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Threads Of Destiny(Eastern Fantasy, Sequel to Forge of Destiny)

Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
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7 degrees of success, a little above average.

I'm inclined to accept Zhengui's offer. We said we'd let him participate and share in our struggles, and while obviously our instinct is to bear all the costs ourself... well, we made a commitment to him.
 
yrsillar said:
Speech Skill evolves
Sincere Negotiator- Honesty is not naivety and sincerity does not mean showing your whole hand. A skill to speak and negotiate with honest intent while maintaining your advantages.
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Oh, I'm a big fan of the skill upgrade. Love the honest diplomat type.

As for the vote, I am tentatively in favor of going through with Zhengui's proposal. Seems in line with "letting our spirits contribute". Not a fan of risking another 60+ roll, even though progress on these arts really won't hurt us.

[] Accept Zhengui's offer. [Zhengui expends B Rank qi, receives minor cultivation penalty for the next turn.]
 
yrsillar said:
Speech Skill evolves
Sincere Negotiator- Honesty is not naivety and sincerity does not mean showing your whole hand. A skill to speak and negotiate with honest intent while maintaining your advantages.
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Absolutely amazing, I love this skill.

yrsillar said:
] Accept Zhengui's offer. [Zhengui expends B Rank qi, receives minor cultivation penalty for the next turn.]
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Super leaning towards this.

Reason #1: We have Darkness turn next, where we expend a ton of resources and dive headfirst into Max training to exploit our pills. We absolutely must not hamstring that.

Reason #2: Our recent personal conflicts are because we keep taking the hits and sacrifices for others, who so desperately want to protect us from those and hate seeing us hurt. Zhengui is jumping on the chance to do this for us, denying him that would really sting.

Reason #3: Especially when it hurts him way less than it would hurt us.
 
That fucking RNG screw was very nearly real.

In the end though, it worked out.

I'm inclined to let Zhengui do his part--he's asking for it, and a purely cold-blooded assessment of our mission profile suggests that even though it's about 20% of his reserves, he won't have much to do until the final phase of our mission, while Ling Qi is going to be spending fairly freely in the infiltration phase.
 
[X] Accept Zhengui's offer. [Zhengui expends B Rank qi, receives minor cultivation penalty for the next turn.]
 
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Qi skills are excellent for the future team fights, recovery will be difficult/restricted on the Depths and in a pinch we can spirit form Zhengui and haul ass after the res of his qi is expended. Ergo,

[]Accept Zhengui's offer. [Zhengui expends B Rank qi, receives minor cultivation penalty for the next turn.]
 
[] Do it yourself and offer a Dream of songs and starless nights, [Ling Qi expends B rank qi, receives a -.2 multiplier to spiritual cultivation for the next turn.]
Tempted by this one, given that we are also trying to get G4 next turn. So it feels like a proper price.
 
[X] Accept Zhengui's offer. [Zhengui expends B Rank qi, receives minor cultivation penalty for the next turn.]

Also leaning towards this. I love Zhengui, but we are likely to need our Qi for the stealth parts of this mission in the immediate future. We NEED to be successful at this first part of the mission more than we need Zhengui at full capacity.
 
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yrsillar said:
1d100= 30

Bare success
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yrsillar said:
1d100=46

1 degree success
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Boy am I glad I campaigned for the approach with 3 rolls and a 30 threshold and not the one with 2 and 45.


yrsillar said:
"We would only…[expend/tire/wound] without [gain/sustenance]," Ling Qi almost startled as she heard her voice waver into the bizzarre not-words that sometimes punctuated a spirit's speech.
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Important first steps being taken. I like the advanced speech skill too and how it works in a sincere approach.

Overall didn't learn too much but we're getting a pretty fast route at costs that aren't prohibitive. The mission goes on. (also if this was a 6-degree negotiation success I shudder to think what a lesser pass or a fail would've been)


Now let's see, these two area no-go:
[] Do it yourself and offer a Dream of songs and starless nights, [Ling Qi expends B rank qi, receives a -.2 multiplier to spiritual cultivation for the next turn.]
[] Refuse, try to offer something lesser still [Ling Qi expends B Rank qi, and permanently loses all progress toward one of (Abyssal Exhalation, Fallen Star, Argent Storm and Argent Pulse. Requires a roll of 60+)

We need the spiritual multiplier to get to Green, and the other option needs a success on a 60+ which is not something we want to tempt.

Of these two:
[] Accept Zhengui's offer. [Zhengui expends B Rank qi, receives minor cultivation penalty for the next turn.]
[] Do it yourself and offer a dream of motion and bright days, [Ling Qi expends B rank qi, receives a -.2 multiplier to physical cultivation for the next turn.]

Doing it yourself costs us 160 phys xp which maay be fine? Currently it might hit us by delaying G4 a turn but should still be manageable by G5. Zhengui cost is fairly minor too.

Narratively I think I actually prefer letting Zhengui do it here for promise-related reasons; here is a small burden he can help with, would LQ accept that even if it means he gets hurt? Here's our chance.

EDIT: also on the matter of qi costs: we have A28 derived qi, so the B cost would be like 3% of LQ's total. Zhengui has B qi so this would be ~20% expenditure for him. Conversely, he's one of the few on the field that actually benefits from LQ's domain regen with elegy up, so it's not the end of the world for when we have to fight.
 
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Arkeus said:
[] Do it yourself and offer a Dream of songs and starless nights, [Ling Qi expends B rank qi, receives a -.2 multiplier to spiritual cultivation for the next turn.]
Tempted by this one, given that we are also trying to get G4 next turn. So it feels like a proper price.
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Even sincere and generous negotiators typically don't deliberately go for concessions that hurt them the most, even when it isn't any more desirable for the other party. If all these options are equally satisfactory for Fungus, then obviously choose the one that costs us the least, on top of the other reasons not to bar Zhengui from making this very minor sacrifice instead of Qi taking a larger one.
 
Hm. Absolutely rotted, stagnant and thinks of us as "poison" probably due to the Moon all through us. Not actually a friend to make, even if we had rolled all successes that didn't have at least 1 100.

Still. Outcome was very positive. Absolute swiftest path through, potentially through liminal slip-space means we're saving a ton of time on the back end. Qi expenditure on the tankiest, highest stamina, bestest boy. We have a Qi Regen domain which will help mitigate the strain as time passes. The B expenditure is ~20% of ZG's total Qi but after some regen, depending on how much time we end up with, it could be 15% or so lost pre-fight? Assuming our regen works on him while he's in the dantian? That's speculation though. 20% missing prefight to be assumed until confirmed.

[] Accept Zhengui's offer. [Zhengui expends B Rank qi, receives minor cultivation penalty for the next turn.]

Next turn is Darkness Turn. The prices not involved in a roll will be *very* steep. Multipliers on top of multipliers and all that.

The cultivation penalty *could* be similar to when we got Fang from the Bloody Dream. An opportunity for growing up and diversifying/individualizing himself. A bit of the ol' LQ Dark Greedy-Self-Sacrifice would be great on a tank, if very scary for us. But we deserve that honestly haha xP He already has one "Pull Effect To Self" ability and enhancing that ability would be grand. Sometimes things are just rot though, not every sacrifice is an opportunity. Sometimes it's just what it says on the tin.

Letting ZG carry the burden is good narratively and mechanically right now. But emotionally we want to coddle-snug-pat our treasured-best-boy.

It's okay. The best case is that ZG gets a lil darkness edge in him that appeals to Cui helps him be his own individual with personal desires more.

worst case he has a tummy ache and we have to give him pats and scritches <3
 
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Zhengui's dream has always been to help. Let him. And if it helps this thing grow, all the better to confound our enemies.

"One person's desires cannot, alone make a home nor a family." Let him be our family, here, when it matters.
 
Black Noise said:
Now let's see, these two area no-go:
[] Do it yourself and offer a Dream of songs and starless nights, [Ling Qi expends B rank qi, receives a -.2 multiplier to spiritual cultivation for the next turn.]
[] Refuse, try to offer something lesser still [Ling Qi expends B Rank qi, and permanently loses all progress toward one of (Abyssal Exhalation, Fallen Star, Argent Storm and Argent Pulse. Requires a roll of 60+)

We need the spiritual multiplier to get to Green, and the other option needs a success on a 60+ which is not something we want to tempt.
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We don't need it to get to green, it just means having to buy one of the new junior spiritual pill, that's all.

I also strongly disagree this is "it lets Zhengui make something for us", considering that it actually make it harder for Zhengui to contribute in the rest of the mission, and Zhengui can contribute a lot in the mission. It also makes his progress slowler, and having him have more trouble mid term re:being strong is not how to resolve that issue.

So yeah, strongly leaning toward either Dream of songs or dreams of motion. Songs is better re: being an acceptable sacrifice, too.
 
[] Refuse, try to offer something lesser still [Ling Qi expends B Rank qi, and permanently loses all progress toward one of (Abyssal Exhalation, Fallen Star, Argent Storm and Argent Pulse. Requires a roll of 60+)


I'll be voting approval not this.

This sounds like a great way to roll a 1 and lose 5 AP.
 
ChronOblivion said:
Even sincere and generous negotiators typically don't deliberately go for concessions that hurt them the most, even when it isn't any more desirable for the other party. If all these options are equally satisfactory for Fungus, then obviously choose the one that costs us the least, on top of the other reasons not to bar Zhengui from making this very minor sacrifice instead of Qi taking a larger one.
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It doesn't "hurt us the most", it's a sincere sacrifice, that's all.

It also screws over Zhengui helping us for this mission as it's like 20% of his Qi while 5% of Ling Qi's, and Zhengui's qi is much more important than Ling qi for being successful.

EDIT: though going the other way and trying to feed him FSA would be awesome (but also means we are getting a 60DC when we just refused one that didn't cost us anything).
 
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Arkeus said:
It doesn't "hurt us the most", it's a sincere sacrifice, that's all.

It also screws over Zhengui helping us for this mission as it's like 20% of his Qi while 5% of Ling Qi's, and Zhengui's qi is much more important than Ling qi for being successful.

EDIT: though going the other way and trying to feed him FSA would be awesome (but also means we are getting a 60DC when we just refused one that didn't cost us anything).
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It's the cultivation penalty that makes those options hurt the most, especially because next turn is Darkness Turn.
 
Arkeus said:
It doesn't "hurt us the most", it's a sincere sacrifice, that's all.

It also screws over Zhengui helping us for this mission as it's like 20% of his Qi while 5% of Ling Qi's, and Zhengui's qi is much more important than Ling qi for being successful.

EDIT: though going the other way and trying to feed him FSA would be awesome (but also means we are getting a 60DC when we just refused one that didn't cost us anything).
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Zhengui isn't needed until the endgame though. Letting him contribute to the approach phase when he otherwise would be irrelevant doesn't seem like a bad choice?

It's harder for him but in no way unbearable, while Ling Qi herself is going to be spending a fair amount more during the infiltration phase where he can't participate. A 3-5% hit on top of what she's already spent getting down here and what she'll be spending setting up the remotes adds up fast.
 
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Let Zhengui have his moment instead of slapping down his attempt to contribute. I'd rather not infantilize him forever.
 
Varder said:
Why?
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Briefvoice said:
I feel like this is a "money where your mouth is" situation for letting Zhengui help instead of always pushing him back to do it ourselves.
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Alectai said:
Zhengui isn't needed until the endgame though. Letting him contribute to the approach phase when he otherwise would be irrelevant doesn't seem like a bad choice?

It's harder for him but in no way unbearable, while Ling Qi herself is going to be spending a fair amount more during the infiltration phase where he can't participate. A 3-5% hit on top of what she's already spent getting down here and what she'll be spending setting up the remotes adds up fast.
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Zhengui is needed pretty constantly to rebuild passages, as we have seen previously: Ling Qi scouts, Zhengui rebuilds a passage that's broken (as the passages we go through are broken ones the underdarker don't use).

Ling Qi herself uses almost no Qi in this, and needs it less.

This isn't "letter Zhengui help", this is "enabling Zhengui sacrificing himself for us (because he sees Ling Qi doing the same for him and wants to do the same) at the price of him being unable to help when he actually would shine".

ChronOblivion said:
It's the cultivation penalty that makes those options hurt the most, especially because next turn is Darkness Turn.
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The penalty doesn't influence darkness arts, it just influence spiritual gains, and we can make do with one of the available pills. It has a AP price, while Phys has no AP price, but it also has actual weight.

I want a Ling Qi who tries to honor bargains with "more than then minimum", even when the minimum is exactly the same as not the minimum for the person asking.
 
Arkeus said:
The penalty doesn't influence darkness arts, it just influence spiritual gains, and we can make do with one of the available pills. It has a AP price, while Phys has no AP price, but it also has actual weight.

I want a Ling Qi who tries to honor bargains with "more than then minimum", even when the minimum is exactly the same as not the minimum for the person asking.
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So why should we do more damage to ourselves to fulfil a deal in a way that makes absolutely no difference to the one we're dealing with (a neutral at best predator)? The characterisation that establishes isn't someone who puts in extra effort to complete their tasks/deals. That's a dangerously self sacrificing idiot.

Which to be fair is not completely out of keeping with Ling Qi's characterisation :sad: but not something I want to encourage.
 
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