Vox Vitae: Warhammer AI quest

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DragonParadox said:
You know the fact that we keep running out of room on the ship and we are nowhere near done on stuff we would like to have on it makes me wonder if we should do the Grand Cruiser research so we can make a battleship personal vessel when we get back to Denva.
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Nah we still got the size cramming techs to do, and they're pretty cheap for their effects. Honestly now that the repair bays can refit we should probably get them done pretty much next turn, since that'll start letting us open up a ton of space.
 
Execute/Dumbo said:
Nah we still got the size cramming techs to do, and they're pretty cheap for their effects. Honestly now that the repair bays can refit we should probably get them done pretty much next turn, since that'll start letting us open up a ton of space.
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I am definitely much more interested in those researches than I was before. Not this turn though, current stuff still has priority.

Those directly improve our packing/cramming:
Neablis said:
-[] Efficient Equipment Distribution (100 RP) Let's see if you can apply the benefits from weapon packing to equipment (Equipment costs count as 0.9x for ship capacity packing.)
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Neablis said:
-[] Extremely Efficient Weapon Distribution (200 RP) You did a good job already in packing more weapons into less space. But you think you see ways to make it even better (Weapons cost at 0.75 for ship capacity packing)
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These ones give us more access for better cramming later:
Neablis said:
-[] Machine Spirit Shipboard Manufactories (100 RP) The constraints on shipboard manufactories make them different enough that you haven't been able to apply the machine spirit technology to them. (Improves the BP produced by the shipboard manufactory equipment, likely by about 20%. May unlock tech allowing better cramming for ship manufactories).
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Neablis said:
-[] Machine Spirit Design (200 RP) The potential of industrial machine spirits to improve the design process could be incredible. It might get to a point where you can simply input a design parameter and they could spit out a new design. And you could theoretically use them to generate new research ideas too... (Discounts all designs, from ships to installations to units. Unlocks technology to further optimize ship cramming, as well as potential technology to incorporate machine spirits into your research process, improving the number of RP you get per action).
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Execute/Dumbo said:
Fair point on the whole but it is a little absurd that three chapters managed to destroy almost every noble family when Commoragh is stated to be a mazelike and sprawling megastructure of a metropolis. Did every single noble house live within one tiny territory?
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They destroyed only half of the noble families of Commorragh and yes Vect was able to do so precisely because half of the noble houses of Commorragh at the time were living in a single tiny territory in a set of spires he lured the Space Marines to. It was a Drukhari gated community for old nobility only and it went up completely in flames during the raid.
 
Dmol8 said:
They destroyed only half of the noble families of Commorragh and yes Vect was able to do so precisely because half of the noble houses of Commorragh at the time were living in a single tiny territory in a set of spires he lured the Space Marines to. It was a Drukhari gated community for old nobility only and it went up completely in flames during the raid.
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That says more about the idiocy of those nobles than the siege-ability of Comorragh.
 
Copperscale said:
That says more about the idiocy of those nobles than the siege-ability of Comorragh.
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Any one set of Drukhari including Vect's own Kabal of the Black Heart can be taken out by attacking Commorragh. The problem isn't taking out a faction even after the raid any faction can be taken out especially since the Drukhari don't use their psychic powers, the ones that do go join Corsairs, the problem is taking out the city itself because it is like an Imperial Hive scaled up to a stellar system size.

They are currently suffering a constant daemon raid because of the events that created the Ynnari and their response was to go after the blueprints for the Golden Throne while repairing it. There are Chaos Cults in M42 inside Commorragh of every Chaos God and this has them only mildly concerned.

It is the mind-boggling size of Commorragh that is its greatest defense. Not anything else.
 
Excellent plan @Prime 2.0, I really like the idea of 'trapping' the DEldar against our ship with Corsair mercenaries

[X] Plan: Hunting Glasses

LightLan said:
I am definitely much more interested in those researches than I was before. Not this turn though, current stuff still has priority.
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Right there with you Light, especially since the repair bay can work on the upgrade in the background. However, I'm not sure I want to start working on our weapons while we are out exploring. Without any construction actions the weapons refit would take just over 7 turns, which is a lot of time to have random weapons offline while we are exploring.

I think the better option for short term would be to grab Efficient Equipment Packing and Machine Spirit Design, then wait a turn to see what those unlock. Assuming we get at least an Extremely Efficient Equipment option (0.75 saving), we could go from 1 -> 0.75 in a single remodel. It would still cost us 7,200 BP, but would open up 4800 x 0.75 = 3,600 = 1,200 BP of space. It would take longer, but keeps all of our weapons online. Then when we get back to Denva we can remodel our ship and build a fleet with Denva's BP.

Edit: Fixed my math, good catch @Karnax626
 
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Aliya said:
Didn't Deathwatch stop the ritual to birth Ynnead and kill Slaanesh? Like, no, actually, Imperium helps out Chaos cults all the time. Mostly accidentally, but Eldar distrust humanity for a very good reason.
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Deathwatch stopped the ritual to birth Ynnead because it was a weird Eldar ritual that was affecting the Astronomican in a harmful way and Eldrad even skipped telling his Eldar allies what he was planning to do because he was convinced they would try to stop him and only did the ritual with people he trusted to want it done, not his usual allies.
 
Dmol8 said:
Deathwatch stopped the ritual to birth Ynnead because it was a weird Eldar ritual that was affecting the Astronomican in a harmful way and Eldrad even skipped telling his Eldar allies what he was planning to do because he was convinced they would try to stop him and only did the ritual with people he trusted to want it done, not his usual allies.
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Yeah there are a lot of reasons for the Eldar to distrust the Imperium, all of which can be summed up as 'the Imperium is fanatically dedicated to killing all Eldar, lacking only the means', but that ritual being interrupted isn't one of them. That part made sense.

On the other hand it doesn't really matter because it's not like they need more reasons beyond general xenocidal tendencies. Every action the Craftworlders ever took against imperial interests can be justified by the Imperium's own state religion and policies. The only place one can find moral fault with the Eldar is where their actions cause harm to civilians over and above a reasonable standard.

In short being at war with the Imperium is justified, war crimes are not.
 
Nightlord256 said:
I think the better option for short term would be to grab Efficient Equipment Packing and Machine Spirit Design, then wait a turn to see what those unlock. Assuming we get at least an Extremely Efficient Equipment option (0.75 saving), we could go from 1 -> 0.75 in a single remodel. It would still cost us 8,400 BP, but would open up 5600x0.75 = 4,200 = 1,400 BP of space. It would take longer, but keeps all of our weapons online. Then when we get back to Denva we can remodel our ship and build a fleet with Denva's BP.
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It's only 4,800 BP of equipment we're able to refit, Alloyed Armour is set when the ship is built and can't be changed afterwards.
 
Nightlord256 said:
Right there with you Light, especially since the repair bay can work on the upgrade in the background. However, I'm not sure I want to start working on our weapons while we are out exploring. Without any construction actions the weapons refit would take just over 7 turns, which is a lot of time to have random weapons offline while we are exploring.

I think the better option for short term would be to grab Efficient Equipment Packing and Machine Spirit Design, then wait a turn to see what those unlock. Assuming we get at least an Extremely Efficient Equipment option (0.75 saving), we could go from 1 -> 0.75 in a single remodel. It would still cost us 7,200 BP, but would open up 4800 x 0.75 = 3,600 = 1,200 BP of space. It would take longer, but keeps all of our weapons online. Then when we get back to Denva we can remodel our ship and build a fleet with Denva's BP.
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Researching (100RP) and refitting (500BP+250BP(done with repair bay)) the Advanced Technological Research Lab is now also something to think about.
If we aint got anything to repair, refits are essentially free.

And while we shouldn't refit all or even most of our weapons at once, we can't do that anyway. We only have 1000BP repair bay per turn.
So at most we can refit 666BP (due to the 50% BP cost increase applies to repair bay refitting) of weapons per turn, with refit costs being:
Neablis said:
2x Light Macrocannons 100 bp. Medium range, projectile weapons built for sustained barrage.
3x Medium Macrocannons 200 bp. Medium range, projectile weapons built for sustained barrage.

4x Light Lances 100 BP. Long range, hitscan burst weapons. Not excellent at sustained fire.
1x Heavy Lances 400 BP. Long range, hitscan burst weapons. Not excellent at sustained fire.

2x Heavy Plasma Cannon 1000 BP, Medium range, high-fire rate with incredible damage potential. Extremely effective against shields, less effective against armor.

4x Fighters 100 BP, 50 CP. Parasite craft with short-ranged guns and some missile capability. Basic stealth automatically applied.
2x Shuttles 100 BP, 50 CP. 10 Shuttlecraft, combined capacity of 500 lift to or from a planet.
2x Assault Shuttles 150 BP, 50 CP. 10 Assault shuttles, with combined capacity of 1000 troops or 10 tanks in one trip. asic stealth automatically applied.

4x Point Defense 50 BP. A series of turrets on the hull to shoot down enemy fighters, missiles and torpedoes.

1x Medium Teleportarium 200 bp. Can teleport a medium number of organics or robots onto enemy ships from medium-close. Enemy shields must be down.
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We can (and should) split that both between weapon types and our other equipment to never have too much offline.
 
LightLan said:
Researching (100RP) and refitting (500BP+250BP(done with repair bay)) the Advanced Technological Research Lab is now also something to think about.
If we aint got anything to repair, refits are essentially free.
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Warp lab too. Other such bays. Strong upgrade possibilities across many turns - but that'll take awhile.

Still - good news.
 
LightLan said:
I refuse to build the warp lab into our flag ship.

That one goes into its own installation. It has too high a risk of blowing up badly.
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Understandable - though I (partly) disagree. There are wards for that, as well as blowout panels. Annie is on the hunt for insight and having it could be very good for Cia.

Of course, building a secondary module or ship for that would work too, at the cost of not being there for our Crew when something does go wrong.
 
SightUnseen said:
Understandable - though I (partly) disagree. There are wards for that, as well as blowout panels. Annie is on the hunt for insight and having it could be very good for Cia.

Of course, building a secondary module or ship for that would work too, at the cost of not being there for our Crew when something does go wrong.
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Build it as an immobile void installation, remote controlled. Do the experiments from remote control too.
If something goes wrong, we got some distance.
 
LightLan said:
Those directly improve our packing/cramming:
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Before getting the efficiency researches I want to get streamlined ship design I think a good roll there will help with overall ship reasearch.

Streamlined ship design (150 RP) You can improve your tools for ship design to make it easier to design ships in the future. That might be nice (Halves the RP cost to design new ships, may unlock other ship design improvements)
 
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michaell8000 said:
Before getting the efficiency researches I want to get streamlined ship design I think a good roll there will help with overall ship reasearch.
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In that case, you'd also want to grab machine spirit design, which has similar benefits and similar unlocks (plus the potential for more RP).

-[] Machine Spirit Design (200 RP) The potential of industrial machine spirits to improve the design process could be incredible. It might get to a point where you can simply input a design parameter and they could spit out a new design. And you could theoretically use them to generate new research ideas too... (Discounts all designs, from ships to installations to units. Unlocks technology to further optimize ship cramming, as well as potential technology to incorporate machine spirits into your research process, improving the number of RP you get per action).
 
I'm sleeping on this. It's been a bad day, I've learned a few things about myself and the world and honestly I'm just exhausted. If the vote is still open in the morning I'll check it out again and see if I actually want to vote on this one.
 
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