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Ymaryn Successor Quest (Paths of Civ AU)

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Nyvis said:
Are noble republics closer to democracy than absolute monarchies? Both kinda require a revolution to get there most of the time :V
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Sure. But in Spain the most egalitarian parts of the country are where the reconquista proceeded slowly and the land grants small, while the most authoritarian are where it went quickly and the land grants large.
 
Fouredged Sword said:
[X] Accept Terms (+5 Prestige, -1 influence, +2 influence, -.3 Income)

Yeah, two things.

First this sets up a better form of government and is essentially them asking us to do what we are already doing with minor changes. This pulls power away from the nobility and gives it to the priests and rural workers, both good things.

We also want TP to be as self administrative as posible. They are going to be a bitch to manage unless they essentially manage themselves and send taxes. They are on the edge between being a colony and a province due to how large the information lag getting through the mountains is.

So democracy and weak nobles allow priests to wander through fixing problems while the land more or less self administrates. Yeah, getting their taxes home is a pain, but we don't need to get involved past that. The king won't be worrying about picking nobles or anything like that.
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This said, I want the Wagonways Megaproject done as soon as possible. This is the only way to truly get them integrated.
 
tenchifew said:
This said, I want the Wagonways Megaproject done as soon as possible. This is the only way to truly get them integrated.
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Oh yes, it will help get the taxes home while at the same time open TP up to significantly easier luxury trade. That trade means money when it hits a port and pays tariffs. I ALSO want to do the signal towers for much the same reason.

Can you imagine the effect of the core having access to the weather report of every edge of every province? It will let us farm REALLY good.
 
[X] Accept Terms (+5 Prestige, -1 influence, +2 influence, -.3 Income)

Let's be real, barring massive infrastructure projects (hello wagonways!) we aren't getting much from TP bar reunification in name only. We have no way of actually invading and making said invasion stick without the people themselves being cool with it.
 
I also think we should do a round of loans from people around us. Loans are a weak assurance of peace because we are honorable enough that we would answer if they got called in. Being able to ding us a treasury at will calling in a loan makes people feel safer about us. It also means that if they declare war on us we void the loan, encouraging peace in the other direction.
 
Fouredged Sword said:
Oh yes, it will help get the taxes home while at the same time open TP up to significantly easier luxury trade. That trade means money when it hits a port and pays tariffs. I ALSO want to do the signal towers for much the same reason.

Can you imagine the effect of the core having access to the weather report of every edge of every province? It will let us farm REALLY good.
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The Signal Tower project only covers Txolla + Thunder Plateau, unless it's actually a megaproject that cover every inches of Ymarynland, in which case I would expect it to have a narrative effect across the land.
 
Raichu1972 said:
[X] Accept Terms (+5 Prestige, -1 influence, +2 influence, -.3 Income)

Let's be real, barring massive infrastructure projects (hello wagonways!) we aren't getting much from TP bar reunification in name only. We have no way of actually invading and making said invasion stick without the people themselves being cool with it.
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Besides, what they want is what we would have given them anyway.
Even:
Land management be distributed across many people rather than concentrated in relatively few.
They get to pick who their administrators are in perpetuity.
is less democracy and more how we used to do things, until this one Dragon general who became king interfered - and I remember the thread thinking if a civil war was worth it to keep at it.

Kiba said:
The Signal Tower project only covers Txolla + Thunder Plateau, unless it's actually a megaproject that cover every inches of Ymarynland, in which case I would expect it to have a narrative effect across the land.
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After doing it once I expect us to be able to expand it to more provinces.
 
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[X] Accept Terms (+5 Prestige, -1 influence, +2 influence, -.3 Income)
If war with the Khem weren't on the horizon, I'd rather take unfavorable trade deals as a way to gain friends over trying to win allies by taking out loans.
 
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[X] Accept Terms (+5 Prestige, -1 influence, +2 influence, -.3 Income)

On a related note, how do casualties work for the Mass Levy? We still are fielding more than a million men, despite the fact that a lot have presumably died in the grinding campaign through the Zagros mountains. Are we reinforcing at the same rate?
 
ExNihilo said:
[X] Accept Terms (+5 Prestige, -1 influence, +2 influence, -.3 Income)

On a related note, how do casualties work for the Mass Levy? We still are fielding more than a million men, despite the fact that a lot have presumably died in the grinding campaign through the Zagros mountains. Are we reinforcing at the same rate?
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We are rasing a levi of 100k men every 2 years, thus the cost of 1 treasury every 2 years. The mechanical effect is our numbers stay at 1 million unless we suffer catastrophic failure.
 
noncannon said:
The main reason not to redeploy is if you're confident of a two-front war with Western Wall and Khemetri (along with tanking the income effects from their partial blockade)
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Well, it also depends if the Black Sheep army was significantly weakened by the rebellion. If we draw too many troops off, we could see a reversal of our gains.
[X] Accept Terms (+5 Prestige, -1 influence, +2 influence, -.3 Income)
Choosing their own administrators in perpetuity is just a small extension of what we were doing to find administrators to train anyway. There was even flavor text about how it might eventually settle down into hereditary "elected" nobles again.
 
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Oshha said:
I also want to point out the possibility that the Khem might not wait until we have overtaken them in prestige as they might do a little pre-emptive strike if they think that they are ready for war, but we aren't and we are going to overtake them in prestige. I don't want to still be bogged down in Thunder Plateau should the Khem decide to make a surprise attack.
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The lower our prestige, the less they gain from a preemptive strike. They want to attack Ymaryn the ascendant to demonstrate their superiority, not Ymaryn the fairly-strong-but-also-mild-embarrassment. Better to wait until it's yesterday's news and people stop laughing at us in pubs; then make them sit up in shock.

So spend the next two turns lowering our Prestige back to 60, and a preemptive strike is unlikely. At that point, we can negotiate Black Sheep's surrender and hope that nets us less than 9 prestige (minimum estimated prestige gain is 3.5 prestige, whereas our buffer is only 4 at this moment).

Rakuhn said:
over trying to win allies by taking out loans.
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Aranfan's confirmed that there's no economic incentive in intervening (because no one fears our default).

(On the bright side, because no one fears our default...)
 
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noncannon said:
The lower our prestige, the less they gain from a preemptive strike. They want to attack Ymaryn the ascendant to demonstrate their superiority, not Ymaryn the fairly-strong-but-also-mild-embarrassment. Better to wait until it's yesterday's news and people stop laughing at us in pubs; then make them sit up in shock.

So spend the next two turns lowering our Prestige back to 60, and a preemptive strike is unlikely. At that point, we can negotiate Black Sheep's surrender and hope that nets us less than 9 prestige (minimum estimated prestige gain is 3.5 prestige, whereas our buffer is only 4 at this moment).
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IF they think they could take on our million strong army alone. So we can't guarantee that we could avoid that confrontation.
 
noncannon said:
The lower our prestige, the less they gain from a preemptive strike. They want to attack Ymaryn the ascendant to demonstrate their superiority, not Ymaryn the fairly-strong-but-also-mild-embarrassment. Better to wait until it's yesterday's news and people stop laughing at us in pubs; then make them sit up in shock.

So spend the next two turns lowering our Prestige back to 60, and a preemptive strike is unlikely. At that point, we can negotiate Black Sheep's surrender and hope that nets us less than 9 prestige (minimum estimated prestige gain is 3.5 prestige, whereas our buffer is only 4 at this moment).


Aranfan's confirmed that there's no economic incentive in intervening (because no one fears our default).

(On the bright side, because no one fears our default...)
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On the other hand, financial ties are a weak, but functional reign on us on the part of other nations. It means they have a slight amount of control over us in the form of calling back the loan in an inconvenient time. On the other hand, such a loan would default if they declared war on us, so they will hesitate to do so as it will make war automatically cost a treasury they can call in at any time.
Themarineguy said:
IF they think they could take on our million strong army alone. So we can't guarantee that we could avoid that confrontation.
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Khem, I am pretty sure, is confidant they won't have to. They can hold us off at sea and sending significant forces down the Arabian peninsula would be a nightmare. War with Khem would most likely take the form of them trashing our navy not shielded behind Trelli and then economic blockade until we peace out, costing us prestige, influence due to humiliation, economy due to enforced trade deals, and our navy.

It's far better to just not and take the influence, economic, and prestige hit without losing our navy. We can't afford to send our million man army to fight them via land. Our supply lines are not that powerful.

Kiba said:
Damn. Do the WW have continuous reinforcement too?
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They are part of the mass levi so yes. misunderstood the question.
 
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Kiba said:
Damn. Do the WW have continuous reinforcement too?
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Probably.
This said, they should have more problems paying for it all.
We have the guilds and are still taking loans, and we do need them - I guess that WW have less possibilities for loans and probably generally more shallow treasury.
So they should be running ou of money.
 
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Aranfan said:
Thus far yes.
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We have spies in their country. How close to breaking is their economy?

tenchifew said:
Probably.
This said, they should have more problems paying for it all.
We have the guilds and are still taking loans, and we do need them - I guess that WW have less possibilities for loans and probably generally more shallow treasury in general.
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Everyone being sure we will win has the reverse of everyone being sure that WW will eventually lose. Everyone knows that will result in WW not existing. I bet they are struggling to get loans.
 
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