Nitpick: Survival skill no longer exists. it got split into Hunting and Discovery.
We never tested survival against Shosho'an and have no idea how good he is in that area. We met him only last turn when the Fox Spirit introduced us directly after we rolled Leadership(Diplomacy). The meeting immediately went to a dominance contest with Awe/Trickery and Perform rolls.
Shoshoan has(Avatar traits draw from memory of Harzivan, so not 100% accurate):
-Fire Avatar - Flame aura(Harzivan's dealt 1 damage every round of combat), receive double damage from water. Immune to physical attacks. Can still be harmed by anything which would normally harm a fire(e.g. strong winds, thrown sand, mud) even if it would normally be harmless to a divine.
-Light Avatar - Double damage for their elemental attacks, doubles damage taken from elemental attacks. Immune to physical attacks. Can be harmed by darkness or other light impediments(fog, sand, etc) even if it would normally be harmless.
Not quite. Shosho'an's known traits are in the Redo Turn 28 post under Turn Resources/Kids, Lines and Spirits/Known Spirits.
Elemental Avatar - Fire (3 accumulating Legend discount to next Avatar Attribute Purchase, gain a Flame Aura that deals damage to enemies in melee, with Elemental Affinity - Fire mimic Full Shapeshifting, doubles water-based influence damage received)
Elemental Avatar - Light (3 accumulating Legend discount to next Influence Attribute purchase, gain Ethereal, gain a free success when performing any light or heat-based Influence Act, all light and heat-based Influence Acts gain bonus damage)
So not quadruple damage, but a free success and bonus damage. Interestingly, without the Fire Avatar he wouldn't be particularly vulnerable against anything since Light Avatar doesn't come with in-built vulnerabilities.
Really, with that combo Shosho'an is incredibly nasty ranging to impossible to fight for most spirits. He can walk up to another spirit/village and watch how they burn while flailing ineffectively against him. Any spirits capable of elemental manipulation he can hit with overpowered influence attacks. Pretty much the same idea we got with Harzivan when we saw the traits in the old Amber Age quest. (And we would have gotten away with it too if it weren't for that meddling rain spirit) Probably a major factor in how he managed to establish himself as pantheon head.
I can't help but wonder if Shosho'an wasn't trying to goad us into a physical confrontation. The lost dominance test probably meant that he couldn't engage on his own or directly order an attack even if he subverted the spirit by telling his mortals horror stories and ordering them to 'defend' themselves. If we stomped his mortals he would be free from any remaining restrictions to keep the peace. If he had planned on that and saved up a few DP that could have gotten nasty.
Saiga and Saitev basically can't hurt him at all. He knew from last turn's dominance struggle that Gaerig is currently coming up very short on water traits in comparison to his fire and light traits. He probably figured he can beat her despite the local god bonus. Considering how much Attrouska's Sunburst hurt he might even be right. The one thing he didn't know is that we got Spirit of Death and Elemental Affinity - Cold via fearbuy after we met him. That might have swung things around, but I don't think the battle would have been an easy win.
Nitpick: Survival skill no longer exists. it got split into Hunting and Discovery.
We never tested survival against Shosho'an and have no idea how good he is in that area. We met him only last turn when the Fox Spirit introduced us directly after we rolled Leadership(Diplomacy). The meeting immediately went to a dominance contest with Awe/Trickery and Perform rolls.
Not quite. Shosho'an's known traits are in the Redo Turn 28 post under Turn Resources/Kids, Lines and Spirits/Known Spirits.
So not quadruple damage, but a free success and bonus damage. Interestingly, without the Fire Avatar he wouldn't be particularly vulnerable against anything since Light Avatar doesn't come with in-built vulnerabilities.
Remember to factor in the new information from Powerofmind about Ethereal traits. Unlike material spirits he faces serious challenges remaining manifested away from his aspects, and Ethereal traits specifically allow the Ethereal spirit to be harmed by manifestations of their natural opposites.
But Shoshoan figured out how to cheat the system by stacking Fire and Light so that hostile elemental attacks have to be able to defeat his flame aura first, and they'd be diminished still.
Really, with that combo Shosho'an is incredibly nasty ranging to impossible to fight for most spirits. He can walk up to another spirit/village and watch how they burn while flailing ineffectively against him. Any spirits capable of elemental manipulation he can hit with overpowered influence attacks. Pretty much the same idea we got with Harzivan when we saw the traits in the old Amber Age quest. (And we would have gotten away with it too if it weren't for that meddling rain spirit) Probably a major factor in how he managed to establish himself as pantheon head.
Depends, I think he hadn't found anything he can't burn yet, so that's an element. But he traded off the ability to use equipment, he can't manifest at night away from fires, and he's fully vulnerable to Magic(which is why he has a enemity to Attrouska, who also wields Light so she's not afraid of him...actually I wonder, did Attrouska beat Light off him?)
I can't help but wonder if Shosho'an wasn't trying to goad us into a physical confrontation. The lost dominance test probably meant that he couldn't engage on his own or directly order an attack even if he subverted the spirit by telling his mortals horror stories and ordering them to 'defend' themselves. If we stomped his mortals he would be free from any remaining restrictions to keep the peace. If he had planned on that and saved up a few DP that could have gotten nasty.
Saiga and Saitev basically can't hurt him at all. He knew from last turn's dominance struggle that Gaerig is currently coming up very short on water traits in comparison to his fire and light traits. He probably figured he can beat her despite the local god bonus. Considering how much Attrouska's Sunburst hurt he might even be right. The one thing he didn't know is that we got Spirit of Death and Elemental Affinity - Cold via fearbuy after we met him. That might have swung things around, but I don't think the battle would have been an easy win.
Yeah, it would have HURT like the dickens. Attrouska could only fire one laser attack for free, he can spam lower powered lasers for free indefinitely.
And the bolded bit?
We did exactly that as Harzivan to fuck the River Mother's compels. The moment we laid hands on his worshippers and children he'd be free to strike back, if we refused to fight back and tried to social his children would disperse us before we got anywhere...but we just fly away cursing him and flipped him the bird, so the compel is still in effect.
He cannot initiate a conflict in person without forcing another dominance contest and winning, and we're too far away to march his dudes over for a long time.
Remember to factor in the new information from Powerofmind about Ethereal traits. Unlike material spirits he faces serious challenges remaining manifested away from his aspects, and Ethereal traits specifically allow the Ethereal spirit to be harmed by manifestations of their natural opposites.
I feel you are misinterpreting some of the things PowerofMind said.
How are you getting serious challenges from 'slightly restricted from manifesting far from their domains'? Domain generally refers to a divine's influence area. I take that to mean that Shosho'an has to pay more AP or perhaps DP to leave his domain. 'Slight restrictions' is certainly not the same as 'serious challenges'.
'Moderately protected from smaller-scale elemental attacks, except where their particular brand of Ethereal comes with a vulnerability.'
Not all Ethereal traits come with a vulnerability. They are always specifically noted. Elemental relationships are not equal. Shadow Avatar is vulnerable to Fire/Dark, but Light Avatar is not vulnerable to Darkness. Light avatar doesn't double incoming damage, either. Fire Avatar (which doesn't grant Ethereal) comes with a vulnerability to water influence acts, but Water Avatar isn't vulnerable to fire.
How are you getting serious challenges from 'slightly restricted from manifesting far from their domains'? Domain generally refers to a divine's influence area. I take that to mean that Shosho'an has to pay more AP or perhaps DP to leave his domain. 'Slight restrictions' is certainly not the same as 'serious challenges'.
'Moderately protected from smaller-scale elemental attacks, except where their particular brand of Ethereal comes with a vulnerability.'
Not all Ethereal traits come with a vulnerability. They are always specifically noted. Elemental relationships are not equal. Shadow Avatar is vulnerable to Fire/Dark, but Light Avatar is not vulnerable to Darkness. Light avatar doesn't double incoming damage, either. Fire Avatar (which doesn't grant Ethereal) comes with a vulnerability to water influence acts, but Water Avatar isn't vulnerable to fire.
Water Avatar isn't Ethereal though, though I'd accept that the wording of Moderately Protected is sufficiently hazy that both our interpretations can fit in with room to stretch.
As a happy side-effect of adjusting how willing I am to do miniturns, I can afford to have shorter voting periods again. I'll say six hours or so to the lock.
@Powerofmind I have more questions. I hope you don't mind. Sorry if anything has been asked before.
1) Is using special items (e.g. The Sleeping Brew and Sight upon Sea) and changing equipment a free action without AP cost?
2) How does using Sight upon Sea work? Do we need to specify the water trait we want to discount or does it apply to all water traits? If we use it to create a preference towards water affinities and manifestations in the fear buy table, how long does the effect last?
3) What sorts of effects are possible with ritual enchantments in item creation? I'm asking for ballparks, not specifics.
4) Is it possible to enchant objects that another divine creates? E.g. can we ask Keshketev or our new child to use their skills in leatherworking to make a pair of boots and next turn commit the necessary ambrosia and AP to do the enchanting?
5) Can finished items be enchanted or does it have to happen during item creation?
6) Are one-use items possible? I'm thinking of something like enchanted war paint in the case of painting.
7) Is it possible to create a one-use item that opens a gate to our divine realm? For example a small bag full of pigments that form a temporary doorway when thrown into the air.
8) In the communion with Saiga we learned that he can divinely empower weapons. Can divine empowerment be combined with ritual enchantment?
9) If we hit someone with Shift Stars, can the target tell that someone cursed them and that we specifically are responsible?
In the case of EQUIPMENT AND GEAR, shuffling things around is a free action. Gifting or taking from others is not. Using Consumables does cost an action; there is an element of ritual to proper use.
2) How does using Sight upon Sea work? Do we need to specify the water trait we want to discount or does it apply to all water traits? If we use it to create a preference towards water affinities and manifestations in the fear buy table, how long does the effect last?
Given you guys have still never used items with those effects, I would prefer to hold that to my chest for now. Maybe if you use one I'll explain properly.
3) What sorts of effects are possible with ritual enchantments in item creation? I'm asking for ballparks, not specifics.
Ritual enchantment brings out elements of the material. Generally, a specific material will provide a specific range of enchantments. Noting that the Hard Crystal pretty much exclusively gave you 'sing' based abilities, for one. Likewise, Obsidian and various qualities of Bone each give their own unique boons when enchanted.
For similarities to old AA, the JADE elements of the golden mace were what brought out it's enchanted special effect, JADE having natural ties to earth and plantlife.
4) Is it possible to enchant objects that another divine creates? E.g. can we ask Keshketev or our new child to use their skills in leatherworking to make a pair of boots and next turn commit the necessary ambrosia and AP to do the enchanting?
Enchantments need to be performed while the mold is still setting, so to speak. Creating magical items with Keshketev is an involved process that the two of you would have to team up for, rather than play Assembly Line.
6) Are one-use items possible? I'm thinking of something like enchanted war paint in the case of painting.
Yes. You can create one-use items, but as it stands you simply lack the required level of skill to devise things with purpose.
7) Is it possible to create a one-use item that opens a gate to our divine realm? For example a small bag full of pigments that form a temporary doorway when thrown into the air.
Yes, but the gateway would have to be set up through the divine realm rather than the item itself (Basically you can make a non-typical enchanted thing that a gate uses as part of it's circumstance).
8) In the communion with Saiga we learned that he can divinely empower weapons. Can divine empowerment be combined with ritual enchantment?
Divine Empowerment is basically a crafter's means of using his tools on par with an enchanter without actually enchanting. Divinely empowered items have Divine Durability, meaning that only other Divinely Durable items (like enchanted items) can break them, but they can't bring out the innate enchantments of the item in question. If enchantment is your average D&D magical effect, then Divine Empowerment is your average Magic +1 Scale Mail equivalent.
9) If we hit someone with Shift Stars, can the target tell that someone cursed them and that we specifically are responsible?
Your current Influence radius is approximately 4 miles from the Holy Site, 8 from any shrine, and an impressive 16 from the Temple. Exploration allows you to travel around twice the temple's reach from the edge of your domain. Someone removed all of your higher-order water traits, so you don't have the innate resistive power to deal with especially deep exploration anymore than you did originally.
Locked with the hope to impress upon a giant that you'd like to have the insect that bothers him so.
To further drive home the point about the process I use to determine base votes, here's what you'd have gotten:
Steal the kid somehow: Played deeply into Gaerig's nascent ties to Goddess of Freedom, also highest chance of success, but the worst backlash from a failure.
Request the kid: The fence option; not as likely to succeed, but also not as likely to burn your ass if it didn't.
Ignore the kid and make a new one with Heske: Played through the Night Mother enhancement and mischief; ultimately a clever-ish workaround to the risks, but it ultimately would grind against Gaerig's Freedom bits in a potentially damaging way (If you had full Goddess of Freedom, you would not have been able to work around the freedom blindspot).
As is, the write-in has given you better odds, but there's long-term consequences associated with taking this kid that you could have avoided more easily by stealing him away.
Generally, all options are equal, assuming totally centrist priorities. Some of you might want to take the risk of upsetting to nearly ensure it works, some of you might rather sit on the fence, or avoid the issue altogether. There's nothing inherently more ideal when it comes to how I present a vote; even trap choices are only traps if you don't like the drawbacks.
EDIT: Totally missed;
Plea: You'd give Heske an in to your blindspots, something that all decent divines are clever enough to exploit to their benefit, but the risks wouldn't be as serious for failure, and success would still be pretty good.
Someone removed all of your higher-order water traits, so you don't have the innate resistive power to deal with especially deep exploration anymore than you did originally.
Install the Sight Upon the Sea once we do the Unknowable Bodies ritual.
I generally mean what I say unless the facts change significantly or I turn out to be outright mistaken on the facts. The time might not have come yet, but things are still fully on schedule even with the revised mechanics.
Again with the Unknowable Bodies. With the changes that have been put into play, I see even less use of it when we can better influence what traits we want.
Except we don't because those chances are already mitigated by being a Fear Spirit.
We hit cap,we get BIG boost to despising traits. We continue as we are now and despise two traits every time, we don't have to worry about dispersal. Empowerment boosts by 30% in addition to whatever we do that turn.
All bodies is going to do is encourage rapid changes to our build when we should be settling down on the chouces we want.
To be fair, a non-insignificant part of the playerbase want to be able to change our build 'on the fly', so to speak.
I wonder, would getting Inscrutable One help Gaerig's ties to Freedom? I mean, she'd no longer be bound by logic or what she is. What greater freedom could there be?
More seriously I'm hoping we can just grab that trait capstone and it's ascension innate , just like we did with Moon Capstone and Nox Arcana. No sidelining midway. Just grab one so we can check it off the list already
Except we don't because those chances are already mitigated by being a Fear Spirit.
We hit cap,we get BIG boost to despising traits. We continue as we are now and despise two traits every time, we don't have to worry about dispersal. Empowerment boosts by 30% in addition to whatever we do that turn.
All bodies is going to do is encourage rapid changes to our build when we should be settling down on the chouces we want.
Yet everyone has major differences about what traits they want to keep. The main reason ANYTHING got despised at all was the promise of being able to reacquire them in the near future(which is a problem without the ability to reload them for certain, since we need those traits back at the right time to do trait fusions)
Speaking of which, still need to replot the shuffle-chart to figure out how to best consolidate traits so everyone is reasonably happy. We have severe challenges actually loading the Water traits on the right turns, the Mystic traits on the right turns and the animal aspects on the right turns.
...and we still have the Temple and Shrines rebuild, as well as the Divine Realm rebuild coming up to complicate things before we see the new trait spread.
...and we still have the Temple and Shrines rebuild, as well as the Divine Realm rebuild coming up to complicate things before we see the new trait spread.
Actually, we have Spirit of Death now. We could make the Afterlife we've always wanted.
... Hmm, we could conciveably go full Disney and have the spirits of the dead become stars that look down on the world.
[X] Request Heske give the spirit into your command. You will take him far from the God of the Earth's domain.
-[X] Explain that this will remove the child from his sight, taken to distant lands, that the Widower will be most effectively punished for her offense by being parted from her child across the sea, than being allowed to hold him within her bosom. A mother would not feel keeping him within her home so onerous as a distant parting.
Convert AP: 2 -> 8
New AP: 13
Empower Realm: 3 Added
New Stored DP: 13 DP
Current Decrees:
Decree of Stones - Receive 2 Obsidian
Decree of Gifts - Receive 1 Good Quality Beastbone Figurine
Decree of Taking - Receive 0.5 Units of Silver
Decree of Attendance - Your standards of beauty are well-known (Gaerig prefers Silver Men, increases Dissemination value)
Bless Petitioners 12
Gain 18 DP for use next turn
Moonlight 1
+10 to appropriate tests (Mystic-based High Skills, Divine Power Tests)
Blood Moon 1
Your Conceptions gain a bonus random Tier 1 Trait; Cause 1 Population Damage to a random village you encounter this turn [Saiga's Fishing Village]
Yellow Moon 1
Grant an additional 0.1 DP per blessing (grants 1.2, rounded down, this turn); Restores 1 unit of Population damage to [Saiga's Fishing Village]
Enhance Action 1 (Boost Exploration)
+10% of Astrology Bonus to marked action
Ambush Protection 1
+10% of Omen Reading to First Surprise Round of the turn
Omen Ritual Development 1
Accuracy +2/10, now 4/10 (8-20 DP, 4-12 Ambrosia OR 50-80 total Tiers Many-Faceted Amber Crafts)
Communion with Gaelte (Son)
81 + 2 (Gaerig's Leadership) + 15 (Some Talent, little drive) = 98 (DC Varies, Passed 3rd tier, takes to taming a dog breed; process will take time)
Communion with Saiga
Friendly Stance : Spouse Opinion
Expect most requests to be positively reciprocated. Expect any demand to be accepted. Expect most trades to be at parity or favorable. Saiga is distracted and strongly wishes to sleep next year, any requests or demands should be short term.
Saiga is pleased with this communion
You commit (10) Ambrosia, Saiga commits (3) Ambrosia
A new divine:
Minor Aspect of Humanity (Can't exceed your own trait tier)
Minor Aspect of the Snowy Owl (Can't exceed your own trait tier) Minor Aspect of the Polar Bear (Random Trait 1) (Granted by Saiga)
Lesser Spirit of the Sea (Random Traits 2 and 3) (Granted by Saiga) Inherent Spirit of Death
Classical Affinity - Air (Blood Trait)
Elemental Affinity - Sky Elemental Affinity - Wind (Random Trait 4) (Granted by Saiga)
Song of Insults
52 + 35 = 87 (Limited success)
Gained 2 Legend
Usko Explorations adjusted (success tier reduced due to decision)
Discovered 9 new villages across the Usko region
Discovered 2 spirits (by air mostly, little is known of them)
Risks of Kaketor
Rolled 57
Evade notice well enough
Kaketor Explorations complete
Discovered 7 new villages across the Kaketor region
Discovered 2 new spirits (The Ancestor Moon, the Stern Mother)
Critical Exploration Success; Mainland Dangers
Rolled... 100.
Seriously?
Mainland Exploration complete
Discovered 4 new villages
Discovered 4 new divines (God of the Home and Loam, The Warmaker, The Widow, The Bastard)
The Bastard Stays, though if you could just get Heske to approve...
Heske welcomes you to stay in the village for a time, and almost immediately you set upon the Widow, seeking her approval to whisk away the child for yourself. "Anything, anything; please, take my son from here!" she agrees.
Heske is another matter. While you have gained the approval of The Widow, the giant considers as ponderously as he moves, his pace almost enough to set you into a tantrum just trying to deal with him.
"No," he states with finality, and as you look up to meet his eyes, you can see the callous pride he takes in the refusal. You gain terrible insight in the workings of his mind; he is all of Attrouska's worst features amplified a hundred times. Bastard creature.
[Heske ascended as a God of Kings]
Empty-handed, you stew in your empty frustrations while you float back to your domain. With a furious, twitching motion, you tear at the fabric of things that hides your realm, venting your frustrations into your private sky.
[Your Realm has room for 3 Improvements]
[Your Realm has room for 1 Gateway Improvement]
[Upkeep is static to Stability Rating, Gateway Improvements can be used to either A. Create a new basic gateway, or B. Include additional elements to an existing gateway]
Due to possessing Spirit of Death, you may enhance Afterlife Components beyond the first tier.
Due to possessing Spirit of Death, you may include Amenity Components for TWO improvement slots instead of one.
Due to possessing Spirit of Mischief, you may enhance Control Components beyond the first tier.
You may include Afterlife Components of any tier (and must also use a Gateway Improvement to define your afterlife's criteria). The basic types of afterlife are Reward and Punishment.
You may include Amenity Components of tier one (Simulated life, hospitable environments for sustained life, realm resists mortal affectations).
You may include Control Components of any tier (Defensive measures against outsider interference).
You may include Skill Components of tier one if at least one trait you possess grants that skill, or any tier if you possess a Mastery of that skill.
You may include components that do not fit the previous categories on a case-by-case basis, by tagged request only.
Fury dissipated, you drift back into the mortal realm, appearing in your temple... You have other things to do this year.
[] Choose from [Water, Sky, Night, or The Bubbling Spring] as a Grand Extension to the Temple.
-[] If Water, Sky, or Night, choose an appropriate Trait to grant Inherence to.
[] Choose from among the following three Extensions at [Gaerig's Village] Shrine.
-[] Painted Stars (Adjusted)
-[] Creche (Adjusted)
-[] Sacrifice Altar (Grants DP semi-regularly)
[] Choose from among the following three Extensions at [Saiga's Fishing Village] Shrine.
-[] Creche (Adjusted)
-[] Pool of Bounty (Grants Population Points semi-regularly)
-[] Sacrifice Altar
[] Choose from among the following three Extensions at [Saitev's Home Village] Shrine.
-[] Chamber of Change (Adjusted)
-[] Mystic Den (Improves Ritual success chances slightly)
-[] Sacrifice Altar
