Sterbelicht - One Sacrifice At A Time Against The Galaxy (40K)

What should your focus for the rest of the Quest be?

  • Mercy (Diplomacy and Expansion)

    Votes: 201 74.7%

  • Ruthlessness (Kick the Duchy in the Balls)

    Votes: 65 24.2%

  • Thule (Yeeni Handholding and Piscarian Cuddling)

    Votes: 102 37.9%
  • Total voters
    269
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The big problem, the big question, remains, that if they can do this kind of fuckery, then why aren't they doing more? Why did they not discover us, go after the Chamleon's.

I think we should consider the possibility that we're not looking at a single actor, but multiple.
Someone wants to sabotage the infiltration of the underhive, weaken it, but crucially, not defeat it.
 
10ebbor10 said:
The big problem, the big question, remains, that if they can do this kind of fuckery, then why aren't they doing more? Why did they not discover us, go after the Chamleon's.

I think we should consider the possibility that we're not looking at a single actor, but multiple.
Someone wants to sabotage the infiltration of the underhive, weaken it, but crucially, not defeat it.
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Alpha Legion being Alpha Legion?

Throwing a wrench into our plans to delay us to fit into their plan?
 
Weaving_Dreamer said:
I'm guessing that's not a mistake and will assume we have around 3-5 turns before its time. Lets... lets just focus on the fleet and preparptions now. Another taskforce of the Artillery ships so we can destroy the orbitals from a safe distance, start building up more stations and evac fleet and the like.
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3-5 turns is a very aggressive assumption. If it's one letter a turn we have 23 turns.

The Laurent said:
[] Plan Vox Damage Control and Restructuring, The Laurent Alternative Version v2
-[] [Military] Militarize The Schools Of Paladins
-[] [Psykana] Sing a Song
--[] Silence, Protection, Grounding, Perception
-[] [Other] Vox Primus Infiltration: Events on Vox Prime have shifted the dynamic rapidly, and as such the servants of the Star Child mush shift in response. Alongside this newest batch of supplies, as well as the Templars coming online, new orders will be relayed: now is a time for retrenchment and scaling back operations. Expansion is to cease, and if done carefully, retraction of territory or even factories is to be done, with any decrease in factory land or agriculture to be matched so as to not lead to shortages and etc. Discretion and the new Song is to be used, and a focus is to be shifted for the moment towards sending personnel and material to begin to infiltrate other levels of the Hive-Cities to establish a functional intelligence network to learn more about both how everything on Vox Primus functions and hopefully more about the history and current state of the Van Zandt Duchy as a civilization. These Intelligence Networks are to take all efforts to avoid exposing themselves-converting others to the Star Child's Light should only be undertaken if operatives are 100% certain that doing so will not jeopardize the network.
--[] A list of questions we expect answers to, given a decade to ask, are to at the VERY least, the following points as seen here.
--[] Furthermore, greater caution and internal security and defensiveness is to be exercised in order to prevent sabotage in the future. All security systems are to be updated, tests are to be utilized for moles, watches or so on to be put in place, etc, etc. Literally everything any spy has ever done to prevent infiltration and subversion.
--[] Before and during enacting it ask for both local (Voxx Primus) advice, advice from the other side from Cerberus, and School of Paladins advice among other things, changing ANY of the previous sections and adding anything that a general consensus of relevant experts would argue would be helpful for achieving the basic and fundamental goals outlined here.
-[] [Free] Audit the School of Paladins to identify limitations of its scope or flaws in the teaching/etc.

With an added clause.
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Respectfully, I think this is getting way too far into the weeds. We are sinking *way* too much discussion, panic and actions into Voxx. I'm frankly getting tired of it.

Let's finish the subversion bureau, militarize the school of paladins, sing a song of stealth (all permanent upgrades to our infiltration that will serve us well into the future) and then let it cook. Our people can manage this conflict without us micromanaging them, and we can move on to other things. Otherwise this quest is gonna burn out on the altar of Voxx. Maybe that's just me.

Aerrow Shadow said:
[] Plan Voxx takes up to many Actions
-[] [General] Propaganda For The Foreign Masses (1/3) x2
--[] Prepare Voxx Primus for an uprising in 170 (17) Turns
-[] [General] Terraform (Maphara)
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I'm a fan. But could we include the write-in for the propaganda action? I don't know that it'll make a huge difference, but I'd like to think it will. Here:

-[] [General] Propaganda For The Foreign Masses x2
With the Glimmering Federation's lessons in subverting Voxx, some have proposed creating a dedicated office that would be responsible with to continue the mission of converting foreign peoples forever more. This Subversion Bureau would be outfitted with ships, Choirs, materials, factories, and a mandate to subvert, convert, and then integrate new systems without causing mass casualties or widespread destruction. They would incorporate the wealth of experience gained from the Voxx covert campaign thus far into their organizational structure, and their first mission would be to complete the infiltration of the Hive world and it's defensive forces, shifting the focus from mass conversion to infiltration of the Hive's policing & defense forces, as well as the nobility, all to set the stage for a revolution across all levels of society when the time is ripe. This will be a pricy Initiative, but it will set the stage for the Federation's future growth.
(Gain: Allows you to slowly convert one [1] random system at a time to the Glimmering Federation without Action cost.)
 
Neablis said:
3-5 turns is a very aggressive assumption. If it's one letter a turn we have 23 turns.



Respectfully, I think this is getting way too far into the weeds. We are sinking *way* too much discussion, panic and actions into Voxx. I'm frankly getting tired of it.

Let's finish the subversion bureau, militarize the school of paladins, sing a song of stealth (all permanent upgrades to our infiltration that will serve us well into the future) and then let it cook. Our people can manage this conflict without us micromanaging them, and we can move on to other things. Otherwise this quest is gonna burn out on the altar of Voxx. Maybe that's just me.
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I do actually plan on doing the Propaganda Bureau and going hands off/turning to focus on Ag Infiltration. However, a Stealth Song and the School of Paladins makes TWO actions, and we need to do something about Voxx right now, so 1x Propaganda would not be wise because it'd leave them to drift for another turn.
 
The Laurent said:
Actually, here's something we ABSOLUTELY would know, @HeroCooky , how's Chaos doing in the Underhives?
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Reasonably well? If "well" can be applied to Chaos. But the number of cults get lower the closer one gets to your territory.

But its not like you have a measurement for how many Chaos Cultists per cubic kilometer is too many beyond "1 is too many already."
Kufufu said:
....if we don't know what they did, how are we proofing against what they did?
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Tripwires, cameras, active surveillance, etc.
Toboe said:
State141,300 km2​
City778.2 km2​
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Huh. But yeah, city.
 
To clarify, my imagined next turn might look like:

1x Propaganda Office, 1x Civilian Fleet, 1x Something else? Maybe research? Maybe SBG stuff?

This is the last active turn where an action will need to be spent on an infiltration action for Voxx Primus.

...now, even once we automate that we still have to basically spend all of our actions on Voxx Primus in the form of Agriculture World Infiltration, building Space Stations, building the Civilian Fleets, Researching Needful Things, and Building Up Our SBGs for the War.
 
Honestly, this stinks of alpha legion, the fucking inquisition, and the eldar being fucking eldar with their brand of bullshit.

Wouldn't surprise me if all three of those attacked our people for nebulous reasonings.
 
The Laurent said:
I do actually plan on doing the Propaganda Bureau and going hands off/turning to focus on Ag Infiltration. However, a Stealth Song and the School of Paladins makes TWO actions, and we need to do something about Voxx right now, so 1x Propaganda would not be wise because it'd leave them to drift for another turn.
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But doing Propaganda Bureau would create the institution that means we don't have to spend an ap every 3 (? or was it 2?) turns to keep it going.
I.e. Create institutional backing for their actual operations.
And we can send orders like your write in as a free action if we finish the Bureau.

We'd just have to delay one of the other actions for one turn.
So we could finish the bureau, give them their orders as a free action, make the stealth song and include in the orders to expect the Schools of Paladins to be done next turns.
 
Toboe said:
But doing Propaganda Bureau would create the institution that means we don't have to spend an ap every 3 (? or was it 2?) turns to keep it going.
I.e. Create institutional backing for their actual operations.
And we can send orders like your write in as a free action if we finish the Bureau.

We'd just have to delay one of the other actions for one turn.
So we could finish the bureau, give them their orders as a free action, make the stealth song and include in the orders to expect the Schools of Paladins to be done next turns.
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I think we actually have been all but outright told that the absence of the School of Paladins or whatnot is a major weakness of our efforts. Like when the QM outright says it, I think it matters.

This is going to be the last write-in Voxx Primus action ever, then we can secure the situation well-enough and by the time the "next" action needed will come along we'll have completed the Propaganda Department/etc.

It is a response to an immediate crisis that needs to be fully addressed. No more and no less.
 
The Laurent said:
I do actually plan on doing the Propaganda Bureau and going hands off/turning to focus on Ag Infiltration. However, a Stealth Song and the School of Paladins makes TWO actions, and we need to do something about Voxx right now, so 1x Propaganda would not be wise because it'd leave them to drift for another turn.
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We have four actions left to do before we can let Voxx cook. 2x Bureau, Song, Paladins. We obviously can't do all of those this turn, but if we delay the Bureau then we need to do 5 total actions, for a write-in this turn.

So I'd much rather delay one of the Paladins and Song until next turn, and polish off the Bureau this turn. That way we have only one action committed next turn instead of two, which really fulfills the "I don't want to think about Voxx for a bit" itch. will let us focus on other things.
 
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Neablis said:
We have four actions left to do before we can let Voxx cook. 2x Bureau, Song, Paladins. We obviously can't do all of those this turn, but if we delay the Bureau then we need to do 5 total actions, for a write-in this turn.

So I'd much rather delay one of the Paladins and Song until next turn, and polish off the Bureau this turn. That way we have only one action committed next turn instead of two, which really fulfills the "I don't want to think about Voxx for a bit" itch.
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I hate to tell you, but literally every single one of our actions for the next "until the war starts" will be about Voxx Primus unless we're actively self-defeating. They won't be specifically Infiltrate Voxx Primus actions, but.
 
HeroCooky said:
[] Trigger The Voxx Revolution
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This is cool, I think this is like a game of Hang-man with things kicking off once Revolution is filled in. We will seen next turn if the next letter goes red, which would give us a 8-9 turn count down.

Neablis said:
Makes me think we 100% need to [] [Military] Militarize The Schools Of Paladins this turn. That's what we're being called out as missing.
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Agreed.

sun tzu said:
...OK, probably pie-in-the-sky here, but, what if the Lamenters showed up on Voxx, did the "we're Space Marines, let us handle this" bit, and pretended to handle it before going "yep, totally killed all the really dangerous heretics, now please focus on all the other problems you have"?
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If Choirs raised alarm bells, 8 foot tall Astartes would definitely bring a lot of attention. Astartes neophytes have served as Scout Marine forces and might be a use.

RaptorusMaximus said:
Ah, the usual Post-Something-Not-Ideal-Happening threadwide freakout.
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Yup, this is getting getting overblown. The update focused on our loses but it was a net staying still, we didn't expand or contract. We're fighting a peer, not Neon in the middle of their collpase or Chaos as its just getting going. Its also been 2 turns since our last Voxx Write In, which is when we have been told our infiltration will stagnate.

HeroCooky said:
One. Before you plopped down the revolution. "Hey, Chamleons! Get into the Duchy and record everything you can, then let our Information Specialists figure out what their deal is."
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I see where you're coming from but considering how long we have been on Voxx and how frequently our Chameleons are passing through the system it seems very counter intuitive that we wouldn't have passively picked up a lot of general information about the Duchy or stepped one foot out of the underhive. It also seems to go against the principle of Actions being general plans with stuff happening a level of abstraction below it. If write ins literally only take into account whats written and nothing else its going to lead to a lot of legal speak contingency clauses as is happening now.

HeroCooky said:
Hide And Divulge Their Sight
Hide And Divulge Their Sight From Our Home
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What does Divulge mean to you here? To me it means making something known or giving information, not something stealthy.
The Laurent said:
...this is just really, really fucking frustrating then if we spent two centuries under the impression that we took an action for a spy-revolutionary school, if it isn't actually a spy-revolutionary school.
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We have been very focused on the faith/missionary aspect of infiltration but its hard to tell what is Warhammer flavour and what is 'literally only that will happen'.

Neablis said:
We have four actions left to do before we can let Voxx cook. 2x Bureau, Song, Paladins. We obviously can't do all of those this turn, but if we delay the Bureau then we need to do 5 total actions, for a write-in this turn.
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I agree, we have been told that completing the Propaganda Office is the same as doing a Voxx write it, its another wasted action.

The Laurent said:
[] Plan Vox Damage Control and Restructuring, The Laurent Alternative Version v2
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I think it should be Militarize the Paladins with 2x Propaganda Office, with your write in attached as a free action. I like the stealth song but we also risk getting more attention if our people disappear off the map through psykery.

HeroCooky said:
Turn Their Eyes Away
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This Song seems great through.
 
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The Laurent said:
I hate to tell you, but literally every single one of our actions for the next "until the war starts" will be about Voxx Primus unless we're actively self-defeating. They won't be specifically Infiltrate Voxx Primus actions, but.
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Yeah that's fair. I more mean focusing on something other than the minutiae of infiltrating Voxx and making Herocooky write out every detail of their counterespionage system so we can tailor ours against it.

As I was informed so long ago in reference to fleet actions, we shouldn't micromanage.

I'd rather focus on setting up our society to absorb Voxx, it sounds more interesting, especially if we build up capabilities that will serve us well into the future.

Speaking of, @HeroCooky might there be some sort of write-in option in a few turns to try to attract a (large) population of Irrita to live within our borders? It feels like something our bureaucracy would be considering, given how useful they've been so far. I've been eyeing the next Omake for a bit and thinking about giving them a strain of wanderlust that would jive well with an invitation. I'm kinda hoping for an (eventual) kin bonus of auto-terraforming or something.
 
ShakeyDog said:
This is cool, I think this is like a game of Hang-man with things kicking off once Revolution is filled in. We will seen next turn if the next letter goes red, which would give us a 8-9 turn count down.



Agreed.


If Choirs raised alarm bells, 8 foot tall Astartes would definitely bring a lot of attention. Astartes neophytes have served as Scout Marine forces and might be a use.


Yup, this is getting getting overblown. The update focused on our loses but it was a net staying still, we didn't expand or contract. We're fighting a peer, not Neon in the middle of their collpase or Chaos as its just getting going. Its also been 2 turns since our last Voxx Write In, which is when we have been told our infiltration will stagnate.

I see where you're coming from but considering how long we have been on Voxx and how frequently our Chameleons are passing through the system it seems very counter intuitive that we wouldn't have passively picked up a lot of general information about the Duchy or stepped one foot out of the underhive. It also seems to go against the principle of Actions being general plans with stuff happening a level of abstraction below it. If write ins literally only take into account whats written and nothing else its going to lead to a lot of legal speak contingency clauses as is happening now.


What does Divulge mean to you here? To me it means making something known or giving information, not something stealthy.


We have been very focused on the faith/missionary aspect of infiltration but its hard to tell what is Warhammer flavour and what is 'literally only that will happen'.


I agree, we have been told that completing the Propaganda Office is the same as doing a Voxx write it, its another wasted action.


I think it should be Militarize the Paladins with 2x Propaganda Office, with your write in attached as a free action. I like the stealth song but we also risk getting more attention if our people disappear off the map through psykery.


This Song seems great through.
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The Song is great enough to be worth slight action economy inefficiency in favor of cauterizing this wound. Like it's really fucking cool and I wanna do it. It might even get us a 4th action, I can't remember if that was a one time Bonus or not...
 
[X] Stay the Course, Distract the Monster
-[X] [Military] Militarize The Schools Of Paladins
-[X] [General] Propaganda For The Foreign Masses x2
With the Glimmering Federation's lessons in subverting Voxx, some have proposed creating a dedicated office that would be responsible with to continue the mission of converting foreign peoples forever more. This Subversion Bureau would be outfitted with ships, Choirs, materials, factories, and a mandate to subvert, convert, and then integrate new systems without causing mass casualties or widespread destruction. They would incorporate the wealth of experience gained from the Voxx covert campaign thus far into their organizational structure, and their first mission would be to complete the infiltration of the Hive world and it's defensive forces, shifting the focus from mass conversion to infiltration of the Hive's policing & defense forces, as well as the nobility, all to set the stage for a revolution across all levels of society when the time is ripe. This will be a pricy Initiative, but it will set the stage for the Federation's future growth.
(Gain: Allows you to slowly convert one [1] random system at a time to the Glimmering Federation without Action cost.)
--[] Free action, tell them to do everything possible to lay low. We don't want the Van Zandt duchy to learn about the infiltration with purpose.


Then we'll do the stealth song next turn. The reasoning is that we were explicitly called out as needing the militarize action instead of the song.
 
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I like @Neablis 's plan, with slight modifications.

[X] Stay the Course, Distract the Monster

[X] Stay the Course, distract the Monster, Shakey version
-[] [Military] Militarize The Schools Of Paladins
-[] [General] Propaganda For The Foreign Masses x2
With the Glimmering Federation's lessons in subverting Voxx, some have proposed creating a dedicated office that would be responsible with to continue the mission of converting foreign peoples forever more. This Subversion Bureau would be outfitted with ships, Choirs, materials, factories, and a mandate to subvert, convert, and then integrate new systems without causing mass casualties or widespread destruction. They would incorporate the wealth of experience gained from the Voxx covert campaign thus far into their organizational structure, and their first mission would be to complete the infiltration of the Hive world and it's defensive forces, shifting the focus from mass conversion to infiltration of the Hive's policing & defense forces, as well as the nobility, all levels of the Hive and its instititutions, all to set the stage for a revolution across all levels of society when the time is ripe. This will be a pricy Initiative, but it will set the stage for the Federation's future growth.
(Gain: Allows you to slowly convert one [1] random system at a time to the Glimmering Federation without Action cost.)
--[] Assess the Missionaries and Paladins during their training in the the School of the Federations, with those who stand out as particularly cunning and collected to be given the option to join an Intelligence/Counter-Intelligence division within the Subversion Bureau.
--[] Free action, tell them to do everything possible to lay low. We don't want the Van Zandt duchy to learn about the infiltration with purpose.
-- Do this through Laurent's Write In
--[] A list of questions we expect answers to, given a decade to ask, are to at the VERY least, the following points as seen here.
--[] Furthermore, greater caution and internal security and defensiveness is to be exercised in order to prevent sabotage in the future. All security systems are to be updated, tests are to be utilized for moles, watches or so on to be put in place, etc, etc. Literally everything any spy has ever done to prevent infiltration and subversion.
--[] Before and during enacting it ask for both local (Voxx Primus) advice, advice from the other side from Cerberus, and School of Paladins advice among other things, changing ANY of the previous sections and adding anything that a general consensus of relevant experts would argue would be helpful for achieving the basic and fundamental goals outlined here.

[X] We made legitimate mistakes in going at and about the infiltration of Voxx Primus. We will live and adapt.

I'm kinda rushing out this slightly modified plan to get it out early in the vote, there might be some polishing.
 
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