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Mercenary Mage Quest: Asur Dogs of War in Warhammer Fantasy

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@Blackout could you tell us a bit about the Asur attitude towards Eldrazor? It seems particularly pertinent right now given how we might be entering an honour duel and how the more I think about it the more likely it seems that Aramil pays homage to the Lord of Blades. Are there any circumstances in which it is acceptable to pay homage to him the way the Asur occassionally pay homage to Khaine and Mathlann?
 
There is a part of me that worries that offering combat may essentially force the Ulrican priest to accept it, since the plan as is is to insult his dedication to his fellows without any clear way to let him save face except for escalating. On the other hand, another part of me thinks that sufficiently impressing the gathered Ulricans by her intent and will may allow him a way out in convincing them that their leader no longer has to press any concern over Fanriel's ability to lead from the front. And there's a third, gleeful part that says that this could all be seen as the Blood of Aenarion egging Fanriel on (if in an unusual way for her) and that it's an interesting character choice regardless, Diplomacy 30 or not!
 
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Nimbus said:
And there's a third, gleeful part that says that this could all be seen as the Blood of Aenarion egging Fanriel on (if in an unusual way for her) and that it's an interesting character choice regardless, Diplomacy 30 or not!
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Indeed.
Imperious said:
@Blackout could you tell us a bit about the Asur attitude towards Eldrazor? It seems particularly pertinent right now
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Hmm.
It's cute that you talk of Eldrazor.
As of one can just pick and choose which divinities will get interested, and kindly lend you a hand to rescue you from your foolishness.
I have an idea of the soundtrack for a duel. One that would resemble the word-and-drums soundtracks from Shadow of Mordor, if you ever played that game. One that would go...
"Khaela- dum-du-dum -Mensha!- dum-du-dum -KHAINE! -dum-du-dum" XD :eek2: :ninja:
 
Netos said:
Indeed.

Hmm.
It's cute that you talk of Eldrazor.
As of one can just pick and choose which divinities will get interested, and kindly lend you a hand to rescue you from your foolishness.
I have an idea of the soundtrack for a duel. One that would resemble the word-and-drums soundtracks from Shadow of Mordor, if you ever played that game. One that would go...
"Khaela- dum-du-dum -Mensha!- dum-du-dum -KHAINE! -dum-du-dum" XD :eek2: :ninja:
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Khaine is more of a war god then a duel god though, at least compared to Eldrazor.

Anyway from the sound of him Eldrazor would be more inclined to egg us on towards foolishness then save us from it.
 
Imperious said:
@Blackout could you tell us a bit about the Asur attitude towards Eldrazor? It seems particularly pertinent right now given how we might be entering an honour duel and how the more I think about it the more likely it seems that Aramil pays homage to the Lord of Blades. Are there any circumstances in which it is acceptable to pay homage to him the way the Asur occassionally pay homage to Khaine and Mathlann?
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As with the other Cytharai, it is considered acceptable to pray to Eldrazor before engaging in activity falling under his purview, in this case a duel. However, this is seen as a solemn thing, a necessarily evil tolerated only because you don't have any other choice. Calling upon the Cytharai at any other time, frivolously or gladly or enthusiastically, accepting more aid than you need, are all seen as serious breaches of Asur religious traditions, and indeed may see you prosecuted as a cultist. Every time the Asur use the power of the Cytharai, they must weigh it in their hearts whether the cause they fight for is worth the risk of empowering the Cytharai and thereby bringing about more darkness in the world, but also their own soul falling under the sway of the Cytharai, and accept that if they fall over the edge it may be better for them to perish than allow themselves to be in thrall to the Pantheon of the Underworld.

Eldrazor is in particular reviled by the Cult of Hoeth, because he teaches that you should fight for no cause save for the sake of your own honour, while Hoeth teaches that fighting without a good cause is the opposite of wisdom.
 
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Blackout said:
Eldrazor is in particular reviled by the Cult of Hoeth, because he teaches that you should fight for no cause save for the sake of your own honour, while Hoeth teaches that fighting without a good cause is the opposite of wisdom.
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Haha. Meeting with Aramil is going to be great.

Though is that because Hoeth doesn't consider your own honour to be a good cause for fighting?
 
Imperious said:
Well getting the Ulricans in line means also helping the fight against Chaos so that might calm down Hoeth, but it's a reason for dueling other then our personal honor, which might upset Eldrazor. Hmm :thonk:
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I think we'll have a difficult enough time if we feel the need to keep all Cadai happy with all our actions, don't think it's possible to also keep all the Cytherai happy.
 
torroar said:
Truly the most Promethean/Atlas-esque duty for an Asur God to take on. Consistently going against elven pride? That's some hold up the world with your liver getting pecked out every day kinda stuff.
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Well, he does get to be the "God of Being Insufferable Knowitall", so I suppose it balances out somewhat.

Imperious said:
Well getting the Ulricans in line means also helping the fight against Chaos so that might calm down Hoeth, but it's a reason for dueling other then our personal honor, which might upset Eldrazor. Hmm :thonk:
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It's almost like its physically impossible to follow the teachings of all of the gods all of the time.

Mystic Pentagram said:
I just noticed this typo, Blackout, if you wanted to fix it.
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Thank you, will fix. Google docs does that sometimes where it merges two different versions.
 
Blackout said:
It's almost like its physically impossible to follow the teachings of all of the gods all of the time.
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Sure. I imagine that's especially true when the Cadai/Cytharai divide is in play as well. I was just musing if the leading write in would end up displeasing Hoeth or pleasing Eldrazor, since on its face we're proposing a classic honor duel, but we also have an ulterior motive of keeping the forest expedition together.
 
We really shouldn't expect divine intervention, nor make living piously contingent on continued divine intervention. The former broadly seems to cheapen Fanriel's own honest achievements, while the latter should be its own reward, nor a mercenary transaction.
 
Blackout said:
I would disagree, considering one of Ulric's strictures is outright "Obey your betters". I'd say Ulric's is among the most hierarchical of the cults.
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Blackout said:
Not just any two parties, Tome of Salvation says that a fistfight is how disagreements between two Ulricans of equal rank are resolved. You can't just challenge your boss into a fistfight if you disagree with him, in fact Ulric specifically says that you're supposed to shut up and do what your superior tells you to do.
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Hmm. Probably a bit late to make a change now given how close we are to the vote being closed, but perhaps this warrants a small modification:

[X] Be clear with the priest that you will not stand for his slander against yourself. Urskoy volunteered himself and his men to the most dangerous role in the initial assault and he and his men proved their valor once again when the knights charged with you to stop the sacrifices being made by his shamans while the men at arms stayed to protect your rear alongside your swordmasters. The mission was a success with the Grim Eyes shamans dead, their Jarl dead and their tribe wiped out and you personally acted to save the life of the surviving knight you could. If the priest is going to refuse the call to arms or call for your dismissal over the blood price paid by the people who valiantly volunteered for all of the most dangerous roles, many of whom you and the Lightfangs took part in as well, in a victorious battle against Chaos, doing so in violation of the decree of his secular liege, who deemed you competent for the role, then he should at least not shame the memory of the courage displayed by Urskoy and his men with his insubordination, but face you in a duel for it or otherwise get in line.

Just added a few lines rubbing it in that the the priest is essentially saying that he either intends to act as a deserter or go against the commands of his superior with his behavior.
 
Imperious said:
Hmm. Probably a bit late to make a change now given how close we are to the vote being closed, but perhaps this warrants a small modification:

[X] Be clear with the priest that you will not stand for his slander against yourself. Urskoy volunteered himself and his men to the most dangerous role in the initial assault and he and his men proved their valor once again when the knights charged with you to stop the sacrifices being made by his shamans while the men at arms stayed to protect your rear alongside your swordmasters. The mission was a success with the Grim Eyes shamans dead, their Jarl dead and their tribe wiped out and you personally acted to save the life of the surviving knight you could. If the priest is going to refuse the call to arms or call for your dismissal over the blood price paid by the people who valiantly volunteered for all of the most dangerous roles, many of whom you and the Lightfangs took part in as well, in a victorious battle against Chaos, doing so in violation of the decree of his secular liege, who deemed you competent for the role, then he should at least not shame the memory of the courage displayed by Urskoy and his men with his insubordination, but face you in a duel for it or otherwise get in line.

Just added a few lines rubbing it in that the the priest is essentially saying that he either intends to act as a deserter or go against the commands of his superior with his behavior.
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The man is the High Priest of Ulric in Ostland the only man he answers to in the hierarchy is the Ar-Ulric and the Elector Count considering how important the Cults support is to the Authority of Elector Counts in this time of The Three Emperors I doubt the Count treats the High Priest as a subordinate instead of as a Ally.

I don't get why you want to get into a fight with the man when we are perfectly capable of proving the the Casualties sustained by our forces against the Grim-Eyes were not because Fanriel is a bad General which is what the High Priest thinks we are because of the limited information he has.
 
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Stewart9 said:
The man is the High Priest of Ulric in Ostland the only man he answers to in the hierarchy is the At-Ulric and the Elector Count considering how important the Cults support is the Authority of Elector Counts in this time of The Three Emperors I doubt the Count treats the High Priest as a subordinate instead of a Ally.
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I mean it was even noted during the update itself that referring to the count's authority over the priest is one way to respond to his accusations. The guy is priest of a city in Ostland, so that seemingly means he also answers to the count to some extent.
Blackout said:
-You don't need to write it out word for word, you just need to give Fanriel's Diplomacy score directions to work with, such as "Appeal to the authority of the Elector-Count and point out that he put you in charge, is he questioning his temporal liege?".
-Six hours Moratorium.

[] Write-in.
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Stewart9 said:
I don't get why you want to get into a fight with the man when we are perfectly capable of proving the the Casualties sustained by our forces against the Grim-Eyes were not because Fanriel is a bad General which is what the High Priest thinks we are because of the limited information he has.
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I don't think we have to fight him? A duel is admittedly a pretty reckless thing to resort to right now. I wrote multiple, more peaceable, options of how to respond to the priest as well. Challenging him just proved overwhelmingly popular, becoming the leading vote in less then half an hour after I wrote it.

Though he doesn't necessarily have to think we're a bad general to be upset with us. It's possible he thinks we just used the White Wolves as cannon fodder.

Also to be fair while a duel could blow up in our face, a forceful, violent, approach like that might actually leave a positive impression when dealing with Ulricans.
 
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TBF, it is not a perfect vote and there are obvious issues - and some issues that might be under-discussed.

I like it, tho, in spite of possibly not being uber optimized social puzzle solution, tho. Sometimes, you just want to share a piece of your mind with people, even if those people are big shot local leaders who can create 1000 and 1 problems for us later on. :V
 
[X] Write In: Domesticating the wolf
-[X] Affirm that he's right to be angry and apologize profusely... for being too busy to pay proper respect to the sacrifice/power/righteousness of the Knights of the White Wolf.
-[X] Give a rundown on Jaarpen. Focus on the following facts:
-[X] Swear on the gods (maybe even Ulric?) that this is all true.
-[X] Beat your breast and swear on the gods that you would've gladly sacrificed your own life for the cause that Urskoy died for (if true, o.w. say something true that's suitably momentous regarding sacrifice).
-[X] Tell him you understand his concerns and will give full information on the plans for the assault. You will give any questions/concerns/input he has the utmost attention and consideration. You will offer to let him be your second in this assault.
-[X] Tell him again you understand his concerns on the safety of the Ulricans. You had wanted to rely on the proven qualities of the Ulricans again, but their safety came first. The Knights of White Wolf have taken grievous losses and even the followers of Ulric must take into account self preservation.
-[X] Say something on the lines of: You do whatever it is you and Ulric will, but my gods demand that I act. I will muster the elven troops and any other available troops (can we also claim to be able to mobilize the butchers or other ogres?) and lead their march on this atrocity. Say something like unless there's more to discuss, I need to rest/plan/make peace with my gods/pray then turn and walk away/duck back into your tent.
 
[X] Write In: The Whole Deal
[X] Write In: Domesticating the wolf
[X] Give a tactical assessment of the difficulties involved in mounting an assault on Jaarpen. The defenses, the terrain, the dangers faced by the first wave, demonstrating your Martial accumen in the process. Point out then that even with those dangers, and that despite that as volunters the White Wolves didn't have to even be on this mission at all, Urskoy insisted that he and his men act as the vanguard, despite the extremely dangerous nature of the role, speaking well of their bravery both during the initial assault and during the entire mission. Point out to the dangers the Lightfangs and Fanriel themselves faced during the battle. Many of the Lightfangs fought back to back with the Ulrican men at arms, while your own second killed the leader of the Grim Eyes in single combat. Note that you yourself went deep into the enemy lines in order to rescue the captives and provided healing to the surviving knight when you saw him. Be clear that the White Wolves' casualties were by no means caused by you thinking lightly of their lives, but out of them bravely taking the most dangerous role in an already dangerous mission, in the process enabling the rescue of captives and the breaking of the Grim Eyes as a power for ages to come, ensuring that the White Wolves' lives were not lost in vain.

I must vote for all the plans that are not the leading one. We are making Fanriel into a Werewolf Weredeer!
Battle form that is a massive fighter, scares people and would be seen as a monster? Check. Talking with spirits and fighting to save them? Check. Being outraged at offenses made to nature? Check.
Withholding information and solving leadership challenges by going into a RAGE? Also check.
 
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