Meguca Micro Empire Quest (PMMM)
- Thread starter inverted_helix
- Start date
I'd just like to point out, for the record, that this method can describe all rational numbers, but in fact cannot describe all numbers. I know that has nothing to do with the point being discussed, but given what thread we're on I think it's far more important to toss aside all this silly philosophy junk and concentrate on the far more important topic of numbers geekery.
- Location
- Montana
Alright, I just finished reading the thread. I think that we should take Sachiko's deal as it is because this is the best deal we can get without damaging our reputation more.
As far what Tokyo's meguca politics will look like, does anyone have a list of the organizations that have confirmed intentions to control part of the city? I only recall Nagoya and ourselves as wanting to get involved, with Heaven's Chosen and Magick Company benefiting by making our success and expansion possible. Has any other group expressed an interest in taking Tokyo or recruiting the Elites that are staying in Tokyo?
My apologies of this is something that has already been discussed and I missed it.
As far what Tokyo's meguca politics will look like, does anyone have a list of the organizations that have confirmed intentions to control part of the city? I only recall Nagoya and ourselves as wanting to get involved, with Heaven's Chosen and Magick Company benefiting by making our success and expansion possible. Has any other group expressed an interest in taking Tokyo or recruiting the Elites that are staying in Tokyo?
My apologies of this is something that has already been discussed and I missed it.
Just wanted to point out our Tokyo expansion is actually fairly continuous with our current territory. As seen here our current territory is separated from the Kanagawa Prefecture by a mere 20km of, as far as we know, unclaimed territory. Of course that is over Mount Fuji so it's not very travel friendly territory, we'd have to go through either Numazu or Kofu for road/train trips. Still it's not at all like Iwata which is trapped between other faction territories and at least 40km through claimed (Coalition) territory.
From what I can tell:
- Nagoya is likely to set up a affiliate/vassal system in Tokyo, as seems to be their MO for regions far enough away from their "core" area of control. They have 200 girls on ice, likely with more on the way given their
- Heaven's Chosen wants a piece of the territory, as unoccupied as possible, as a relief valve from their current Troubles over in the Osaka/Kyoto region.
- The Magick Company seems more interested in making money than grabbing territory, and would probably stand to make quite a bit of money guaranteeing micro-loans and providing startup capital for meguca businesses in the greater Tokyo area and beyond. If this is their idea of a good deal, though, they really have to work on their sales pitch.
- Thus far we haven't been able to tell what Sendai and the Magic Republic's stances on Tokyo are. The later seems to be preoccupied by local matters; we don't know what Sendai's up to at all.
- We at SIMP were planning on an affiliate program for anyone who wanted to join our semi-religious cause after we cleared Tokyo; that has morphed into a rather larger commitment to take a vast swatch of territory for ourselves when it was revealed that:
- The Osaka Junta has been aggressively poaching Elites from the Tokyo area, ending up with some of the more violent, anti-social and dangerous ones whom Nagoya specifically excluded. This has vastly increased the likelihood that, should Tokyo be left to its own devices, we will soon be seeing either a reversion to the exact situation that spawned the youma apocalypse or, worse, a takeover of Tokyo by a group that has self-identified as a Junta.
While true, it's still a logistical split in our territory, and I'd rather not have to deal with it if we didn't have to. I'd much, much rather be taking our time
Powerofmind
In Madness Fallen
- Location
- United States
How can the Junta take over Tokyo without infuriating every other group in Japan? They know that nobody likes them, and they definitely won't be able to integrate their claims inside the two months it takes for the NM, HC, and Republic to come down on their heads for it. The only reason we can get away with claiming huge swathes of Tokyo is because we're doing the vast majority of clearing it.
Like you said, they poached the unstable, dangerous elites from the crumbling organizations, people that literally no one will want. If they either claimed the land and tried to kick a thousand girls to the curb, or claimed the girls with it, they would piss so many people off, including the girls they claimed or evicted, that they wouldn't be able to hold Tokyo for a single month, let alone be allowed to sit pretty in Osaka without retribution. You can only German Reich so many things before you piss off France and Great Britain into kicking off WWII.
Nolrai
weak to fangs
- Location
- Porltand
Because of these little concepts called "Hell" and "Heaven".
I mean there are /far/ better examples of what you are trying to say.
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How the fuck is this even relevant to anything?
Heaven's Chosen and the Magical Republic have had their territory regularly invaded for several months now and amazingly have not only allowed it to happen but somehow have avoided any sort of conflicts between rival meguca despite the two sides' joint occupation of vast swaths of territory. The politics of appeasement are ridiculously strong there. That basically leaves Nagoya as the only group willing to actually defend itself; the problem there is that they seem rather war-weary, and don't have real territorial ambitions in Tokyo, so they may not even notice the Junta taking over until it's too late to do anything about it. I suppose that's an option, though: do you think we should abdicate any responsibility for Tokyo to Hino, and go back to playing a local game once Tokyo has been cleansed of youma?
Oh... my bad, sorry for trying to SAVE TOKYO!
Saving Tokyo requires killing youma. Killing youma results in refugees. Refugees creates problems for other magical girl organizations. Helping refugees so as to lessen the burden on other magical girls requires lots of money...
Yeah, the chain is strong. The loan from Sachiko is indeed entirely wrapped up in the whole saving Tokyo business, and is not primarily driven by selfish demands.
Now don't get me wrong. It's entirely reasonable for all these complications to exist, and it's entirely reasonable for Sachiko and others to perceive this as self serving, that happens all the time. However, you as GM are aware of all the context and discussion, and yet you seem to be presenting it as fact rather than Sachiko's opinion.
Because you've driven it home to us, repeatedly, that altruistic goals without the power to back them up are doomed to failure. As we have come to understand the situation better it becomes more and more clear that stabilizing the region without growing to become a significant power is virtually impossible.
Additionally, the massive number of refugees that want to join up with us is demonstrating that expansion is not going to require us imposing dominion over Tokyo, but rather just accepting all those that want to join up with us, and then organizing those that don't want to join up with us into some kind of associate groups that have oversight.
You seem to be oblivious that the new circumstances you are revealing to us are forcing us to reconsider the best pragmatic means to achieve our altruistic goals. Both as to what is required to stabilize Tokyo, and as to what the girls of Tokyo are going to be happiest with. That's what has changed. Not us suddenly becoming more self-serving.
Mami is the pragmatic altruist. This has always created a lot of tension between Mami's goals, her means, and the limits of her power. Mami (unlike Sayaka) has always approached this by balancing the pragmatic with the altruism. The players all have very different ideas on how to best balance these competing aspects, and that has been driving the discussion. I, for example, tend to deal with it by being altruistic in the setting of high level goals, but then focusing heavily on the pragmatic side of the nitty gritty steps in between (like loan arrangements and equity deals). But even the most extreme point I can remember being made by any player was the "we need more power so we can do more good" argument, which is still a pragmatic altruist argument.
"Self-serving" just does not describe the attitude of the players accurately. I mean, I've been in other quests where there are players who actually make the "power for more powers sake" and "for LOLZ" arguments. Meguca Micro Empire is actually a very altruistic bunch of players.
Now if Sachiko and other IC character players want to misinterpret our actions as self serving, I can't argue against that, as that's a common enough result in these circumstances. Particularly when the altruistic goals are set out first, and then circumstances force reconfiguration into more pragmatic approaches.
Yes, politically it may bind them together stronger, it doesn't change the fact that refugees are going to create a burden on the organization. If only from the sudden need to put more forces on patrol and guard duty. It's not free.
Additionally, this points up again the altruistic nature of our approach to the refugees of trying to take them all in instead.
And we shouldn't be concerned with more than a year out without being labeled self-serving?
That supposes that maximizing our size is not also the most altruistic approach, which most of your other drivers are pushing us towards.
This is something you and I have always disagreed on. I do not accept you assumptions here, and have always felt that if we had enough money to expand the courier business that we could then bootstrap the Tokyo area into financial solvency. We had enough money on hand to support the courier expansion. Then we spent it all on refugees.
So yes, from my perspective this whole borrowing money business is driven by the refugee crisis.
Now if we are going to be borrowing money anyway, then it is only pragmatic to consider all other possible monetary needs and what additional gains we can make personally according to how we construct the loan. That doesn't change that the driving factor here is the refugees, and if the refugee crisis had never occurred that we would not be considering selling equity to Sachiko. (At least I wouldn't be. Although I suppose we could get into the reconstruction of Tokyo, find out that bootstrapping is harder than I think, and be cornered into getting a loan anyway, but we certainly wouldn't be doing it now.)
1: 1/6 of refugees is entirely reasonable from our preservative. At 100 refugees total a month that's 15 refugees a month for Magick Corp to deal with. After two months that would result in 30 refugees to Magick Corps ~50 current members, which is roughly equivalent to the percentage of of refugees to current members that we have already absorbed.
So fine, if Sachiko doesn't see that as fair. It's entirely reasonable for us to see it as "fair."
Furthermore, considering that Nagoya is tapped out, (and has been for over a year now), that we are approaching the breaking point, that the Junta is not worth considering, and that the Republic/Heaven's Chosen are distant enough away that it will be impossible to convince them to intervene (plus they are overhunted already), that just leaves Sendai, The Enlightened, and Magick Corp to deal with the remainder of refugees, and it is thus only reasonable to assume 1/6th for Magick Corp.
2: I explicitly recognized the territorial impacts and suggested cooperation to help them deal with that:
I'm not trying to condemn them to starvation, I'm just telling them that hey, we need some help here, and that standing back and trying to let us and Nagoya handle it all is foolish, if they want to help through a loan with favorable terms, that's cool, but that if they don't want to offer favorable terms, maybe they should consider what other kind of help they can provide.
Frankly, I was leaving an opening for them to get more directly involved in Tokyo themselves. I didn't expect them to take that opening, but it wasn't something I would have been opposed to.
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Welcome to the thread!
Don't mind the heated morality debates, just part of the package when you get to play as an actual heroic heroine that is trying her best to save the world despite the world doing it's best to not be saved and make everything far more complicated than it ought to be.
Powerofmind
In Madness Fallen
- Location
- United States
Again I call bullshit, because for all intents and purposes, the territory the HC and MR claim as theirs, the Junta claims as theirs too. It's not a god damn invasion, they're not even fighting each other. They are enemies that hunt the same grounds and they only don't shoot each other because an entire army will appear if they try.
I also never said we should 'abdicate responsibility to Hino,' I said we should have gone with the original concept for stabilizing Tokyo, by forming independent organizations and acting in conjunction with other outside groups as oversight to keep things from spinning out of control.
Except that entire concept was blown out the water by the need to cough up part of Tokyo to HC to bribe them into giving us the anti-teleport artifact.
Powerofmind
In Madness Fallen
- Location
- United States
"I'll use power better than you, so shut up and listen to me," is all the rest of the world is going to hear when Mami speaks. That you refuse to acknowledge that's the situation leaves me completely baffled.
No it wasn't. We could easily have taken a small chunk of the pie with how underpopulated Tokyo has become without pushing many, if any, girls from their homes. If I recall, that was part of the initial plan, where we and Nagoya would each take small annexes for ourselves to keep an eye on things directly. You can't very well keep things stable without actually being there, but you don't have to rule it all yourself, either.
- Location
- A friendly desert community
Here are some numbers to back this up:
Before our campaign in Tokyo, this is from just before Turn 31, there were 1,000 Magical Girls:
in the area.
As per:
there are now 800 to 900 girls left and according to this, although it's from the previous turn, the majority of the decrease is due to refugees:
So even if we assume the full decrease, 200 girls, is from refugees that still puts the 76 refugees:
who want to join, and as of the latest votes have joined us, at 0.38% of the total population. When you consider that at least some of that figure has to be down to deaths and the fact it's actual value is somewhere between 100 and 200 not actually 200 then that percentage is probably closer to 45% or even 50%.
If a similar percentage of girls still in Tokyo want to join up after we've saved the city then we're looking at a minimum of 304 extra girls which would bring us to at least 454 which is pretty damn close to those 500 girl figures people have been throwing around.
As some more evidence for the number being closer to 50% in the latest round of girls, those who came to help us free Tokyo, we had a total of 18 girls show up of which 9 (8 vets + Miho) or exactly half were willing to join. That's probably more representative of the general population which would put us at 550 girls after Tokyo is cleared.
As I understand it Elder Haman's problem isn't that the character don't understand our goals it's that The GM isn't.
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Powerofmind
In Madness Fallen
- Location
- United States
But aren't we, as the players, doing exactly what I said? It's the SV mentality to strip as many people of enough agency to fuck up our plans as possible. Are you really surprised the GM sees us as being power-mongers when we've had a meta-spiral just discovering there was a faction with more physical oomph than us?
Interestingly, recently I've been analyzing the Moral Foundations Theory that you brought up back in February. A pretty decent starting point for a descriptive theory, though incomplete and flawed. Been writing up a critique on it, which has led to some interesting conclusions.
Should probably make a note here (including for @Aranfan, since this might possibly be related to his issues with the previous argument): Saying that motivations are based on self-interest is not the same as having selfish motivations. Self-interest and selfishness are two entirely separate things.
Left off the end of this sentence?
In isolation, and ignoring other factors, perhaps. However we also need enough meguca hunting to bring DS back up to a usable level (ie: greater than -10) before I would expect any business venture to be viable, just on account of the horrific mental pressure on normal people at the extremely low DS. And, after accounting for the numbers needed for that, projections on the number of girls available for the purpose of actually implementing the courier service (or any other business) is insufficient to cover general upkeep costs of the full number of new members. We'd be short a couple hundred thousand per month.
In more practical terms, it would take a couple months of hunting with almost all the girls available to bring things up to a level where starting a new business is likely to gain traction. By that point, the number of hunters needed would also drop significantly, which frees up enough people to actually staff the business, so that we can make enough money to handle the upkeep and stuff.
We did indeed have the money necessary for the courier expansion, but that in itself is insufficient for the purposes of maintaining a stable territory. And I also agree that we likely could have made the deal sustainable with a much smaller territory grab (something in the 200-300 range, maybe). However the switch to a 1000+ territory grab is sufficient in and of itself to require additional funding, even without accounting for the additional refugees and their costs.
We've accepted (or are about to accept) 76 refugees, compared to our starting 74 meguca population, meaning we've hit the 100% mark already. 30 refugees for the Magick Company would be 60%-ish.. 50 was the territory size, and their population is probably lower — perhaps as low as 40 — which could put it as high as a 75% mark. However there are additional factors:
1) We are most definitely accepting far more than our 'fair' share.
2) We can only afford to do this because of the massive supplementary cube returns from the youma bounties.
3) Remember that the baseline buffer for cubes is 100%. Accepting even 50% of their base population could potentially strip them of their buffer entirely in two months. Granted, we don't know what kind of buffer they have, but that would be the baseline estimate.
4) They don't actually know how long it's going to take us to clear Tokyo. We can give them estimates, but our estimates have been wrong before. For practical purposes, Sachiko would likely have to make her estimates based on needing to support N refugees for up to perhaps 6 months, and that's if we succeed. There's still the risk of failure to be concerned about, which leads to supporting N refugees indefinitely.
Please run an estimate on the viability of supporting, say, 12 extra girls per month, increasing every month for 3 months, when you have 50 territory, 45 members, a 50 cube buffer, no legendary to help you kill youma, your own personal power being poorly suited for serious combat, and at best 50/50 odds of this other organization succeeding in their attempt to kill the youma in Tokyo. Bonus points for the unknown risk factor of youma scattering. Put yourself in Sachiko's shoes for just 5 minutes and tell me what that sort of request looks like.
Once again, why can't you write something like that in the offer? That's an entirely reasonable and decent approach (aside from perhaps the dig at 'favorable terms'). Instead you have to go around making veiled threats with fake generosity, and come off looking very much like an ass.
Aranfan
Team Plasma Grunt
Bullshit. Having your interest primarily on yourself is exactly the definition of selfishness.
*Leaves to continue cooling down, people don't tag me to drag me back into the argument, I left for a reason*
I agree that it is incomplete, but I do find it useful in understanding why people often have different moral beginnings, not just different conclusions.
Well... while I can agree that self-interest and selfishness are not the same thing. I wouldn't go so far as to claim they are entirely separate.
Also, it's pretty clear that the criticism is that somehow the morality of the players has changed, and I just don't see that.
Thanks, fixed.
See, I don't think that's an accurate depiction of the business climate. Tokyo is in an economic recession, not an economic breakdown. Therefor the current DS cannot be so low that it prevents the establishment of a business. In fact, the negative emotional effects cut both ways, since we would be immune to it while our competitors would not be.
Furthermore, I have always maintained that we do not need immediate roll out of the general upkeep costs, but can roll out amenities progressively as the business is established. We could also potentially rent territory space out to groups that need to rebuild their cube reserves. There are lots of ways we could approach this, and I really do feel that the refugee problem is what is driving the Sachiko loan, with Tokyo expansion a secondary concern, but very much an add on not the key component. Though I suppose it's understandable that Sachiko can't see that.
Again, not to my mind, since I was always considering a larger number to be very possible, at least once incorporating the association model - which I expected to include the courier business as a primary linkage.
I DID! I even quoted the line in the offer where I did it in my last post so that you could see that I put it in the offer.
And I posit again that the 1/6th is indeed a very heavy lift, but entirely reasonable ask considering the effort everyone else is making. The whole point of that section was to remind Sachiko that everyone else is also stretched to the limit, and so we appreciate that she needs to make a profit, but she should consider the cost to her if we fail, and maybe she should give us the best deal she can afford. Which I suspect she did.
I'm not in the "Sachiko is a gouger" camp, but at the same time, I think it entirely reasonable for us to push her a bit and feel morally justified in doing so. That was plenty of sentiment in the thread that Magick Corp is ignoring the refugee problem and basically saying that it's not their problem, or blaming it on us, because we dared to actually do something successful about Tokyo. I toned that down into a blunt reminder to Magick Corp that there is a refugee problem, and it could be very expensive to them to deal with, so they ought to consider our efforts and how that effects them.
And I don't buy the argument that Magick Corp is immune from the refugee crisis. Even supposing that Magick Corp can forcibly keep refugees out, that just shoves them out on to other groups, like Kofu. And what happens when they get desperate? Maybe disorganized refugees can't get into Magick Corp boundaries, but I bet a 20 meguca group would be able too. And that's a real threat to Magick Corp.
- Location
- Montana
Doesn't Magick Corp have less than ten meguca? And only enough territory to support themselves? I'm pretty sure it has been said that they only count as significant because they have so much mundane income, so asking them or even implying that they should take in more is forcing them to support in GCU beyond their capacity. Also remember that we are the only group that is more worried about the world wide meguca situation and well being. Other groups are totally focused on their own girls or on the possibility of youma appearances.
On the topic of Tokyo: if the youma all die and no one steps in to provide oversight in regards to overhunting, how long would it take the Incubators to find and contract enough girls from the remaining Tokyo population to bring DS to a reasonable level? And is this the reason inverted_helix says that our expansion into Tokyo is purely for our own benefit?
As regards the refugee crisis, while it is good that those girls can make it out of Tokyo now the pressure placed on all the established groups that have to deal with them is a direct result of our actions. It is perfectly reasonable for them to blame us for the problem, or to believe that we are taking advantage of the situation. It is irrational and wouldn't hold up if we asked some third party, but the irrationality of their opinions doesn't make them unreasonable from their perspective. Remember that these groups have been maintaining an exclusion zone that worked for them until we broke it. Basically because we didn't have a perfect plan to deal with all the refugees we are taking the blame for all negative results as they affect each group.
Also our perceived failure in the first attack on the youna is what opened the issues to start with. None of the other groups are looking at us and seeing that we are taking in more than anyone else, they only see us as the cause of the refugee crisis and its impact on their girls and operations. Moreover we will probably continue to be viewed as such until the youma are gone.
Does anyone know if the Incubators contract every potential girl they find or do they limit themselves based on current meguca population?
On the topic of Tokyo: if the youma all die and no one steps in to provide oversight in regards to overhunting, how long would it take the Incubators to find and contract enough girls from the remaining Tokyo population to bring DS to a reasonable level? And is this the reason inverted_helix says that our expansion into Tokyo is purely for our own benefit?
As regards the refugee crisis, while it is good that those girls can make it out of Tokyo now the pressure placed on all the established groups that have to deal with them is a direct result of our actions. It is perfectly reasonable for them to blame us for the problem, or to believe that we are taking advantage of the situation. It is irrational and wouldn't hold up if we asked some third party, but the irrationality of their opinions doesn't make them unreasonable from their perspective. Remember that these groups have been maintaining an exclusion zone that worked for them until we broke it. Basically because we didn't have a perfect plan to deal with all the refugees we are taking the blame for all negative results as they affect each group.
Also our perceived failure in the first attack on the youna is what opened the issues to start with. None of the other groups are looking at us and seeing that we are taking in more than anyone else, they only see us as the cause of the refugee crisis and its impact on their girls and operations. Moreover we will probably continue to be viewed as such until the youma are gone.
Does anyone know if the Incubators contract every potential girl they find or do they limit themselves based on current meguca population?
Vague-ish time estimates have us, at present, about 1 year past the point where DS fell below 0. This assumes some months pushing DS up towards maybe +20 (in order to start the youma spawning in significant numbers), and then a few months of DS dropping relatively quickly while it's above 0, and somewhere around then being about when Nagoya started to get involved.
So, with 10-12 months of it falling from DS 0, and accelerating as time goes on, there's probably a good 3 to 5 months before it hits -10, so maybe 5 to 8 months of it falling into the truly detrimental DS range, and only a handful of months in the really horrific range it's reached now. I made no mention of any economic breakdown, because that has no relevance to my argument.
Tokyo is in an economic recession, yes, but that's been accumulating and growing over time. It's not a switch that gets flipped, making it Recession Time; it accumulates over months. Recession means negative growth. Businesses stop expanding, and don't replace things that are failing. They're in a situation with explicitly negative hope being impressed on their minds on a daily basis. They're not in a mindset to take chances, to try to expand and grow their business, and so forth, which means that a business that depends on that attitude is dead in the water.
Now, I'll grant that the presentation of the appearance of hope can be advantageous for us, but I only really expect people to be willing to take the step to start recovery once the DS at least rises to the "I can live with this" level of around -10.
The absolute bare minimum would be about $225 (food, shelter,
As noted, the "business being established" is not guaranteed in the immediate term. Even if it was, we know that it takes a few months for it to get up to speed, if the past courier expansions and the restaurant have been anything to go by. Even the best case scenario of an immediate startup and no meguca-time conflict is still leaving people homeless and starving for several months.
This would actually be a reasonable thing to help cover how limited we are on hunting, though we don't really have many groups to sell it to. Kifu and Numazu, maybe the Enlightened and Sachiko (though with the currently-proposed split-up, they'd be closer to the Nagoya-controlled areas). It would provide a small boost, but I don't expect it to add anything significant to the bottom line.
Well, we were approaching her before the refugee thing really hit, in order to get the restaurant loan. And we intended to get extra money out of the restaurant loan for Serena's village houses anyway. The refugee issue has pushed the need for immediate funding up to the front, yes, but it's not like we waited til we were deluged with refugees to even consider it. We've just adjusted our plans and expectations as the situation has evolved. Still, the vast majority of our monetary needs arise explicitly because of the Tokyo expansion plans. We could handle the refugees on maybe $300k (including a few houses for Serena), but we need another ~$1.5 mil (by my estimated worst case) to cover the Tokyo half of things.
You did not make the offer as you wrote it in the above post. You did not go to her as an equal and simply explain the situation and ask her to consider ways she could help. You went in with a not-so-veiled threat, followed by a mafia-like oh-so-generous acceptance of what you'd like her to provide.
Here you say 1/6 is a heavy lift, while previously you said it was fair, or even low. Someone can accept an unfair request if they deem it reasonable or necessary, given the circumstances, but that doesn't make it a fair request, nor something that should be expected.
You did not present it as an extraordinary request that we still felt compelled to ask; you presented it as "You ought to be doing this, but we'll be kind enough to accept the fact that you can't/won't." You're dictating what their obligations are supposed to be, rather than entreat them to understand the needs of the situation and request their assistance. You're undermining their agency, and treating them as little more than a tool for your own use.
Given the supposed hard mode of this quest, I keep waiting for someone to tell us "No" when we start acting too unreasonable, and leave us in a horribly untenable position.
I'm not sure I remember such stances in the thread discussion. The only thing I remember is TheEyes being one of the two people who did a full panic over the equity issue, and threw in the threat as a suggestion to get her to back off, and then you incorporated that into your proposal.
And the refugee problem is our fault. We opened paths out, and didn't consider the ramifications of that. We didn't have plans to deal with that, and even after our first batch of refugees, made no notable plans for dealing with the exodus in the second month, which hit several other areas rather hard. Saying, "We're just trying to save Tokyo!" is not an excuse (or perhaps, just an excuse). We would be expected to know the consequences of our actions, and didn't take any action to help mitigate the resulting problem.
People being upset at someone for saying that to our face is not Sachiko's problem. At the same time, saying that it's our fault is not the same as blaming us, and some people don't seem to be able to distinguish between those two concepts.
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Based on the map, they have a territory which roughly covers enough population centers to count as about 50 territory. We do not know how many meguca are in the MC, but it could reasonably be as high as 45, though I would guess 40 to be more likely (particularly since they said they could accept 2-3 more girls).
I would guess a minimum of 6 months for the Incubators, and possibly a few years, to bring it back up to basic sustainability levels purely through contracting. However other groups would be much quicker to move in to claim territory if it was not otherwise claimed.
Moving into Tokyo is for our own benefit because:
- It increases our hunting territory, and thus GCU income, which helps us a great deal for our ongoing research projects.
- It increases our capability for monetary income, increasing the general well-being of our membership.
- It provides a 'presence' to help deter invasive activity from more aggressive groups such as the Junta, thus reducing the risk of a return to the conflicts which generated the youma in the first place.
- It provides us a solid political strength which can be used to help stabilize the remaining groups in Japan.
- It provides a resource base which can be used move into other countries for the same purpose as clearing out Tokyo — political and GCU stability, and long-term health and growth for the magical girl community.
- It provides a resource base for truly futuristic dreams for magical girls and mankind as a whole.
They limit themselves. For example, Kyuubey has only explicitly gone out of his way to contract a single new girl in the Mitakihara area since we began operating. Meanwhile, they've been contracting probably dozens per month in Tokyo to try to compensate for the death rates.
Oh dear. It's spreading.
While I agree that over 700 girls isn't unlikely, I'd peg that as unlikely immediately, and thus we will hopefully have a bit more of an economic buffer before we get more pop.
It's might be their 'territory', but that doesn't mean they've got that many girls. With their greater monetary focus, it's possible they do something like our share-cropping arrangement with Kyouko earlier (probably with some monetary incentives as well) or something similar.
(Otherwise very well said).
No they weren't. What are you talking about? The youma were maintaining a patrol that trapped the girls inside Tokyo. Other meguca groups were not doing anything.
New businesses do get started during recessions. The dynamics are different but still entirely plausible for us, as during a recession other businesses will be looking to reduce costs, and so a new entry that competes on cost (which we almost certainly do) can succeed.
I think we just have to agree to disagree about a lot of the other things, because we just have different premises.