ThatGazzer
Minds Eye Bind
- Location
- PNW
- Pronouns
- They/Them
It probably went something like...
"Cat claws? does she have cat ears and a cat tail too?"
"What, don't be...well...that would be pretty neat wouldn't it?"
Chronicles of Nations - Civ Quest
- Thread starter Oshha
- Start date
- Original
"Cat claws? does she have cat ears and a cat tail too?"
"What, don't be...well...that would be pretty neat wouldn't it?"
These are all good points and indeed, things that I have considered. But to the matter of fact, let's examine them rather closely and show you where I disagree with them.
There are middle grounds, in that the sway of power is held by different pantheons much like power blocks. The end is not always the destruction of all a la Ragnarok or destruction of Gods found disagreeable a la Titanomachy. Moreover and with regards to compatibility, what happens if our Pantheon find a God who is agreeable...who in turn finds another God to be agreeable but not with the Goddesses?
Another difficult question, one that I feel should be answered promptly considering our religious focus.
And here's the big point of uncertainty. The Gods are real, yes. They have power, yes. But you said it yourself, the biggest point of uncertainty:
'So far'. 'For now'. The other undeniable fact is that Gods change. They are old, but they can, through actions of other Gods or their worshippers, change, shift, and have different aspects to change entirely. Arthryn dragged It-That-Became All-Seerest kicking and screaming into the Pantheon. Wryn casually making it so that Evalyn turn into a Catgirl Goddess (I did the opposite of complaining when the sidestory dropped). Gods can become so unrecognizable in this world, even. Dionysus' treatment in the mythos (check out the Overly Sarcastic Production video on the matter, it's great) is a prime example of this.
Simply put, we cannot rely our Gods to remain the same, that they retain the values that us, the player want. Like the civilization, we need to take careful stock of their disposition and nature, and how the civilization venerates them.
Certainly, but notably speaking, that is not what is happening with this current vote. I have no outward problems with it, not with a Double Hero in the helm. But what do you think will happen to the Boarfolk who might to their perceived barbaric ways, the ways of the damned Scourge of the past?
Nothing good for them, that is for sure.
So long as our people maintain their strongly theocratic nature, I don't see us being willing to allow gods/goddesses ours consider evil to continue to exist long term. Eventually we'll expand all around that evil forest filled with the undead. I find it rather unlikely that we'll just let that sit in our lands. Its possible we'll encounter another civ sufficiently powerful that hating their gods isn't considered reason enough to spend the resources removing them, but unless their gods find ours acceptable even though ours hates them, they'd have to make that same decision to keep a holy war from happening. And based on our current values, a pantheon ours hates would likely be particularly warlike, and thus willing to go for those kinds of massive holy wars.
As for pantheon X that gets along with pantheon Y, but our pantheon hates pantheon X but likes pantheon Y? I suspect at least one of those 3 pantheons will be changed. Either us or X changes to be able to agree, or Y is changed to hate X same as ours. Failing that, if sufficient distance is reached between our civ and that of pantheon X, we might be able to keep peaceable relations, but I suspect there'd be a bare minimum if any trade or other flow of people between our civs. Though, I rather doubt that would last long term.
I agree that we can't rely on our Goddesses to remain the same, but as a general rule, we control our civ, which informs how our goddesses change. We do have to be careful about the actions we take, and try and make sure we guide the civ to where we want it to be. So far, it seems to me that our civ's pantheon is pretty decent. Things work together fairly well, and they've more often than not been able to help us out with things. We need to keep up our efforts there, but so far we're doing OK.
Well, the Boarfolk clearly aren't the same as the Scourge of the past. These Boarfolk are willing to work together with the rest of the middlelanders, unlike the scourge who simply tried to kill and enslave us. They've already proven themselves to be sufficiently different that I don't see the issue going out of control, even without a hero at the helm. Though that said, what makes you think that we aren't going to be letting them have their ways and teaching them of our own? She's trying to convert them, not enslave them. Much like how the Merntir were converted to the worship of Arthryn. The sticking point will likely be the Boarfolk not wanting to merge the All-Boar into the pantheon, but even that can be easily workable by simply having it be an allied God, meant for the Boarfolk in particular. No one else worships the All-Boar, so that could easily occur, keep them as a Racial Deity for the Boarfolk that works alongside Arthryn and her daughters. If you've got any evidence that our Hero is going to try and convert the people forcibly though, let me know and I'll change my vote immediately, because that's not what I want our civ to do.
Nah, Oshha assuaged that fear.
I would argue more and deliberate further, but a burgeoning headache is putting a stopper to that.
hope the headache gets better, that kinda thing is always sucky.
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Actually Romans did worshiped other gods that were not part of Greek pantheon so i would see All-Boar religion spreading, especially among those that have boars later on like farmers or warriors .
I see him as allied god in this case as he is worshiped by other boarfolk nomad and as such wouldn't be inclined to become member of pantheon under Arthryn .
- Location
- Germany
[X] Yes. (???)
unlikely to happen with how we likely still remember the nomands.
unlikely to happen with how we likely still remember the nomands.
- Location
- Leicester UK
I agree with this.
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- Space
I do wonder what effects this would have in inner pantheon relationship.
Goddess like Hera (Marriage ) and Aphrodite (Love) both of wich are communal values are shown to have rivalies from time to time.
Wryn doing this shouldn't really be brushed of, especially by the goddess that is defined by battle and death. We may soon see iner pantheon rivalies that spread onto followers.
In other hand Arthryn even though was goddess of community didn't solve this properly, just don't do this again and say sorry doesn't solve the problem.
Goddess like Hera (Marriage ) and Aphrodite (Love) both of wich are communal values are shown to have rivalies from time to time.
Wryn doing this shouldn't really be brushed of, especially by the goddess that is defined by battle and death. We may soon see iner pantheon rivalies that spread onto followers.
In other hand Arthryn even though was goddess of community didn't solve this properly, just don't do this again and say sorry doesn't solve the problem.
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I mean... if she listens, and our goddess of death accepts it... it kinda does?
- Location
- Southampton, Great Britain
- Pronouns
- He/Him
When I think of Evalyn's appearance, I use the default female Commander Shepard from Mass Effect as basis so basically like Commander Jane Shepard, but in stone clothing rather than space power armour and with a pair of cat ears on the top of her head and a cat tail. Maybe bigger muscles and curves since becoming a goddess due to the those aspects of her appearance being emphasised by her followers.
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But the problem is that it was done to her against her will.
If you are female and your brother or sister cuts your hair of and does it forever, would you be so accepting.
Or spread a rumor among school that holds.
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I mean, no. Like I said, "if she accepts it" she may or may not. I'm not her. If she doesn't accept it, Wyrn will have to fix it somehow. But if she does, then Wyrn learned a lesson, and Evalyn gets to use Catgirl powers.
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I kinda don't think that she will. She is defined by battle and death and she did overthrown government in life.
Sure, but cat-tail and cat-ears seem like they might be beneficial for fighting, something she'd consider worthwhile.
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- Space
She can shape shift and is a goddess, form the looks of it Wryn did it for lolz. It is more about Wryn giving her subjects certain picture about her.
Add All-Seeress to it since it seems that Wryn is rewriting her own weary being against her consent and we have two goddess after her.
As said before goddesses in Greek myth were similar to ours in their domain and yet they were known to take revenge against those who offended them.
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- Location
- Southampton, Great Britain
- Pronouns
- He/Him
In regards to Wyrn and Evalyn, Evalyn doesn't mind. She spent pretty much all of life as a warrior and was waging war for the entirety of her adult life and is too pragmatically minded to hold a grudge. That said, once she had gotten over the initial shock, Evalyn found the change hilarious and actually enjoyed being involved in a harmless sisterly prank even if she had the part of being the victim.
When she was growing up, Evalyn was something of an outcast and didn't have any friends and when since she got blessed, she always stood out, getting treated as someone special and a person to look up to. While Evalyn formed plenty of close bonds with others during her adult life, she never had an equal relationship with anyone apart from Cadyn as she was always treated as being a superior. Even with Cadyn, the two of them are informal lovers who spend most of their lives away from each other.
Because of this, Evalyn enjoys the sisterhood that she has gained amongst her fellow goddesses. She doesn't mind Wyrn's pranks as long as they don't go too far and likes the jokes of her eldest sister.
I will also clarify that the prank done by Wyrn is considered harmless by Evalyn and is reversible. While it is technically permanent, it would take Wyrn a trivial amount of undo what she did should Evalyn decide that she didn't like the cat ears and tails. As things stand, Evalyn has decided to keep them as a sign of sisterly affection towards Wyrn as she isn't really bothered by them either way and if she doesn't feel like having them, she can just change her form to not have time.
On a related note, I view the Arthrnite goddesses having the following roles.
Arthryn = Kind and all powerful mother
Wyrn = Playful Prankster sister
Ymarn = Intelligent and wise sister
All-Seeress = Grumpy and annoying sister
Evalyn = Boisterous and athletic sister
No because Wyrn outclasses her and has the rest of the Arthrynite goddess helping her hide it. It is pretty much impossible for All-Seeress to find out so I don't bother rolling.
When she was growing up, Evalyn was something of an outcast and didn't have any friends and when since she got blessed, she always stood out, getting treated as someone special and a person to look up to. While Evalyn formed plenty of close bonds with others during her adult life, she never had an equal relationship with anyone apart from Cadyn as she was always treated as being a superior. Even with Cadyn, the two of them are informal lovers who spend most of their lives away from each other.
Because of this, Evalyn enjoys the sisterhood that she has gained amongst her fellow goddesses. She doesn't mind Wyrn's pranks as long as they don't go too far and likes the jokes of her eldest sister.
I will also clarify that the prank done by Wyrn is considered harmless by Evalyn and is reversible. While it is technically permanent, it would take Wyrn a trivial amount of undo what she did should Evalyn decide that she didn't like the cat ears and tails. As things stand, Evalyn has decided to keep them as a sign of sisterly affection towards Wyrn as she isn't really bothered by them either way and if she doesn't feel like having them, she can just change her form to not have time.
On a related note, I view the Arthrnite goddesses having the following roles.
Arthryn = Kind and all powerful mother
Wyrn = Playful Prankster sister
Ymarn = Intelligent and wise sister
All-Seeress = Grumpy and annoying sister
Evalyn = Boisterous and athletic sister
No because Wyrn outclasses her and has the rest of the Arthrynite goddess helping her hide it. It is pretty much impossible for All-Seeress to find out so I don't bother rolling.
taovkool
Forever Gone
- Location
- The Library, Department of General Works
Alright then. Lemme put that on my notes.
Assuming there's not much changes, then the initial chargen for future Arthwyd!Singularity is going to be hilarious. That's still a long ways away though....
- Location
- Somewhere
You started us with -4 temp econ to build settlements, and some other gunk. Why wouldn't the temp econ be about the same temp econ we spend if they had been hit with a reset button due to the Cataclysm?
How is it possible that our civ cannot rapidly pick up building settlements practices from the Southerners, or be more informed as to how the Southerners are building villages so quickly compared to the Arthwyd?
We probably can but as we have not build settlements recently we might not have had the motivation to look into their construction methods.
One possibly is that they use the boars to pull the goods needed for new settlements so we needed boars to adopt that.
10ebbor10
DON'T PANIC
- Location
- Present
In the original POC, one civ had a value that led them build settlements at the cost of centralization. It worked really well for them, until there was a drought and then their hugely negative centralization created a massive hit.
They probably have something similar.
- Location
- Toronto, Canada
Remember that support action where the Maradysh got really pissed at us? We may have crit failed the relationship roll but we rolled pretty high in the material support roll. It might have helped give the Maradysh the temp econ to construct those settlements for several turns in a row.
*Hurriedly scurries away before anyone realizes I forgot about that too*
*Hurriedly scurries away before anyone realizes I forgot about that too*
- Location
- Southampton, Great Britain
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Because they have different values and a different economy type which make it cheaper to expand, but you get less benefits from expansion. Not only does it make it cheaper, but the support that Gwynlyn sent to them has gave them enough spare temp econ to sustain founding more settlements then they would have otherwise. Between those two things, they can expand more quickly, but it takes longer to build tall.
It is also wrong to assume that the collapse of the lowlands reset the Maradysh beyond them losing all of their old lands and most of their population.
As for what those techniques are, the Maradysh are using inferior barbarian ways that violate the divine teachings of the goddesses, which also explains why you cannot use them.
I also recommend not buying into the Arthwyd's in-universe beliefs on the barbarism of their neighbours as they are rather biased in that regard and can overlook important things that they deem irrelevant or uncivilised.
For all we know, their construction could be slap dash and of atrocious qualities.