works, at the cost of a further Two Liquid tiberium detonations, whether deposits accidentally ignited, or the result of nod Bombs is unclear.
But the effects speak for themselves. Spreading tiberium at a vast rate, as former blue zones lie in ruins and more blue zones lie on the cusp of falling to the status of Yellow, this provokes rioting and protests. leading to the government enabling the use of further emergency powers during martial law. Their slipshod attempts at governance are finally ended with the order for the military to shoot on protestors and the ranking officers refusal of such orders. Leading to first an attempted purging of GDI's officer corps, but instead has the military arrest dangerously incompetent leaders.
From there, with GDI's democracy dubbed a 'failed experiment' military officials cement control over GDI. Returning it to something resembling it's original structure. Almost purely a military, varying generals and admirals have wide ranging authority, running the remaining blue zones akin to a collection of police states at best, and more closely resembling personal fiefdoms or dictatorships at worst.
Despite this, the Military Junta proves adepts at the challenges of leadership. And, using captured Nod combatants. Swiftly presses them into service as forced labour. Criminals soon share the same fate. And when that is insuffient. Captured Cybernetic tech is employed too.
Nonetheless, despite the harsh measures used. It is, eventually successful, in revamping GDI's industry and abatement efforts. Protecting the Blue zone populace, at the expense of much of the rest of the world.
The book has inspired much discussion. And a rabid following among Initiative first voters. However, it has also gained an unlikely fan following among many yellowzoners who point to it as an example of GDI as it could have been, enjoying it for it's supposed 'gritty realism'.
- Location
- The internet
The military votes for basically every political party, according to the voter's individual preferences. The Hawks and their successors want high military spending, that doesn't mean that every military member votes for them.
- Location
- Milky Way
[X] Plan R&D is Expensive
[X] Plan Military All-In
[X] Plan Military All-In
The point is that, while the Initiative First party is opposed, the Militarists are not. Which strongly suggests that the issue is not military readiness-related. Because the party whose whole platform is military capability is fine with it, as opposed to the one which is military+xenophobia.
BoSPaladin
The Paladin
You'll note, her name is not actually used, merely a 'female protoge' of Boyle.
- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
I mean, it totally is. But your authority on the matter is still appreciated.
That's not how political parties work.
The political parties consist of civilian voters who have certain opinions about what the government should or should not do. There is no political party that consists of "the military" or "the military's opinion."
Now, it may be that a disproportionate number of GDI's soldiers are members of one political party or another. It may be that one or another party tends to listen more closely to the military than another.
But there is no one political party whose opinions we can use as a proxy for "what the military thinks."
The position of the old Hawk Party was "we should spend more on the military, and concentrate on beating Nod."
The hidden difference of opinion within the old Hawk Party was over how they felt about GDI doing positive things to ally with Yellow Zone people against Nod and protect Yellow Zone people from Nod.
The old Hawk leader, Osawa, and his faction, didn't want GDI to do that. His people have split away and become the Initiative First party. They are opposed to the current military strategy we have, and want GDI to pull its operations back into the Blue Zones and spend resources only on protecting the Blue Zones, with maybe a minimum of stuff like glacier mining done outside them.
The rest of the Hawks split off to form the "Militarist Party." This faction basically supports GDI's current overall strategy of forward-deploying in the Yellow Zones, improving living conditions there, and expanding operations in Yellow Zones.
NEITHER party is the 'official party of the military.' They both want the military to be large and well armed, but that's because a strong military is part of their overall plans for what they want GDI to do.
...
Given that your primary issue is tiberium harvesting and abatement, and you want to do as much of that as possible, you should probably sympathize with the Militarists and oppose the Initiative First Party. Because further tiberium abatement in the Yellow Zones (both to expand the Blue Zones and to contain the Red Zones) will require us to maintain a large presence in the Yellow Zones, and we can't do that without secure, comfortable bases IN the Yellow Zones.
BoSPaladin
The Paladin
I should add... There's a bunch of developmentalists who want the military to be large and well armed too. Difference being, they're fine with laying the foundation for a strong economy we can build with first.
[X] Plan Military Myomers
[X] Plan Military All-In, With Myomers
Hello folks, I arrive here after being content with most plans and spent my time popcorn reacting in the Discord. For the most part, that'd be all my contributions for the Quest except now, I found something that I want to put forth. Something that by now has gotten me somewhat frustrated.
Myomers.
Some background. Essentially, for the good part of the Discord, particularly a lot of the Plan 1 discussion revolved around what sort of military fundings should be done. Of course as seen in the chart, we barely gave the military any sort of funding but the one thing that kept popping up as far back as March is Advanced Myomers:
Does a lot of things, both in terms of economy – from advanced prosthetics to extremely-high quality production line — to military, the least of which is upgrading our Zone Armour by making them more akin to Crysis Suits, to allowing mecha shenanigans - even if some folks here are averse to that. The closest equivalent to this sort of revolutionary action in others PlanQuests would've been VSNKh/MNKh's Experimental Rubber Plants, which gave us synthetic rubber plants and ensured the supply for rubber is kept as a constant despite embargo from Japan.
And despite all that Myomers promised, it took another four IRL months and 6 in-game years for us to do and complete the action.
I do not intend to disparage the planmakers here. Again, I was fine with the priority they put forth both in the Discord and the thread and so for the most part, that was that.
But now, as it is clear that the FMP is finished and our greatest internal foes are 'just' xenophobes, I am no longer fine.
The Johannessburg Plant needs to be done, and now for the slowburn augmentation of economic and military fields, owing to what seems to be a spool time. This will also mean that once the Steel Talon finishes another round of prototyping, we can quickly deploy their chosen mechs without missing a beat.
I ask now because elsewise, there will only be more noises about doing Myomer-Spinners, putting it off for one project or another and letting what is essentially the next wonder-material go unused as Nod upgrade and upgrade. So I implore you all to vote for Myomers. Thank you.
- Location
- Place
[X] Plan Military All-In, With Myomers
- Location
- Earth
[X] Plan Cruisers, Power and Development
[X] Plan Practical Deployments
[X] Plan Military Myomers
[X] Plan Practical Deployments
[X] Plan Military Myomers
- Pronouns
- He/It/Argh!
Wasn't keen to rely on Boston for all the Capitol Goods, so I've made up a variation.
[X]Plan: Capitol Military Upgrades
Infrastructure 5/5 65R
-[X] Tidal Power Plants (Phase 2) x1 5R
-[X] Yellow Zone Arcologies (Phase 1) x1 15R
-[X] Rail Link Reconstruction (Phase 2) x3 45R 81%
Heavy Industry 5/5 60R
-[X] Heavy Rolling Stock Plants x3 30R 93%
-[X] Kure Machine Works 0/280 x2 30R
Light and Chemical Industry 4/4 55R
-[X] Chemical Precursor Plants x3 dice 45R 79%
-[X] Yellow Zone Light Industrial Sectors 327/400 x1 10R 56%
Agriculture 3/3 30R
-[X] State Operated Breweries 69/125 x1 10R 73%
-[X] Perennial Aquaponics Bays 177/350 x2 20R 24%
Tiberium 5/5 55R
-[X] Chicago Planned City (Phase 2) x2 Tib 40R
-[X] Tiberium Prospecting Expeditions (Phase 4) x3 15R
Orbital 3/3 60R
-[X] GDSS Philadelphia II (Phase 3) x3 dice 60R+ 93%
Services 4/4 55R
-[X] Ethnic Restaurant Program 97/150 x1 10R 91%
-[X] Durable Goods Libraries and Central Repositories x3 45R 98%
Military 5/5+5 Free 145R
-[X] Super MARV Reclaimator Fleet (YZ-5a) x3 60R 72%
-[X] Zone Suit Factories 0/60 x1 15R 69%
-[X] Orca Refit Package Development 0/40 x1 15R 89%
-[X] Railgun Munitions Development 0/60 x1 10R 69%
-[X] Ablat Plating Deployment (phase 1) 152/200 x1 10R 81%
-[X] Governor Class Cruiser Development 0/40 x1 15R 89%
-[X] Wolverine Mark 3 Deployment 58/150 x2 20R 88%
Bureaucrazy 3/3 0R
-[X] Interdepartmental Communication Initiative DC 90 x3 99%
Free Dice 5/5
525/530R
Heavy Rolling Stock and Chemical Precursors get our Capitol Goods above Meeting Demand. Also starts the Kure Machine Works.
Military is slightly different as I've gone for finishing the new SMARV fleet instead of starting a new Hub. Also gunning for railguns instead of lasers.
[X]Plan: Capitol Military Upgrades
Infrastructure 5/5 65R
-[X] Tidal Power Plants (Phase 2) x1 5R
-[X] Yellow Zone Arcologies (Phase 1) x1 15R
-[X] Rail Link Reconstruction (Phase 2) x3 45R 81%
Heavy Industry 5/5 60R
-[X] Heavy Rolling Stock Plants x3 30R 93%
-[X] Kure Machine Works 0/280 x2 30R
Light and Chemical Industry 4/4 55R
-[X] Chemical Precursor Plants x3 dice 45R 79%
-[X] Yellow Zone Light Industrial Sectors 327/400 x1 10R 56%
Agriculture 3/3 30R
-[X] State Operated Breweries 69/125 x1 10R 73%
-[X] Perennial Aquaponics Bays 177/350 x2 20R 24%
Tiberium 5/5 55R
-[X] Chicago Planned City (Phase 2) x2 Tib 40R
-[X] Tiberium Prospecting Expeditions (Phase 4) x3 15R
Orbital 3/3 60R
-[X] GDSS Philadelphia II (Phase 3) x3 dice 60R+ 93%
Services 4/4 55R
-[X] Ethnic Restaurant Program 97/150 x1 10R 91%
-[X] Durable Goods Libraries and Central Repositories x3 45R 98%
Military 5/5+5 Free 145R
-[X] Super MARV Reclaimator Fleet (YZ-5a) x3 60R 72%
-[X] Zone Suit Factories 0/60 x1 15R 69%
-[X] Orca Refit Package Development 0/40 x1 15R 89%
-[X] Railgun Munitions Development 0/60 x1 10R 69%
-[X] Ablat Plating Deployment (phase 1) 152/200 x1 10R 81%
-[X] Governor Class Cruiser Development 0/40 x1 15R 89%
-[X] Wolverine Mark 3 Deployment 58/150 x2 20R 88%
Bureaucrazy 3/3 0R
-[X] Interdepartmental Communication Initiative DC 90 x3 99%
Free Dice 5/5
525/530R
Heavy Rolling Stock and Chemical Precursors get our Capitol Goods above Meeting Demand. Also starts the Kure Machine Works.
Military is slightly different as I've gone for finishing the new SMARV fleet instead of starting a new Hub. Also gunning for railguns instead of lasers.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Just going to leave these here.
[X] Plan Practical Deployments
[X] Plan R&D is Expensive
[X] Plan Military All-In
The Hawks along with their successor parties are not nor have they ever been the voice of GDIs military or its high command. The high command can, has and does approach the Treasury with funding requests, security reports on harvesting/abatement operations, projected funding requirements and capability assessments that allow the Treasury to plan appropriately around their needs. The Hawks were an amalgam of civilian politicians who supported a high degree of military spending and were generally against helping the Yellow Zones until the Blue Zones had everything they needed. These were what seem to have been the leading party up to Tib War 3 and in canon basically ran GDI up until Kane left with his inner circle. I stress to you again that they were civilians, not military officers of any stripe. Sure, a lot of officers probably voted for them, but they kept their politics quiet and out of their duties as they will have inherited the western belief that the place of the military is to "Protect and defend from all enemies" not to influence politics or spread their own views.
Similarly, the Militarist and Initiative First parties are not military parties but civilian political organizations. The militarists are truer to the ideal of GDI in that it is a global entity responsible for protecting and governing everyone, regardless of what zone they live in. If anything they are more of a "big tent" party like the Developmentalists only they advocate for higher military spending while the Developmentalists likely either focus more on the economy or a more balanced spending policy that includes a little of everything while accommodating everyone. In a related vein, the Initiative First party are also not a military party, nor should their views be taken as representative of our armed forces. As has been said, they are against any spending in the Yellow Zones through distrust of the people in said zones as they have been used as recruiting grounds by Nod. Ironically, this is thanks to such sentiments guiding GDI policy between Tib War 2 and Tib War 3 and leaving the populations of the Yellow Zones desperate for any support. Their leader is also a raving fanatic who's speeches we will not see more than tiny snippets of, as in the words of the QM they would not be out of place in 1940s Nuremberg with a few words swapped out. I would very much doubt his entire party toes his line and suspect that InOps watch him very closely, along with anyone in the party close to him thanks to his beliefs. But as it stands his party are all for abandoning the Yellow Zones to Tiberium and building the military to be as strong as possible to keep Nod and any Yellow Zoners out of the Blue Zones even as they shrink smaller and smaller.
Will people in the military hold views expressed by either party? Yes. Will they admit to them? Probably not in uniform and probably not in public if they support the Initiative First party. Does that make either party a party run by the military? No, not by a longshot. I'm actually fairly certain that Director Granger (formerly a 3-star General and head of the GDI Armed Forces) is a Developmentalist at heart.
[X] Plan Practical Deployments
[X] Plan R&D is Expensive
[X] Plan Military All-In
The Hawks along with their successor parties are not nor have they ever been the voice of GDIs military or its high command. The high command can, has and does approach the Treasury with funding requests, security reports on harvesting/abatement operations, projected funding requirements and capability assessments that allow the Treasury to plan appropriately around their needs. The Hawks were an amalgam of civilian politicians who supported a high degree of military spending and were generally against helping the Yellow Zones until the Blue Zones had everything they needed. These were what seem to have been the leading party up to Tib War 3 and in canon basically ran GDI up until Kane left with his inner circle. I stress to you again that they were civilians, not military officers of any stripe. Sure, a lot of officers probably voted for them, but they kept their politics quiet and out of their duties as they will have inherited the western belief that the place of the military is to "Protect and defend from all enemies" not to influence politics or spread their own views.
Similarly, the Militarist and Initiative First parties are not military parties but civilian political organizations. The militarists are truer to the ideal of GDI in that it is a global entity responsible for protecting and governing everyone, regardless of what zone they live in. If anything they are more of a "big tent" party like the Developmentalists only they advocate for higher military spending while the Developmentalists likely either focus more on the economy or a more balanced spending policy that includes a little of everything while accommodating everyone. In a related vein, the Initiative First party are also not a military party, nor should their views be taken as representative of our armed forces. As has been said, they are against any spending in the Yellow Zones through distrust of the people in said zones as they have been used as recruiting grounds by Nod. Ironically, this is thanks to such sentiments guiding GDI policy between Tib War 2 and Tib War 3 and leaving the populations of the Yellow Zones desperate for any support. Their leader is also a raving fanatic who's speeches we will not see more than tiny snippets of, as in the words of the QM they would not be out of place in 1940s Nuremberg with a few words swapped out. I would very much doubt his entire party toes his line and suspect that InOps watch him very closely, along with anyone in the party close to him thanks to his beliefs. But as it stands his party are all for abandoning the Yellow Zones to Tiberium and building the military to be as strong as possible to keep Nod and any Yellow Zoners out of the Blue Zones even as they shrink smaller and smaller.
Will people in the military hold views expressed by either party? Yes. Will they admit to them? Probably not in uniform and probably not in public if they support the Initiative First party. Does that make either party a party run by the military? No, not by a longshot. I'm actually fairly certain that Director Granger (formerly a 3-star General and head of the GDI Armed Forces) is a Developmentalist at heart.
[X] Plan Military All-In
[X] Plan Military All-In, With Myomers
I could go for either, but I think I do prefer the myomers version over the original one. We won't be getting Boston out on the 3-turn lightning fast timeline we dreamed about but we can definitely keep it under two years and get the military factory refits in comfortably before the end of the Plan. Getting sidetracked into myomers is a pretty acceptable sidetrack, they're capital goods and energy efficiency and military upgrades all in one package.
[X] Plan Military All-In, With Myomers
I could go for either, but I think I do prefer the myomers version over the original one. We won't be getting Boston out on the 3-turn lightning fast timeline we dreamed about but we can definitely keep it under two years and get the military factory refits in comfortably before the end of the Plan. Getting sidetracked into myomers is a pretty acceptable sidetrack, they're capital goods and energy efficiency and military upgrades all in one package.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
If exposure to the Internet is making Kane a more pleasant person to be around, I'm going to be a little peeved.
I feel the same way about Superconducter Foundries, actually. It's been in the docket awhile and I can't help but hear further improvements beyond the promised fusion synergies.
- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
I didn't mean to imply that only those two parties wanted the military to be large and well armed. While we're at it, I'm sure plenty of the ex-Hawks, both the ones who went Initiative First and the ones who went Militarist, are quite approving of laying the foundation of a strong economy. The Hawks only got driven into opposition against us after we'd confirmed their initial suspicions about Dr. Granger's disinterest in the military with years of very low military funding.
Very well. Just to be clear, which of the following sacrifices do you find most palatable:
1) Dropping two dice worth of Military projects, because that's where most of our free dice are going, OR
2) Dropping the effort to complete Yellow Zone Light Industry before the election, and the concomitant +8 Consumer Goods and boost in popularity among Yellow Zone voters we were hoping for, OR
3) Dropping the Chemical Precursors project that provides the +2 Capital Goods we're seriously hoping to have next turn so we can proceed confidently to build the warship production facilities the Navy's been wanting since 2050, and which likely has synergies of its own just as Myomer Macrospinners surely does?
It's very likely to be part of the next tier of stuff we prioritize, simply because for now Yellow Zone Light Industry is a 400-point project that's been sucking a lot of the oxygen out of the room in the field of Light Industry dice.
Once we get that out of the way, and thanks to our now having four LCI dice instead of three, we're going to be in a better position to get some of the many 150-250 point projects cleared out in there. Chemical Precursors, Personal Pharmaceuticals, Personal Robotics, Chemical Fertilizers, Superconductor Foundries, and the first stage or two of Myomer Macrospinner are ALL very attractive, and they ALL need roughly 3-4 dice each to complete, so we can be cautiously optimistic about knocking off roughly one of those per turn for the rest of the Plan as long as we don't do anything unwise like leaving Light Industry dice fallow.
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