Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)

So, the whole quest logic seems fairly straightforward - the Dragon wants to stay close to their family, likely to a dragonblooded clan, possibly an underwater isolated one (in before we find Atlantis, and I swear to God, if the thing is actually Luthe with a bad paint job, and/or the shard turns out to have belonged to Leviathan, I will... I don't know what, but it'll be graphic). It is using the power of Lunar exaltation (because Lunar power should actually be very good for using in breeding and mutation rituals) to strengthen heir breeding. It is, however, painful to hold the shard. So, options:
1) Boost him to D Dragon status, so it doesn't need a power boost to keep going
2) Boost the Nest to a Manse, for the same purpose

All of those require talking to the dragon, possibly also calling Ferrovax in or raiding Syriothrax's hoard. In order to talk to the dragon I want to have one of his dragonblooded with us, and friendly.
I believe a compromise should be possible.

Did i miss something?
Is this the end all and be all for odin and he wont accept a compromise?



Is there some lore about him being unreasonable?

Why cant qe talk to the guy?

Aside from him having an ability to divine information?
We probably will need to ask to him, but I'd very much prefer to have more information first
 
Aside from him having an ability to divine information?
It's not the fact that he has the ability it's that the last time we called him to help him out with one of his missions, as a member of the Grey Council, he saw that we were trying to keep our source, the Crown, hidden (something not unusual for the Dresden Files setting) and instead of respecting that used that power to grab information we very much want to keep hidden.

This is the same guy that deliberately hung himself on a tree for over a week for knowledge.

What is he going to do for us that you want to talk to him so bad? DP said that according to Molly Kingfisher won't find the dragon for days if not weeks. We can simply talk to him later after the situation is already resolved. That would make things easier and less complicated. Less likely to break out into conflict.
 
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I thought talking to the guy in charge of one side of thus potential conflict would help solve it.
And i expected talking to the dragon to be the harder part.

We can wait and gather more info, sure.
But we are trying to get people to not assume we are hostile as default, so i would like to treat odin the same way.


If thats bad strategy, my bad.
The situation is important enough to warrant some social maneuvering, i just didnt think it was required.
 
I guess we can also just call on Dibs's right. We found this thing first!/joke
 
I thought talking to the guy in charge of one side of thus potential conflict would help solve it.
I'm suggesting that we do so after it's resolved. Odin has his own motives for doing this but lacks our options for fixing it.

But we are trying to get people to not assume we are hostile as default, so i would like to treat odin the same way.
Sure but that's not what I'm saying. My judgement here is based off of something we already saw him do to us the last time we tried helping him. I wasn't saying these sort of things before Odin did that. Actions speak louder than words.
 
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I dont really remember, so i thought what happened wasnt serious.

But if its a problem, i will defer to the ones who better remember our past interactions.
 
So, the whole quest logic seems fairly straightforward - the Dragon wants to stay close to their family, likely to a dragonblooded clan, possibly an underwater isolated one (in before we find Atlantis, and I swear to God, if the thing is actually Luthe with a bad paint job, and/or the shard turns out to have belonged to Leviathan, I will... I don't know what, but it'll be graphic). It is using the power of Lunar exaltation (because Lunar power should actually be very good for using in breeding and mutation rituals) to strengthen heir breeding. It is, however, painful to hold the shard. So, options:
1) Boost him to D Dragon status, so it doesn't need a power boost to keep going
2) Boost the Nest to a Manse, for the same purpose

All of those require talking to the dragon, possibly also calling Ferrovax in or raiding Syriothrax's hoard. In order to talk to the dragon I want to have one of his dragonblooded with us, and friendly.

We probably will need to ask to him, but I'd very much prefer to have more information first
I think there's more to it than that:
Yep, that is what it is doing, though it wouldn't be all of them just some. After all this thing has only been here for fourteen hundred years or so.

The dragon is using what appears to be a mix of immense magical power taken from the leyline nexus it's sleeping in and something it's drawing from the probably!exaltation to keep the exalted lineage itself viable.

My impression is that without this life support mechanism for the bloodline it's possible one of the last surviving traces of the terrestrials could go extinct. Potentially the very last of them depending on how lucky they've been.

We should check, but I wouldn't be surprised if there's something important about the exaltation in particular as a source of power here.

I think it's worth considering this as an opportunity to recruit our own terrestrial officers* like a later day hack job exalted host instead of getting a single lunar out of it.



* A lot of our disagreements on exalted have been about the celestials, or ancient assholes who are at odds with the modern world. Modern terrestrials have the potential to be very different.
 
I dont really remember, so i thought what happened wasnt serious.
I suppose that depends on how important you think it is to keep the Crown a secret. We've been told multiple times both in story and out of story by DragonParadox that that people would not react well to the Crown getting out. Odin gave us a warning that could be perceived as a threat as well when we described it's effects, and what we did with it, even if we didn't tell him what it was.
Name someone who can ask what Big G is doing and get an answer. I'll wait.



We are, however, the only fish in the pool with nuclear codes in our pocket. Knowledge is power, and when you can get any knowledge... even what can make Angels Fall...

A LOT of people would say screw everything and devote everything to killing Molly if they realized just how powerful her Crown is. That Odin is poking around is a direct threat to Molly and everything around her, and if he actually understood what secret she was hiding he wouldn't want to know. Ironic, considering his own lust for knowledge.
 
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I thought talking to the guy in charge of one side of thus potential conflict would help solve it.
And i expected talking to the dragon to be the harder part.

We can wait and gather more info, sure.
But we are trying to get people to not assume we are hostile as default, so i would like to treat odin the same way.


If thats bad strategy, my bad.
The situation is important enough to warrant some social maneuvering, i just didnt think it was required.
He's a competitor and we're ahead of him in the race.

The complication of contacting him now is that technically we haven't really come into conflict with him yet, or taken anything from him in a way he can complain about.

Talking to him both gives up a good portion of our advantage and puts us in a position where we have to balance direct conflict against maintaining friendly relations. Winning before either of us formally acknowledges the other is involved is much cleaner politically speaking.

Especially because I and I believe a number of others in the thread do not want to share.

There's not much room for good faith negotiation around the point "screw you, I have dibs on all the precursor tech orbital death rays".
 
Usum has already felt the instinct that dragons serving us is right and proper, and that that is different from his normal feeling that we should rule over everyone and everything. Presumably, he is picking up on the echoes of the memories of solars and dragonbloods working together as generals and legions to reshape the state of Creation, and that that is a fundamental purpose buried deep in the core of us. If we ask the right question or questions as we pursue this, then we might learn of that relationship.

Pledging to reform that bond might go a long way in our favor with this dragon and/or the family it feels close to. With the sort of proper care and respect that should have been a part of it, and not some of the calous disregard that helped fuel the Usurpation.
 
The dragon is using what appears to be a mix of immense magical power taken from the leyline nexus it's sleeping in and something it's drawing from the probably!exaltation to keep the exalted lineage itself viable.

My impression is that without this life support mechanism for the bloodline it's possible one of the last surviving traces of the terrestrials could go extinct. Potentially the very last of them depending on how lucky they've been.

We should check, but I wouldn't be surprised if there's something important about the exaltation in particular as a source of power here.

I think it's worth considering this as an opportunity to recruit our own terrestrial officers* like a later day hack job exalted host instead of getting a single lunar out of it.
I am fairly sure it's using lunar breeding magic to artificially boost a dragonblooded tribe's breeding (i.e. the odds of the children exalting), to keep the number of exalts at least steady in the population from generation to generation. The Lunar powers align very well with that.

I will absolutely take a dragonblooded tribe as a consolation prize for a lunar circlemate. Gladly so. We'll still need to do stuff to the exaltation so it's not painful for the dragon anymore, and if we can both get the exaltation and the tribe, we should go for that, but I'll take it.

Investigating who he sends power to comes first, though. We need more information, and ideally a friendly face and a proper way to wake the dragon up to talk to him.
* A lot of our disagreements on exalted have been about the celestials, or ancient assholes who are at odds with the modern world. Modern terrestrials have the potential to be very different.
Breedable superpowers and breeding politics where eugenics are, in fact, the correct way to go introduce their own problems. I am down for that, though. Dragonblooded legions, hell yeah! We'll just need a proper warstrider and then, when an inevitable time travel episode comes, we won't be embarrassed to show our face in a First Age party.
I thought talking to the guy in charge of one side of thus potential conflict would help solve it.
And i expected talking to the dragon to be the harder part.

We can wait and gather more info, sure.
But we are trying to get people to not assume we are hostile as default, so i would like to treat odin the same way.


If thats bad strategy, my bad.
The situation is important enough to warrant some social maneuvering, i just didnt think it was required.
We should absolutely talk to Odin. When we have as many facts as possible, and there's as little as possible for him to exploit (like initiating the fight against the dragon, and calling in the favor we owe him to join combat).

When talking about Odin, one has to remember several things:
1) He is, ultimately, one of the "good guys" on the side of Creation and Humanity.
2) He is, however, not a nice guy in the modern meaning of the word at all.
3) He is not our friend, and even if he was, it wouldn't help us.

This is the person with the greatest supernatural spy agency in the world. The Father of Hosts, the chief deity of vikings, raiders of the high seas who terrified Europe for centuries. He is the Gallow's god, whose ideal of a king, and the chosen modern champion is a Chicago mobster Johnny Marcone, the person who willingly became a denarian. He is the Winter's King, Mab's counterpart and in some ways equal to all her cruelty. He is a kinslayer, who murdered his grandfather to create the world.

He is not nice, and he is a very hard man, making very hard decisions in a very hard world. Even if he's also Santa Claus.
 
When talking about Odin, one has to remember several things:
4) Odin and Molly are huge political entities with everything that implies. They don't have to present themselves in such a way but we can't control when Odin does and on some level every interaction is political.

He is not nice, and he is a very hard man, making very hard decisions in a very hard world. Even if he's also Santa Claus.
It's a bit contradictory but as we saw in his interlude juggling multiple Mantles gives him something like divine DID.
 
So, the whole quest logic seems fairly straightforward - the Dragon wants to stay close to their family, likely to a dragonblooded clan, possibly an underwater isolated one (in before we find Atlantis, and I swear to God, if the thing is actually Luthe with a bad paint job, and/or the shard turns out to have belonged to Leviathan, I will... I don't know what, but it'll be graphic). It is using the power of Lunar exaltation (because Lunar power should actually be very good for using in breeding and mutation rituals) to strengthen heir breeding. It is, however, painful to hold the shard. So, options:
1) Boost him to D Dragon status, so it doesn't need a power boost to keep going
2) Boost the Nest to a Manse, for the same purpose

All of those require talking to the dragon, possibly also calling Ferrovax in or raiding Syriothrax's hoard. In order to talk to the dragon I want to have one of his dragonblooded with us, and friendly.
That sounds accurate. It would be best to wake the sleeping dragon up to a friendly, familiar face rather than just Molly. That seems like the best way of going about it.

[X] Use the scene as the focus to find where the power is being sent to, go there

Edit: I had thought something was wrong with the leyline connection but it makes more sense that the dragon is doing this on purpose.
 
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Okay, with confirmation I'm more interested in meeting the Dragonblooded than stealing from their doting grandparent.

If they're nice I'm tempted to build the dragon an endless essence snack bar and immunity trinket so that whoever comes down here to take it gets the worst possible surprise.

There are many dragons, but very few Dragons:





Cite

I'm pretty sure there's a more specific cite out there, but I don't have time to dig too deep right now.

There is a pretty obvious inference to be made from the only named big Dragons being named for a single element that they rule over with no overlap or competition among themselves.

Fire, Earth, and Wind.
That doesn't really lend to there being 5 or that the elements strictly align to the 5 from exalted or even just 5. I mean for the purposes of this quest probably but I doubt it in dresden files.

I mean I know there are only 2 alive now in canon that doesn't really mean they started at 5.
 
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I am fairly sure it's using lunar breeding magic to artificially boost a dragonblooded tribe's breeding (i.e. the odds of the children exalting), to keep the number of exalts at least steady in the population from generation to generation. The Lunar powers align very well with that.

I will absolutely take a dragonblooded tribe as a consolation prize for a lunar circlemate. Gladly so. We'll still need to do stuff to the exaltation so it's not painful for the dragon anymore, and if we can both get the exaltation and the tribe, we should go for that, but I'll take it.

Investigating who he sends power to comes first, though. We need more information, and ideally a friendly face and a proper way to wake the dragon up to talk to him
Fair enough, but we shouldn't do something irreversible and break things so pressing for both seems like a for later project to me.

If you're right about what the dragon is doing then we have no sure way to replicate the type of juice it needs.


Even helping make the burned easier to bear is hit or miss. Best case that I see right now is that we can define some sort of Invincible Assertion that applies to whatever it's doing here, acting as a supernatural brace for the exaltation's weight.

Which is highly dependent on how precisely the dragon's mechanics work.
Breedable superpowers and breeding politics where eugenics are, in fact, the correct way to go introduce their own problems. I am down for that, though. Dragonblooded legions, hell yeah! We'll just need a proper warstrider and then, when an inevitable time travel episode comes, we won't be embarrassed to show our face in a First Age party.
I said less problems, not no problems.

Terrestrials can be very bullshit, but the worst extremes of the celestials aren't always or even commonly in play.

On a more OOC level they can contribute to the story and be powerful actors without pushing Molly or the DF setting out of the story to the same degree.
 
[x] Literally poke the sleeping dragon and try to talk to it
-[x] Maybe your apprentice in dream magic will be able to help you.
 
Adhoc vote count started by Anaja on Dec 6, 2024 at 2:11 AM, finished with 39 posts and 7 votes.

  • [X] Use the scene as the focus to find where the power is being sent to, go there
    [x] Literally poke the sleeping dragon and try to talk to it
    [x] Literally poke the sleeping dragon and try to talk to it
    -[x] Maybe your apprentice in dream magic will be able to help you.
 
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