"We'll totally get their whole nuclear force in the first five minutes, right?" has been laughed out of the room by every nuclear officer since a century ago at the latest. We're not going to even be able to get the Brotherhood's old fashioned nuclear triad neutralized, much less alternative delivery methods like backpack nukes, or more exotic WMDs they have like tsunami bombs, Tiberium weapons, and biological agents. If we go strategic on the Brotherhood, they don't just nuke us back they also start chucking liquid Tiberium bombs and dispersing aerosolized hyperEbolAIDSpox in arcology HVAC systems. The reason we don't go strategic in 2060 is the same reason nobody went strategic in 1960, MAD still holds and we'll all die.
 
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Seriously whats stopping us from carpet bombing all of South america in a grid pattern with ion cannons from space. We bomb a grid, see if some invisible structure had blocked it, if yes, we keep firing until the shield s are overwhelmed or we move on to another grid.

I... Do I really need to explain why this isn't an option? Like, seriously, do you not see why that would be bad, wrong, reprehensible etc.?

In terms of practical concerns, Nod has both stealth to hide their stuff and Ion Disruptors to stop our Ion Cannons from blowing up their nukes. Also as mentined, boomers. And probably WMDs we don't even know to look for, as we don't know that they have weapons like that.

So in short, moraly repugnant and actually impossible.
 
Except we, the player base are generally aware and have started too, and is semi-commited to building ships.

And if Bintang was that unstopable we'd have heard screams from every single naval and logistical officer breaking down our doors because she's hoisted the sails and is now ruling the seas and bombarding all the costal towns, while letting no transport ship of GDI color go past.

Which hasn't happened! Because while she is strong, she is by no means going Bitang rules the sea level strong.

Furthermore, the nuclear concept applies to her too, there is a reason she isn't going around in a submarine launching random nukes at cities spread across the world with impunity.

Because she would absolutly get full attention from GDI, never mind the other warlords who might get a tad annoying at someone spreading nuclear waste and making GDI go full fury frothing mode.

Bitang is strong due to our failures at realizing how the navel situation was, but that's all. Strong, not invurable
 
So we will just let her have her free reign because she has nukes and we neither have the ships (and absolutely 0 submarines for some reason) nor the will to stop her from freely raiding us of all the materials she needs to expand and build herself into a massive threat that will actually nuke our cities once she is unstoppable?
My dude. Read the room.
If GDI had ever been inclined to commit genocide, it would have done so in the first Tiberium War. Or in the Second.

GDI is content to hold the orbitals and implement MAD.
When Boyle wanted to nuke the Scrin with liquid Tib and cause even more unnecessary Nod civilian casualties, the military had him summarily deposed, leading to his trial and execution. GDI are not saints, but some things are beyond the pale.

And frankly, we can crush Bintang just fine conventionally, just like we broke Nod China during the events of Kane's Wrath.
In 18 months we'll have enough ships to start punching out her fleet if they try to stand and fight.
She doesnt have the industry to compete.
 
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Also, the war and conflict in this quest is as much one of ideology as one of combat. GDI also has vested interest in keeping as much of humanity alive as possible.

Because frankly, we have negative population growth in terms of humanity as a whole. The only reason GDI isn't dealing with a shrinking population is because we are taking so much from Nod.
 
All sides have the resources and ability to obliterate humanity a hundred times over, and make the fall of ozymandias look like it left a wealth of archeological evidence. What is stopping them is that all sides in this war very much want to win. And here, being the last to die is not a victory condition.
 
So we will just let her have her free reign because she has nukes and we neither have the ships (and absolutely 0 submarines for some reason) nor the will to stop her from freely raiding us of all the materials she needs to expand and build herself into a massive threat that will actually nuke our cities once she is unstoppable?

That's two points on the logical fallacy bingo board for the straw man and false dichotomy. No one is arguing for doing nothing, and our choices are not just between doing nothing and going full Director Boyle on the rest of the world. We can build up our navy and airforce as well as invest in more orbital fire support to make it so every combat is far more risky for her than for us. And we have a much greater capacity to rebuild and recover from losses.
 
So we will just let her have her free reign because she has nukes and we neither have the ships (and absolutely 0 submarines for some reason) nor the will to stop her from freely raiding us of all the materials she needs to expand and build herself into a massive threat that will actually nuke our cities once she is unstoppable?
Ah yes, maybe we should invest in shipyards for a shitload of ships designed both to escort our convoys (therefore freeing up the larger, scarier ships to enable them to directly operate against bintang, etc) and hunt submarines (like the ones that fired missiles at Tokyo). Meanwhile we could start heavily improving our air force, possibly using drones to increase the number of aircraft we have, thus allowing us to maul any Nod fleet that approaches any GDI held territories.

Also, lol at Bintang becoming unstoppable. She's a regional threat. Very dangerous in the Pacific but doesn't tend to operate elsewhere. GDI's navy is bigger and more powerful than hers it's just spread across the entire world and therefore can't concentrate on her without unacceptable losses elsewhere. She starts becoming an 'unstoppable threat' and GDI starts reevaluating that.

Also, frankly I don't believe Bintang will nuke our cities without a massive GDI provocation such as (for example) GDI walking Ion cannons across an entire continent controlled by a major warlord, killing untold millions and telling every member of Nod that GDI is willing to commit genocide in order to wipe them out utterly.
 
Why are our counter insurgency forces so useless against the Shadow Warriors?
Your systematic bias in favor of only ever noticing Nod successes while ignoring Nod failures is causing you to post a lot of really bad takes. It's getting kind of dumb. You need to check your bias, get it under control, and recognize that while we often see pictures of Nod winning a battle, GDI won the war.

Notably, we often see Nod winning a battle because it's the battles Nod won that cause shit we have to sort out in the aftermath. Which means Ithillid has to alert us to the fact that those battles have taken place. If Bintang hulks out and fucks up Tokyo, we have to know, so that we are aware of why there is suddenly an "unfuck Tokyo" project on our docket. If Nod as a whole starts firing nuclear warning shots, we have to know so that we know to dial back the Yellow Zone Harvesting action before a nuclear war starts. This tends to result in Ithillid posting war posts in which some rough stuff happens to Nod.

Gideon saved himself because we cpuldnt close the lines as his subtle operators helped to neuter Indianopolis' defenses.

And is there a reason why we arent using Tiberium shard bombs ourselves on NOD bases and population centers in retaliation to Gideon's Tib fuckery?
In regards to the first, yes, Gideon was able to launch effective rear guard actions. Gideon is a very well equipped warlord. He has nukes and shit. If he gets desperate enough, he has many cans of powerful whup-ass he can unleash. His only source of restraint is the fear that we might retaliate in kind, just as we are restrained in using our greatest whup-assery for fear that Nod might retaliate in kind. Do not whine about the cosmic unfairness of Gideon being able to launch effective rear guard actions; he is perfectly capable of drawing a line in the sand with fusion bombs if pressed hard enough, because "nuclear missile silo" is canonically a weapon Nod possesses for people who've maxed out their tech tree, and Gideon's maxed out his.

In regards to the second, we aren't using tiberium shard bombs on Nod bases and population centers, or other weapons of mass destructions such as nuclear bombs and ion cannon, for several reasons, which have already been explained at some length. I won't go into more

Like do we have any stealth units or special ops at all.
Four words, buddy.

Gotta present for ya.

Like Decim said, it's mostly just a sampling bias in what makes it to our desk. But even among on-screen incidents, the Brotherhood doesn't "always win," they don't even mostly win. Just over the course of the past couple years that I can remember off the top of my head:

1) We captured a Shadow Team and shook them upside down until all their tech fell out before the war.
2) A whole string of failed assassinations before the war.
3) The intelligence coup of the century that let us flip the tables on the Brotherhood with Steel Vanguard. This is a real big one.
4) Mehretu and Reynaldo whiffing the majority of their assassination attempts during the war.
5) The Remembrancers getting detected and chased away from the Bogatyr.
6) The Remembrancers getting detected and chased away from the portal facility.
7) Failing half of their recent assassination attempts, yeah they bagged two politicians but they also missed Stavrakas and Crucible.

And that's just what I can recall offhand from recent events without going back and re-reading old updates
They also recently tried for General Jackson but only got close enough to kneecap her mech, so... B- for effort, I guess?

If we're discussing NODs ability infiltration and sabotage should we not work towards things like Advanced ECCM Development to counter jamming and Stealth Disruptor Development to impact their stealth abilities?
Yeah, we totally should.

The thing is, what we learned from the Stealth Detector or whatever it was is that technologies that materially cut into Nod's capability for deception and stealth grant a huge advantage over Nod when they are first deployed, but are expensive to deploy. That combination means that we have a strong incentive to wait until an opportune time when deploying the technology has the potential to be decisive. I, for one, am hoping to have one or both deployed shortly before Karachi.

Seriously whats stopping us from carpet bombing all of South america in a grid pattern with ion cannons from space. We bomb a grid, see if some invisible structure had blocked it, if yes, we keep firing until the shield s are overwhelmed or we move on to another grid.

1) Killing every civilian in the South American Yellow Zone, which at a casual and approximate estimate is likely to be something like 30-60 million people, the vast majority of whom are more like Nod's slaves than they are like Nod's supporters.

2) You probably don't care about all that Hitler-level mass murder, though. So care about this: High probability that Nod has some liquid tiberium kicking around somewhere in sufficient quantity that a hit from an ion cannon to trigger massive tiberium explosions of the type that created the giant-ass Red Zones now carpeting large chunks of Australia, Eastern Europe, and the Middle East. You're gambling with the continued existence of the South American Blue Zone.

3) Actually, it's not so much of a gamble as a "burn it," because Stahl has nuclear weapons. We can't carpet-bomb his territories with ion cannon and nuclear weapons fast enough to stop him from launching his own nuclear missiles, nor can we stop his missiles before they destroy every target in at least the adjacent Blue Zone in South America. He may turn out to have enough reach to also hit targets in Blue Zones in North America or Africa, too; it wouldn't be out of the question. Remember: Nod knows where our centers of population and industry are. We do NOT know where Nod's centers are. Not precisely. Likewise, we do not know where their nuclear weapons are. That is a crippling disadvantage in a war fought with weapons of mass destruction. All they have to do is see that we are starting to pulverize certain grid squares and shoot. So you're just flat-out wrong about this destroying Nod's nuclear launch capabilities in this kind of attack, unless of course Stahl is dumbass enough to park all his nukes in one place and you get lucky and hit that place first, which ahahahah, NO.

4) Nod's most important targets are protected by ion-disruptor shields anyway and cannot be ionized from space by any reasonable volume of fire. This is tech Nod has had for at least fifteen years, so it is in no way "broken" that this tech is more available now than it was then.

5) All other Nod warlords will correctly conclude that they're next, and will launch their own strikes with weapons of mass destruction against all GDI targets in reach. The ensuing apocalyptic war ends with GDI crippled and lobotomized, the vast majority of our citizens dead or dying, and the orbital ion cannons still pecking away from space to exterminate virtually all surviving human life on the surface

More like entirely confirmed. Look at what Bintang bombarded Tokyo with. Remember, she nuked your ships, and conventionally bombarded your cities. There is a reason for that. Namely because it is an open threat that she could have blown every city in the Japanese Blue Zone to cinders if you kept pushing her.
Yeah. I kinda gathered that that was Bintang's way of saying "This could have been Operation Curtis LeMay Was A Pansy and dropped a few hundred kilotons each on most of your major cities in East Asia if I were more pissed about you conquering my tributaries in East Australia."
 
Ah, there's the other shoe. Good for them honestly, less work for us, if the Brotherhood wants to call off this whole "shooting at each other" thing in favor of fighting the ACTUAL enemy I am all aboard.
 
On other news, I gotta present for yall.
[is kaboomed]

Yaaaay!

Seriously, good for them!

There's some risk that it'll make them more formidable because they can run more complex industrial processes more easily and safely, but it's also a sign that they care about something other than ignoring the impending death rock walls to kill us!

Of course, the downside is that we're planning on invading what they see as the fringes of their territory (Karachi) some time in... probably 2063-64, and that may draw a lot of their attention away from continuing to expand their... Teal Zone?
 
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On other news, I gotta present for yall.

Looks like the Cyan Zone is based around Hyderabad. Not a bad choice on their part to be honest, its central to their territory, while simultaneously being far away from the closest BZ and the coast where the GDI could raid it.

NOD is completely going to think Karachi is a result of this.
 
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On one hand, this is a very good thing for the future of the world. On the other hand, this does help NOD and may soften the propaganda blow of losing the regency war by showing the GDI is not the only one who can push back Tiberium.

Still a net positive for humanity so I feel it's overall good news.
 
New Policy for Knightdisciple
Also, new policy, every time someone advocates the anhillation of the Yellow Zones, @KnightDisciple gets a free roll for what new tech the Brotherhood gets.

Edit: I got argued down. Instead I will simply be asking for threadbans for anyone who advocates that. It is not fair to everyone else. It is more an overreaction to a kind of argument that I had hoped we had left behind months ago.
 
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On one hand, this is a very good thing for the future of the world. On the other hand, this does help NOD and may soften the propaganda blow of losing the regency war by showing the GDI is not the only one who can push back Tiberium.

Still a net positive for humanity so I feel it's overall good news.
Except Nod isn't ideologically opposed to tiberium in the same way that GDI is.
 
I assume we can't abuse this to get more Nod tech to loot even without any actual desire to annihilation the Yellow Zones (except through the measure of turning them into Blue Zones).
 
Gotta present for ya.

Notably, check the post for when we completed the plasma warhead deployment.

A commando ran off with a couple of them and somehow got them somewhere Nod found really inconvenient.

(The quartermaster they were stolen from is mostly trying to deal with the paperwork that came from said commando running off with a couple of the extremely new and restricted access plasma warheads.)

I assume we can't abuse this to get more Nod tech to loot even without any actual desire to annihilation the Yellow Zones (except through the measure of turning them into Blue Zones).

We can try.

But, ehm, I'd guess this involves 1) Nod getting to play with it first, probably by demonstrating a truly uncomfortable and unpleasant method upon GDI, and 2) it means we need to roll it on the gacha, which isn't guaranteed.

I think I'll go for 'make Nod cough up the Scrin tables when we finally take the Italian YZ in the late 2080s'.
 
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