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A Song Of Peace: Imperial Regent Quest [40k]

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[X] Questions for Antegymax
-[X] Is the Mechanicus truly the pinnacle of human science and development to her, even with there being alien civilizations there that have more advanced technology than even DAoT humanity had in its prime?
-[X] As she put it, we're not fond of Mechanicus as it is. Does she actually understand why?

Don't really care about the treaty vote so skipping that this time... what I'd really like to see is a discussion between Panda and admech leader about the question of "How can the admech change just a little to benefit everyone." We don't really want to abolish the admech - we just want the admech to be more progressive, more scientific and ensuring that technological progress, even if just the end product, is spread to the greater imperium. None of which threatens their monopoly, really.
 
Little more info about the gloriana from Swordo.
The strike cruiser is 3 and the battleship was 4

A gloriana is roughly twice the length and substantially bulkier than a battleship

Soooooo yeah probably 8

And maybe even like, extra guardsmen on top

Sword o' Cute Comet — Yesterday at 11:23 PM

If you give someone with the know-how a couple years - like mona or lily or lyra - they could inscribe runes onto the amphion too

And now you have a stealth gloriana

As far as daemons are concerned

Yes this is kinda bonkers
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Stealth gloriana and eight slots for honor guard
 
[X] Plan: Martian Problem Alchemy
-[X] Pandora's Eyes (+1 Favour/AP and +2x2 Favour/Divination; total of +5 Favour)
-[X] Teach Sanctic Sorcery's Wards (+3 Favour, 1 AP by Turn 6)
-[X] Acknowledgement of the Void Order (-3 Favour)
-[X] Telepathica Campus Support (-2 Favour)
-[X] The Amphion and its Escorts (-3 to not have any Tech-Priests aboard)
 
Burning Mars would be horrifically wasteful. You don't burn your own primary shipyard in the middle of a war. What Pandora actually needs is a loyal servant installed as the new Fabricator General of Mars, along with the necessary lieutenants to enforce the new regime's rules. If she's clever, she might even be able to do that with a minimum of bloodshed.

The whole co-equal empire thing with differing religions and cultural practices and everything else isn't a practical system. Centralization and reform are necessary. A coup is the cleanest way of doing that.
 
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[X]Plan choke on your own ideals and die
[x] Plan: Martian Problem Alchemy

If we can get her political support we can get a lot more stuff done to fix things, even if it is only for a few times.
 
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On deeper consideration of Lyra things, I have decided to support getting our new ship.

[X] Plan: Martian Problem Alchemy

It's been like, a whole 2 months since we got a swag ship for Lyra. We're really slacking off. :(
 
Mayto said:
Kill the Fabricator General for being utterly devoted to ensuring the Treaty of Olympus Mons is honoured and replace him with someone who goes along with that, and you'd have the mother of all uprisings in response.

Kill him and have the natural succession replace him, and you'd probably still have someone that puts mars above the Imperium
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Only if it can be proven you did so. Hypothetically we have a lot of means of ensuring that it is not. We could frame her for all manner of crimes her subordinates would find distasteful. That is how authoritarian systems like the Imperium of Man work which is another reason why it is so remarkable that is is certain the literal godlike psyker with the aid of her demigod intrigue specialist sister who just broke the back of the Inquisition cannot execute standard plot #167 against her: Undermine Reputation and Execute

And it's not like the natural successor would have to be someone this hostile, especially if it is someone we used our influence to push over the top. There is a wide field between 'putting your own faction first' and basically screaming 'I'm going to take you with me bitch, I'm going to take everyone with me!' :V
 
Ya know I will point out, we did just vassalize a fairly advanced race not too long ago. With mech suits. And railguns.

And we may or may not have picked up their auxiliaries.
 
Roaming_Guardian said:
Ya know I will point out, we did just vassalize a fairly advanced race not too long ago. With mech suits. And railguns.

And we may or may not have picked up their auxiliaries.
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It does not really matter. We can replace what is comically called the Ad Mech's 'technology base' trivially, what we cannot replace is their manufacturing base and we certainly cannot deal with all or even a significant number of them going hostile at once, they would blow up half our fleets in suicide attacks to begin with, they are the only ones who know enough about how the engine works to know that bomb is not supposed to be there.
 
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Roaming_Guardian said:
Ya know I will point out, we did just vassalize a fairly advanced race not too long ago. With mech suits. And railguns.

And we may or may not have picked up their auxiliaries.
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DragonParadox said:
It does not really matter. We can replace what is comically called the Ad Mech's 'technology base' trivially, what we cannot replace is their manufacturing base and we certainly cannot deal with all or even a significant number of them going hostile at once, they would blow up half our fleets in suicide attacks to begin with, they are the only ones who know enough about how the engine works to know that bomb is not supposed to be there.
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Also, we did not vassalize them in the first place. We claimed the Damocles Gulf as Imperial Household territory in the treaty among the other agreements, but none of this included any Tau coming under the Imperium and/or Pandora's rule.
 
It occurs to me that we should probably be thinking about other things we may want to discuss for that write-in portion about now.

Can't immediately think of anything to use it for myself since I'm dead tired, but it seems like something that's not getting much attention at the moment.
 
[X] Plan Visionary
I don't want to give the Mechanicus sorcery, and this plan has less of a chance of burying us in a deep hole.
 
meianmaru said:
Also, we did not vassalize them in the first place. We claimed the Damocles Gulf as Imperial Household territory in the treaty among the other agreements, but none of this included any Tau coming under the Imperium and/or Pandora's rule.
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There are so many things going on so I understand it not getting much attention from Swordo, but man am I curious as to how the Damocles Gulf is going now.
 
flaviusb said:
And like, to be clear, from Antegymax's point of view, Pandora is coming in to destroy her religion, her way of life, her people, and throw her to the wolves, starting a civil war within the Mechanicus, with the intent of enslaving all the Mechanicus forever and then leaving them on the ash heap once they have been worn out beyond usefulness. So like, coming in firm and making it clear that you won't go down without a fight but you are still willing to cooperate as long as it is as it was agreed long ago is actually surprisingly good natured and far sighted. So like, part of 'fixing things' would probably involve resolving the fact that Malcador designed things such that any change for the better would be a real existential threat of destruction, which would involve some kind of push to change the logic of hierarchy and domination and 'survival of the fittest / etc' and patronage that both the Mechanicus and the Imperium as a whole operates on towards one of universalism or democracy or etc, so that Antegymax does not have to fear that every other Forge World and also all of her apprentices will turn into werewolves and murder her unless she keeps doing foolish and bad shit.

So, in that vein, I suggest plan 'Reject techbase, focus on the core problem, but not in anger'
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From her point of view most of what we see as desirable, personal freedom, improvements in general quality of life, pluralism of opinion is at best a distraction from the holy mission, or it is outright evil.

Universalism and democracy are I would argue inherently against her religion, once someone actually explains those very old and very alien concepts to her. After all if 'her people', most of which are brainwashed drones living lives that make even the average hive worlder's wretched existence seem pleasant, could make decisions, they might decide to do things that are against dogma. Theocracies to not love democracy for a very good reason that is baked into them, authority flows from above, from those presumably closest to the divine.

The Ad Mech does not want domination and strict hierarchy because it is afraid of the alien and chaos from without that is why it latched onto them in the aftermath of the betrayal of what would become the Dark Mech, but it has been a long time since then. Over the past ten thousand years that has become core to its ethos. Antegymax herself is for all my jokes about her losing sleep, a victim here. She has been indoctrinated into believing this as have most tech priests, cases like Lyra and her master are rare as hell and more a function of how widespread the faith is and how idiosyncratic it can get in extremis. The Cult Mechanicum in anything like its orthodox form, like its sister the Imperial Faith makes modern theocracies for instance seem liberal and reasonable by comparison. 'More democracy' would seem like offering them a nice refreshing cup of poison.

Like the inquisition, if not quite for the same reasons, the Mechanicum must be broken, alas we do not have the mechanisms to even begin doing so at the moment.
 
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[X] Plan Visionary
[X]Plan choke on your own ideals and die

Giving our enemies more shinies does not seem a good idea. Let's hope Lucan or Mona decide to deal with the admech themselves, but I don't think we are going to be that lucky.

One way to weaken the admech would be letting the Lucan's rebellion tech up and consolidate, than let admech go after them. I suppose admech may potentially come up on top in that fight but we can nudge things around to change that, ensuring admech assets are exhausted and they come out of it greatly weakened while the rebellion stands victorious but also potentially willing to sue for peace. Or it may just result in deeper hatred, who knows.

Not the most bloodless idea, but it's not like the galaxy isn't being drenched in oceans of blood, including in places where Imperium's 'peace' reigns. Ofc, Pandora might not go for it.
 
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So if we can't start top-down, why not start in the middle?

There are a lot of Forgeworlds out there, a lot of Fabricators and Archmagi with influence and independant ressources and knowledge.

If Horus could draw a significant faction of them on his side as a little side-project besides his other Heresy-preps, why couldn't we?

Offer the leaders of Graia, Cypra Mundi and other important Forgeworlds knowledge and archeotech or even a bit of Mona's time in exchange for supporting our Campuses and other policies and see how many of them let their love of the good loot overwhelm their conservatism.

Of course this takes longer and is less efficient than getting the help of Mars itself, but it's still helpful in the mid-term, and in the long-term it might even get us enough AdMech backing not to be forced to negotiate with this particular FabGen anymore.
 
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